Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

Fandom: Michael Bay, isn't this a stupid decision?

Michael Bay: I HAVE NO IDEA!
(Prepares to flip 'Maximum Trolling' switch on his lulz gun)


This development shows how little Hasbro/Michael Bay cares. They won't even bother trying to improve these films. Just so long as the formula works (and they get loads of cash), they aren't going to try and change it for the better. If it ain't broke, don't fix it is their philosophy.

Also, see my signature for what I think of Hasbro and Michael Bay pretty much all of the time now:

Wait! They had writers in the last 3 movies???

I really hope they spend a ton of money on TF4 just to have barely enough people show up to turn a profit (trying to be realistic). For once, people need to stop giving in and just wait to see it on DVD (or torrent for free), just to help change the boring formula of current mainstream movies.

He did a fairly good job with DotM, it was better than the 1st 2 films. As long as Orci and Kurtzman stay away, it's safe.

Just think, it could be worse. It could be Uwe Boll.

I don't get all the hate for Orci and Kurtzman. I think Transformers Prime proves that they were not the problem.

Anyway, this is just another sign that we're in for more of the same crap with TF4. All I can say about that is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YxChiuA398

I just got home from seeing the Avengers. If they sack Ehren Kruger and Michael Bay right now and hire Joss Whedon that would be awesome. Going by what he just did, I think it would be something special.

TheForgottenTaxi wrote:I don't get all the hate for Orci and Kurtzman. I think Transformers Prime proves that they were not the problem.

Agreed. They wrote the first movie which I absolutely loved. And we all know how awesome TF Prime is. I have zero problem with those two.

I've always viewed the Bay movies as a seperate TF continuity, and as such, I enjoyed them all. Yes, there were the obvious plotholes (especially in revenge), but when you look at them the way I do, they dont have to mirror past TF lore to be enjoyable...they're just another version of what we all love. I've also learned in the past 5 years not to try and argue their worth to die hard g1ers, LOL. It's all in what you like.

BTW...of course they are gonna get Kruger to write #4...Dark of the Moon made OVER A BILLION DOLLARS! Like or not, 85% of them are in it for the money, not to make us die-hards happy. It sucks, but its true.

I'm excited for another movie! However as I've said before I hope Shia does not come back. I'm curious to see if we get a new villain or if Unicron gets brought into the picture. I will miss the Big Four Decepticons, as I call them, since they are dead, especially Shockwave, because his character wasn't explored at all in DOTM. Other than that bring it on!

why cant they just get rid of everyone who was involved with the last 3 and let some new people take a stab at it? This franchise needs some new life and i dont think this is going to do it. I still say the entire franchise needs a reboot, forget bayformers forget TF Prime and start from scratch. We need another Beast Wars style reboot and fast.

Well, I'm not happy and even less surprised, but would you really want a good writer to squeeze out the next stinker in this legacy of turd's?

Trikeboy wrote:I just got home from seeing the Avengers. If they sack Ehren Kruger and Michael Bay right now and hire Joss Whedon that would be awesome. Going by what he just did, I think it would be something special.

Hah! This is kinda what I said on my Twitter the other day...

It's all about character in my opinion. I know it's difficult to juggle loads of personalities with both Cybertronian AND human sides. Whedon, as said, is AMAZING with multiple characters/ensembles. Thing is; Kruger isn't a bad writer and Bay is a good technical & action director...But when it boils down to character and how they are part of narrative, we need someone like Whedon.

And yes, that means treating both the Decepticons AND Autobots like characters and not like mindless drones!

I know this thing is being greenlit for making dosh but can we stop dragging TF's good name through puddles of **** mud? Call it something else, give it some cool lore than hasbro can sell TFs and "insert poopy bayformer robot title here".

It took me a year or so to finally watch dark side of the moon and I was ashamed to be a TF fan afterwards.

synthetik wrote:I know this thing is being greenlit for making dosh but can we stop dragging TF's good name through puddles of **** mud? Call it something else, give it some cool lore than hasbro can sell TFs and "insert poopy bayformer robot title here".

It took me a year or so to finally watch dark side of the moon and I was ashamed to be a TF fan afterwards.

Oh well.

autobotOG wrote: Yes, there were the obvious plotholes (especially in revenge)

No there weren't.

Bleak5170 wrote:

TheForgottenTaxi wrote:I don't get all the hate for Orci and Kurtzman. I think Transformers Prime proves that they were not the problem.

Agreed. They wrote the first movie which I absolutely loved. And we all know how awesome TF Prime is. I have zero problem with those two.

They're not writing TF Prime though. They're simply only producers. If we're going to give credit to producers then people should either be forming a lynch mob for, or think the sun shines out of Don Murphy's butt.

