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more than meets the eye with Starscream?

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more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby jeddalo » Wed Jul 08, 2009 5:26 pm

Hi, I'm new here on these boards and I wanted to ask my fellow Cybertronians, Do you think that there is more depth to Starscream than what we see in the cartoons, movies, comics,etc.? Because when you think about it no one is that imcompetent and megalomaniacal from birth, that there has to be a method to his madness, what do you guys think?
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Rodimus Prime » Wed Jul 08, 2009 11:47 pm

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Every epic story revolving around great leaders (Megatron; fine, he was a Decepticon, but he was their greatest leader throughout the continuities) has to have a classic cowardly backstabber. This usually happens on the good side, like someone would always be backstabbing Prime, but only the Decepticon side could tolerate such a despicable character. But to answer your question to the point, no I don't think there is more to Starscream. Throughout all the continuities (that i am familiar with) he has been a sniveling cowardly greedy backstabber. It is one of the few constants throughout the TF universe. Honestly, I think the writers could have had such a good story if they made Starscream Unicron's herald instead of Megatron/Galvatron. Believe me, Starscream would have found a way to backstab even the most evil being in TF history.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Siren Prime » Thu Jul 09, 2009 1:46 am

Well, it depends on which Starscream you are referring too.
Because G1 Starscream and Armada Starscream for example are two VERY different robots.

G1 Starscream is about as trustworthy as a ravenous pit viper.
Armada Starscream was ultimately a good guy.

Both certainly had a lot that went on in their lives before the time when the shows took place.
But they are so different that you gotta know that their backgrounds are also different.
Last edited by Siren Prime on Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Rodimus Prime » Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:18 am

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Ah yes...Armada. I did forget he made that turn. I am so used to Starscream being who he is that I never see any room for him to change.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Darkenlite » Thu Jul 09, 2009 2:37 pm

G1 Starscream's motivation to backstabbing is that he figures he's better than Megatron right down to being better looking so therefore he should lead. Problem is Megatron isn't about to just hand Starscream the role of leadership utterly. Yes he will send him on missions and so forth, and be his second but other than that Megatron is in command by might. Starscream has never been able to beat Megatron in a "fair" fight and he knows he can't so he'll do whatever it takes to be on top right down to backstabbing.

Armada Starscream is a excellent twist of the good-version of Starscream.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby T-Macksimus » Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:30 pm

It's almost the smae thing as trying to review the new movie. It's a matter of of personal P.O.V. How do you really psycho-analyze a fictional character? You can't but you can sure have fun and spend next to eternity trying. To me he's like trying to deal with that one obstinate child that just will not listen and refuses to learn from past mistakes. He's so singularly focused on what he wants that instead of figuring out why he couldn't get through his obstacle the first time(or even what the real obstacle is) he tries to use whatever short-cut to go over, under or around it to get his prize.
He wants his ice-cream, he can't have it till he finishes his peas, so he stuffs them in his pocket, tries to fed them to the dog, dumps them on a siblings plate, gets caught all 3 times, get's punished, doesn't get ice-cream and tries the same sh** all over again the next night and the next. Starscream may be capable of taking out the trash or doing the dishes but he ain't driving the family car till he grows up and shows he can handle it.
At least that's one way to look at it. The fan girls are going to tear me a new one I'm sure, but I can handle living dangerously.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby jeddalo » Thu Jul 09, 2009 6:26 pm

Ok Cool, I just asked because me and a friend are doing a fan film using stop motion and we're writing a backstory to Starscream and why he has this utter hatred for Megatron and why he has always tried to destroy him, in the story we will be mixing the TF universe with another Universe or genre if you will, I can't say what it is but it is one that many of you I'm sure enjoy as well. I dont want to give too much of the story away but i will say this....The whole wanting to lead the Decepticons thing is just his cover, theres more to it than that. I hope I dont get any flak about trying to change the enhance the G1 storyline, not to mention, most of the Transformer universe, But I believe that this story needs to be told. what do you guys think?
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Editor » Thu Jul 09, 2009 6:52 pm

