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Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Mekatron wrote:I wonder what copyrights (if any) 3rd Party companies like Maketoys and Fansproject actually have to their products.

I wonder about that too. I think the transformation and those mechanics are copywritten. Although actually finding and suing the guys responsible is a whole other matter.

A small 3P company suing a Chinese factory; that'll be the day!

DevastaTTor wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Mekatron wrote:I wonder what copyrights (if any) 3rd Party companies like Maketoys and Fansproject actually have to their products.

I wonder about that too. I think the transformation and those mechanics are copywritten. Although actually finding and suing the guys responsible is a whole other matter.

A small 3P company suing a Chinese factory; that'll be the day!

Well, they wouldn't really sue the factory, they'd sue the company responsible for producing the KO.

But I agree on the point, it's pretty damn unlikely. We'll see Hasbro do that before some small 3rd party company.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

DevastaTTor wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Mekatron wrote:I wonder what copyrights (if any) 3rd Party companies like Maketoys and Fansproject actually have to their products.

I wonder about that too. I think the transformation and those mechanics are copywritten. Although actually finding and suing the guys responsible is a whole other matter.

A small 3P company suing a Chinese factory; that'll be the day!

Well, they wouldn't really sue the factory, they'd sue the company responsible for producing the KO.

But I agree on the point, it's pretty damn unlikely. We'll see Hasbro do that before some small 3rd party company.

The manager of the factory is probably the guy knocking these off. Factories there do that kind of stuff all the time; produce the authentic version by day, run the knock off at night.

DevastaTTor wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

DevastaTTor wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Mekatron wrote:I wonder what copyrights (if any) 3rd Party companies like Maketoys and Fansproject actually have to their products.

I wonder about that too. I think the transformation and those mechanics are copywritten. Although actually finding and suing the guys responsible is a whole other matter.

A small 3P company suing a Chinese factory; that'll be the day!

Well, they wouldn't really sue the factory, they'd sue the company responsible for producing the KO.

But I agree on the point, it's pretty damn unlikely. We'll see Hasbro do that before some small 3rd party company.

The manager of the factory is probably the guy knocking these off. Factories there do that kind of stuff all the time; produce the authentic version by day, run the knock off at night.

Well, the quality of the trailer was decent, so this may be the case. But there was some mold issues too (mostly the head). If the factory manager was behind it, wouldn't it be a perfect copy?

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

DevastaTTor wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

DevastaTTor wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Mekatron wrote:I wonder what copyrights (if any) 3rd Party companies like Maketoys and Fansproject actually have to their products.

I wonder about that too. I think the transformation and those mechanics are copywritten. Although actually finding and suing the guys responsible is a whole other matter.

A small 3P company suing a Chinese factory; that'll be the day!

Well, they wouldn't really sue the factory, they'd sue the company responsible for producing the KO.

But I agree on the point, it's pretty damn unlikely. We'll see Hasbro do that before some small 3rd party company.

The manager of the factory is probably the guy knocking these off. Factories there do that kind of stuff all the time; produce the authentic version by day, run the knock off at night.

Well, the quality of the trailer was decent, so this may be the case. But there was some mold issues too (mostly the head). If the factory manager was behind it, wouldn't it be a perfect copy?

True. Wouldn't put it past them to loan the molds out for reproduction though.

It's too bad really... but such is life in China where IP protections don't exist.

Maketoys is in a BAD spot here though... there's a LOT of people on the fence about buying Giant. If they released it when they said they were going to... they would have been sold-out already & no harm done. I imagine there's quite a few that will jump off the boat for a cheap KO. Then again, the people that aren't able to afford Giant are probably still not going to be able to afford $160 plus shipping.

I won't buy a green Giant (KO or otherwise) since I'm quite satisfied with Hercules, but if they KO the yellow version, I'm all over it. I couldn't justify the cost for such a thing when the original was out, but if they KO'd it and it was cheap enough, I'd happily add it to my collection.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Well, the quality of the trailer was decent, so this may be the case. But there was some mold issues too (mostly the head). If the factory manager was behind it, wouldn't it be a perfect copy?

Hopefully there's mold "issues" when they cast the derp head and it comes out NOT looking like ****!

