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Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Starscream GaGa » Wed Jan 25, 2012 7:12 pm

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CaSSeTteBOTs45 wrote:
Starscream GaGa wrote:The artwork is so, SO bad. God only knows how Andrew Wildman got a job in the first place.


That's how it should look. Have you read ANY of the G1 comics?



Yes. I have. Andrew Wildman's drawings were terrible back then too. What's your point?

Marvel G1 never had GOOD art, but Wildman was definitely the worst.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby helli0n » Wed Jan 25, 2012 7:31 pm

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I love the preview art work... :KREMZEEK: Wildman and Furman...I am so there. =P~

I only hope I can talk someone in my family into picking the free comic book day issue, since I will be gone when it comes out, I will be set. :-?
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Darth Bombshell » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:59 pm

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Starscream GaGa wrote:The artwork is so, SO bad. God only knows how Andrew Wildman got a job in the first place.


Um...because he was the artist during G1's final run, maybe? Because Furman wanted him on it, perhaps? Because they wanted to maintain some sort of artistic continuity, possibly?

Starscream GaGa wrote:Andrew Wildman's drawings were terrible back then too. What's your point?


The point is that this is how it was drawn back then.

Oh, and before anyone else makes any cracks about the art, I'll say this: if you were born after 2001, this comic run is probably not intended for you anyway, so don't whine if you don't like it.

Chaoslock wrote:According to Furman, both is possible (even if I don't know how).


Slots in between G1 #80 and G2 #1. Easy.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Starscream GaGa » Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:47 pm

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Darth Bombshell wrote:Um...because he was the artist during G1's final run, maybe? Because Furman wanted him on it, perhaps? Because they wanted to maintain some sort of artistic continuity, possibly?


When I say first place, I mean FIRST place. Wildman's art was trash back then to. Nostalgia or not, I don't think anyone with eyes can say he's a good artist.

Darth Bombshell wrote:Oh, and before anyone else makes any cracks about the art, I'll say this: if you were born after 2001, this comic run is probably not intended for you anyway, so don't whine if you don't like it.


I don't think there will be many eleven year olds coming online to complain about a continuation of G1 Marvel, do you?
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Sabrblade » Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:50 pm

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If they make a TPB release of ReGeneration One, I hope they include #80.5 in it.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Bristleback » Wed Jan 25, 2012 11:02 pm

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Wow they haven't even changed the random sizing of people in the background, that's one BIG Rumble. :D
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Clayface » Wed Jan 25, 2012 11:02 pm

Starscream GaGa wrote: Nostalgia or not, I don't think anyone with eyes can say he's a good artist.


I have eyes, and, yes, I would say he's a good artist. In fact, I'd say he's a great artist. Probably in my top 3 of all TF artists.

What are your specific complaints about his art? And who in your opinion is a good artist, so I have some frame of reference or insight into your thinking?
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby AnnaChristine » Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:28 am

Marvel G1 had nothing but bad art?

Geoff Senior
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I'll go on record and say that few comic book artists, never mind just Transformers ones, display the dynamism and skill with layouts that Senior shows.

Andrew Wildman
Image

Maybe not his best work, and I'll admit sometimes, Wildman had his iffy moments, but one the he does brilliantly is detail work - not the "robot made of a million panels with cracks in it" kind of detail, but really cool little things like cogs, levers, wires and stuff in the background.

John Ridgway
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Theres nothing I can say about this pic. Its a classic. Yes, he just drew the toys with better proportions, but it really does make Jazz, Mirage and Hound look very alien and very threatening.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby T-Macksimus » Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:33 am

Clayface wrote:
Starscream GaGa wrote: Nostalgia or not, I don't think anyone with eyes can say he's a good artist.


I have eyes, and, yes, I would say he's a good artist. In fact, I'd say he's a great artist. Probably in my top 3 of all TF artists.

What are your specific complaints about his art? And who in your opinion is a good artist, so I have some frame of reference or insight into your thinking?



Waste of time. Art is a subjective thing. Each individual is going to get something completely different out of what he/she experiences based on their own personal tastes. However, for one person to say that something is straight up crap is a total load of BS. Just because you don't like it and believe me that is entirely within your right, doesn't mean that the artist sucks. It just means that it isn't something that you would prefer to see. Fine. At least show some respect for what is being attempted and step back and see the big picture, which in this case means stepping back and looking at close to 30 years of TF comic history and all the changes in comic book artistry and production that have happened along the way and then try to show an ounce of respect for said history.
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As one who grew up with (and still has possession of) the original 1984 comic series I'm excited to have this continuation come out. I collected all of the G2 comics, not that that was much of a stretch, and I have to say that I didn't much care for that arc and never considered it a continuation of the original. For me it won't matter where issue 80.5 is "supposed" to slip in. I'll just put it right in back of issue 80 where it belongs and G2 will have it own separate box to reside in. The fact that the artwork is going to stay on par with where they left off, if not backtrack a bit even which is fine by me, just adds a whole other level of coolness to this belated continuation. I'm probably not the only old-schooler who would have to chime in with the same sentiment as Megatron from the '86 movie..."I would have waited an eternity for this..."
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Rodimus Prime » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:29 am