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jeddalo wrote:Ok Cool, I just asked because me and a friend are doing a fan film using stop motion and we're writing a backstory to Starscream and why he has this utter hatred for Megatron and why he has always tried to destroy him, in the story we will be mixing the TF universe with another Universe or genre if you will, I can't say what it is but it is one that many of you I'm sure enjoy as well. I dont want to give too much of the story away but i will say this....The whole wanting to lead the Decepticons thing is just his cover, theres more to it than that. I hope I dont get any flak about trying to change the enhance the G1 storyline, not to mention, most of the Transformer universe, But I believe that this story needs to be told. what do you guys think?


I think it would depend on what universes you are trying to tie together. Hasbro's differing properties are already tied together for the most part it's just a question of what source materials you choose to use. (MASK and Inhumaniods are already connected to GIJoe, GIJoe is already connected to Transformers, Transformers is already connected to Go-Bots)And with Crossover, we can see transformers crossing with the Marvel universes, Star Wars Expanded universe, and even Disney.

Now if you are to do a fan work combining Transformers with another property with a similar background it could be quite interesting. If you are trying to tie it with something a bit more out there (TMNT, MOTU, MLP) than it may be harder to grab readers. It all depends on your choices for sources, and your ability to write a solid story to unite them.

Do a Star Trek/X-men level crossing, It might be a good read.
Do a Godzilla/Charles Barkley crossing, than no thank you.

Yes those are both actual crossovers you can buy in comic form.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby jeddalo » Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:31 pm

Editor wrote:I think it would depend on what universes you are trying to tie together. Hasbro's differing properties are already tied together for the most part it's just a question of what source materials you choose to use. (MASK and Inhumaniods are already connected to GIJoe, GIJoe is already connected to Transformers, Transformers is already connected to Go-Bots)And with Crossover, we can see transformers crossing with the Marvel universes, Star Wars Expanded universe, and even Disney.

Now if you are to do a fan work combining Transformers with another property with a similar background it could be quite interesting. If you are trying to tie it with something a bit more out there (TMNT, MOTU, MLP) than it may be harder to grab readers. It all depends on your choices for sources, and your ability to write a solid story to unite them.

Do a Star Trek/X-men level crossing, It might be a good read.
Do a Godzilla/Charles Barkley crossing, than no thank you.

Yes those are both actual crossovers you can buy in comic form.


O ok well in that case it will be crossed with Star Wars in some way, I'm not gonna say how but it will be Star Wars, I didnt want to say what it was going to be but since you had put it in that aspect I figured I'd just go ahead and say so. But in any case how do you guys feel about a backstory for Starscream being written?
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby T-Macksimus » Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:40 pm

jeddalo wrote:
Editor wrote:O ok well in that case it will be crossed with Star Wars in some way, I'm not gonna say how but it will be Star Wars, I didnt want to say what it was going to be but since you had put it in that aspect I figured I'd just go ahead and say so. But in any case how do you guys feel about a backstory for Starscream being written?


That's the beautiful thing about FanFiction, it doesn't matter how we feel about it. You are the master and creator and I say if it feels like something that you will enjoy doing, go for it. :grin: If you want input along the way, we are here to bounce ideas off of and to help support the effort. (I cant begin to tell you how many works I'm either giving input to for various folks or ideas I'm working on myself right now)
I think having an origin piece for 'Screamer set in the SW universe is brilliant. The myriad of personalities (especially in the smuggler/bounty-hunter/underworld of SW) opens a ton of possibilities if it is a universe that you are well versed in.

My only question for you is this: Is the SW Expanded Universe one in which you are quite familiar? You don't have to be but it sometimes helps. I look forward to you what you come up with, just make sure that, first and foremost, you have fun doing it.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Rial Vestro » Fri Jul 10, 2009 3:19 am

Siren Prime wrote:Well, it depends on which Starscream you are referring too.
Because G1 Starscream and Armada Starscream for example are two VERY different robots.

