Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

Sabrblade wrote:

robofinch wrote:And the character development. Oh man, you just love every single character on that show. The only character I couldn't get in to was Scorponok, but I know tons of other people really like him.

Same here. I mean, every character had something about them that was taken in some direction, but not with Scorponok. He was the loyal sub commander, but they never really ran with that. Sure, he'd be the one defending Megatron's authority during acts of defiance by other Predacons, but he wasn't really the center of attention at any point. And when Inferno came along, we a got a whole new and much more appealing flavor of "loyalty" that made Scorponok just feel superfluous in his role.

Didn't help that I never owned his toy either (I wanted it, though), aside from the McDonald's Transmetal toy.

Well, he did have his 'Cyber Bees' and occasional gadgets, but eventually Tarantulas (and to a lesser degree, Blackarachnia) took over the role of creating new anti-Maximal tech and he was much better at it than Scorponok due to his very nature of being so scheming and creepy.

xyl360 wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

robofinch wrote:And the character development. Oh man, you just love every single character on that show. The only character I couldn't get in to was Scorponok, but I know tons of other people really like him.

Same here. I mean, every character had something about them that was taken in some direction, but not with Scorponok. He was the loyal sub commander, but they never really ran with that. Sure, he'd be the one defending Megatron's authority during acts of defiance by other Predacons, but he wasn't really the center of attention at any point. And when Inferno came along, we a got a whole new and much more appealing flavor of "loyalty" that made Scorponok just feel superfluous in his role.

Didn't help that I never owned his toy either (I wanted it, though), aside from the McDonald's Transmetal toy.

Well, he did have his 'Cyber Bees' and occasional gadgets, but eventually Tarantulas (and to a lesser degree, Blackarachnia) took over the role of creating new anti-Maximal tech and he was much better at it than Scorponok due to his very nature of being so scheming and creepy.

Yeah, that Cyberbee episode that infected Optimus was his biggest moment, but I kept thinking while watching it that that whole plan felt more like something Tarantulas would have done instead. Plus, Dinobot and Optimus seemed to be more of the stars of that episode than him.

Tarantulas was the mad scientist, and Inferno the loyal zealot, with Scorponok just feeling like an extra.

Sabrblade wrote:

xyl360 wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

robofinch wrote:And the character development. Oh man, you just love every single character on that show. The only character I couldn't get in to was Scorponok, but I know tons of other people really like him.

Same here. I mean, every character had something about them that was taken in some direction, but not with Scorponok. He was the loyal sub commander, but they never really ran with that. Sure, he'd be the one defending Megatron's authority during acts of defiance by other Predacons, but he wasn't really the center of attention at any point. And when Inferno came along, we a got a whole new and much more appealing flavor of "loyalty" that made Scorponok just feel superfluous in his role.

Didn't help that I never owned his toy either (I wanted it, though), aside from the McDonald's Transmetal toy.

Well, he did have his 'Cyber Bees' and occasional gadgets, but eventually Tarantulas (and to a lesser degree, Blackarachnia) took over the role of creating new anti-Maximal tech and he was much better at it than Scorponok due to his very nature of being so scheming and creepy.

Yeah, that Cyberbee episode that infected Optimus was his biggest moment, but I kept thinking while watching it that that whole plan felt more like something Tarantulas would have done instead. Plus, Dinobot and Optimus seemed to be more of the stars of that episode than him.

Tarantulas was the mad scientist, and Inferno the loyal zealot, with Scorponok just feeling like an extra.

Yep. Most often he was just the extra muscle to fill out the ranks of the Preds and occasionally the punching bag, though Waspinator again filled that role MUCH better than him. Ah Waspinator, the 'Kenny McCormick of the Transformers universe .

I literally got head aches from watching Beat Wars. Animation sucks sooo bad!..lol Good story though.

AdamFett wrote:I literally got head aches from watching Beat Wars. Animation sucks sooo bad!..lol Good story though.

