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Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Dean ML » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:37 pm

At least they admitted in a roundabout way that the DotM line was a missed opportunity. It would cost me over $150 to get deluxe Soundwave, Que, and Leadfoot, which is impossible for me. Here's hoping that these figures see an eventual US release and that they get the next movie line right.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby RazorSlash92 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:45 pm

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3. Slide for Universal exclusive Evac, both Legion and Deluxe class figures

Evac is exclusive to the ride giftshop? Man, I was looking forward to picking 'im up, too. Really hope the ride opens at Universal Orlando at some point.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Autobot032 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:16 pm

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RazorSlash92 wrote:
3. Slide for Universal exclusive Evac, both Legion and Deluxe class figures

Evac is exclusive to the ride giftshop? Man, I was looking forward to picking 'im up, too. Really hope the ride opens at Universal Orlando at some point.


I'm sure they'll make their way to BBTS and eBay.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Sun Mar 11, 2012 9:32 pm

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While I don't disagree that Hasbro has missed some opportunities to create some product consumers have been wanting, there seems to be some confusion here and in this hobby in general.

3rd Parties are not the heroic protectors of Transformers from your childhood.

They do not care to give you the toys you dream of, only the ones you will pay for.

To suggest that they maintain some moral highground vs Hasbro is well... ******.

Are they more selective and focused on each release? Ofourse, they release one figure at a time.

And to the collectors that want more movie stuff: I would suggest a little patience. Certainly some of these figures will be re-released or repackaged or reused soon or for the next movie line. The movies aesthetic is not going anywhere.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby 1111111222233333 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:26 pm

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I don't think anyone is claiming that 3rd parties are the "heroic protectors of transformers from our childhood". THAT is ******. They absolutely care to give us the toys we dream of, because those ARE the toys we will pay for. People wanted a classics Devastator done right, and they are willing to pay $600 for him! Anyone who is bringing morality into the 3rd party argument is delusional. It is purely business. Maybe it's morally questionable, but I hold no loyalty to any company, nor will I ever. They are after one thing, and I am after one thing. Plain and simple.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:36 pm

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KenjaminLinus wrote:I don't think anyone is claiming that 3rd parties are the "heroic protectors of transformers from our childhood". THAT is ******. They absolutely care to give us the toys we dream of, because those ARE the toys we will pay for. People wanted a classics Devastator done right, and they are willing to pay $600 for him! Anyone who is bringing morality into the 3rd party argument is delusional. It is purely business. Maybe it's morally questionable, but I hold no loyalty to any company, nor will I ever. They are after one thing, and I am after one thing. Plain and simple.



I wasn't trying to single anyone out. It's like this; I spend A LOT of money on 3rd party stuff (Herc is awesome), I'm just quiet about it. I think a dose of humble pie is over due. Hasbro markets to a different demographic than 3rd party's do and well, lets face it, it's their product. I just get sick of the Hasbro bashing. I want my after-market pieces like most collectors, but I want it to be a little less... in your face Hasbro.

Although what I said may not apply to you, there are plenty of people who view 3rd party companies as the Caped Crusader AND Knight in Shining Army.... and the Peace Corps and Jesus... ok, maybe not that severe, but you get my drift right?
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby 1111111222233333 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:50 pm

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Yeah when you put it that way I definitely hear you. I know that for me personally, it's just about getting awesome representations of the characters I love. Maybe I'll take a piece of that pie. I know it was definitely easy to get caught up in the Hasbro bashing with all of the things fans had to deal with this year. But yeah I definitely agree that 3rd parties should not be viewed as saviors. It's like you said, they just set cross hairs on the collector's market, so their job is easier as far as pleasing their intended demographic.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:53 pm

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KenjaminLinus wrote:Yeah when you put it that way I definitely hear you. I know that for me personally, it's just about getting awesome representations of the characters I love. Maybe I'll take a piece of that pie. I know it was definitely easy to get caught up in the Hasbro bashing with all of the things fans had to deal with this year. But yeah I definitely agree that 3rd parties should not be viewed as saviors. It's like you said, they just set cross hairs on the collector's market, so their job is easier as far as pleasing their intended demographic.


It has been a tough year for "Official" fans. Some serious shortcomings. But there is promise on the horizon. Who knows, we might finally get a Bumble Bee. :lol: I kid.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Rated X » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:24 am

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Where did all this "moral" crap come from ???

