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SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed: Metroplex, Shockwave's Laboratory, & Titan Guardians set

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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby mbd88prime » Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:36 pm

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GuyIncognito wrote:This isn't a communist system where everyone has an equal right to every product produced. In a capitalist system, some products are going to be unavailable or unaffordable to some of the population. That's life. Deal with it, or move to North Korea where everyone gets the same 1 cup of rice per month. Also, there's a big difference between groceries (a necessity) and toys (a luxury).


nothing I sell is a necessity. You know what happens when its gonna snow, people rush out, often in the snow, to get pop, chips, beer, ice cream, and whatever. If everyone only bought what would be considered a needed item there would be no such thing as a supermarket there would only be a tiny 10X10 building with the bare necessities to live. So basically yes its a different market but the way you cater to your market is the same because the demands are for the same thing: a quality product at an affordable price. whatis a quality product is relative. Relative to who? The customer. Each customer. To me, and apparently all those who are now scrambling to pick up the SDCC metroplex for insane markups, the SDCC metroplex is a quality product. The retail version is not. You're right Seibertron the extra gun and chrome isn't worth the extra $50. So why isn't it the retail version? Simply because Hasbro couldn't give a crap about making it's customers happy there is no reason why it can't be available as an exclusive in a venue that is accessible by all. Is there?

And of course this is not a communist society, thank god. If I believed in such a thing I would have said that everyone has a right to the SDCC metroplex at the $150 price point. What I said is that, if Hasbro cared about it's customers, it would make it possible for any of them to acquire it not just a select number who have $3000 to go to a toy show.

I will even admit that one of the great things about a capitalist free market economy is that such a thing as scalpers can exist. People can go out and pursue their own means of profit and that could be scalping. But because you can do a thing doesn't mean you should. That is my point there. Go ahead and argue the morality of taking advantage of someone for trying to enjoy what used to be a simple hobby. The villains always think they're the heroes. Always somehow justifying their actions to themselves and trying to do the same to those around them. Maybe this sounds overboard but look, I have a crappy job that I still bust my butt at all day long to pay bills. All I want is to be able to enjoy my hobby but Hasbro with their exclusive crap and scalpers always find a way to make sure that i'm let down and will have to settle for the half- assed retail versions that can't even include a second, probably $1 value gun to make me, the customer, happy.

One other great thing about a free market capitalist society, when one competitor doesn't do anything to improve it's competition will take advantage of that and take their market share. GO THIRD PARTIES!!!!! It would be nice if any one of these third parties had the rights to produce actual transformers in name and in spirit and the economies of scale that Hasbro does then we would have some fun and I could stop at target on the way home and find a retail version of metroplex that is the quality of the SDCC metroplex for less than $150 because the third parties care about the quality of their product and the satisfaction of their customer not just meating their gross margin goal for the quarter.... Then of course scalpers could try to scalp but there would be no point because everyone would have access to the best quality products available at their local walmart or target or whatever.

BTW Seibertron I love your website, I do not mean to pick on you in particular yours was simply the first comment I saw that I felt the need to respond to. I also appreciate that you are not so full of yourself that you won't kick someone off for having a different opinion than your own. Most of my anger that you will clearly detect in my posts on this subject is directed at scalpers and Hasbro in general not YOU in particular. I simply haven't got the ability to not say how I feel about things that make me so angry and I'm really angry about and tired of being taken advantage of by fellow transfans and ignored as a customer by Hasbro when all I wanna do is buy a cool toy (not a half assed underpainted underaccessorized substitute) When did this become so complicated. If it had been this way when I was a kid I would never have gotten into Transformers! When did the whole exclusive thing and scalping thing start? :BOOM: :BOOM:
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Arctorro » Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:41 pm

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Bowspearer wrote:
Arctorro wrote:]If you want these things so badly then start a convention of your own in Australia and try and sweet talk Hasbro into providing you with some :P


Do I even need to point out how inexcusable and utterly ignorant your response is?

I could understand it from someone who wasn't a fellow Aussie, but you have no excuse for being unfamiliar with the Australian pop culture convention landscape.