You think that animation was bad, go watch Energon. It was made eight years later and was completely worse. Not just its animation, but in every regard.

AdamFett wrote:I literally got head aches from watching Beat Wars. Animation sucks sooo bad!

I take it you haven't watched Armada or Energon.

Armada's animation style wasn't bad, but the animation itself wasn't the best.

Energon speaks for itself.

After watching both seasons of Prime, I decided to go through some of the good old shows. Animated happened to be what I picked first but BW is next.

Only bad thing I can say about the show that isn't due to it being constrained by its ultimate producers is that they never made a 4th season for some unknowable reason and IDK about the portrayal of women. Sari is a good point but Blackarachnia (as if being saddled with a bad name wasn't unfortunate enough) and Arcee are kind of stereotypical. The latter admittedly didn't receive much characterisation but that in itself is kind of a deal.

Other than that it's a nice little Saturday morning cartoon sort of thing. Optimus is more fun when he isn't the god-emperor of all autobots and I like Bumblebee when he can talk.

I was a GeeWan kid and discovered girls around the time of BeastWars and BeastMachines so missed out on both of these series. When I came back into Transformers it was because of Binaltech because of the realistic vehicle modes. I loved G1 as a kid because of the realistic cars etc.

Which brings me to BW/BM. With all the BotCon talk etc I've tried to give the DVDs a watch, but it's hard going. Don't think I'll get past ep2 of BM as everything I know as Transformers has been thrown out the window on this. I hate the Prime series (more for the **** story/love the aesthetic), but this has totally eclipsed it! I hate everything about the BM show, the aesthetic, transformation sequences, music, 'I Am Transformed'!!! Aahhhhh! take it away!

No matter how much I look at the toys, tv show etc I just can't get down with BW/BM.

I'd like to ask a question to the BW/BM fans. Did you grow up with it, or get into it after?

Yes, I grew up on the Beast Era and am so glad I did. Otherwise, I fear I'd feel iffy about beast altmodes like those who grew up on G1 or post-Beast Era series do, which I feel is an injustice to beast altmodes.

I'm glad my first exposure to the Transformers was a top notch, quality written story with a great cast of characters and a great scope of coolness, cleverness, and fun, along with a sequel that was written in a very mature mindset with very deep and sophisticated themes.

I grew up on G1. Beast Wars brought me back into Transformers back in the late 90's when I was in high school. I eventually started buying toys again, and when I did, the first ones I started picking up were Beast Wars figures. Now I have nearly every beast from the entire line as well as those from the two Japanese Beast Wars lines and most of the cast of Beast Machines too. I can't bring myself to go back and watch G1 again though I own the entire series on DVD (and it's on Netflix now). It just doesn't hold up any more. I still watch Beast Wars and have seen the entire series from the beginning to the end more times than I can count. Beast Machines is another matter, but it's definitely grown on my as time has passed, especially when I compared the events in G1's 'The Rebirth' to the plot of Beast Machines (BM makes a LOT more sense when you do that).

Beast Wars is not without its flaws, especially early on and the animation has not aged so well in some respect. I do feel the character models are very good (especially season 2 onward), but its the environment and lighting. Dear god, that season 1 flat texture grass and lack of shadows! Its painful to look at nowadays!

It also had flaws in its narrative and some plot points went nowhere or were poorly handled. I will admit those are valid flaws. But its wrting was good (and still is), its voice acting was equally great. Sure, it had flaws but it was a major step up from Generation 1. In a way, BW is to Transformers what Next Generation is to the original serie. Or what Zeta Gundam is to Mobile Suit Gundam.

Beast Machine is (pardon the pun) a whole different beast. However, its deepest flaw is that is completely butcher the characterization of characters we came to know and like in Beast Wars. And that is a more serious offense, in my eyes, than its different take of Transformers. Because it hurt BM. Whereas being different merely enhance and makes it a truly unique installment in an otherwise sometimes predictable franchise. It was also, at the time, the most story-driven cartoon on the air.