I had already decided to pass on Giant. If the KO sees the light of day, is good quality, and is really only $160 or so, I may reconsider. I suppose I kinda feel bad for MT, but I'm not very impressed by their product and wouldn't be too upset if they were to fall off the map.

There's no honor amongst thieves boys!
The Factory does whatever they want.
I work in the auto industry, these guys send people out to trade shows, to take pictures
of new product, to go back to China and mass produce hard made R&D Copyrighted projects.

They will often fight each other, even if it's one factory over another.
Literal fist fights.

It's much more cut throat over there then you realize.

Kibble wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Well, the quality of the trailer was decent, so this may be the case. But there was some mold issues too (mostly the head). If the factory manager was behind it, wouldn't it be a perfect copy?

Hopefully there's mold "issues" when they cast the derp head and it comes out NOT looking like ****!

I had already decided to pass on Giant. If the KO sees the light of day, is good quality, and is really only $160 or so, I may reconsider. I suppose I kinda feel bad for MT, but I'm not very impressed by their product and wouldn't be too upset if they were to fall off the map.

Get your hands on a legit Giant and you'll change your tune. He's a well made piece. The construction quality is amazing. The design for each robot is, too. The articulation, all around, is amazing. I mean, he can do solid poses as a combiner.

Oh man, can't wait until the legit Green Giant arrives...ahh!!!!

This is great news. I have no interest in a green Giant since I own Hercules, but I would love to get a yellow KO Giant. Even better if it doesnt have those annoying "Maketoys" tonka decals on it. I believe it's a dog eat dog world. I dont feel any more sorry for Maketoys than I do Hasbro. KO's help keep the 3rd party prices in check. Since most 3rd parties operate out of China, maybe Fansproject, TFC, Maketoys, etc. should do business with factories like CHMS to bring down the price of 3rd party figures. More resources and manpower means lower prices. Lower prices mean more units sold. And if 3rd parties let factories like CHMS use the original molds there will be no more KO's. Just tons of originals at reasonable prices for everyone to enjoy. It's a win win for everyone.

It's a win win for everyone.

Except Maketoy and anyone who wants to see them release future products. They lose out. Don't pretend this is "good for everyone." This is only good for people who wanted Giant, but couldn't afford it. And only in the short run because it hampers MT's efforts to make toys LIKE Giant.

As for CHMS, those guys can keep prices at a "low" $40 for a KO because they don't have to actually design any of their the things they make. Talk to me about CHMS when they make something 100% their own.

Autobot032 wrote:Get your hands on a legit Giant and you'll change your tune. He's a well made piece. The construction quality is amazing. The design for each robot is, too. The articulation, all around, is amazing. I mean, he can do solid poses as a combiner.

I believe it's a quality piece...I just don't like the look of the individual bots shy of Mixmaster. Scavanger is ok, but I don't like that his scoop arm is attached to his bot arm. Scrapper is okay, too, but I don't like the alt cab sticking out on his chest. The other 3 I just don't like. And I don't like how much they vary in size and look. Plus I bought Herc so Giant is redundant. I like the look of the combiner fig well enough, but not enough to drop another $350+ on it. Around $150, I might be interested again.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

It's a win win for everyone.

Except Maketoy and anyone who wants to see them release future products. They lose out. Don't pretend this is "good for everyone." This is only good for people who wanted Giant, but couldn't afford it. And only in the short run because it hampers MT's efforts to make toys LIKE Giant.

As for CHMS, those guys can keep prices at a "low" $40 for a KO because they don't have to actually design any of their the things they make. Talk to me about CHMS when they make something 100% their own.

What I meant is the 3rd partys should do the designing and pay CHMS to mold the parts and assemble them properly from the original molds. Everybody gets a cut. CHMS has the resources and workers to run those molds day and night. If TFC and CHMS teams up, you got both brains and brawn. Thats a win win.

Is CHMS excellent quality though? Not sure I own any of their products...

Mekatron wrote:Is CHMS excellent quality though? Not sure I own any of their products...

CHMS molds are between 75-90% comparable to their Henkei originals. They have their issues. But who doesnt these days ? If CHMS was using the original molds instead of reverse molding, it would be 100%. The 3rd party company could train CHMS workers to properly assemble the figures to avoid QC issues.

Rated X wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

It's a win win for everyone.