G1 Starscream is about as trustworthy as a ravenous pit viper.
Armada Starscream was ultimately a good guy.

Both certainly had a lot that went on in their lives before the time when the shows took place.
But they are so different that you gotta know that their backgrounds are also different.


The way I see it, G1 Starscream STARTED as a good guy when he was an exsplorer along side Skyfire but something happened between then and when he started working with the Decepticons that changed his character. I don't think that G1 Starscream was allways the way we saw him as.

Armada Starscream however is not "ultimately a good guy" he tried to join the Autobots for a time and ultimately rejoined his original team. To paraphrase Rattrap "Once a Decepticon, allways a Decepticon."

At least when Dinobot and others on Beast Wars switched sides even though the characters weren't trusted at first they eventually did earn the trust of others. Starscream never stayed with the Autobots long enough to earn their trust.

There was ALOT more depth to Energon Starscream's character being that he didn't even remember who he was.

Cybertron Starscream, he's just what he is.

Animated Starscream, he's just exactly what you see... unless you want to try and figure out what Slipstream is supose to represent in Starscream.

Movie Starscream however... hard to say sence I have seen enough of him to even tell if he's anything like the others.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby T-Macksimus » Fri Jul 10, 2009 10:45 am

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Rial Vestro wrote:...Movie Starscream however... hard to say sence I have seen enough of him to even tell if he's anything like the others.


He's one that you have to read the other novels in the movie-verse line to really get a full appreciation of how nasty he is. He's the #2 Decepticon in every respect and neither the other 'Cons nor the Autobots want to tangle with him one-on-one (except Prime) due to fire power and ruthlesness. His "fear" of Megatron and sub-servience isn't just some act. It's because Meagtron is the only one capable of rendering him offline in a 1 to 1 confrontation and will so so without provocation. The other Decepticons would have to stage a coordinated coup to get rid of Starscream themselves.
What's fun is that in the novels he gets to be the leader in the prequel books. One book set before they come to Earth and the other before Megs reawakening in RotF.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Editor » Fri Jul 10, 2009 11:25 am

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Rial Vestro wrote:
The way I see it, G1 Starscream STARTED as a good guy when he was an exsplorer along side Skyfire but something happened between then and when he started working with the Decepticons that changed his character. I don't think that G1 Starscream was allways the way we saw him as.


Well it's a good thing that we have enough information about the character already in print that we can surmise what the deal with him was.

Shortly before the outbreak of the Autobot-Decepticon war nine million years ago, Starscream was not a warrior, but rather a scientist. He and his colleague and friend Skyfire were exploring an unnamed planet—the ancient Earth—when severe atmospheric conditions separated the two friends. Starscream circled the globe looking for Skyfire, but never found him. Upon his return to Cybertron, Starscream mostly abandoned his scientific pursuits, deciding that a career as a warrior would be much more exciting, and instead enrolled in the Cybertron War Academy, of which he would later profess to be the pride.

Starscream rose through the ranks of Megatron's Decepticons until he reached the position of second in command, but even this was not enough: Starscream saw Megatron as old and soft, and after five million years of war drained Cybertron of all its energy, Starscream came to believe that the Decepticons would have won the conflict eons beforehand if he had been in charge. Starscream was never afraid to let Megatron know this, but Megatron was always ready with a disparaging comeback, and the constant belief that while Starscream had the ambition, he did not have the ability to lead.


Basicly
1) He lost his research partner. Likely lost his purpose.
2) Became a fighter, learned to depend on himself, and became more powerful.
3) Power corrupts. His personal victories and the lack of a Decepticon victory conspire to make him believe he would be a better leader.