The fact is that just going off the top of my head, between Supanova, Animania, SMASH and most recently, Comic Con alone, there are already plenty of cons here in Oceania that companies like Hasbro could do shared exclusives with when it came to something like SDCC exclusives (with fandom specific cons like Botcon of course, it's a different story).

I'm sure it's a similar story in Europe and other regions.
Are you so completly clueless that you can't tell a joke when someone is using the :P smile? No need to be insulting and call me ignorant because you can't get some stupid exclusive [-(
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Bowspearer » Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:38 pm

mbd88prime wrote:And of course this is not a communist society, thank god. If I believed in such a thing I would have said that everyone has a right to the SDCC metroplex at the $150 price point.


Yes but between free market economics and Communism (both opposite extremes yet both equally forms of financial slavery) there is a large degree of scope.

mbd88prime wrote:I will even admit that one of the great things about a capitalist free market economy is that such a thing as scalpers can exist.


Except that free-market capitalism is a complete oxymoron which at best, only exists within the realms of a textbook. In fact free-market economics is completely anti-capitalist. Where in practice, capitalism regulates to prevent oligopalies from forming and thereby allows small business to flourish; free-market economics is completely anti-competitive.

A glaring example of this is predatory pricing, where a corporation will open up a store in a new market, deliberately sell products lower than their small business competition can buy them for to deliberately put them out of business. Then when their competition has been wiped out, deliberately raise prices far higher than what consumers were originally paying, while being the only gig in town and as a result, everyone is forced to buy from them. Yes oligopalies might be the opposite of communism, but they're equally a form of financial slavery for a population.

mbd88prime wrote:People can go out and pursue their own means of profit and that could be scalping. But because you can do a thing doesn't mean you should. That is my point there. Go ahead and argue the morality of taking advantage of someone for trying to enjoy what used to be a simple hobby. The villains always think they're the heroes. Always somehow justifying their actions to themselves and trying to do the same to those around them. Maybe this sounds overboard but look, I have a crappy job that I still bust my butt at all day long to pay bills. All I want is to be able to enjoy my hobby but Hasbro with their exclusive crap and scalpers always find a way to make sure that i'm let down and will have to settle for the half- assed retail versions that can't even include a second, probably $1 value gun to make me, the customer, happy.


And this is a glaring example of this. There is anything but a fine line between servicing a demand and exploitation. Bear in mind that if you translated scalping what people here claim is a "luxury item" to scalping a "necessity", you're in the same ethical territory as the drug warlords in Afghanistan who got hold of essential medical supplies and charged the local population through the teeth for them.

mbd88prime wrote:One other great thing about a free market capitalist society, when one competitor doesn't do anything to improve it's competition will take advantage of that and take their market share. GO THIRD PARTIES!!!!!


Except that at least ethically speaking, since most are clearly ripping off designs (go Fansproject for showing how 3rd party SHOULD be done with the Retro Future line) as there is no licensing involved, making it a form of blatant theft on the part of 3rd party companies.

mbd88prime wrote:It would be nice if any one of these third parties had the rights to produce actual transformers in name and in spirit and the economies of scale that Hasbro does then we would have some fun and I could stop at target on the way home and find a retail version of metroplex that is the quality of the SDCC metroplex for less than $150 because the third parties care about the quality of their product and the satisfaction of their customer not just meating their gross margin goal for the quarter....


That would definitely remove any ethical issues there. I honestly wish Hasbro would look at licensing out to third parties because in so many respects it would allow them to service the adult collector's market with little investment themselves. At some point, Hasbro has to deal with the elephant in the room, and when they do, hopefully there will be licensing deals involved.

Arctorro wrote:Are you so completly clueless that you can't tell a joke when someone is using the :P smile? No need to be insulting and call me ignorant because you can't get some stupid exclusive [-(


First off I said your response was an inexcusibly ignorant one (which is it considering that in the Australian geekdom, with the exception of maybe Animania and SMASH those cons are common knowledge - heck Supanova even made prime time news this year which was a real surprise), I never accused you of being an ignorant person.

