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by **dinogeist** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 9:50 pm

Whether or not people liked/hated the live action TF movies. One can't deny how much money micheal bay & his team made for hasbro/Takara & the TF toy line. because of micheal bays TF movies,the TF moie toy lines reached record time highs in selling decent in stores.

Micheal bay appears to be a decent polite man. his good bye words were polite & sincere.

Shia la beouf saying he isn't returning after TF3 ends is kinda RIDICULOUS & a EMPTY threat. Because without micheal bay they'll be a reboot. reboots never have the same actors.

by **Treetop Maximus** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 9:57 pm

I'm going to miss the live action franchise and I just hope that they'll make more toys in the Bayformers aesthetic from time to time. But I doubt they will.

by **dinogeist** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:03 pm

Treetop Maximus wrote:I'm going to miss the live action franchise and I just hope that they'll make more toys in the Bayformers aesthetic from time to time. But I doubt they will.

I agree on the toys part.

One has to give micheal bay & his team the "positive credit" they deserve for helping to design the most awesome TF toys of all time. which are known as the movie-verse TF toys.

These movie-verse TF toys are pure awesome. the sculpts/designs look like they cater to older kids over 12 years old & older veteran adult TF fans. I like that they use realistic liscensed vechicles & realistic military vechicles. the complex transformations are another plus in my book. the Movie verse leader sized TF toys are pure works of art especially the optimus toys. the sheer fact takara is labeling some movie verse leader toys as Masterpiece toys says a lot in terms of design & poseability & hard work to make these toys look amazing.

News Credits: 1 · by **vulgar_wraith** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:04 pm

Autobot032 wrote:I've used this argument before, and I'll use it again because it's true, logical and honest.

Bay can be blamed for the following:

- Bad attitude.
- Jerky, fast cuts that make it difficult to make out scenes and characters.
- Not giving the films enough time to flesh out characters or depth in scenes.
- Some, but not all of the sophomoric and juvenile humor. (More on this in a moment.)

Alex Kurtzman and Roberto Orci can be blamed for the following:

- Hack writing.
- Boring writing. (The first hour of the first film was human dramedy, with barely a whisper or hint of TransFormers in it.)
- Reusing the same old schtick, sometimes in the same film. (Star Trek. Remember Kirk nearly died on a ledge? No less than THREE times in the same TWO HOUR movie?? Really? There's no other possible danger they could've come up with? And they got that idea from Star Trek III when he kicked Kruge into the erupting planet beneath him.)
- No new or fresh ideas of their own. (They've built their reputation and career on the works of other people. Zorro, TransFormers, Mission: Impossible, Star Trek, Hawaii Five-0, all of it is their take on someone else's work, none of it original or their own.)

Bay can only go so far with what he's given. Past a certain point, he's being given only so much and he has to make it work. People have made this argument before: "Well, what about Ridley Scott? He'd never film something off of a script so weak!" and guess what? They're wrong. He has made bombs before, and if he does turn down a script...he has far more power, money and name status to allow him to say "Oh screw off. Write me something worthy of my work." Bay is very faithful to the people he works with, and when he accepts a job, it's not just for him but also for his crew. It's not just his paycheck, not just his time, it's their's. It's a team effort and he's one of the biggest proponents of "there is no I in team".

When the writers went on strike during ROTF, he went on with it. Filming what he could, where and when he could, and kept the paychecks coming to his crew, his cast, and answering to his bosses at Paramount and Dreamworks, not to mention the producers.

People look at Bay and make light of his work and mock him and tear into him, but they have no idea what it's like to be in his shoes. Plenty of people rely on him and plenty of people demand a lot of him. He answers that call, every time. Is it perfect? Of course not. Is it commendable and deserves respect? YES.

Orci & Kurtzman are your culprits, ladies and gentlemen.

The Mask Of Zorro? Excellent movie.
The Legend Of Zorro? Boring, over long and pales in comparison to the original.