Now all the other uses of Starscream all have different backgrounds as really there is no point at looking at them. That said you might want to take a quick look at Shattered Glass Starscream. That Screamer shows the possible pinnacle he could have archived has G1 Screamer not transfered from science to war for excitement. His level of competance and loyalty to Megatron and the Heroic Decepticon cause shows ability beyond what even G1 Ultra Magnus or Rodimus have achieved.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby jeddalo » Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:36 pm

T-Macksimus wrote:That's the beautiful thing about FanFiction, it doesn't matter how we feel about it. You are the master and creator and I say if it feels like something that you will enjoy doing, go for it. :grin: If you want input along the way, we are here to bounce ideas off of and to help support the effort. (I cant begin to tell you how many works I'm either giving input to for various folks or ideas I'm working on myself right now)
I think having an origin piece for 'Screamer set in the SW universe is brilliant. The myriad of personalities (especially in the smuggler/bounty-hunter/underworld of SW) opens a ton of possibilities if it is a universe that you are well versed in.

My only question for you is this: Is the SW Expanded Universe one in which you are quite familiar? You don't have to be but it sometimes helps. I look forward to you what you come up with, just make sure that, first and foremost, you have fun doing it.


Yes I am well versed with the Star Wars universe, otherwise I wouldn't be doing it with them, as for the expanded universe i'm only aware of stuff like Luke finally joining the dark side, Clone Emperors, Boba Fett escaping the Sarlacc and teaming up with dengar, Han and Leia having kids (one named Jacen I believe) But other than that just pretty much the movies to be honest, But I think I still will be able to pull off a good movie.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Siren Prime » Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:46 pm

Rial Vestro wrote:Armada Starscream however is not "ultimately a good guy" he tried to join the Autobots for a time and ultimately rejoined his original team.

After which he allowed himself to be run through the chest with a sword by Megatron and was then promptly vaporized by Unicron after firing upon him.
Just to get Megatron (at that time Galvaron) to wake up and help the Autobots stop Unicron before he destroyed them all.

Armada Starscream ultimately a good guy? Yeah, I think so.
He screwed up continually, but in the end sacrificed himself to keep everyone else from dying.

It doesn't matter that he didn't get the Autobots trust.
But he sure got their respect. Unfortunately for him it also included their last respects.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Rial Vestro » Fri Jul 10, 2009 10:50 pm

Siren Prime wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:Armada Starscream however is not "ultimately a good guy" he tried to join the Autobots for a time and ultimately rejoined his original team.

After which he allowed himself to be run through the chest with a sword by Megatron and was then promptly vaporized by Unicron after firing upon him.
Just to get Megatron (at that time Galvaron) to wake up and help the Autobots stop Unicron before he destroyed them all.

Armada Starscream ultimately a good guy? Yeah, I think so.
He screwed up continually, but in the end sacrificed himself to keep everyone else from dying.

It doesn't matter that he didn't get the Autobots trust.
But he sure got their respect. Unfortunately for him it also included their last respects.


Not really the LAST sence he gets resurected in Energon, tries to kill Prime, and doesn't even know who he is.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Siren Prime » Fri Jul 10, 2009 10:59 pm

Rial Vestro wrote:
Siren Prime wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:Armada Starscream however is not "ultimately a good guy" he tried to join the Autobots for a time and ultimately rejoined his original team.

After which he allowed himself to be run through the chest with a sword by Megatron and was then promptly vaporized by Unicron after firing upon him.
Just to get Megatron (at that time Galvaron) to wake up and help the Autobots stop Unicron before he destroyed them all.

Armada Starscream ultimately a good guy? Yeah, I think so.
He screwed up continually, but in the end sacrificed himself to keep everyone else from dying.

It doesn't matter that he didn't get the Autobots trust.
But he sure got their respect. Unfortunately for him it also included their last respects.


Not really the LAST sence he gets resurected in Energon, tries to kill Prime, and doesn't even know who he is.

Yeah, I know.

But since he didn't even know his own name and was basically just a puppet for a lot of the series, I can't really count him as the same character.

And actually that Starscream originally wasn't Starscream.
In original Japanese cartoon he was supposed to be a completely different character, but they renamed him when the show came to America and persented him as the resurected version of Armada Starscream.