Secondly, the old saying is, don't throw gasoline on a fire. ;)
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby mbd88prime » Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:55 pm

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"Except that at least ethically speaking, since most are clearly ripping off designs (go Fansproject for showing how 3rd party SHOULD be done with the Retro Future line) as there is no licensing involved, making it a form of blatant theft on the part of 3rd party companies."

Yeah you're being a bit liberal with the use of the word "most" here dontchya think? The only third party I can think of that rips off has/tak designs is I gear and even they are moving away from that practice.

"That would definitely remove any ethical issues there. I honestly wish Hasbro would look at licensing out to third parties because in so many respects it would allow them to service the adult collector's market with little investment themselves. At some point, Hasbro has to deal with the elephant in the room, and when they do, hopefully there will be licensing deals involved."

YES!! A great idea. HASBRO TAKE NOTES. you rock at kid things you suck at collector things. just let the professionals do the work of pleasing the collectors, you can even still profit from it! Just try it. Its ok.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby ScottyP » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:02 pm

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Has anyone else received a shipping notice? 30 hours later and nothing :/
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby mbd88prime » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:09 pm

Motto: ""Freedom is the right of all sentient beings""
Weapon: Dual Rocket-Propelled Grenade Launcher
mbd88prime wrote:"Except that at least ethically speaking, since most are clearly ripping off designs (go Fansproject for showing how 3rd party SHOULD be done with the Retro Future line) as there is no licensing involved, making it a form of blatant theft on the part of 3rd party companies."

Yeah you're being a bit liberal with the use of the word "most" here dontchya think? The only third party I can think of that rips off has/tak designs is I gear and even they are moving away from that practice.

"That would definitely remove any ethical issues there. I honestly wish Hasbro would look at licensing out to third parties because in so many respects it would allow them to service the adult collector's market with little investment themselves. At some point, Hasbro has to deal with the elephant in the room, and when they do, hopefully there will be licensing deals involved."

YES!! A great idea. HASBRO TAKE NOTES. you rock at kid things you suck at collector things. just let the professionals do the work of pleasing the collectors, you can even still profit from it! Just try it. Its ok.


"And this is a glaring example of this. There is anything but a fine line between servicing a demand and exploitation. Bear in mind that if you translated scalping what people here claim is a "luxury item" to scalping a "necessity", you're in the same ethical territory as the drug warlords in Afghanistan who got hold of essential medical supplies and charged the local population through the teeth for them."

So yeah we're talking about toys and i'm a dissatisfied customer that's it, there is no need to compare me or anyone who's opinion you don't like to drug warlords in Afghanistan. Where do you get off drawing such comparisons? And once more 99.9% of what a supermarket sells is in no way a necessity so you would be the first one to draw such a comparison in this discussion
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby JackStraw » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:47 pm

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This is a great thread. Lots of great points on both sides,

I do agree though that a fandom that buys extras to sell to their fellow fans for TWICE the price + to "off-set" their own expenses is not cool. We should be helping each other out, at cost, or a small mark up. Some of the prices fans sell stuff for is douchey, regardless of whether someone is willing to pay or not. There's a sucker and two overpriviledged rich people born every minute - doesn't make it right.

Then there's the real scalpers that aren't even fans and would rather hustle toys or DVDs, exploiting people and systems than get real jobs. Those are the worst and shitty Hasbro's shitty marketing and distribution breeds them.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Bowspearer » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:56 pm

First off, you might want to fix the quote formatting because it looks like you're talking to yourself here when you get into the second post ;). That said I'll deal with each thing (oh and I've taken the liberty of fixing your formatting to point to where you've quoted me).

mbd88prime wrote:
bowspearer wrote:"Except that at least ethically speaking, since most are clearly ripping off designs (go Fansproject for showing how 3rd party SHOULD be done with the Retro Future line) as there is no licensing involved, making it a form of blatant theft on the part of 3rd party companies."


Yeah you're being a bit liberal with the use of the word "most" here dontchya think? The only third party I can think of that rips off has/tak designs is I gear and even they are moving away from that practice.