Except Maketoy and anyone who wants to see them release future products. They lose out. Don't pretend this is "good for everyone." This is only good for people who wanted Giant, but couldn't afford it. And only in the short run because it hampers MT's efforts to make toys LIKE Giant.

As for CHMS, those guys can keep prices at a "low" $40 for a KO because they don't have to actually design any of their the things they make. Talk to me about CHMS when they make something 100% their own.

What I meant is the 3rd partys should do the designing and pay CHMS to mold the parts and assemble them properly from the original molds. Everybody gets a cut. CHMS has the resources and workers to run those molds day and night. If TFC and CHMS teams up, you got both brains and brawn. Thats a win win.

You assume a lot about CHMS here. What makes you think they are any cheaper or better than the factory MT already uses? I mean, you realize that it's much cheaper to copy an existing mold than to produce an original one yourself, right? So far that's all CHMS has done. And done with a spotty record at that. Maybe I'll change my mind if their Ironhide gets glowing reviews. Let's see how their first fully original figure goes before commenting about how cheaply they can make their "high quality" product.

On CHMS' quality - they do decent work. Most KOs are crap, but CHMS does decent work. They aren't what I'd expect from an expencive 3rd party company, but they did a good enough job with the Seekers to get me to buy several. But I hear their CrazyDevy copies are total crap. Can't recall how their Powerglide was. Jury's out on any original molds ... guess we'll finally see with ironhide.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Rated X wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

It's a win win for everyone.

Except Maketoy and anyone who wants to see them release future products. They lose out. Don't pretend this is "good for everyone." This is only good for people who wanted Giant, but couldn't afford it. And only in the short run because it hampers MT's efforts to make toys LIKE Giant.

As for CHMS, those guys can keep prices at a "low" $40 for a KO because they don't have to actually design any of their the things they make. Talk to me about CHMS when they make something 100% their own.

What I meant is the 3rd partys should do the designing and pay CHMS to mold the parts and assemble them properly from the original molds. Everybody gets a cut. CHMS has the resources and workers to run those molds day and night. If TFC and CHMS teams up, you got both brains and brawn. Thats a win win.

You assume a lot about CHMS here. What makes you think they are any cheaper or better than the factory MT already uses? I mean, you realize that it's much cheaper to copy an existing mold than to produce an original one yourself, right? So far that's all CHMS has done. And done with a spotty record at that. Maybe I'll change my mind if their Ironhide gets glowing reviews. Let's see how their first fully original figure goes before commenting about how cheaply they can make their "high quality" product.

On CHMS' quality - they do decent work. Most KOs are crap, but CHMS does decent work. They aren't what I'd expect from an expencive 3rd party company, but they did a good enough job with the Seekers to get me to buy several. But I hear their CrazyDevy copies are total crap. Can't recall how their Powerglide was. Jury's out on any original molds ... guess we'll finally see with ironhide.

As far as I know all original molds are hand carved. Or maybe even done by computer like shapeways in this day and age. (Hasbro, Maketoys,etc) You cant really put a price on designing. They do it out of love with hopes of making a great seller. It’s whatever factory uses the original mold and how much resources they have that will determine the price. Workers can be trained for better QC. Maybe better plastic mixes can be bought. But it seems pretty apparent by now that CHMS can push out more figures cheaper and quicker. Call it “outsourcing” if you like, it works. That is unless the 3rd party companies are just plain overpricing because we keep buying their stuff.

Im not sold on Ironhide because he seems to big and the head sucks.

Rated X wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Rated X wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

It's a win win for everyone.

Except Maketoy and anyone who wants to see them release future products. They lose out. Don't pretend this is "good for everyone." This is only good for people who wanted Giant, but couldn't afford it. And only in the short run because it hampers MT's efforts to make toys LIKE Giant.

As for CHMS, those guys can keep prices at a "low" $40 for a KO because they don't have to actually design any of their the things they make. Talk to me about CHMS when they make something 100% their own.

What I meant is the 3rd partys should do the designing and pay CHMS to mold the parts and assemble them properly from the original molds. Everybody gets a cut. CHMS has the resources and workers to run those molds day and night. If TFC and CHMS teams up, you got both brains and brawn. Thats a win win.