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T-Macksimus wrote:Waste of time. Art is a subjective thing. Each individual is going to get something completely different out of what he/she experiences based on their own personal tastes. However, for one person to say that something is straight up crap is a total load of BS. Just because you don't like it and believe me that is entirely within your right, doesn't mean that the artist sucks. It just means that it isn't something that you would prefer to see. Fine. At least show some respect for what is being attempted and step back and see the big picture, which in this case means stepping back and looking at close to 30 years of TF comic history and all the changes in comic book artistry and production that have happened along the way and then try to show an ounce of respect for said history.


QFT.

As one who grew up with (and still has possession of) the original 1984 comic series I'm excited to have this continuation come out. I collected all of the G2 comics, not that that was much of a stretch, and I have to say that I didn't much care for that arc and never considered it a continuation of the original. For me it won't matter where issue 80.5 is "supposed" to slip in. I'll just put it right in back of issue 80 where it belongs and G2 will have it own separate box to reside in. The fact that the artwork is going to stay on par with where they left off, if not backtrack a bit even which is fine by me, just adds a whole other level of coolness to this belated continuation. I'm probably not the only old-schooler who would have to chime in with the same sentiment as Megatron from the '86 movie..."I would have waited an eternity for this..."


I also grew up with the originals, however I do count G2 as the continuation of G1. I am looking forward to this very much, and hopefully the TPB will be coming out once the run ends or enough issues are printed. I would like to own this in TPB as I do the rest of the comics.

As for the art, I am not sure if Wildman has done anything for IDW recently, as most IDW art looks horrible to me (you might enjoy it and that's fine) but the preview art shown here actually looks good. I'm optimistic about this and looking forward to it.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Banjo-Tron » Thu Jan 26, 2012 3:43 am

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AnnaChristine wrote:I'd put a shout for Dan Reed, but I know hes very unpopular with other fans. He did produce some lovely art (sometimes) and (I think) he does actual "art" now, so seeing how that interperets into Transformers would be fun :P


Nooo, transformers with fangs who resemble melted waxworks keep me awake at night. Please no Dan Reed. I used to have similar opinions on Andy Wildman, but over the years I have learned to appreciate his style more. As another poster said, his attention to datail is great. I'm excited about this series, but I'm guessing that the UK will not get a free comic book day, so I'll probably have to pick this up on eBay for a stupid price :(
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby michael alex kawa » Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:25 am

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There is so many problems and holes in what Simon Furman has said i don't know where to begin :BANG_HEAD: .As anyone who knows me i hate the 21 years in the future already ,and Optimus having his (very familiar ) G1 body ,not his "Action Master " ( in appearance ) body he had in issue #80 .If Prime and Megatron has any type of confrontation ,then there is NO POSSIBLE (No matter your opinions on when the two series took place ) WAY TO CONNECT RG1 to G2 ,don't believe me ,then read G2 (not scan READ ) and tell me this is not one big hole .Now about the art ,i am a big fan BIG FAN of Wildman/Baskerville ,but the art so far looks like some amateur copied there style ,there is none of that detail i came to love from the team .I guess Rumble :CON: (Frenzy ? :CON:) decided to grow in the 21 years .Andrew claimed on his blog that IDW sent him some "More Then Meets the Eye" -Profile books from Dreamwave to give him some reference material ,and it shows .I don't know what he used back in the day (i tried to ask on his blog but you know artist) ,but i wish he would go back to his old ways .I feel he has become very lazy ,his other works coming out this year like "Horizon" look awesome ,but i feel his heart is not in to RG1 .I really hate to say this but maybe we (fans that signed the petition ,like me ) should of just let it be ,cause signing it was a big mistake .That Rumble :CON: (Frenzy :CON: ) is really bugging me ,so is the whole Headmaster thing ,i kind of see what he is getting at (IE - What about the original heads of the Headmasters, still on Nebulos? ) ,yes unanswered ,but yes resolved by The UK Annual from 1988 , -From the TFwiki -"Although it is explained that the Nebulans turn into heads that only resemble the original heads of the Headmaster Autobots, and that the original heads maintain radio contact with their Nebulan partners, the original miniseries never mentions what becomes of the original heads. However, "The Final Conflict" in the 1988 UK annual showed that Fortress Maximus, at least, stored his original head in a chest compartment" -http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Broken_Glass%21 ,plus does anyone care ,and does Fort Max still have his head while Spike (not Galen) is in control .Which brings up one more issue ,i believe that humans will age in the book by what Simon says ,and the character Circuit Smasher (look at one of the pics from the article ) seems to be Circuit Breakers son (does Marvel know ) or did she get a sex change ??? sneaky way to use an other company's character .Well so much for my rant ,i know a lot of people ( included me ) that could of done the continuation better ,we may have the skill ,but we don't have the name SIMON FURMAN .
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Mindmaster » Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:14 am

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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby quickmixed » Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:39 am

Rodimus Prime wrote:As for the art, I am not sure if Wildman has done anything for IDW recently, as most IDW art looks horrible to me (you might enjoy it and that's fine) but the preview art shown here actually looks good. I'm optimistic about this and looking forward to it.