On the contrary, Ken's Fantasy Club, Maketoys and even Fansproject, to name a few, have been guilty of it in the past, as well as iGear. I can bring up specific examples if you like, such as the cassettes, minibots and combiner teams, but having mentioned those companies, most fans, including yourself will most likely know which specific examples I'm referring to. Sure you have guys like Dr Wu, but the vast majority are actually crossing over the line from add-ons to ripping off character designs.


mbd88prime wrote:
bowspearer wrote:"And this is a glaring example of this. There is anything but a fine line between servicing a demand and exploitation. Bear in mind that if you translated scalping what people here claim is a "luxury item" to scalping a "necessity", you're in the same ethical territory as the drug warlords in Afghanistan who got hold of essential medical supplies and charged the local population through the teeth for them."


So yeah we're talking about toys and i'm a dissatisfied customer that's it, there is no need to compare me or anyone who's opinion you don't like to drug warlords in Afghanistan. Where do you get off drawing such comparisons? And once more 99.9% of what a supermarket sells is in no way a necessity so you would be the first one to draw such a comparison in this discussion


First off, I wasn't personally smearing anyone's character here, as I've already said that I have no problem with resellers who have reasonable markups - which by your own admission, not only includes you in situations where you are a reseller, but you yourself have shown a complete disdain for scalping.

At the same time though, you were making the same logical error which lies at the justification behind scalping behaviour - namely "communism=bad; free market economics=capitalism; capitalism=good". However this is completely flawed as free market economics!=captialism and in the end result, is far closer to communism in terms of how the masses are ultimately financially enslaved than it is to capitalism.

Furthermore many people in this thread have put forward the argument that "luxury goods"!="necessities" which on its own would be fine, were it not for the fact that this argument was being used to somehow suggest that the business ethics of predatory business practices somehow change when going from applying them to a "luxury item" to a "necessity".

All I did here was draw on a real world example of said exploitative business practices being applied by a monopoly, in a society, to a commodity which is very much a necessity. Certainly the outcome changes when you shift from a "necessity" to a "luxury item", however the ethics driving each situation are identical.

Furthermore as there is every reason to believe that those who engage in such exploitative business practices in the case of "luxury items" would do the same with "necessities", it is entirely reasonable to draw such comparisons - as in both cases, the creed "greed is good" drives said unethical business practices.

Therefore, while my comparison was certainly a visceral one, it was also a completely reasonable one to make.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby mooncake623 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 11:13 pm

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ScottyP wrote:Has anyone else received a shipping notice? 30 hours later and nothing :/



I haven't received my shipping notice either. I believe they are going through everyone's account and canceling all the orders of people ordering more then one of the one limited exclusives. There hasn't been any restock of cancel orders yet and I believe people are still camping hoping for these restocks. I think once they cancel all the orders of people trying to cheap the system and post the restocks they will start shipping these out all together.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby mooncake623 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 11:16 pm

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Also I know for a fact that there will be restocks due to this cause people were saying how they order multiple metroplex on different CC's but to the same household for a friend. those will get cancel.

for the people complaining about not being able to get a Metroplex. Go camp Hasbrotoyshop website and start refreshing the page like everyone else and stop complaining because technically you can still get it. use that energy to score yourself an exclusive.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Bowspearer » Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:58 am

mooncake623 wrote:for the people complaining about not being able to get a Metroplex. Go camp Hasbrotoyshop website and start refreshing the page like everyone else and stop complaining because technically you can still get it. use that energy to score yourself an exclusive.


That would be great advice if it weren't so limited in who it was useful for.

To quote from HTS:

We are currently shipping to the 50 United States, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, the US Virgin Islands, Canada, and APO/FPO addresses. Please note: we cannot ship to a PO Box.


In other words, for anyone outside of those territories (Asia, Europe, Africa (including South Africa), the Middle East, most South America and Oceania), their only option is generally going to be being bled dry by scalpers.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby mooncake623 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 6:45 am

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Bowspearer wrote:
To quote from HTS:

We are currently shipping to the 50 United States, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, the US Virgin Islands, Canada, and APO/FPO addresses. Please note: we cannot ship to a PO Box.


