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freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Discuss anything and everything related to the Transformers Live Action Films franchise, which are directed by Michael Bay. Transformers 3 is scheduled to be released on July 1st, 2011. Check out our Live Action Film section here.

Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby shamone » Wed Aug 03, 2011 2:28 pm

dylansdad wrote:
Phategod1 wrote:The Long and short of it is Bay Never understood the character of Optimus. Bay made him your typical Kill everything hero. The G1 Optimus would never Kill a defenseless opponent, There is no honor in that. Optimus killing with cheap one liners is not Optimus at all.

Yeah, totally agree. The Optimus I know & admire would never kill an injured,unarmed foe. This movie sucks bad & has perverted all that was good about Transformers.


i agree to an extent. The killing wounded injured unarmed combatants is not the actions of a hero
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Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby SlyTF1 » Wed Aug 03, 2011 3:38 pm

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shamone wrote:
dylansdad wrote:
Phategod1 wrote:The Long and short of it is Bay Never understood the character of Optimus. Bay made him your typical Kill everything hero. The G1 Optimus would never Kill a defenseless opponent, There is no honor in that. Optimus killing with cheap one liners is not Optimus at all.

Yeah, totally agree. The Optimus I know & admire would never kill an injured,unarmed foe. This movie sucks bad & has perverted all that was good about Transformers.


i agree to an extent. The killing wounded injured unarmed combatants is not the actions of a hero


A hero is someone who is willing to do whatever it takes for the great or good. Not someone who lets huge threats escape or live.
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Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby shamone » Wed Aug 03, 2011 3:42 pm

SlyTF1 wrote:
shamone wrote:
dylansdad wrote:
Phategod1 wrote:The Long and short of it is Bay Never understood the character of Optimus. Bay made him your typical Kill everything hero. The G1 Optimus would never Kill a defenseless opponent, There is no honor in that. Optimus killing with cheap one liners is not Optimus at all.

Yeah, totally agree. The Optimus I know & admire would never kill an injured,unarmed foe. This movie sucks bad & has perverted all that was good about Transformers.


i agree to an extent. The killing wounded injured unarmed combatants is not the actions of a hero


A hero is someone who is willing to do whatever it takes for the great or good. Not someone who lets huge threats escape or live.


thats one interpretation
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Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Wed Aug 03, 2011 4:39 pm

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dylansdad wrote:This movie sucks bad & has perverted all that was good about Transformers.


You have admitted you know very little about Transformers outside the G1 toon.
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Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby Optimus Primevil » Thu Aug 04, 2011 2:22 am

@jetoptimus23: the plumed serpent believes the decepticons are the heroes, i believe that the decepticons are evil yet still have to be given rights like everybody else. big difference. one of the problems with the trilogy is that they keep contradicting each other. the first movie originally has megatron go after the allspark and if he had succeeded he probably would've left because at that time there were no earth machines to turn into an army(meaning that earth had no value for megatron at that point). then the second movie suddenly shows that they've got a big machine in egypt(suddenly the earth is important to the transformers) then the third has apparently the allspark was sent here on purpose (as oppossed to being sent here by accident) with help from a prime who is in league with megatron (and by default, the fallen who is in his couch waiting for the primes to die out).

if some snot nosed punks can keep a giant whale thingy in their pocket via a spherical container, why not giant robots?

@Evil_the-nub: so why can't the autobots work with the humans in incarcerating beaten/surrendering decepticons...wing dagger and padlock are jailers after all.

@dinojack: you're correct about the lack of onscreen character development, the first movie practically implies that optimus was holding back (via insisting on a suicide plan rather than fight megatron) then the sequels have him being able to kick everyone's collective skidplates. the big question for me is why it took earth and the humans for him to be more aggresive?

@Biddybot: isn't it strange that since the allspark was the cause of the war (according to the first movie) won't it's loss signal that the war is over or has the killing gone long enough that there has to be a winner to justify all the loses? optimus could've reasoned that since the allspark is gone that means their species is doomed because they can't make anymore, would they risk extinction(to keep on fighting) over preservation?(though the hatchlings from the sequel kinda renders the allspark useless as the only means of reproduction). though in ROTF the autobots and nest are hunting decepticons and apparently good at it, maybe a sadistic streak in him got lit up seeing that despite the loss of the allspark, the decepticons are coming to earth for no good reason (seeing that it took the fallen's big broadcast of 2009 to blow the lid that aliens walk amongst us, one would think the decepticons are not too aggresive/blatant in their actions to blow their cover). if you add your theory about jetfire's parts heightening optimus' aggression, can one think optimus is in a power trip?

the scary part about optimus putting decepticons in the same class as "sick, instinct-driven, non-thinking animals" is has optimus subscribed to the same train of thought as his enemies?

@5150 cruiser: the problem about the 'cons started the war' is that who presented that argument to the humans? the autobots. and "Freedom is everyones right in the way that someone else does not have the right to take that freedom away" so optimus not giving a choice to a injured decepticon is exempt from that? heck did he asked for their unconditional surrender? no, he wanted them all dead and would probably hunted them all down even the ones off earth.

@red 50: so demolishor's size is excuse enough to kill him? he could've caused a lot more damage fighting yet he ran. they reduced him into a head (easy enough to incarcerate and maintain) but they never intended for him to live seeing instead of "do you yield?" optimus says "any last words?".
about the troops: one of my biggest complaints about nearly every tf series is the flimsy reasoning about the decepticons being evil, basically they just are.

and you're right justice must be served but who would be more credible serving it? superman or justice lord superman? because what would happen to human collaborators? would he deem them the same justice he'd dispense to the decepticons?
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Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby TulioDude » Fri Aug 05, 2011 8:23 pm

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shamone wrote:
SlyTF1 wrote:
shamone wrote:
dylansdad wrote:
Phategod1 wrote:The Long and short of it is Bay Never understood the character of Optimus. Bay made him your typical Kill everything hero. The G1 Optimus would never Kill a defenseless opponent, There is no honor in that. Optimus killing with cheap one liners is not Optimus at all.

Yeah, totally agree. The Optimus I know & admire would never kill an injured,unarmed foe. This movie sucks bad & has perverted all that was good about Transformers.


i agree to an extent. The killing wounded injured unarmed combatants is not the actions of a hero


A hero is someone who is willing to do whatever it takes for the great or good. Not someone who lets huge threats escape or live.


thats one interpretation



In a war,they fight for survival because the Decepticons have no mercy,they dont care to kill all the Autobots or humans.IF they come back they might kill their friends.
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Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby dash23 » Sun Aug 07, 2011 12:24 am

Typical "the good always prevail against evil" thus giving Optimus Prime the "freedom" to kill them all...Plus that's what most movie goers want to see. :)
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Re: freedom is the right of all sentient beings...

Postby F Prime » Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:41 am

Motto: "math...thrash...Math....Thrash...MATH....THRASH..."
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I always interpreted Prime's status a little differently. I took him to mean that each sentient species has the right to obtain Freedom. He never violates that. The Decepticons had freedom to choose their actions; that freedom does not excuse them from consequences. Thus I had no problem with his killing of Decepticons.

I wouldn't want G1 Prime doing that....but this is not G1 Prime in the same way that the Optimus in Animated is not G1 Prime. Personally, I think variety adds flavor and I am glad that every single Prime portrayed is not G1 Prime.
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