Im the one who started the 3rd party discussion on this thread and I never mentioned any such thing. All I wanted to clarify is that 3rd parties are making Transformers right these days. And yeah, for a price. I thought I made it clear that todays Hasbro is not the same people from 1984-1988. They might hold the paperwork and copyrights, but they are not the creators. Therefore I dont respect them in the same fashion as I do the originators of the characters. These characters are 25 years old. Dont confuse creators with investors.

This whole "intellectual property" arguement is a load of horse s**t. If the artist who created Rodimus Prime in 1986 isnt complaining about Protector, then who really has a right to complain ??? Did Hercules ruin any chances of Hasbro ever making profit from a G1 Devastator ??? F**K YEAH !!! But Hasbro has been making classics themed figures since 2006. So for six years Hasbro has dropped the ball and people get mad when the other team picks it up. You guys should be praising TCC for doing what Hasbro couldnt do.



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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Autobot032 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:31 am

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KenjaminLinus wrote:I don't think anyone is claiming that 3rd parties are the "heroic protectors of transformers from our childhood". THAT is ******.


Exactly. Thank you!

KenjaminLinus wrote:They absolutely care to give us the toys we dream of, because those ARE the toys we will pay for. People wanted a classics Devastator done right, and they are willing to pay $600 for him!


Yep. See, we're willing to buy Hasbro product, they refuse to give it to us. This is where the 3rd parties come in. Shouldn't Hasbro be making these products? Yep. They just flat out refuse. I'm tired of it, the 3rd party companies are tired of it, and so should ya'll be. (And yes, the 3rd parties are in it to make money, no doubt, but most of these companies come from fans who've had enough of "No". Plain and simple.)

KenjaminLinus wrote:Anyone who is bringing morality into the 3rd party argument is delusional. It is purely business. Maybe it's morally questionable, but I hold no loyalty to any company, nor will I ever. They are after one thing, and I am after one thing. Plain and simple.


Exactly. Well, for the most part they're after one thing, which is money, but groups like TFC and FansProject really do have the fans best interests at heart. iGear and other companies are just opportunists who just so happen to have what we want and we buy. Oh, do we buy.

GetRightRobot wrote:I wasn't trying to single anyone out. It's like this; I spend A LOT of money on 3rd party stuff (Herc is awesome), I'm just quiet about it. I think a dose of humble pie is over due. Hasbro markets to a different demographic than 3rd party's do and well, lets face it, it's their product. I just get sick of the Hasbro bashing. I want my after-market pieces like most collectors, but I want it to be a little less... in your face Hasbro.

Although what I said may not apply to you, there are plenty of people who view 3rd party companies as the Caped Crusader AND Knight in Shining Army.... and the Peace Corps and Jesus... ok, maybe not that severe, but you get my drift right?


Being a Christian, I'm not exactly sitting easy with the Jesus/savior lines. Just FYI. I don't believe the 3rd parties are anything but a fan run business. Bid'ness. While I do buy their product and fully appreciate their incredible work, I don't believe they've done anything for me but answer our cries for the items that just don't exist, or exist anymore. They're doing for us what Hasbro refuses to do. To me, that makes them awesome. It also makes them a target and it has to make them money to be worth it and to fund future productions. I see nothing wrong with them making money off of our wishes and desires.

I'm not sick of the Hasbro bashing. People seem to forget that Hasbro constantly reminds us that WE don't matter. OUR money doesn't matter. If they lost us as customers, they'd still make their money without our 10%. They didn't give us conventions and exclusives. FANS did. Hasbro was more than happy to let us twist in the wind, twiddling our thumbs.

After seeing what the fans are capable of, and "Hey! It's extra money!", they milked the public and us out of money using the movies. Same for the shows. They get a tidy sum from Savage and Co. on the conventions, plus other official cons around the world. See, Hasbro has no problem showing up and peddling their wares to us and collecting our money. They just don't need it and they've let us know this, time and again. That doesn't bother you? At all? At least the fan run 3rd parties are up front about it. "We'll give you what you want, sure. But we need money to do it. Are you willing to buy? You are? Okay. Here it comes."

Considering Hasbro comes to us and tells us they're going to take our money, even though they don't need it, this canceling figures crap is an even bigger stab to the back, ya know?

So yeah, I'm going to bash Hasbro. I'm also not going to trust a word they say, because you never know when they'll kill a figure or entire line, just when you want it most.