In other words, for anyone outside of those territories (Asia, Europe, Africa (including South Africa), the Middle East, most South America and Oceania), their only option is generally going to be being bled dry by scalpers.


No Hasbro got you covered! ;)

http://www.bigbadtoystore.com/bbts/product.aspx?product=HAS23059&mode=retail or

http://www.robotkingdom.com/services/eshop/main.php?action=details&CatType=&II=TF2013METROACG&lang=us&CatID=
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby MagnetarPrime » Fri Jul 26, 2013 8:08 am

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I'm just glad Hasbro toy shop still has both Transformers Titan Warrior 5-Pack and Transformers Prime Shockwave's Lab for a decent price, I was able to cancel my bbts pre-order and save me 50 bucks enough to pick me a second Transformers Prime Shockwave's Lab lol,,,,, :grin:
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby sixshot20 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:47 am

I do not understand why people got so mad about Metroplex. I am just like all the other people who could not find the time to go to SDCC and get Metroplex. I am also one of those people who were not able to get one on HTS. The difference is I didn't start complaining after that, I went on ebay and bid on one and you know what I only had to pay 80 dollars more than retail. I am fine with that because as Seibertron said this thing ended up costing closer to around 200$. The guy who I bought it off was really cool as well. He was just a Comic Con fan who wasn't interested in transformers and bought one to help make some money back from all the things he bought for himself. I did not have to spend money on a flight, hotel room, and food.I don't see my purchase as me overpaying, I see it as me saving allot of time and money.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby JelZe GoldRabbit » Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:58 am

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sixshot20 wrote:I do not understand why people got so mad about Metroplex. I am just like all the other people who could not find the time to go to SDCC and get Metroplex. I am also one of those people who were not able to get one on HTS. The difference is I didn't start complaining after that, I went on ebay and bid on one and you know what I only had to pay 80 dollars more than retail. I am fine with that because as Seibertron said this thing ended up costing closer to around 200$. The guy who I bought it off was really cool as well. He was just a Comic Con fan who wasn't interested in transformers and bought one to help make some money back from all the things he bought for himself. I did not have to spend money on a flight, hotel room, and food.I don't see my purchase as me overpaying, I see it as me saving allot of time and money.


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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby datguy86 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 2:49 pm

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mooncake623 wrote:
ScottyP wrote:Has anyone else received a shipping notice? 30 hours later and nothing :/



I haven't received my shipping notice either. I believe they are going through everyone's account and canceling all the orders of people ordering more then one of the one limited exclusives. There hasn't been any restock of cancel orders yet and I believe people are still camping hoping for these restocks. I think once they cancel all the orders of people trying to cheap the system and post the restocks they will start shipping these out all together.


Yeah, I'm getting antsy. HTS has canceled orders before. I have an order in, but a Predaking is also still pending and I'd hate for some confusion to somehow deny me my product.

I was surprised a second round didn't go up yet, but I understand it hasn't for the same reasons you listed. Hell, the second round is how I got Bruticus last year.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Bowspearer » Sat Jul 27, 2013 3:15 am

mooncake623 wrote:
Bowspearer wrote:
To quote from HTS:

We are currently shipping to the 50 United States, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, the US Virgin Islands, Canada, and APO/FPO addresses. Please note: we cannot ship to a PO Box.


In other words, for anyone outside of those territories (Asia, Europe, Africa (including South Africa), the Middle East, most South America and Oceania), their only option is generally going to be being bled dry by scalpers.


