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I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby njb902 » Sat Aug 04, 2012 1:30 pm

DevastaTTor wrote:
Autobot032 wrote:
orangeitis wrote:
PrimeStriker wrote:
orangeitis wrote:Hope Hasbro makes a better mold of him in the future. That sounds horrifying.


.....Have you not seen what Hasbro does to molds already made? Optimus Prime, Bumblebee, Bulkhead, Starscream, and (opinion may differ here) Cliffjumper all suffer from being worse than their original molds. Hasbro is more than likely to screw it up than fix it.
First of all, opinion may differ on all of them, not just ol' CJ there. Second, the FEs are originally Hasbro's too. And what else is Hasbro's? CHUGs, the figures from the movie trilogy, the Animated line... their track record is just as good as it is bad IMO. I don't see how there's more of a chance of Hasbro making a crappier figure.


Hasbro isn't releasing Breakdown here, so it's a moot point, really. And Hasbro's toys are getting thinner and cheaper in terms of quality. No reason to be tooting Hasbro's horn. I bought FOC Jazz today and it feels like junk.

I wonder if Hasbro/TT is going to reserve the good plastic for MP figures from now on, leaving the standard releases lighter and more fragile. The issue with figures getting smaller is a problem across the board.


It's to early to jump to any conclusions, though it is a distressing trend. time will tell I supose.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby Autobot032 » Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:16 pm

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Gearslide wrote:Goodness. All I wanted to point out is that this particular mold wouldn't be suitable in an American market, and that I understood Hasbro's reasons for not bringing it over! This wasn't supposed to be a Hasbro bashing thread or anything.

Based on my experience with the figure, I strongly feel that Hasbro won't ever release it or any iteration of it in this market. It's just too fragile for the rough-housing a lot of kids will do with it. MAYBE if Hasbro beefed up the plastic on it, it could pass as a First Edition (or equivalent) figure.

I do think, however, that Hasbro will release their own mold. Considering that the Prime series isn't a filler line, like Fall of Cybertron, I'm sure Hasbro will take designing a Breakdown figure seriously.


I would like to sincerely apologize to you, Gearslide. It was never my intention to have this derail as it has. I was only trying to make a point and I had no idea it would be taken so far out of line. I'm not bashing Hasbro, by the way. It was not my intention. Airing grievances, was.

I would hope they wouldn't change the mold, just the plastic, but if they do, I hope you're right. Hasbro's done it before, they could do it again.

DevastaTTor wrote:I wonder if Hasbro/TT is going to reserve the good plastic for MP figures from now on, leaving the standard releases lighter and more fragile. The issue with figures getting smaller is a problem across the board.


Indeed, it is a problem. A worrisome one, at that. But I'd say not even the good plastic goes to the Masterpieces. Rodimus had arms break off, literally "just because". They just snapped, while on display. No user interaction required. That's some weak ass plastic, right there. Because the TT version has the same thickness of plastic, the same mold and their's didn't break. That tells me Hasbro is using a much cheaper quality plastic.

njb902 wrote:It's to early to jump to any conclusions, though it is a distressing trend. time will tell I supose.


Fair point, but I will say that with the increase of complaints and increase of proof of this, it's fair to say that it's a logical conclusion to jump to.

Thinner, smaller, lighter, less metal, all across the board. That's scary. It's one thing when it's one line, but now it's looking like all of them are becoming the same thing. And when TakaraTomy does the same thing, that's even worse.

I've seen thicker and more sturdy plastic in disposable utensils. (No, I'm not kidding.)

If you hold Breakdown up to a light, and open his inner leg panel, you can see light through it quite well. Almost lightpipe worthy. That's some thin plastic. I held my Giant Mixmaster up to the light, not a single bleed through. Nothing.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby PrymeStriker » Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:34 pm

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Well, then. It seems once an argument is over, the thread really dies, so, I'll leave it alone after I say this:

I bought Takara's Breakdown because I know the Hasbro one is going to suck, with the Powerizer gimmicks, and the unnecessary translucent plastic everywhere. That's why I have no faith Hasbro will make a better Breakdown.