That doesn't make the 3rd parties a hero, that just makes them honest. More honest than Hasbro.

And, like I said, any idiot who asks about this issue, is making problems for us. They're going to open their mouths one too many times and ruin it for all of us. That part about being in your face about it? I fully agree. It shows me just how STUPID some of the people in the fandom really are. It's amazing to me how low a person's IQ can really be. It's either that they're tree stump stupid, or completely ignorant to social graces and common sense. Or they're going for the gusto and it's a mix of both. I'm going to go with "it's a mix of both"

KenjaminLinus wrote:It's like you said, they just set cross hairs on the collector's market, so their job is easier as far as pleasing their intended demographic.


A very fair point, however... Doesn't it bother anyone else but me that Hasbro has no problem telling us that our money isn't necessary, but they'll take it anyway? Doesn't it bother you that their only consistent and faithful fans have been US? I mean, some, like me, have been here since '84. Coming close to THIRTY years of fan love. I get that kids outnumber us and they have to go where the money is, but don't take our money and then barely give us something to show for it. Some years, sure they did better than others. Other years? Eh, not so much.

Fans wanted DOTM Soundwave. Collectors wanted to complete their DOTM Wreckers set. Some, like me, wanted their DOTM Que figure. Hasbro even went so far as to produce Leadfoot with Target logos (among others) on it. There's even a Hasbro HK Soundwave. You know what the rest of us got? "Mmm. Sorry. No dice. Moving on!"

The molds have been created! The toys have a buying audience! They didn't even try and offer them to us through Hasbro Toy Shop, or make them exclusive to TRU. We didn't even get a fair chance at First Edition.

Before someone says "Don't you own the figures? What are you complaining about?" Full disclosure: Yes, I do. I was fortunate enough to find a way to import them. Key word: Fortunate. I count my blessings and I'm grateful for them. However, there are many kids and collectors who CAN'T do what I (and a few others) were capable of doing. That's just not fair. It shouldn't be some, it should be ALL.

There are kids on this site, right now. I don't care if they're 13 or 16 or whatever. Until they're 18, they're juveniles. Kids. Which is Hasbro's target audience. Why do they have to suffer without First Editions and DOTM finishers? And I don't think there's a good or reasonable answer for that. Well, not one other than Hasbro's being run by idiotic planning right now.

Everyone should be able to enjoy these figures. Hasbro shouldn't offer them if they're going to take them from us at the last minute. Tease the fans? Eh, it sucks, but okay. Tease the kids? That's just wrong. Plain and simple.

GetRightRobot wrote:It has been a tough year for "Official" fans. Some serious shortcomings. But there is promise on the horizon. Who knows, we might finally get a Bumble Bee. :lol: I kid.


Kid nothing. We will get more Bumblebees than we know what to do with. I mean, it's ridiculous. And outside of a few good PRID figures, the only promise on the horizon is TakaraTomy (to a small degree) and the 3rd parties.

Rated X wrote:Where did all this "moral" crap come from ???


It's always been an issue for some. (Probably more than they admit.)

Rated X wrote:Im the one who started the 3rd party discussion on this thread and I never mentioned any such thing. All I wanted to clarify is that 3rd parties are making Transformers right these days. And yeah, for a price. I thought I made it clear that todays Hasbro is not the same people from 1984-1988. They might hold the paperwork and copyrights, but they are not the creators. Therefore I dont respect them in the same fashion as I do the originators of the characters. These characters are 25 years old. Dont confuse creators with investors.


Oh, but they DO matter. BECAUSE they hold the paperwork and copyrights. You just don't get it. Whether it was a designer or a team, ultimately, they're paid for their ideas. Hasbro either buys them from them, or hires them to come up with ideas for them. In the end, Hasbro owns 'em. Lock, stock and barrel.

I don't respect their business practices or their disrespect of us, but they have all rights to these, no ifs, ands or buts. Creators? Investors? Who cares? Simple fact is, these are all owned by Hasbro. 3rd parties are violating laws and copyrights, plain and simple. (Well, let me rephrase. Not all 3rd parties are. Some are legal and just skirt the line without crossing it.)

