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dirk2243 wrote:

shamone wrote:

dirk2243 wrote:

shamone wrote:

paul053 wrote:Justice comes with victory. Winner makes their own history.

If Megatron wins, he is a patriot. Since he lost, he is just a maniac or even a moron. Patriots or winners don't listen to a skinny hotdog lip girl.

this

Prime himself says to Sentinel when he ask did they win the war he said no.

Patriotism is in the eyes of the beholder. Osama Bin Laden and his followers think there patriots. I do not share there same idea's and do not see them as patriots.

so....if you see megs as a patriot....thats your point of view...if not.....

i think i see your point, but osama wouldnt consider himself a patriot,its not about nation for him tbf

but yeh hitler was a patriot

I agree with you about hitler (in his mind) But for Osama it was about a religion which is idealy bigger right, then a country? Wanting Westerners out of Muslim countries? And yet, his thoughts wern't in line with actual Muslim teachings. I think (and my opinion) that he saw himself as a patriot for the Muslim cause, yet he seemed to shift his teachings around to fit his needs.

Reminds me a bit of Hitler.... Aryan race supremacy, Communism needs to be crushed.

@ dirk2243: your last statement is confusing...are you saying adolf in the name of aryan supremacy want to crush communism or are YOU saying communism needs to be crushed?

if we're on the subject of conflicting patriotism...thomas jefferson wanted freedom yet kept black slaves after the US gained their independence. freedom from the british yet keeping slaves? how about andrew jackson? He is praised as a protector of popular democracy and individual liberty for American citizens, but criticized for his support for slavery and Indian removal. The tea party movement...

no no....I was agreeing that Hitler saw himself as a patriot (but not the world nor I).

It's like, let me start this war, Go after countries I don't see as equals and call myself a genious/patriot.

"Megatron.... start a war on a peacful planet (that he is 50% in charge of) and the last movie he comes off so that people see this as a patriot?

I agree with ya. many "patriots" winning or loosing have some issues. Problem is the story usually goes to the winner.

dirk2243 wrote:no no....I was agreeing that Hitler saw himself as a patriot (but not the world nor I).

It's like, let me start this war, Go after countries I don't see as equals and call myself a genious/patriot.

"Megatron.... start a war on a peacful planet (that he is 50% in charge of) and the last movie he comes off so that people see this as a patriot?

I agree with ya. many "patriots" winning or loosing have some issues. Problem is the story usually goes to the winner.

chinggis khan had a better excuse "as there is one God in heaven, there should only be one king on earth". he viewed all opposition not as equals but rebels to his rule and while the mongolians revere him akin to a god, the rest view him as a monster from hell...that or the punishment of God.

If you think about it, practically every version of the decepticons follow the strongest, the most ruthless individual (the g1 marvel comic has the lone exception...ratbat) and they follow only him (because they learned to fear power) and while movie optimus has the power and the ruthlessness... can he muster the ferocity needed to rein the remaining decepticons and bring them under his banner? and can he keep them under his thumb long enough that they'll be...i dunno, domesticated/civilized?

In my opinion, they didn't make Megatron's character clear enough. Then again, all of his dialogue from the three movies could fit on one piece of paper.

Also in the third one, he seemed less of a tyrant and more of a Hobo with a Shotgun. I guess the idea of a prideful, powerful dictator got boring for Bay.

Decepticon_Vandal wrote:In my opinion, they didn't make Megatron's character clear enough. Then again, all of his dialogue from the three movies could fit on one piece of paper.

Also in the third one, he seemed less of a tyrant and more of a Hobo with a Shotgun. I guess the idea of a prideful, powerful dictator got boring for Bay.

its sad that we have to instill motivation and character to the cons and bots because bay and the writers couldnt be bothered

is there one set of writers or are the writers different from one movie to the other? and does Michael even remember what happened to the previous movie that he does not notice the plot holes the new movie presents to the continuity?


did ANYONE tell Michael that the scripts doesn't make any sense continuity wise?

Optimus Primevil wrote:is there one set of writers or are the writers different from one movie to the other? and does Michael even remember what happened to the previous movie that he does not notice the plot holes the new movie presents to the continuity?


did ANYONE tell Michael that the scripts doesn't make any sense continuity wise?

Yes, yes they do. Are they perfect? No. But in all honesty, not every single aspect of the films are going to be explained in great detail. They just aren't. at some point, people need to fill in the blanks themselfs. And to point, i think this is supposed to be the case. Let the audience come up to their own conclusions and have their own views of the characters.

Decepticon_Vandal wrote:In my opinion, they didn't make Megatron's character clear enough. Then again, all of his dialogue from the three movies could fit on one piece of paper.

Also in the third one, he seemed less of a tyrant and more of a Hobo with a Shotgun. I guess the idea of a prideful, powerful dictator got boring for Bay.

In Megatron...Yes. We've seen him play this role before, so why not show his weaker side? Or maybe Megatron wasn't supposed to be seen as viliness as the last two movies since that role was filled by Sentinel? Meaning they wanted the Tyrannt dictator role to be dominated by the main vilian. Thats not to say that Megs didn't have his moments. He said himself that Sentinel was his "greatest accomplishment." So i don't know about you, but to corupt the Leader of the autobots with the ideals that goes against everything they've been fighting for for hunreads of years certianly shows power in my eyes.