Mission: Impossible III? Fun, accessible to everyone, but throwaway entertainment. Much like hollow sweets that give you nothing.

TransFormers? BORING. The human focus was too heavy. (Oh and before anyone complains about the humor being Bay's fault...I read excerpts of the first movie's novel. Chock full of crappy humor. Bay had no control over the book. What was it based on? The screenplay written by Orci & Kurtzman.)

Star Trek? Fun, accessible to everyone, but horribly flawed. The flaws become more and more apparent with each viewing. So much so that they stick out and jar you. Doesn't make the film bad, but it certainly could've been better.

Revenge Of The Fallen? A much better movie, but had Ehren Kruger helping out. Heavily flawed and awkward in some scenes, overly silly in others. I don't deny that there are serious problems with the film, but it's nowhere near as bad as critics say. (Once you see DOTM, you'll see that all of ROTF's good parts came from Kruger, and none from them.)

Hawaii Five-0? Great show, but they wrote the pilot and I have to say it was one of the weakest TV shows I've ever seen. Action, action, action, and no depth to the characters, no real background story. (It took other writers and the rest of the entire SEASON to do that.)

TransFormers Prime? Great show, loads more depth than some of their other work, but it's dark. Autobots that kill humans? Those aren't the TransFormers I remember. Sure, it's more realistic, I don't deny that, but it's not the Optimus Prime I remember. It's not the Optimus Prime that Peter Cullen turned into a hero for generations. Where is his humor? His heart? His compassion? And the episodes written by other writers make the show stronger.

Bay had nothing to do with Prime or the other properties and they all have one weakness...the writing. If you can't see that, then you're just unwilling to, and he's your scapegoat for everything and anything.

There's one positive thing about Bay leaving the movies: He doesn't have to deal with this ungrateful and self entitled fandom, anymore.

I would be more willing to accept this proposed idea.I will still say the movies are not as bad as some say I still think they fun.

by **Capt.Failure** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:12 pm

vulgar_wraith wrote:I would be more willing to accept this proposed idea.I will still say the movies are not as bad as some say I still think they fun.

This. With this kind of entertainment fun trumps everything. I had tons of fun, and so did the audiences when I saw them. I haven't seen an audience get this into a film since the Star Wars special editions. Cheering, applause, laughing along and booing the Decepticons, things I look forward to again on Tuesday.

by **dinogeist** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:27 pm

Capt.Failure wrote:
vulgar_wraith wrote:I would be more willing to accept this proposed idea.I will still say the movies are not as bad as some say I still think they fun.

This. With this kind of entertainment fun trumps everything. I had tons of fun, and so did the audiences when I saw them. I haven't seen an audience get this into a film since the Star Wars special editions. Cheering, applause, laughing along and booing the Decepticons, things I look forward to again on Tuesday.

I was satisfied with the live action movies because I was in it purely for the CGI Robots designs & how they moved/fought on the big screen. as long as I got this,I didn't need the other stuff.

I agree with some of TF fans in the on-line fandom. when they say the actors chosen were horrible & had little talent. I agree that the writters didn't do a decent job writting the scripts. I agree that the dialogue was corny.

Shia la beof,I dis-like him on & off screen. can't go into detail because I don't want to get banned.

I was sad & upset that megan Fox got fired & isn't in the DOTM movie. I view megan fox as simply beautiful & cute. megan fox was a trend setter because she had dark black/brown hair. it was refreshing to see the non-blondes getting put into the spot light & stealing the show.

Honestly megan fox & her beautiful body+cute smile made watching the horrible TF live action movies bearable & worth while.

News Credits: 2 · by **xyl360** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 11:13 pm

deathy wrote:I was satisfied with the live action movies because I was in it purely for the CGI Robots designs & how they moved/fought on the big screen. as long as I got this,I didn't need the other stuff.

I think that's why I was initially so impressed with the first film, overlooking its flaws. But just as with a new video game that has great graphics, a movie with no "replay value" won't last very long.