No Hasbro got you covered! ;)

http://www.bigbadtoystore.com/bbts/product.aspx?product=HAS23059&mode=retail or

http://www.robotkingdom.com/services/eshop/main.php?action=details&CatType=&II=TF2013METROACG&lang=us&CatID=



I'll definitely keep Robot Kingdom in mind. The thing that I'm not too pleased about missing on it is the decoys funnily enough and the ones with the AGC version don't evoke the retro feel that the SDCC ones did.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Seibertron » Sat Jul 27, 2013 12:48 pm

Motto: "Tell my tale to those who ask. Tell it truly; the ill deeds along with the good, and let me be judged accordingly. The rest ... is silence."
Weapon: Twin Shock-Concussion Missiles
mbd88prime wrote:BTW Seibertron I love your website, I do not mean to pick on you in particular yours was simply the first comment I saw that I felt the need to respond to. I also appreciate that you are not so full of yourself that you won't kick someone off for having a different opinion than your own. Most of my anger that you will clearly detect in my posts on this subject is directed at scalpers and Hasbro in general not YOU in particular. I simply haven't got the ability to not say how I feel about things that make me so angry and I'm really angry about and tired of being taken advantage of by fellow transfans and ignored as a customer by Hasbro when all I wanna do is buy a cool toy (not a half assed underpainted underaccessorized substitute)


Don't worry about it. I wish I had been a little more sensitive in a few of my posts because I know first hand how frustrating it is when you can't get something that you really want. I used to sound much more like many of you in this thread who are opposed to flipping. I entered into this debate knowing that it was a hot one. I hope some of you will read what I wrote and try to understand the other side of the coin, that there is a bigger picture to all of this than many think about and try to realize that not everyone who flips products to make a few bucks is a bad guy (not to mention that "a few bucks" is also a relative term with different meanings to all of you).

mbd88prime wrote:When did this become so complicated. If it had been this way when I was a kid I would never have gotten into Transformers! When did the whole exclusive thing and scalping thing start? :BOOM: :BOOM:


A long time ago, in a decade far away ... before many of you were born and before I knew what the hell was going on in the world. Here's an article from a microfiche film I obtained in high school back in the 1990s. The article itself is from around Christmas 1984 ... if you think this was just parents trying to kid their kids a Transformers toy for Christmas, you are really kidding yourself.

Hottest toy sells out before it's delivered
http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/hottest-toy-sells-out-before-its-delivered/18244/
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby chuckdawg1999 » Sat Jul 27, 2013 3:38 pm

Motto: "The man, the myth, the legend... yeah right."
Weapon: Saber Blade
My first experience with scalping was back in the 90's when local news stations ran reports on parents not being able to find the Dragonzord from MMPR due to independent comic stores buying them up to sell at a premium. I know a few places go into trouble because parents complained. That's one of the reasons I try to stay out of stores during the holidays.

Really the whole issue of scalping/flipping and hording can be attributed to one product; beanie babies. When those were hot it was the first time I could remember an item being one to a case or in some cases one to a pallet. It was also the first time I remember something that can be found on shelves for retail prices going for triple or more on the private market. This was also around the speculator comic market of the early 90's so I guess people figures if it worked for plush animals and comics...
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Bowspearer » Sat Jul 27, 2013 7:03 pm

Seibertron wrote:I hope some of you will read what I wrote and try to understand the other side of the coin, that there is a bigger picture to all of this than many think about and try to realize that not everyone who flips products to make a few bucks is a bad guy (not to mention that "a few bucks" is also a relative term with different meanings to all of you).


Except that some of us here do understand that - the issue is what someone's approach is in doing so.

Let's face it, there are 2 ways it could go - the first being the capitalist approach, best summed up as "I have something you need/want? Great, let's work together to find a solution that's mutually beneficial." In that approach, a reasonable price is charged, the seller feels like they've covered their time and money and made a little bit of money, and the buyer feels like they've gotten the item for a reasonable price. I can't imagine many people would begrudge a fellow fan taking this approach.

However the other approach is the free market approach and considering we're seeing 100%+ markups on the secondary market (eg BBTS) for convention exclusives, that's the approach that is clearly in play here. That approach is best summed up by "I've got something you need/want? Great, then hand me that machette, because I'm going to bleed you dry." In this approach, it's not about a reasonable exchange, it's about the seller abusing an oligopaly on a product and bleeding people dry with it. The buyer might get something they want. but they walk away feeling screwed over, whilst the seller laughs all the way to the bank, knowing they've screwed the seller over.