You assume a lot about CHMS here. What makes you think they are any cheaper or better than the factory MT already uses? I mean, you realize that it's much cheaper to copy an existing mold than to produce an original one yourself, right? So far that's all CHMS has done. And done with a spotty record at that. Maybe I'll change my mind if their Ironhide gets glowing reviews. Let's see how their first fully original figure goes before commenting about how cheaply they can make their "high quality" product.

On CHMS' quality - they do decent work. Most KOs are crap, but CHMS does decent work. They aren't what I'd expect from an expencive 3rd party company, but they did a good enough job with the Seekers to get me to buy several. But I hear their CrazyDevy copies are total crap. Can't recall how their Powerglide was. Jury's out on any original molds ... guess we'll finally see with ironhide.

As far as I know all original molds are hand carved. Or maybe even done by computer like shapeways in this day and age. (Hasbro, Maketoys,etc) You cant really put a price on designing. They do it out of love with hopes of making a great seller. It’s whatever factory uses the original mold and how much resources they have that will determine the price. Workers can be trained for better QC. Maybe better plastic mixes can be bought. But it seems pretty apparent by now that CHMS can push out more figures cheaper and quicker. Call it “outsourcing” if you like, it works. That is unless the 3rd party companies are just plain overpricing because we keep buying their stuff.

Im not sold on Ironhide because he seems to big and the head sucks.

Well, you'll have to some price on it. Even for fans, time is money. As much as this is a work of passion for 3rd party guys, you can't expect them to work for nothing. And you CAN put a price on the materials used in the process of designing figures, and those materials are probably not cheap.

I don't know why you're so sold on CHMS or think they're any better at production than the guys MT already uses. Battle Tanker is made excellently. My CHMS Seekers, meanwhile, are made only decently. I suppose CHMS could do a better job if they're given the real molds, but could they do a CHEAPER job? Their stuff isn't any less expensive than imported figured already, so I don't see where the logic is coming from. You;'re assuming a lot about CHMS's business model and MT's business model and think that production is where the lion's share of money goes. Moreover, you're assuming that MT can even work with CHMS without factoring in where either is located.

Plus, you gotta wonder about the logic in turning to a company known for stealing other people's designs to make your own. I might be out of line here, but maybe ... just maybe ... they aren't all that trustworthy.

I'm 100% with Gauntlet on this one.

Irregardless of the quality issues of most KOs, Maketoys is literally being robbed. Why do you think perscription drugs cost so much? The cost to manufacture them? NO! It's the YEARS of R&D involved to develop them. Even with commercial goods (like toys), you can't assume the bulk of the cost is the manufacturing. Buying a Knock-Off when the original is still available is simply buying from a thief.

As far as the fast turnaround for the MakeToys knockoffs, China has never been an honest partner in manufacturing. I'd assume that Maketoys used the same factory to manufacture Giant as they did with the Battle Tanker. I wouldn't be suprised at all if the molds were copied and sold.


And I have both Herc and Yellow Giant and personally, I like Giant better. I had two of my herc units come already defective (thank you BBTS customer support for fixing that) and after combining the sets, Giant is sturdier and an all around better piece.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Rated X wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Rated X wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

It's a win win for everyone.

Except Maketoy and anyone who wants to see them release future products. They lose out. Don't pretend this is "good for everyone." This is only good for people who wanted Giant, but couldn't afford it. And only in the short run because it hampers MT's efforts to make toys LIKE Giant.

As for CHMS, those guys can keep prices at a "low" $40 for a KO because they don't have to actually design any of their the things they make. Talk to me about CHMS when they make something 100% their own.

What I meant is the 3rd partys should do the designing and pay CHMS to mold the parts and assemble them properly from the original molds. Everybody gets a cut. CHMS has the resources and workers to run those molds day and night. If TFC and CHMS teams up, you got both brains and brawn. Thats a win win.

You assume a lot about CHMS here. What makes you think they are any cheaper or better than the factory MT already uses? I mean, you realize that it's much cheaper to copy an existing mold than to produce an original one yourself, right? So far that's all CHMS has done. And done with a spotty record at that. Maybe I'll change my mind if their Ironhide gets glowing reviews. Let's see how their first fully original figure goes before commenting about how cheaply they can make their "high quality" product.