As I said before, I don't blame anyone who made the films, they did their jobs, which were to take the Transformers mythos/franchise and turn it into a blockbuster summer film. That's precisely what they created, I just hope that it gets revisited later and gets a different treatment now that awesome looking, massive CGI robots that turn into things are somewhat old hat. That's when audiences will be looking for more, once the novelty of the effects has worn off (which I still must admit, are truly incredible, especially in HD).

Either way, someone had to take the first step and make the first one, just as Burton did with Batman, and now we have Batman Begins etc., which, while the Burton films have their place and are decent films, in my opinion do not compare to the reboot.

Anyway, I'll look on the bright side. At least they made the Transformers look cool, the effects were one thing that were critical to creating a TF live action film series, and in my opinion, they never disappointed in that respect.

by **Megatronsdemise666** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 11:18 pm

vegetacron wrote:I am seriously glad this crap is going to be over after this movie. Micheal Bay and Shia LeBarf can go do other stuff that i could care less about. Lets start thinking about a reboot. Get some real talent into this and make a set of movies that are actually going to be worth watching.

Thank you, Micheal Bay for placing my favorite IP back into the limelight and causing revenue so that bigger and better things could happen! But in the same sentence, **** you, Michael Bay for creating a set of **** movies that bashed a beloved IP from my childhood."

dude without michael bay transformers would have been dead after transformers animated. when i was in school before the first transformers movie NO ONE TALKED ABOUT NOR LIKED THE TRANSFORMERS. everyone thought it was gay, and to be honost i was an outcast, but guess what after the first transformers movie in 2007. EVERONE was talking about how awesome it was and i was stunned by how many people were turned into transformers fans. even people that told me it was gay started collecting that toys. i even saw girls carrying around bumblebees at my school.

shouldnt you be happy for the movies? especially the toy line, because there making so much more money that it could bring a whole NEW series of transformers and a good cartoon to go withit

by **Capt.Failure** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 11:22 pm

xyl360 wrote:
deathy wrote:I was satisfied with the live action movies because I was in it purely for the CGI Robots designs & how they moved/fought on the big screen. as long as I got this,I didn't need the other stuff.
I think that's why I was initially so impressed with the first film, overlooking its flaws. But just as with a new video game that has great graphics, a movie with no "replay value" won't last very long.

As I said before, I don't blame anyone who made the films, they did their jobs, which were to take the Transformers mythos/franchise and turn it into a blockbuster summer film. That's precisely what they created, I just hope that it gets revisited later and gets a different treatment now that awesome looking, massive CGI robots that turn into things are somewhat old hat. That's when audiences will be looking for more, once the novelty of the effects has worn off (which I still must admit, are truly incredible, especially in HD).

Either way, someone had to take the first step and make the first one, just as Burton did with Batman, and now we have Batman Begins etc., which, while the Burton films have their place and are decent films, in my opinion do not compare to the reboot.

Anyway, I'll look on the bright side. At least they made the Transformers look cool, the effects were one thing that were critical to creating a TF live action film series, and in my opinion, they never disappointed in that respect.

I wouldn't say the giant robot theme is becoming old hat. Guillermo del Toro just signed on to do a film with the writer from Monsters called Pacific Rim. It's basically mankind vs. Cthulhuesque abominations in giant mechs ala Gundam. There's also a film coming out in September called Real Steel that, I **** you not, looks like a Rock'em Sock'em Robots movie.

In short: Transformers is out for awhile until the next film series, but giant robot movies are gonna be in for awhile trying to recreate that success.

News Credits: 1 · by **D-340** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:47 am

5150 Cruiser wrote:
See, your not getting my point. There's absolutely nothing wrong with voicing a negative opinion on something you don't like. Especialy if you paid for it and can't get a refund. BUt there's a difference between a negative coment, and telling someone to F*** off, you make **** movies, and saying that you don't care about respecting him or not. If thats the case, why should he respect you? And on that note, we disrespected him long before he "disrespected" us. Death treats, home being broken into.. and for what? Prime being a long nose Perterbuilt and having flames? Lame.
So in the end, complain all you want. Its your right. But expect the same level of "respect" back. Also, I don't know what you concider a "Younger crowd", but i'm 29 and grew up with G1. I liked both movies. They brought me out of my TF dark ages.Yes, i'm sure the somehow, the franchise would have continued without the movies, but it would have been alot less lonely road.