That's why none of the other characters react to his being brought back from the dead.

Think about it. If someone you knew was vaporized right before your eyes and then ten years later they suddenly appeared again, how would you react?
Shock? Amazment? Tears? Fear?

The Autobots and Decepticons barely blink.

Personally it drives me nuts.
It would have been so much better if they had written the character as Starscream and had everyone really get thunderstruck at the fact that he's alive.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Rial Vestro » Sat Jul 11, 2009 8:20 am

Siren Prime wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:
Siren Prime wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:Armada Starscream however is not "ultimately a good guy" he tried to join the Autobots for a time and ultimately rejoined his original team.

After which he allowed himself to be run through the chest with a sword by Megatron and was then promptly vaporized by Unicron after firing upon him.
Just to get Megatron (at that time Galvaron) to wake up and help the Autobots stop Unicron before he destroyed them all.

Armada Starscream ultimately a good guy? Yeah, I think so.
He screwed up continually, but in the end sacrificed himself to keep everyone else from dying.

It doesn't matter that he didn't get the Autobots trust.
But he sure got their respect. Unfortunately for him it also included their last respects.


Not really the LAST sence he gets resurected in Energon, tries to kill Prime, and doesn't even know who he is.

Yeah, I know.

But since he didn't even know his own name and was basically just a puppet for a lot of the series, I can't really count him as the same character.

And actually that Starscream originally wasn't Starscream.
In original Japanese cartoon he was supposed to be a completely different character, but they renamed him when the show came to America and persented him as the resurected version of Armada Starscream.

That's why none of the other characters react to his being brought back from the dead.

Think about it. If someone you knew was vaporized right before your eyes and then ten years later they suddenly appeared again, how would you react?
Shock? Amazment? Tears? Fear?

The Autobots and Decepticons barely blink.

Personally it drives me nuts.
It would have been so much better if they had written the character as Starscream and had everyone really get thunderstruck at the fact that he's alive.


But people did react to him... with dialog... Just not with facial exspressions. But I thought they were all preddy emotionless all the time anyway. Well the Transformers anyway. Kicker was allways verry exspessive but he didn't even know Starscream.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Siren Prime » Sat Jul 11, 2009 12:25 pm

Rial Vestro wrote:
Siren Prime wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:
Siren Prime wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:Armada Starscream however is not "ultimately a good guy" he tried to join the Autobots for a time and ultimately rejoined his original team.

After which he allowed himself to be run through the chest with a sword by Megatron and was then promptly vaporized by Unicron after firing upon him.
Just to get Megatron (at that time Galvaron) to wake up and help the Autobots stop Unicron before he destroyed them all.

Armada Starscream ultimately a good guy? Yeah, I think so.
He screwed up continually, but in the end sacrificed himself to keep everyone else from dying.

It doesn't matter that he didn't get the Autobots trust.
But he sure got their respect. Unfortunately for him it also included their last respects.


Not really the LAST sence he gets resurected in Energon, tries to kill Prime, and doesn't even know who he is.

Yeah, I know.

But since he didn't even know his own name and was basically just a puppet for a lot of the series, I can't really count him as the same character.

And actually that Starscream originally wasn't Starscream.
In original Japanese cartoon he was supposed to be a completely different character, but they renamed him when the show came to America and persented him as the resurected version of Armada Starscream.

That's why none of the other characters react to his being brought back from the dead.

Think about it. If someone you knew was vaporized right before your eyes and then ten years later they suddenly appeared again, how would you react?
Shock? Amazment? Tears? Fear?

The Autobots and Decepticons barely blink.

Personally it drives me nuts.
It would have been so much better if they had written the character as Starscream and had everyone really get thunderstruck at the fact that he's alive.


But people did react to him... with dialog... Just not with facial exspressions. But I thought they were all preddy emotionless all the time anyway. Well the Transformers anyway. Kicker was allways verry exspessive but he didn't even know Starscream.