So yes, Orci and Kurtzman were very much the problem. They couldn't come up with an original idea between them. Take a look at their track record of writing and see that their big "successes" are based on franchises that have decades of mythology.

Burn wrote:So yes, Orci and Kurtzman were very much the problem. They couldn't come up with an original idea between them. Take a look at their track record of writing and see that their big "successes" are based on franchises that have decades of mythology.

Riiiight. Which obviously makes them a terrible choice to work on this franchise with decades of mythology.

Burn wrote:I swear, your comedy has gotten to the level of G1 Starscream since we put staff colours on you.

I...had to. I was compelled. It was there, begging me to do it.

TheForgottenTaxi wrote:I don't get all the hate for Orci and Kurtzman. I think Transformers Prime proves that they were not the problem.

Anyway, this is just another sign that we're in for more of the same crap with TF4. All I can say about that is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YxChiuA398

Oh no. Prime does prove they are the problem. I love Prime, I think it's an excellent series, but it has flaws. Many of which can be seen in the movies.

I've gone over it in detail before, but here's the Cliff Notes version:

TF1: Boring. Some of that was due to cost, but some of it was due to their writing. They can drag out a story like crazy.
TF2: Some of the zaniness came from Bay's input, I don't deny that, but seriously, you could tell which parts belonged to them and which ones didn't. (The boring segments were their's.)
The Legend Of Zorro: B O R I N G. And waaaay too long. When the movie was like 50% over, it felt like the end of the movie. He had rescued his son, story was over. Right? WRONG. Another hour, maybe even 1.5 to go. Egads.
Star Trek: Kirk, a klutz? Really? The guy couldn't keep himself from going over a cliff. He was either narrowly escaping death on one, or dangling from it. And he couldn't fight worth a damn. Really? REALLY?
Hawaii Five-0: Great show. Draggy episodes, story arcs going on for too long, people getting offed when there's no need, other episodes are hollow and rushed.

And then we get to Prime. Rushed episodes, hollow episodes, draggy episodes, characters getting offed for no good reason, arcs going on for far too long, abrupt endings, and a clip show already? Really? No excuse.

The only good work they've done was Mission: Impossible III. It was entertaining, it was fast paced and wasn't a bad story. I think the thrill and fame went to their heads.

Burn wrote:

Bleak5170 wrote:

TheForgottenTaxi wrote:I don't get all the hate for Orci and Kurtzman. I think Transformers Prime proves that they were not the problem.

Agreed. They wrote the first movie which I absolutely loved. And we all know how awesome TF Prime is. I have zero problem with those two.

They're not writing TF Prime though. They're simply only producers. If we're going to give credit to producers then people should either be forming a lynch mob for, or think the sun shines out of Don Murphy's butt.

So yes, Orci and Kurtzman were very much the problem. They couldn't come up with an original idea between them. Take a look at their track record of writing and see that their big "successes" are based on franchises that have decades of mythology.

And they're still a problem, at least for Prime. People seem to think that producers don't have much input or power, but they actually do. They let them loose on TF1 and ROTF. It showed. People blame Bay for so much, but people overlook O & K. I just don't understand why.

I have to admit, Prime, on the whole, is leaps and bounds better than the film series. It really is, but it has imperfections and they need to be addressed.

Autobot032 wrote:What you just said.

I actually agree with you. Wow. haha. The prime shows do have flaws that I hope they fix in some form. It is why I can understand MegatronWolf wanting a reboot. It still has some dragginess that tends to put me off, story-wise. I love the characters, and their dialogue, but I sometimes feel the very core of the story needs something more... surprising. Inside Unicron was awesome, but Unicrons death somehow didn't feel right, even though its obvious that was how he might die, from unleashing the Matrix. Still, felt like Unicron allowed it to easily, and thats sort of the problem I see similar to the movies. Things come to a conclusion in a sort of... formulaic way? running out of time way? I dunno.

A good example of Unicron battling the mere mortal Cybertronians and such is found in the Marvel TF Comics (forgot the issue number) called "The end?" One of the few older comics I own in hard copy, and pretty much the entire comic is a battle against Unicron. He even goes up again the Dark Matrix or something like that? Pretty sick stuff, check it out if you can.

Either way, Prime is waaaay better than the flicks.

Dang...I just don't see how they can squeeze out another decent movie...everyone's DEAD.

And yes, I did say the others were decent, but no doubt flawed.

MINDVVIPE wrote:Either way, Prime is waaaay better than the flicks.

Well...SHYEAH!

SlyTF1 wrote:

synthetik wrote:I know this thing is being greenlit for making dosh but can we stop dragging TF's good name through puddles of **** mud? Call it something else, give it some cool lore than hasbro can sell TFs and "insert poopy bayformer robot title here".

It took me a year or so to finally watch dark side of the moon and I was ashamed to be a TF fan afterwards.