First, I wasn't saying eff off, you make **** movies. I liked the first, alot. I like all the movie line toys thus far, alot. I have quite a few of them. My problem is with all the blindly devoted movie supporters who say the Transformers are nothing without the films, and were dying before they came along. Those are just false and ignorant statements. Just because the Transformers faded from your minds years prior to the movies doesn't mean it was a dead franchise. It was one of Hasbro's top selling lines consistently for years, and many fans who stuck around post G1, Beast Wars, or whatever can certainly vouch for that. The Botcon's attendance numbers were climbing every year prior to the movies, toys were still flying off shelves pre 2007(anyone remember the stretch during Armada when no new toys could be found for months? Remember Smokescreen peg warming? Sure you do.), merchandise other than toys was being marketed just like now. And all without the help of the live action movies. Once again, I agree, the live action films thrust the Transformers into the mainstream, but it's not like they were gone and all of a sudden miraculously revived. The franchise was doing just fine before.

And, like Burn, anything bad with both films(ROTF more so than the first) I blame Orci and Kurtzman equally. Their hands were in it just as much as Bay's. For me though, Bay just comes of as a jackass. Most interviews prior to whatever he's doing now, he seemingly talked down to ALL the fans, making us all sound like horrible little basement dwellers who had no lives. And then on top of it, the Transformers to him were nothing more than stupid toys(his words) until enough money was waved in front of his face. That's my take anyway.

News Credits: 668 · by **Autobot032** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:01 am

D-340 wrote:And, like Burn, anything bad with both films(ROTF more so than the first) I blame Orci and Kurtzman equally. Their hands were in it just as much as Bay's. For me though, Bay just comes of as a jackass. Most interviews prior to whatever he's doing now, he seemingly talked down to ALL the fans, making us all sound like horrible little basement dwellers who had no lives. And then on top of it, the Transformers to him were nothing more than stupid toys(his words) until enough money was waved in front of his face. That's my take anyway.

You're close on this one.

I agree that his attitude towards the fandom and the property hasn't always been kind. It's never escaped me how he's acted, especially how he responded to the award at this year's Botcon. However, his direction of the films, his work put into them, and his flare for the visuals shouldn't be mocked or criticized.

He did deliver on his promise of making them bigger than life and he definitely delivered on the wow factor.

The writing is out of his hands at the end of the day, because the studio can make a final cut if they wish to. In the end, he's really just the guy behind the camera and yelling at people. They don't have as much control in the final analysis. People think they do, but they don't.

For example, Green Lantern. There's rumors going around that director Martin Campbell's final cut of the film was longer and had far more depth and sensible action in it. What we're seeing is the studio's cut of the film and that we can expect a director's cut on DVD and Blu-Ray. Whether that pans out, or not, is still up for grabs, but it's further proof that in the end, the director doesn't have ultimate control.

Highlander 2: The Quickening, which did suffer from bad writing, is the perfect example of the director getting screwed over by studio editing. Russell Mulcahy worked his butt off and literally put his life on the line to finish the film. The studio cut it from a little over two hours, down to a little over 90. The director's cut of the film makes so much more sense than the theatrical cut did. Still, the story suffered due to bad writing and terrible ideas. It wasn't the director's fault.

Same thing applies to Bay. While the studio isn't screwing him over, his writers did. Kruger seems to be the only one capable of giving us a good story.