On CHMS' quality - they do decent work. Most KOs are crap, but CHMS does decent work. They aren't what I'd expect from an expencive 3rd party company, but they did a good enough job with the Seekers to get me to buy several. But I hear their CrazyDevy copies are total crap. Can't recall how their Powerglide was. Jury's out on any original molds ... guess we'll finally see with ironhide.

As far as I know all original molds are hand carved. Or maybe even done by computer like shapeways in this day and age. (Hasbro, Maketoys,etc) You cant really put a price on designing. They do it out of love with hopes of making a great seller. It’s whatever factory uses the original mold and how much resources they have that will determine the price. Workers can be trained for better QC. Maybe better plastic mixes can be bought. But it seems pretty apparent by now that CHMS can push out more figures cheaper and quicker. Call it “outsourcing” if you like, it works. That is unless the 3rd party companies are just plain overpricing because we keep buying their stuff.

Im not sold on Ironhide because he seems to big and the head sucks.

Well, you'll have to some price on it. Even for fans, time is money. As much as this is a work of passion for 3rd party guys, you can't expect them to work for nothing. And you CAN put a price on the materials used in the process of designing figures, and those materials are probably not cheap.

I don't know why you're so sold on CHMS or think they're any better at production than the guys MT already uses. Battle Tanker is made excellently. My CHMS Seekers, meanwhile, are made only decently. I suppose CHMS could do a better job if they're given the real molds, but could they do a CHEAPER job? Their stuff isn't any less expensive than imported figured already, so I don't see where the logic is coming from. You;'re assuming a lot about CHMS's business model and MT's business model and think that production is where the lion's share of money goes. Moreover, you're assuming that MT can even work with CHMS without factoring in where either is located.

Plus, you gotta wonder about the logic in turning to a company known for stealing other people's designs to make your own. I might be out of line here, but maybe ... just maybe ... they aren't all that trustworthy.

Actually designing a mold from scratch is a similar process to KO’ing a Hasbro mold. It’s called reverse molding. The only difference is the KO guys are using a Hasbro figure instead of a grey prototype to cast the original mold. I imagine after they cast 5-10 perfect parts they use them to cast a new reverse mold that makes each part in multiples. As far as the prototypes used to cast the original molds, do you really believe some Maketoy CEO contracts designers and pays them by the hour to shave grey plastic into a prototype ? They’re a group of fans that put in work at their own pace and then split the profit when the final units are sold out. 3rd parties don’t operate like a Hasbro style business model where every worker clocks in an 8 hour shift and gets a 401K, health insurance, and vacation days. In other words 3rd parties are not real corporations. They just outsource their final molds to plastic factories that make anything for anybody. Hasbro actually owns their factory and everybody that makes the product from designing, to final production, to packaging is a Hasbro employee on company time.

CHMS can push out figures cheaper. It’s not like those seekers and Sideswipes are raining from the sky. It’s all about cheap labor and enough capital to buy raw materials in bulk prices. I used to talk online to Mike from KO toys. He said KO’s were usually made at night in legit factories that make car parts and other plastic stuff.

The question is are 3rd party companies using more expensive factories, or just jacking the price way up for various reasons ? Even if the CHMS factory is on the other side of China, it would be profitable to ship the molds there or base their operation out of the area where the cheapest factories exist. More figures means more profit. I cant tell Maketoys how to run their business, but I can tell you how I would run it if I were them.
I got the original Battle Tanker for $99.99. But after seeing the review of the KO, I wish I had waited. Getting burnt for 50 bucks is not that bad, but wasting 200 bucks (Giant) would really suck.

As far as CHMS being dishonest, money talks. Why screw over a business partner for a FEW GRAND when they can make you a FEW HUNDRED GRAND over the period of a few years ? Gotta look at the big picture my friend…

BulletSponge wrote:I'm 100% with Gauntlet on this one.

Irregardless of the quality issues of most KOs, Maketoys is literally being robbed. Why do you think perscription drugs cost so much? The cost to manufacture them? NO! It's the YEARS of R&D involved to develop them. Even with commercial goods (like toys), you can't assume the bulk of the cost is the manufacturing. Buying a Knock-Off when the original is still available is simply buying from a thief.

As far as the fast turnaround for the MakeToys knockoffs, China has never been an honest partner in manufacturing. I'd assume that Maketoys used the same factory to manufacture Giant as they did with the Battle Tanker. I wouldn't be suprised at all if the molds were copied and sold.