Rated X wrote:This whole "intellectual property" arguement is a load of horse s**t. If the artist who created Rodimus Prime in 1986 isnt complaining about Protector, then who really has a right to complain ??? Did Hercules ruin any chances of Hasbro ever making profit from a G1 Devastator ??? F**K YEAH !!! But Hasbro has been making classics themed figures since 2006. So for six years Hasbro has dropped the ball and people get mad when the other team picks it up. You guys should be praising TCC for doing what Hasbro couldnt do.


Wow...
1.) Hercules did not hurt Hasbro's profits. If they build a Devastator, we will come. The fans flock to combiners. Whether they're crappy, mediocre or excellent, we'll be there. Hasbro refuses to give us Devastator. They could, they just won't. If their profits are somehow hurt by Hercules, it's their own fault.

2.) Praising? Eh. We appreciate and recognize their work with every dollar we spend. That, plus a "Wow, you guys are awesome, thanks!" note every once in a while should suffice. I don't think the 3rd parties want us heaping praise anyway. It draws more attention. If more attention is drawn, it can cause them problems. Which them comes to be our problems because we can't get our 3rd party goodness if Hasbro gets too mad about it.

And stoking the fire with Hasbro over 3rd parties is a BAD, BAD idea. It's only going to make things worse for us. Be angry with Hasbro over what crap they pull, what stuff they don't give us, and their tactics. Be vocal about it, but leave the 3rd parties out of it. There's so much to complain about Hasbro right now, on their own merits. Don't ruin it for the rest of us because a person can't keep their mouths in check.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:09 am

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Ok. Well to all that (I stopped reading like a quarter way dude, honestly) I'll just say, in my best mocking tone "Some but groups like TFC and FansProject really do have the fans best interests at heart." No seriously they do, really, they're not even companies, they're groups.

You are.

Did the Jesus thing bother You? I'm sorry. I meant no offense. I'm a Christian and I could not think of more extreme example of... ok see above.

What did I say? Was it the ****** thing? >:oP

I am sorry if I offended anyone. It's just real fashionable these days to take stabs at a toy company that makes toys for children and not collectors.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Autobot032 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:20 am

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GetRightRobot wrote:Ok. Well to all that (I stopped reading like a quarter way dude, honestly) I'll just say, in my best mocking tone "Some but groups like TFC and FansProject really do have the fans best interests at heart." No seriously they do, really, they're not even companies, they're groups.


At the very least, if you're going to respond to me, at least read the parts of my posts that deal with you. It's just rude to skim it and randomly reply.

"I stopped reading like a quarter way dude, honestly" Yep, I'm like a wordy fellow, man. Like, it's not my fault people have like, ADD n' stuff? Um. Like where was I? Oh look! A BIRD! Whut? LOL?

:HEADHURTS:

GetRightRobot wrote:You are.


I have absolutely no idea what this is about...

GetRightRobot wrote:Did the Jesus thing bother You? I'm sorry. I meant no offense. I'm a Christian and I could not think of more extreme example of... ok see above.


I understand what you were trying to do. I appreciate the apology.

GetRightRobot wrote:What did I say? Was it the ****** thing? >:oP


I...have absolutely no idea what the heck you're talking about. O_o

GetRightRobot wrote:I am sorry if I offended anyone. It's just real fashionable these days to take stabs at a toy company that makes toys for children and not collectors.


It's fashionable because what we're saying is true. It's getting to the point where Hasbro's even lying to their target audience. Kids.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:23 am

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I'm going to read your post friend. Gimme a sec.
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:43 am

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OK. I had an idea, if anything I said previously has upset anyone, please go back to the offensive statement, and read it again but read in the voice of an elderly British man. That should help ease the sting.

This comes down to simple issue, an issue many people in the US have a hard time fully comprehending. If you fall victim to this syndrome, you are more than likely, going to deny it. Entitlement. It's a condition this country has suffered from for far too long.

Hasbro does not "owe" collectors anything. If you want more of a say in Hasbro, their stock is HAS and it is traded on the NYSE.

After 30 years people, we still get some aweseome stuff. Did you see the pics of the new MP Sideswipe? Come on.

Yes they have missed the mark on some things, yes they have dropped the ball on distribution. If they are not making the product you want, do buy it. 3rd Party will make it eventually, and more to your liking. I'm just glad I don't have to shell out 3rd P. prices for every figure I own. I like having a lot of Transformers.

As far as the FE and DOTM wave 6 (it was deluxe wave 6 and HA wave 4, right?), thee has been some discussion and it was a business decision. It wasn't personal. Try not to take it personally. Besides, those figures are almost certainly going to make it into mainstream lines, just not right this second.