News Credits: 1 · by **D-340** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:09 am

Autobot032 wrote:
D-340 wrote:And, like Burn, anything bad with both films(ROTF more so than the first) I blame Orci and Kurtzman equally. Their hands were in it just as much as Bay's. For me though, Bay just comes of as a jackass. Most interviews prior to whatever he's doing now, he seemingly talked down to ALL the fans, making us all sound like horrible little basement dwellers who had no lives. And then on top of it, the Transformers to him were nothing more than stupid toys(his words) until enough money was waved in front of his face. That's my take anyway.

You're close on this one.

I agree that his attitude towards the fandom and the property hasn't always been kind. It's never escaped me how he's acted, especially how he responded to the award at this year's Botcon. However, his direction of the films, his work put into them, and his flare for the visuals shouldn't be mocked or criticized.

He did deliver on his promise of making them bigger than life and he definitely delivered on the wow factor.

The writing is out of his hands at the end of the day, because the studio can make a final cut if they wish to. In the end, he's really just the guy behind the camera and yelling at people. They don't have as much control in the final analysis. People think they do, but they don't.

For example, Green Lantern. There's rumors going around that director Martin Campbell's final cut of the film was longer and had far more depth and sensible action in it. What we're seeing is the studio's cut of the film and that we can expect a director's cut on DVD and Blu-Ray. Whether that pans out, or not, is still up for grabs, but it's further proof that in the end, the director doesn't have ultimate control.

Highlander 2: The Quickening, which did suffer from bad writing, is the perfect example of the director getting screwed over by studio editing. Russell Mulcahy worked his butt off and literally put his life on the line to finish the film. The studio cut it from a little over two hours, down to a little over 90. The director's cut of the film makes so much more sense than the theatrical cut did. Still, the story suffered due to bad writing and terrible ideas. It wasn't the director's fault.

Same thing applies to Bay. While the studio isn't screwing him over, his writers did. Kruger seems to be the only one capable of giving us a good story.

Agreed sir, on all points. Hope you're right about Kruger too, I really want DOTM to be good. If it is, and you ever make it to Joliet, I owe you a beer.

by **dinogeist** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:12 am

D-340 wrote:
5150 Cruiser wrote:
See, your not getting my point. There's absolutely nothing wrong with voicing a negative opinion on something you don't like. Especialy if you paid for it and can't get a refund. BUt there's a difference between a negative coment, and telling someone to F*** off, you make **** movies, and saying that you don't care about respecting him or not. If thats the case, why should he respect you? And on that note, we disrespected him long before he "disrespected" us. Death treats, home being broken into.. and for what? Prime being a long nose Perterbuilt and having flames? Lame.
So in the end, complain all you want. Its your right. But expect the same level of "respect" back. Also, I don't know what you concider a "Younger crowd", but i'm 29 and grew up with G1. I liked both movies. They brought me out of my TF dark ages.Yes, i'm sure the somehow, the franchise would have continued without the movies, but it would have been alot less lonely road.

First, I wasn't saying eff off, you make **** movies. I liked the first, alot. I like all the movie line toys thus far, alot. I have quite a few of them. My problem is with all the blindly devoted movie supporters who say the Transformers are nothing without the films, and were dying before they came along. Those are just false and ignorant statements. Just because the Transformers faded from your minds years prior to the movies doesn't mean it was a dead franchise. It was one of Hasbro's top selling lines consistently for years, and many fans who stuck around post G1, Beast Wars, or whatever can certainly vouch for that. The Botcon's attendance numbers were climbing every year prior to the movies, toys were still flying off shelves pre 2007(anyone remember the stretch during Armada when no new toys could be found for months? Remember Smokescreen peg warming? Sure you do.), merchandise other than toys was being marketed just like now. And all without the help of the live action movies. Once again, I agree, the live action films thrust the Transformers into the mainstream, but it's not like they were gone and all of a sudden miraculously revived. The franchise was doing just fine before.

And, like Burn, anything bad with both films(ROTF more so than the first) I blame Orci and Kurtzman equally. Their hands were in it just as much as Bay's. For me though, Bay just comes of as a jackass. Most interviews prior to whatever he's doing now, he seemingly talked down to ALL the fans, making us all sound like horrible little basement dwellers who had no lives. And then on top of it, the Transformers to him were nothing more than stupid toys(his words) until enough money was waved in front of his face. That's my take anyway.