And, I guess that's /thread, unless anyone else has anything to add :)
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby xyl360 » Sat Aug 04, 2012 11:30 pm

Right out of the packaging, one of the leg panels that's supposed to rotate and fold around to form the leg panel was detached. I popped it back on easily enough, but those panels are pretty loose. They're plugged on in a similar fashion to Knockout's wheels. I'll just have to be careful when transforming him not to get to rough with those parts to avoid popping them off again.

Overall, I'm pleased with the figure so I'm glad I got it.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby PrymeStriker » Sun Aug 05, 2012 9:23 am

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xyl360 wrote:Right out of the packaging, one of the leg panels that's supposed to rotate and fold around to form the leg panel was detached. I popped it back on easily enough, but those panels are pretty loose. They're plugged on in a similar fashion to Knockout's wheels. I'll just have to be careful when transforming him not to get to rough with those parts to avoid popping them off again.

Overall, I'm pleased with the figure so I'm glad I got it.


Ha-ha, my Breakdown's leg panels are like that too, but they didn't pop off until I transformed him a few times. Hasn't done that since, as I'm more careful when I transform them. But damn, they are loosey-goosey!
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby Gearslide » Sun Aug 05, 2012 9:47 am

Wow, this thread is doing a better job at staying alive than Breakdown did!

Image

But anyways, for those of you with the Breakdown toy, did anyone place the Decepticon faction stickers on his door like the instructions call for? Because I did not, since they are not there in the show.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby gavinfuzzy » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:10 am

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DevastaTTor wrote:
Autobot032 wrote:
orangeitis wrote:
PrimeStriker wrote:
orangeitis wrote:Hope Hasbro makes a better mold of him in the future. That sounds horrifying.


.....Have you not seen what Hasbro does to molds already made? Optimus Prime, Bumblebee, Bulkhead, Starscream, and (opinion may differ here) Cliffjumper all suffer from being worse than their original molds. Hasbro is more than likely to screw it up than fix it.
First of all, opinion may differ on all of them, not just ol' CJ there. Second, the FEs are originally Hasbro's too. And what else is Hasbro's? CHUGs, the figures from the movie trilogy, the Animated line... their track record is just as good as it is bad IMO. I don't see how there's more of a chance of Hasbro making a crappier figure.


Hasbro isn't releasing Breakdown here, so it's a moot point, really. And Hasbro's toys are getting thinner and cheaper in terms of quality. No reason to be tooting Hasbro's horn. I bought FOC Jazz today and it feels like junk.

I wonder if Hasbro/TT is going to reserve the good plastic for MP figures from now on, leaving the standard releases lighter and more fragile. The issue with figures getting smaller is a problem across the board.


I can imagine my Hasbro optimus's arm popping off like Rodimus... hmm... :BANG_HEAD:
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby xyl360 » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:26 am

Gearslide wrote:Wow, this thread is doing a better job at staying alive than Breakdown did!

Image

But anyways, for those of you with the Breakdown toy, did anyone place the Decepticon faction stickers on his door like the instructions call for? Because I did not, since they are not there in the show.

I didn't put any stickers on him yet. I don't like most of them, those bright chrome stickers just don't fit in with his drab looks on the show so I think I might leave him as is or paint him a bit.

I'm displaying him in bot mode, so compared to the show, even without stickers, he looks pretty accurate. In fact, he's one of the most show-accurate characters I've seen from the line so far (Hasbro or Takara). He looks great standing next to Takara FE Bulkhead. I just have to be careful that they don't try to kill each other as I doubt I'd be able to easily replace either of them given how popular those two partiular figures are :P.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby Gearslide » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:42 am

xyl360 wrote:
Gearslide wrote:Wow, this thread is doing a better job at staying alive than Breakdown did!

Image

But anyways, for those of you with the Breakdown toy, did anyone place the Decepticon faction stickers on his door like the instructions call for? Because I did not, since they are not there in the show.

I didn't put any stickers on him yet. I don't like most of them, those bright chrome stickers just don't fit in with his drab looks on the show so I think I might leave him as is or paint him a bit.