Yeah, but was no, "OMG, STARSCREAM!?! But you were blasted into a million sub-particles!! What the h***?"

I know that wouldn't be the exact wording, but that be my reaction to a dead person suddenly popping up in front of me.
I hate it when stuff get screwed up in translation.

I mean I'm glad Star showed up at all, but the weird rewriting kinda goofed things up.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby primusminor22 » Sun Jul 12, 2009 11:54 am

maybe you should read transformers mosaic: the first betrayal.


hope that helps!
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby jeddalo » Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:40 pm

with the screamer fanfilm me and my friend were planning to do most of the voices ourselves, if you guys wanted to I could post a video on here of myself doing the voices of the characters I'll be doing.
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Ba2tiaan » Fri Jul 17, 2009 4:21 am

Starscream is sneaky. On Cybertron he was the one that thought Megatron AND Optimus where no good leaders for the Cybertronians and that he may be a good leader to his people. He could not do it because he is afraid of Megatron, but still I think he is up to something. I think his plan is to kill Megatron himself one day by turn the Decepticons on him and take over his army of Cybertronians (the one on that Decepticon ship on the moon of Saturn in the ROTF movie).
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Flare » Fri Jul 17, 2009 6:36 am

Motto: "If you're going to be bad, make sure you're the best at it!"
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Rodimus Prime wrote:Every epic story revolving around great leaders (Megatron; fine, he was a Decepticon, but he was their greatest leader throughout the continuities) has to have a classic cowardly backstabber. This usually happens on the good side, like someone would always be backstabbing Prime, but only the Decepticon side could tolerate such a despicable character. But to answer your question to the point, no I don't think there is more to Starscream. Throughout all the continuities (that i am familiar with) he has been a sniveling cowardly greedy backstabber. It is one of the few constants throughout the TF universe. Honestly, I think the writers could have had such a good story if they made Starscream Unicron's herald instead of Megatron/Galvatron. Believe me, Starscream would have found a way to backstab even the most evil being in TF history.

Ever see the episode; "Ghost in the Machine"? Thats the episode where Starscream's Ghost reactivated Unicron's head, in order to make a deal with him. In exchange for Unicron restoring Starscream's body, Starscream would recreate Unicron's by attaching his head to Cybertron, thus making Cybertron Unicron's new body. Unicron recreates Starscream's original body in keeping his part of the bargain and also so that Starscream could finish his end of the deal, but Starscream double-crosses Unicron and refused to complete his job. It's a fun episode. Starscream's still up to his old traitorous schemes! :wink:
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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby cybercat » Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:18 pm

Flare wrote: Starscream's still up to his old traitorous schemes! :wink:


Correction: Starscream's still up to his *adorably* traitorous schemes.

(insert fangirl swoon).

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Re: more than meets the eye with Starscream?

Postby Flare » Fri Jul 17, 2009 11:20 pm

Motto: "If you're going to be bad, make sure you're the best at it!"
Weapon: Double-Barreled, Armor-Piercing Particle Beam Cann...
hellkitty wrote:
Flare wrote: Starscream's still up to his old traitorous schemes! :wink:


Correction: Starscream's still up to his *adorably* traitorous schemes.

(insert fangirl swoon).

HK, Oh man I'm punchy today. I hate Freshman Comp.

Hehe, you know it's so funny when I hear of all these girls/women who just love Starscream. I was the same once. I used to be really into Starscream but then I was fickled and was also in love with Rumble, Shockwave, Trypticon and a few Autobots too like Prowl and Sunstreaker. I hated seeing Starscream killed in the 86' movie. I thought that was a major let down for the Transformers saga. How could they remove such a favored character? I guess they got many complaints because they kept bringing back his ghost; even in the Beast Wars era. So tell me why exactly do you love Starscream? I know the reason why I liked him but it might be different for others. It's almost a phenomenon. And for the men reading do you have any theories on why Starscream is favored by the ladies so much? Image
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