It's a mixed 50/50 bag. the live action TF movies & lines equally helped & hurt various other TF toy lines.

The live action movies/toy line caused tons of great toy lines to end earlier & we got tons of cancelled never seen toys.

Animated was suspose to get a season 4 & 5 with toy lines. but had to end early due to the toy resources being given to ROTF. Hasbro/Takara couldn't afford nor did they have the time to do 2 full blown toy lines in 2009 & 2010.

A bunch of great awesome TF toy lines & toys got cancelled in 2006 & 2007 due to the 2007 TF movie. like the titanium 6 inch toy line & alternators getting cancelled. we were suspose to get 5 titanium 6 inch TF toys which were shockwave,cosmos,arcee,WW Bumblebee & G-1 Galvatron. the alternators that we were suspose to get were bigger sized versions starting with G-1 Megatron as a liscensed Cadillac escalade.

Animated got cut short & the money & resources got taken away to make the ROTF toys awesome. we were supose to get a supreme size omega supreme, a 3 changer season 4 marudaer megatron. several season 3 character toys & upgrades toys.

The UPSIDE was the MOVIE VERSE toys & movies sell beyond well in stores. these toys sell out better than previous TF toy lines do. the better they sell in stores,the more hasbro/takara makes money. thus the bigger The future TF toy budgets are for years to come. having the movie verse toys sell beyond decent in stores encourages stores to buy more TF toys from other TF toy lines beyond the movie verse. LETS FACE IT Hasbro can create all the toys they want,if retailers aren't willing to take a chance & stock them in decent/any volume units then hasbro makes no money. as hasbro is stuck with wharehouses full of un-wanted TF toys that no one wants to take a chance on stocking.

While most view the micheal bay live action movies as horrible(myself included) some of us (myself included) does realize that have 3 back to back to back blockbuster movies in theathres is a great thing for the over all TF toy line. having these movies/dvd's success under hasbro's/takara's belts makes these 2 toy compannies invincible/powerful world wide as far a the retail store chains are concerned. because the live action TF movies make so much money in theathres,more buy the movie verse toys.

Having the movie verse toys sell beyond decent in a downward spiral economy is just a amazing thing.

having movie toys sell out like hot cakes. makes retailers feel comfortable with ordering higher volume units from hasbro other TF toy lines.

Having the movie verse TF toys sell out like hot cakes. gives hasbro more profit,resources,employees,higher budget to create better non-movie TF toys. like the fan catered TF toy lines,Masterpieces,TF Prime,etc...

by **moritron** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:13 am

wow. some of these comments remind me that i don't just hate fanboys because of toy aisle competition. to those who've been saying transformers was thriving from r.i.d./ unicron saga, get real. those shows and the toys that came from them almost destroyed the franchise, and made it harder to get another transformer show on the air. whether you like them or not, if not for the movies, the toyline would be dying or dead, and we certainly wouldn't have gotten lines like generations or reveal the shield. the movies revived the franchise the same way that the beast era revived the franchise in the 90's. so you can thank mr.bay for that sweet generations warpath that just came out, if not for the movies, it never would've seen the light of day.
as for the movies, maybe they weren't the best or what everyone wanted, but they were fun. i don't know what everyone expected, but i went to see giant robots transform and fight each other, both movies gave me that,(the forest scene in ROTF was epic.) i don't get g1 fans who complain about the plots of these movies. do you even remember the g1 cartoon? trust me the plots of most episodes of the g1 series would have you guys begging for a story as good as ROTF. mr. bay didn't rape your childhood, he didn't ruin transformers, some people need to move on from this hating.