And Autobot32, so uhm, like chill out man, like, be happy we still have a living, thriving hobby and franchise. Dude, like, totally imagine being this die hard about Knight Rider... right? Not so bad. :lol:
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Court Jester » Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:18 am

LOST Cybertronian wrote:
DevastaTTor wrote:2. (This one was a cringe-worthy moment) Q: Third party toy makers are producing some amazing toys. Any plans to collaborate with one to produce what could be the most incredible Transformer ever?

A:
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Rated X » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:23 pm

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Im too lazy to find the specific post where my comments were brought up but I will respond on a new post...


I think it is great that China doesnt give a crap about "intellectual property". The term alone is like something right out of SOPA legislation. If I decide to patent a turd and 25 years later somebody decides to sell bigger turds, I can sue the s**t out of him literally. Thats the problem in the USA these days, nobody respects good old fashioned competition. Imagine in the 50's if Chevy sued Ford or Oldsmobile for putting fins on the back of their cars claiming intellectual property ? What has happened to this god damn country ? People are so greedy these days and use cheap legal tatics to destroy the competition. What ever happened to stepping up your game ???

As far as the 3rd party question at Botcon, if it is asked in a respectful fashion, the only people that will be ticked off are the a**holes in the back row who are mad because I dont live in a little Hasbro world with lego men and my little ponies bouncing around all over the place. The question was asked before at Botcon 2010 I believe, in a respectful fashion and it was answered respectfully by the Hasbro team. They refferred to the Jizai Toys Cyclonus as an example of a 3rd party figure put out when nobody even knew Universe Cyclonus was in it's design stages. A few in the crowd were pissed that someone had the balls to ask about 3rd parties. What a bunch of suck ups. Im a paying customer so I suck up to no one. If they put out something good, Ill buy it. If their competition is blowing them away, Im not afraid to respectfully ask them to step up their game.

If the Snoop Dogg was directed towards me, Im flattered. He was one of my idols back in the early 90's. A pimp, a music legend, and an icon. :BOWDOWN:
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:46 pm

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@ Rated X

It's great that you know where you stand. I may not agree 100% with you, but I appreciate you defending your position so vehemently. Wanna get kicked out of the Fun Pub roundtable at Botcon together? :D
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Rated X » Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:58 pm

Motto: ""Assumption is the mother of all screw ups.""
Weapon: Saw-Edged Pincer
GetRightRobot wrote:@ Rated X

It's great that you know where you stand. I may not agree 100% with you, but I appreciate you defending your position so vehemently. Wanna get kicked out of the Fun Pub roundtable at Botcon together? :D



Lets do this ! :grin:
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Check out my Customs:

Classics Pounce and Wingspan
classics-pounce-and-wingspan-t95811.php

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Collection photos will be updated soon at this link :
http://www.seibertron.com/energonpub/rated-x-s-collection-t55699.php
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:49 pm

Motto: "Surf in the Summer, Collect in the Winter."
Weapon: Neptune Sword
Rated X wrote:
GetRightRobot wrote:@ Rated X

It's great that you know where you stand. I may not agree 100% with you, but I appreciate you defending your position so vehemently. Wanna get kicked out of the Fun Pub roundtable at Botcon together? :D



Lets do this ! :grin:


Sweet! I have a feeling we won't be the only ones. :D
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby Kibble » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:11 am

Motto: "Shut up and take my SQUEE!"
Weapon: No Weapon
While I think it's pointless to ask Hasbro their feelings on 3rd Party groups and product, I do think it's fair to ask something along the lines of:

'How is it a 3rd Party group totally pwned any combiner you've ever done (Herc)...why don't you step up your game and at least match what these amateurs are doing?'

Unfortunately they'd just respond with FoC Bruticus as an answer...but then you'd have to follow up with:

'I said at least MATCH what they're doing...'
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Re: Cybertron Con 2012 Coverage: Recap of Hasbro/Takara Tomy Brand Panel

Postby GetRightRobot » Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:24 pm

Motto: "Surf in the Summer, Collect in the Winter."
Weapon: Neptune Sword
Kibble wrote:Unfortunately they'd just respond with FoC Bruticus as an answer...but then you'd have to follow up with:

'I said at least MATCH what they're doing...'



:lol: That's Hilarious! :lol:
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