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Autobot hiearchy

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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Tresob » Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:58 pm

Rodimus was technically a "Protector," not a leader or commander (usually a title given to a political leader who is avoiding the term "king"). I believe Galvatron was listed as a "City Commander"...the same title as Ultra Magnus. (Remember, some of the iterations of Transformers did not have Galvatron as a reformatted Megatron. I always assumed the "City" in their titles referred to Trypticon and Metroplex...think Scramble City.)

My argument that Commander is not the same as Leader comes from the first issue of Marvel's comic in which Optimus is depicted as taking orders from an Autobot Council.
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby PrymeStriker » Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:04 pm

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Tresob wrote:Commander is not the same as Leader



Yeah, it pretty much does.

TFWiki wrote:Decepticon commander, a title for the leader of the Decepticons.

TFWiki wrote:Autobot commander, a catch all term for the leader of the Autobots.


http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Commander
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Tresob » Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:44 pm

Well, here's my case :-B :

Exhibit A: From Marvel Issue One
"But from Iacon, greatest of the city-states, there came a leader to inspire the Autobots in their hour of deadliest peril...Optimus Prime!"

"Of all the Autobots, only he, wise and powerful beyond understanding, was able to unite the scattered warriors into a fully effective fighting force."

This suggests that the Autobots were governed by a system of city-states, like ancient Greece...which implies that there would have been different leaders for each city state. I certainly concede that it uses the language of leader, but this sounds more like a classical "tyrant" -- which originally meant only a temporary military leader appointed during times of distress. (Later, tyrant took on the less flattering meaning that we think of today.)

Exhibit B: More to my point is this panel:
http://i398.photobucket.com/albums/pp63/tresobyr/3D%20Models/opnotincharge_zps2c3d4bc2.png

The Autobots have a council of elders...one of whom appears to sit on a throne, and whom Optimus addresses as "Sire" (which can mean Lord, Father, or Elder...a "title of rank"). That panel does not seem to depict Optimus as the highest ranking Autobot, but rather as the highest ranking military leader.

Megatron calls no one "Sire."

Other versions of Transformers (and I'd concede later issues) depict Optimus differently, and I think the general impression is that Optimus is solely in charge.

I'm just making the case that looking at the original tech specs and the first Marvel comic, Optimus's authority over the Autobots could be reasonably construed as limited...certainly more limited than Megatron's.
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Shadowstream » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:06 am

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First of all: Wrong forum... unless you were intent to talk about the made hierarchy within our own collections
Second:
Tresob wrote:I'm just making the case that looking at the original tech specs and the first Marvel comic, Optimus's authority over the Autobots could be reasonably construed as limited...certainly more limited than Megatron's.

From your evidence I can say you make a good argument for the marvel comics setup, but that's not a catch all set up for those series that have come and gone since then.
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Megs for pres » Wed Feb 13, 2013 8:23 pm

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Incase you were wondering, I have prowel in the very front of optimus. In my collection he is certainly #2 :D
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Tresob » Wed Feb 13, 2013 8:47 pm

And if you look very closely at Jetfire's Tech Spec, he's a 10 as well (slightly above it, actually, but who wants to get picky?).

I'm assuming this relates to why International toy comic had Jetfire as leader of the Autobots.

So high-ranking, and yet he never seemed to get his dues...
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Megs for pres » Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:32 pm

Motto: "May all bad things come to those who have the means to help, yet choose no to."
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Tresob wrote:And if you look very closely at Jetfire's Tech Spec, he's a 10 as well (slightly above it, actually, but who wants to get picky?).

I'm assuming this relates to why International toy comic had Jetfire as leader of the Autobots.

So high-ranking, and yet he never seemed to get his dues...


Oh I didnt know ole pacifist jet fire had a 10 rank. I quite love his FOC reindition and would love a figure.
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Sinnertwin » Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:21 am

Motto: "Take the foolish path, it's much more fun."
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Tech specs are a funny thing indeed; IIRC
Hot Rod / Rodimus 10. They toned it down for his TM release, his specs are rdiculous.
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I can see why Magnus left him to crash and burn on Quintessa. :twisted:
Also, just out of curiosity, didnt they use the terms commander etc so the kids wouldnt catch on that there was a leadership change before the movie came out? I thought that i read that somewhere :-?
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby Megs for pres » Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:36 pm

Motto: "May all bad things come to those who have the means to help, yet choose no to."
Weapon: Fusion Cannon
Sinnertwin wrote:Tech specs are a funny thing indeed; IIRC
Hot Rod / Rodimus 10. They toned it down for his TM release, his specs are rdiculous.
Magnus 8
I can see why Magnus left him to crash and burn on Quintessa. :twisted:
Also, just out of curiosity, didnt they use the terms commander etc so the kids wouldnt catch on that there was a leadership change before the movie came out? I thought that i read that somewhere :-?



I thought I read that somewhere too twin. They also wrote vague biographies for rod and galvie. Presumably to keep the secret.
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Re: Autobot hiearchy

Postby craggy » Thu Feb 14, 2013 4:28 pm

Prowl has always done the job, whilst Prime, Grimlock, Ironhide, Jazz, etc are off getting killed or copied onto floppy discs or what have you. Tactician might have been his rank or function, but his actions should point to him being a capable leader. A dick, sure, but a leader nonetheless. In the recent IDW comics, Bumblebee was the official leader of the Autobots, but it was Prowl who made stuff happen.

edit: weren't the Galvatron (and Ultra Magnus) toys simply labelled City Commander on their packaging?
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