by **dinogeist** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:35 am

moritron wrote:wow. some of these comments remind me that i don't just hate fanboys because of toy aisle competition. to those who've been saying transformers was thriving from r.i.d./ unicron saga, get real. those shows and the toys that came from them almost destroyed the franchise, and made it harder to get another transformer show on the air. whether you like them or not, if not for the movies, the toyline would be dying or dead, and we certainly wouldn't have gotten lines like generations or reveal the shield. the movies revived the franchise the same way that the beast era revived the franchise in the 90's. so you can thank mr.bay for that sweet generations warpath that just came out, if not for the movies, it never would've seen the light of day.
as for the movies, maybe they weren't the best or what everyone wanted, but they were fun. i don't know what everyone expected, but i went to see giant robots transform and fight each other, both movies gave me that,(the forest scene in ROTF was epic.) i don't get g1 fans who complain about the plots of these movies. do you even remember the g1 cartoon? trust me the plots of most episodes of the g1 series would have you guys begging for a story as good as ROTF. mr. bay didn't rape your childhood, he didn't ruin transformers, some people need to move on from this hating.

All the the transformers cartoons you mentioned in your reply were on highly rated & top notch networks. Like WB,Fox,UPN,Cartoon network,SCI-FI & Other networks around the world.

Beastwars sold really decent in stores but lost steam/sales when the toys went TM2. Beastmachines didn't sell that great in stores. Rid for a one year toy line pratically sold out in stores world wide. the Armada,energon & Cybertron toy lines sold beyond decent in stores.

Animated toys had a hard time selling stores in america due to the downward spiral economy just starting around this time & still going on right now.

The fan catered TF toy lines like classics/Generations/RTS sold great in stores & are currently highly wanted on ebay.

Hasbro from time to time post's yearly quarter updates on how their brands are doing on the internet. everyone has acess to this. this is why fans know what sells & what didn't.

As far as all the TF cartoons from 1996 to 2011 Not doing great. networks post rattings for everyone to see. needless to say almost all the 1996 thru 2011 TF cartoons did beyond great in rattings.

For what it Worth being on the top network when the network was number isn't something to dismiss. Beastwars & beastmachines were both on Fox kids when that network was number one. being on cartoon nework on of the most highly rated & watched network for over 6 years isn't something to dis-miss nor take lightly.

by **moritron** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:22 am

those series may have started strong, but they didn't end that way. and except for the r.i.d stuff, (which i'm pretty sure was produced in smaller numbers than future lines), most of those toys warmed shelves and ended up in clearance bins.

News Credits: 1 · by **vegetacron** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 6:19 am

@Vulgar_Wraith

Revenge Of The Fallen? A much better movie,

LMAO, you just lost credibility in what you were saying after i read that.

-Anyhow-

I'm glad you brought up the Star Trek reboot. I'm not a huge old school Star Trek fan, but i've seen quite a few of the shows and all the movies. I thought the Star Trek reboot was awesome. Thats a good example of how to do a reboot AND Orci and Kurtzman where a part of that. Thats a movie that has memorable characters and character development. Not just random idiots running around a war zone pretending to have some purpose. You actually understand why Spock reacts to things the way he does. You understand why Kirk becomes the leader. It just doesn't happen because of a bunch of crap that happens of screen that has left the viewer to make up their own inventions on why it should be this way.

LeBarf's version of Sam Witwicky was terrible. Before Micheal Bay decided they probabily shouldn't develop his character, he was shown as a horny con-man. And these characters are just not memorable at all. At the end of the day, i'll have better luck remembering the motivations of the new version of Spock than i will of whatever Megan Fox's character's name was. LMAO...which sadly, no matter how many times ive seen the film, i still can't remember.

So laying blame on the writers, more so than Bay = you wrong.

I don't care what else they wrote, as i don't care about the other crap, but they wrote 2 movies that i watched: Star Trek, which was good. ROTF, which might as well have been a Uwe Boll movie.

So that tells me what? That it must have been the director and or his studio that screwed this up. Thus, the Bay hate.

I mean seriously, nice try. But you're logic is about as flawed as mine is in your eyes.