It's the later of these which is driving secondary market prices and the reason so many people are ticked off..
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby xyl360 » Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:38 pm

Bowspearer wrote:
Seibertron wrote:I hope some of you will read what I wrote and try to understand the other side of the coin, that there is a bigger picture to all of this than many think about and try to realize that not everyone who flips products to make a few bucks is a bad guy (not to mention that "a few bucks" is also a relative term with different meanings to all of you).


Except that some of us here do understand that - the issue is what someone's approach is in doing so.

Let's face it, there are 2 ways it could go - the first being the capitalist approach, best summed up as "I have something you need/want? Great, let's work together to find a solution that's mutually beneficial." In that approach, a reasonable price is charged, the seller feels like they've covered their time and money and made a little bit of money, and the buyer feels like they've gotten the item for a reasonable price. I can't imagine many people would begrudge a fellow fan taking this approach.

However the other approach is the free market approach and considering we're seeing 100%+ markups on the secondary market (eg BBTS) for convention exclusives, that's the approach that is clearly in play here. That approach is best summed up by "I've got something you need/want? Great, then hand me that machette, because I'm going to bleed you dry." In this approach, it's not about a reasonable exchange, it's about the seller abusing an oligopaly on a product and bleeding people dry with it. The buyer might get something they want. but they walk away feeling screwed over, whilst the seller laughs all the way to the bank, knowing they've screwed the seller over.

It's the later of these which is driving secondary market prices and the reason so many people are ticked off..

I agree 100%. I'm totally willing to pay more than retail for something, I'm not looking to screw ebay sellers when they either have a spare to sell or they're just getting rid of something from their collection. It's when they are buying up supply of something that's a bit hard to come by via normal means and marking it up to insane prices with the other sellers either following suit, or the few that don't (and it's always just a few) selling out immediately because they're the best game in town.

I realize that I, as the buyer, have the option of not purchasing, but you guys all know how obsessive collecting can be. It's the reason most of us are here on this very site, and the fact of the matter is, these sellers know who they're selling to and how to take full advantage of the situation (and I do mean TAKE). I realize they're not selling for fun, the point is for them as sellers to turn a profit, but they gotta be really cold to do that to people, knowing the only reason they could charge what they did is because either everyone else is, or because everyone else will eventually run out and they'll be the only one with any left (along with any other sellers who will then follow their inflated pricepoint).

There's nothing illegal about it, but it sure is a dick move.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Pigbeard » Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:33 am

Weapon: Jawbreaker Cannon
SDCC items should be shipping now, mine was out at 8:03am today.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby datguy86 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:45 pm

Motto: "SHEEAGH!"
Pigbeard wrote:SDCC items should be shipping now, mine was out at 8:03am today.


I got a shipping e-mail as well. When I went to check the order it said it was shipped Saturday. I hope it comes tomorrow and not today since I'm not at my house and that's a big box to be left sitting on my porch.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby Sunstar » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:14 pm

Motto: "All hail Lord Starscream"
Weapon: Null-Ray Rifle
I got the hero complex set at tfcon 75


Edit: reading up a bit about the flipping the product.

As I see it and more in the case of the botcon exclusive I wanted as opposed to the set I got from the SDCC.

I paid 140 cdn for the Starscream figure. Someone said to me "how does it feel to have been over charged for a free item"
I contemplated the comment for a moment and what I paid for the item.
my response was:
I did not need to fly over to the convention, I did not need to buy a hotel room for the nights.
SO for me, paying someone else the 140 was okay. I was willing to pay a bit more but I haggled a little.

Sure enough I did spend the night at the hotel for tfcon, but I am local. I did not have to as I am within about 40km of the convention - but for me that is my vacation of the year and No better place for me to stay and get the full experience of the convention.
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Re: SDCC 2013 Transformers Exclusives Revealed

Postby gen1autobot » Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:59 pm

Mine came in today and I am quite impressed. Beware, that shipping box was huge!!!!Image
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