I'm displaying him in bot mode, so compared to the show, even without stickers, he looks pretty accurate. In fact, he's one of the most show-accurate characters I've seen from the line so far (Hasbro or Takara). He looks great standing next to Takara FE Bulkhead. I just have to be careful that they don't try to kill each other as I doubt I'd be able to easily replace either of them given how popular those two partiular figures are :P.


Well, as far show accuracy goes, the important stickers are the bumper sticker (like, the entire bumper is one massive sticker), his kneecaps (the silver pieces, the black aren't that important), his waist-lights, his headlights, and those red and blue strips that go over the rear wheel plates.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby PrymeStriker » Sun Aug 05, 2012 11:06 am

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Gearslide wrote:
xyl360 wrote:
Gearslide wrote:Wow, this thread is doing a better job at staying alive than Breakdown did!

Image

But anyways, for those of you with the Breakdown toy, did anyone place the Decepticon faction stickers on his door like the instructions call for? Because I did not, since they are not there in the show.

I didn't put any stickers on him yet. I don't like most of them, those bright chrome stickers just don't fit in with his drab looks on the show so I think I might leave him as is or paint him a bit.

I'm displaying him in bot mode, so compared to the show, even without stickers, he looks pretty accurate. In fact, he's one of the most show-accurate characters I've seen from the line so far (Hasbro or Takara). He looks great standing next to Takara FE Bulkhead. I just have to be careful that they don't try to kill each other as I doubt I'd be able to easily replace either of them given how popular those two partiular figures are :P.


Well, as far show accuracy goes, the important stickers are the bumper sticker (like, the entire bumper is one massive sticker), his kneecaps (the silver pieces, the black aren't that important), his waist-lights, his headlights, and those red and blue strips that go over the rear wheel plates.


I put them all on, including the extra two :CON: logos (I put them on his shoulders). I don't care how some stickers make him a little bit inaccurate, he's still boss either way.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby Autobot032 » Sun Aug 05, 2012 9:00 pm

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Put 'em on the doors and one of the extra's went to my Hegemon.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby orangeitis » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:08 pm

Gearslide wrote:Wow, this thread is doing a better job at staying alive than Breakdown did!

Image
NOOO SPOILERS Image

Eeeeh my fault for being too cheap for premium cable. :HEADHURTS:
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby PrymeStriker » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:26 pm

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orangeitis wrote:
Gearslide wrote:Wow, this thread is doing a better job at staying alive than Breakdown did!

Image
NOOO SPOILERS Image

Eeeeh my fault for being too cheap for premium cable. :HEADHURTS:


I thought it was well established 'round here that Breakdown got his ass beat. I guess I won't tell you who killed him if you still haven't seen the episode. In fact......

The episode is right here. Crossfire; S2E7. Although I don't recommend watching it if you haven't seen the One Shall Rise 3-parter, Operation: Breakdown, Loose Cannons, and a couple other episodes that this one makes a lot of reference to. That is, if you do not want to be spoiled.



Enjoy, if you want. :)
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby orangeitis » Sun Aug 05, 2012 11:05 pm

PrimeStriker wrote:Awesome post
Sweet, thanks! ;)^

Will watch after the Mars landing.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby Hierophant » Mon Aug 06, 2012 4:50 am

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Not bashing on anyone here (honest!) but I always had a glee when people complained about Tak's breakdown being fragile when the figure itself is purely catered for a different audience in a different country. I'd say them asians have quite good hands, able to pose and transform the figure well unlike us having a problem one after another :grin:

On a flipside though, I would consider (read: speculation) that Tak's take on Breakdown's fragile plastic is their answer to uhm, prices of plastics nowadays. unlike hasbro which retains overall sturdiness but simpler transformation and size with their figures (FoC vs WFC?) while Tak prolly goes on the alternative route to retain the same size and transformation complexity, all the while reducing the mass as a whole. Now when I look at it, it's pretty much explains why Breakdown is lighter than previous line figures all the while on par with FE's level of transformation.