I would like to add though, that Micheal Bay has officially reached "Uwe Boll" status in my mind. rofl

News Credits: 668 · by **Autobot032** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 6:37 am

vegetacron wrote:
moritron wrote:i don't get g1 fans who complain about the plots of these movies. do you even remember the g1 cartoon? trust me the plots of most episodes of the g1 series would have you guys begging for a story as good as ROTF. mr. bay didn't rape your childhood, he didn't ruin transformers, some people need to move on from this hating.

*EDITED*

Please, just leave now.

Perhaps you should take your own advice. If you can't function any better than this because he posted his opinion, then perhaps it is you who needs to find the door and be on the other side of it.

Go catch your breath, have a moment or two to calm down, and don't get so upset over such silliness.

Honestly, you're taking all of this waaaaay too seriously.

News Credits: 2 · by **Tekka** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 6:40 am

i don't get bay fans who complain about the plots of g1 episodes. do you even remember the bay movies? trust me the plots of most movies of michael bay would have you guys begging for a story as good as Carnage in C Minor. mr. dixon didn't rape your childhood, he didn't ruin transformers, some people need to move on from this hating.

News Credits: 1 · by **vegetacron** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 6:54 am

Autobot032 wrote:
vegetacron wrote:*EDITED*

Please, just leave now.

Perhaps you should take your own advice. If you can't function any better than this because he posted his opinion, then perhaps it is you who needs to find the door and be on the other side of it.

Go catch your breath, have a moment or two to calm down, and don't get so upset over such silliness.

Honestly, you're taking all of this waaaaay too seriously.

I did. Thats why i edited it. Please read again.

Sorry, but that other comment just about had me pissed, until i realized the source wasn't worth the time.

MACROSS WORLD PROFILE · by **ae_productions** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:37 am

Maybe we can get a director with talent!

BEST NEWS I'VE HEARD IN A WHILE!

Good riddance, no-talent ass clown.

MACROSS WORLD PROFILE · by **ae_productions** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:39 am

The man said "I won't make a movie...about stupid Saturday morning cartoons..."

And he did anyway.

He's a sell out.

He's just thanking you for lining his pocket book and saving his failing career. Which is why he did Transformers. His last few films bombed, and it was an easy bail out.

Damn I am VERY happy to see him go.

by **Red 50** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:59 am

Wait, does that make Transformers a stupid Saturday morning cartoon? 'Cause it ain't for me!

by **moritron** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:50 am

vegetacron wrote:
Autobot032 wrote:
vegetacron wrote:*EDITED*

Please, just leave now.

Perhaps you should take your own advice. If you can't function any better than this because he posted his opinion, then perhaps it is you who needs to find the door and be on the other side of it.

Go catch your breath, have a moment or two to calm down, and don't get so upset over such silliness.

Honestly, you're taking all of this waaaaay too seriously.

I did. Thats why i edited it. Please read again.

Sorry, but that other comment just about had me pissed, until i realized the source wasn't worth the time.

my opinion is just as valid as yours, sorry if you don't like it. i may not post often, but i've been with transformers since '84, and have forgotten more than most know about tranformers. but you still shouldn't get pissed at someone else's opinion. and yeah, maybe it is you who should leave.

by **shamone** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:56 am

i dont blame bay completely, i have laid blame on producers and writers in the past.

however for those who praise him, you have to accept if he is deserving of your praise then he is deserving of some of the dissent from non movie fans

the tight camera angles where you can see nothing, the objectifying of women, the poorly defined characters (directors have input in this) are partly his responsibility amongst other shortcomings in the movie

as for the fan boy vs fan hater. I think people here are lumping everyone into the two extremes.

Its unfair to link people who dislike the movies, with those who threaten bay, picket his house, call his names and only want G1. Just like its wrong to say all movie lovers think its the greatestested and bestest movie known to man.

They are both extreme views, and the middle ground is the more populous.

As for positive ratings, popularity doesnt equate to quality