Oh well.

autobotOG wrote: Yes, there were the obvious plotholes (especially in revenge)

No there weren't.

No? So you don't think the fact that Megatron could be reanimated with a shard from the allspark, but it was necessary to travel to Egypt and find an ancient autobot relic to reanimate optimus (with shard of allspark in hand, mind you) wasent an OBVIOUS plothole?

autobotOG wrote:

SlyTF1 wrote:

synthetik wrote:I know this thing is being greenlit for making dosh but can we stop dragging TF's good name through puddles of **** mud? Call it something else, give it some cool lore than hasbro can sell TFs and "insert poopy bayformer robot title here".

It took me a year or so to finally watch dark side of the moon and I was ashamed to be a TF fan afterwards.

Oh well.

autobotOG wrote: Yes, there were the obvious plotholes (especially in revenge)

No there weren't.

No? So you don't think the fact that Megatron could be reanimated with a shard from the allspark, but it was necessary to travel to Egypt and find an ancient autobot relic to reanimate optimus (with shard of allspark in hand, mind you) wasent an OBVIOUS plothole?

Easy enough to explain.

Megatron's spark chamber wasn't completely destroyed, nor was his torso. Plus, Scalpel and the diving team rebuilt him before giving him the shard. Plus, the Allspark is known for magical macguffin resurrections.

Optimus, on the other hand, had his entire spark chamber destroyed, his torso was basically gone because of the stab/blast combo, and no one had any Allspark pieces lying around. The last known piece was used by Sam to revive Jetfire. The only source of Energon on Earth, was the Matrix of Leadership.

See, I saw it a different way...I thought in the battle in the woods, it was optimus's abdominal area that was destroyed (hence the new abs in dark of the Moon), i thought his spark chamber was higher up...in the chest area you could say. Where as, Megatron had the all spark actually INSERTED into his spark chamber, leaving it a charred hole. So it would make more sense to me than an all spark shard would be more effective on optimus. And I get Megatron was rebuilt prior to reanimation, but couldn't ratchet had repaired him enough for him to be brought back to life? That, and Sam knew of the second shards existance 30 minutes into the movie, you would have thought he would have at least tried it first before venturing off into the unknown, right?

Either way, I don't need a seemless plot to enjoy a movie about bots and cons, so I liked it regardless, LOL

autobotOG wrote:See, I saw it a different way...I thought in the battle in the woods, it was optimus's abdominal area that was destroyed (hence the new abs in dark of the Moon), i thought his spark chamber was higher up...in the chest area you could say. Where as, Megatron had the all spark actually INSERTED into his spark chamber, leaving it a charred hole. So it would make more sense to me than an all spark shard would be more effective on optimus. And I get Megatron was rebuilt prior to reanimation, but couldn't ratchet had repaired him enough for him to be brought back to life? That, and Sam knew of the second shards existance 30 minutes into the movie, you would have thought he would have at least tried it first before venturing off into the unknown, right?

Either way, I don't need a seemless plot to enjoy a movie about bots and cons, so I liked it regardless, LOL

Optimus's whole chest got blown out. Plus, Wheelie was the human's only source of information, and he lead them to Jetfire (possibly) in the hopes that Jetfire was still a Decepticon and would kill the humans and return him to the Decepticons.

autobotOG wrote:See, I saw it a different way...I thought in the battle in the woods, it was optimus's abdominal area that was destroyed (hence the new abs in dark of the Moon), i thought his spark chamber was higher up...in the chest area you could say. Where as, Megatron had the all spark actually INSERTED into his spark chamber, leaving it a charred hole. So it would make more sense to me than an all spark shard would be more effective on optimus. And I get Megatron was rebuilt prior to reanimation, but couldn't ratchet had repaired him enough for him to be brought back to life? That, and Sam knew of the second shards existance 30 minutes into the movie, you would have thought he would have at least tried it first before venturing off into the unknown, right?

Either way, I don't need a seemless plot to enjoy a movie about bots and cons, so I liked it regardless, LOL

Here are the problems with your theory.

1.) His "abs" were rebuilt, and intact, and looked as they did prior to his killing blow.
2.) Sam rammed the Matrix into his chest cavity between the two windshield pieces.
3.) Both the Voyager and Leader Class toys are rather accurate to the CGI model, at least from the front, and the Matrix cavity is above his abs.

The All Spark's energy was released into Megatron's chest/spark chamber, with a shard left over (the one Optimus took), but the cube itself never entered his body.

Optimus told Sam to run. He wasn't concerned with his own safety. With Prime dying, Decepticons everywhere, and the crew shattered and shook to their core, no one was thinking clearly. To top that off, The Fallen had made their presence known, which caused hysteria.

Plus, fate decided that Sam needed to recover the Matrix by accepting his destiny.

Is it perfect? No. Is it full of plot holes? No.