If Tak's route is truly that (same complexity, but thinner plastic in return) is their answer, I know it won't bode well with many people, but for me that's fine and I'm all for it. It teaches me to be more careful with my collection :D

And guys, in the end of the day, it's the brand/figure that we all know and love. If you guys buy it with flaws and everything but still happy at the end, it's cool! Cheers all~
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby xyl360 » Mon Aug 06, 2012 2:05 pm

Hierophant wrote:Not bashing on anyone here (honest!) but I always had a glee when people complained about Tak's breakdown being fragile when the figure itself is purely catered for a different audience in a different country. I'd say them asians have quite good hands, able to pose and transform the figure well unlike us having a problem one after another :grin:

On a flipside though, I would consider (read: speculation) that Tak's take on Breakdown's fragile plastic is their answer to uhm, prices of plastics nowadays. unlike hasbro which retains overall sturdiness but simpler transformation and size with their figures (FoC vs WFC?) while Tak prolly goes on the alternative route to retain the same size and transformation complexity, all the while reducing the mass as a whole. Now when I look at it, it's pretty much explains why Breakdown is lighter than previous line figures all the while on par with FE's level of transformation.

If Tak's route is truly that (same complexity, but thinner plastic in return) is their answer, I know it won't bode well with many people, but for me that's fine and I'm all for it. It teaches me to be more careful with my collection :D

And guys, in the end of the day, it's the brand/figure that we all know and love. If you guys buy it with flaws and everything but still happy at the end, it's cool! Cheers all~

I agree that many Japanese market toys tend to be more fragile (Gundam anyone?), but Hasbro is getting cheap/thin with their plastics too. I've had plenty of Hasbro figures fall apart or straight up crack/break (or be broken inside the packaging!).

On both sides, for both companies, I believe it's a matter of dealing with the bottom line, whether it's the price of plastics, the cost of labor, or a simple reaction to inflation or anything else is anyone's guess, but the reality is, toys are made cheaper now than they once were and it's only getting worse at this point.

Parents don't want to buy toys that cost more, regardless of how well they're made, how big they are, or how much paint they have on them, so whatever is driving up the cost of production/distribution/whatever on Has/Tak's end will drive up the prices and drive down the quality.

It sucks, and it's the very reason I keep praying that Takara will see the light and start doing with the rest of the lines what they've done with the MP/Alternators/Alternity/Binaltech lines: start creating figures and lines targeted directly at collectors. They did that somewhat with both Henkei and United, but as long as they're using the same molds as Hasbro, the toys will still suffer from the same cut corners that exist in the molds themselves from the engineering stages, be that thin plastic, cheats in transformation or whatever else that can't be solved by injecting molds with sturdier plastics/different colored (more accurate ;)) colored plastics, or applying more/better/more accurate paint.
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Re: I can definitely see why Breakdown didn't make it state side...

Postby Blurrz » Mon Aug 06, 2012 4:48 pm

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xyl360 wrote: I believe it's a matter of dealing with the bottom line, whether it's the price of plastics, the cost of labor, or a simple reaction to inflation or anything else is anyone's guess, but the reality is, toys are made cheaper now than they once were and it's only getting worse at this point.


Transformers have decreasing detail and plastic quality, accompanied with increased pricing. Bandai, Lego, DC, McFarlane, and a majority of toy brands have increasing toy tech, quality, detail with the standard increase in pricing. Toys are far from getting worse, it's really only Transformers - they are getting the short end of the stick. I honestly think that Hasbro doesn't think the Prime line was ever going to be a money maker - the cartoon has run forever how long it has, and we aren't even on RID Deluxe Wave 5.

The demographic argument isn't working for this either. Whether it's a kid or an adult collector, the concept of collecting is to collect everything. Or atleast the maincast of characters. Breakdown is a main cast character. All in all you could say it's still the kids Hasbro is looking out for, or they're aimed at kids, but that's nonsense - that concept has been around forever and with that we could say that Armada Overload or Energon Tidalwave shouldn't have been released by Hasbro because it wasn't 'aimed for kids'.

TFP is the black sheep right now. Hasbro would rather toot the horn for Star Wars, their Marvel license, and GIJ for the upcoming movie. We're movieless.. and we're on the bench. Breakdown isn't the first case. It's a notch on the list of ridiculous things post-DOTM. We're in a movie-mania era and cartoons seem to be slowly fading away.
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