And I have both Herc and Yellow Giant and personally, I like Giant better. I had two of my herc units come already defective (thank you BBTS customer support for fixing that) and after combining the sets, Giant is sturdier and an all around better piece.

Not true. Drug research is usually founded by private donations from wealthy individuals or federal research grants. In other words, free money by the millions. The reason FDA approved drugs cost so much is pure profit. The relationship between congress and pharmaceutical industries runs deep. What the FDA approves or doesn’t approve is usually based on political favors common throughout big business. Go to Canada and see how many “generic” versions of expensive drugs are sold at half the price. They are all tested and approved by the Canadian version of the FDA. They are basically KO’s that are made out of the jurisdiction of the FDA. And they all work just as well. And just like KO Transformers, they are easily mail ordered into the USA.

You really can’t compare medical “research” to time spent rendering transformation sequences on a computer or shaving plastic off a grey prototype with an exacto blade. You could spend years working on a miracle drug, only for it not to cure what it is supposed to treat. But 3rd party companies seem to be able to pump out figures in 6-8 months from the drawing board to our classics shelves. And the process getting easier and easier apparently by the number of 3rd party figures coming out these days.

Once upon a time somebody created this wonderful drink called orange juice. Maybe only Tropicana should make it and all other companies that duplicate the recipe should be indicted. If you buy Minute Maid you are buying from a thief, right ? We would also be thiefs if we buy anything from the "Equate" line at wal-mart instead of buying the name brands like Motrin or Listerine ? In theory, that’s how it would be if we all believed in your rationale about thiefs.

Rated X wrote:Once upon a time somebody created this wonderful drink called orange juice. Maybe only Tropicana should make it and all other companies that duplicate the recipe should be indicted. If you buy Minute Maid you are buying from a thief, right ?

Wow, even if I wasn't anti-bootleg... you'd have lost me there. Really? Even putting aside the grey area that is Maketoys having a right to a design of six toy construction vehicles that happen to have large similarities to the Constructicons... Comparing different companies making orange juice directly to intelectual property theft? That's... well, that's apples and orange juice, my friend.

But to go back to another thing in your post... As long as Maketoys doesn't slap Decepticon logos on their toys, actually call them Constructicons or any other associated names, or use toy designs identical to or slightly modified from Hasbro molds, then I don't consider Maketoys a bootleg product. Rather, they'd be like Wal*Mart with their Equate brand to Hasbro's name brand. They're the generic equivelent of the Constructicons, but also an original product by Maketoys. (It isn't a perfect analogy, since in the drug world a generic is supposed to be a fairly close copy where as with Transformers, third party products should be original designs... But go with it!)

On a slightly different topic... some in this thread have been debating the quality of CHMS items... Well, I will admit I did go to the dark side once, and bought some of the KO Seekers... They feel cheep, have sloppy paint, and I've had two of them break on me, one a pretty bad break. If I were to compare them with the Hasbro seekers I have, they are rather crap. The one Maketoys product I currently have (Battle Tanker) is a solidly built toy. (As is, I fear I have heard, it's knock off... so I would guess it wasn't by the CHMS people.) I would not want a third party producer who made toys I was interested in using the same lack of quality control I saw on those Seekers. They're good for looking pretty on a shelf if you don't touch them, but not much else.

I find it hillarious that you think the drugs we get up here are KOs of perscription stuff just because we allow some forms of medicine to be sold that the FDA does not.

Yeah, you just keep on believing cheap KO factories are the solution to the 3rd party price problem. I'm sure no 3rd party company has ever thought of using cheap labor before. They must use the most expencive factories possible sicne they're so small and can obviously afford it. Why not go to FP Core and make this brilliant suggestion there?

As far as CHMS being dishonest, money talks. Why screw over a business partner for a FEW GRAND when they can make you a FEW HUNDRED GRAND over the period of a few years ? Gotta look at the big picture my friend…

There is so much wrong with this sentence that I don't even know where to begin.

Edit: And, while full of sarcasm, I actually think it's a good idea to go to FP Core and get the real deal on why things are priced like they are instead of just assuming it's all in the cost of materials an further assuming that CHMS is the solution to the whole production problem. They aren't MT, but they do know them.