I'm looking forward to this also. Wildmans last work with idw was the b covers for the first six issues of ongoing two years ago.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Darth Bombshell » Thu Jan 26, 2012 7:33 am

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Sabrblade wrote:If they make a TPB release of ReGeneration One, I hope they include #80.5 in it.


I don't see why not.

Starscream GaGa wrote:I don't think anyone with eyes can say he's a good artist.


:BANG_HEAD:

I get the feeling you're comparing his art style to the style of the artists of today. And I ask you...why? Of course he isn't going to look good if you compare his work to the artists of today.

Starscream GaGa wrote:I don't think there will be many eleven year olds coming online to complain about a continuation of G1 Marvel, do you?


No, because, as I said, this comic series isn't going to appeal to them, because it's target audience are people who read the Marvel comic in the late eighties/early ninties and have fond memories of it.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Marcdachamp » Thu Jan 26, 2012 8:34 am

Starscream GaGa wrote:When I say first place, I mean FIRST place. Wildman's art was trash back then to. Nostalgia or not, I don't think anyone with eyes can say he's a good artist.


I must be blind then, because my two framed pieces of original Wildman art look pretty gorgeous to me.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Clayface » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:13 am

Darth Bombshell wrote:I get the feeling you're comparing his art style to the style of the artists of today. And I ask you...why? Of course he isn't going to look good if you compare his work to the artists of today.


Yeah, it doesn't look good compared to the artists of today, it looks better. I'm sorry, but Wildman's designs and level of detail blows away a lot of what we've gotten from the ongoing for the past couple year (blank backgrounds, hideous robot designs, etc).
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Windsweeper » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:08 pm

I can't wait for this. I grew up on Marvel Uk but I do have reservations about Wildman's art, especially since we've been spoiled over the years by the likes of Figuera (I know, i can't remember how his name is spelt), Milne, Raiz and Roche. However, I can understand the nostalgia, I'm getting it just looking at the sample art.

As for who cares about the Headmasters? Scorponok was one of my favourite characters so if there's a sensible way to bring him back, then I'm all for it. Highbrow and Hardhead too. Hosehead would intrigue me because he never had his Headmaster origin shown.

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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Windsweeper » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:10 pm

Slag it, double post.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Mat001 » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:53 pm

michael alex kawa wrote:There is so many problems and holes in what Simon Furman has said i don't know where to begin :BANG_HEAD: .As anyone who knows me i hate the 21 years in the future already ,and Optimus having his (very familiar ) G1 body ,not his "Action Master " ( in appearance ) body he had in issue #80 .


The twenty one years allows for Generation 2 and for Optimus to be back to his old self. We know that if the original series had continued, the Action Master process would've been reversed to allow for the Generation 2 designs.

If Prime and Megatron has any type of confrontation ,then there is NO POSSIBLE (No matter your opinions on when the two series took place ) WAY TO CONNECT RG1 to G2 ,don't believe me ,then read G2 (not scan READ ) and tell me this is not one big hole .


You'll have to wait and see how Furman addresses it.

Now about the art ,i am a big fan BIG FAN of Wildman/Baskerville ,but the art so far looks like some amateur copied there style ,there is none of that detail i came to love from the team .I guess Rumble :CON: (Frenzy ? :CON:) decided to grow in the 21 years .Andrew claimed on his blog that IDW sent him some "More Then Meets the Eye" -Profile books from Dreamwave to give him some reference material ,and it shows .I don't know what he used back in the day (i tried to ask on his blog but you know artist) ,but i wish he would go back to his old ways .I feel he has become very lazy ,his other works coming out this year like "Horizon" look awesome ,but i feel his heart is not in to RG1 .


Doesn't read that way in his interviews.

I really hate to say this but maybe we (fans that signed the petition ,like me ) should of just let it be ,cause signing it was a big mistake .That Rumble :CON: (Frenzy :CON: ) is really bugging me ,so is the whole Headmaster thing ,i kind of see what he is getting at (IE - What about the original heads of the Headmasters, still on Nebulos? ) ,yes unanswered ,but yes resolved by The UK Annual from 1988 , -From the TFwiki -"Although it is explained that the Nebulans turn into heads that only resemble the original heads of the Headmaster Autobots, and that the original heads maintain radio contact with their Nebulan partners, the original miniseries never mentions what becomes of the original heads. However, "The Final Conflict" in the 1988 UK annual showed that Fortress Maximus, at least, stored his original head in a chest compartment" -http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Broken_Glass%21 ,plus does anyone care ,and does Fort Max still have his head while Spike (not Galen) is in control .Which brings up one more issue ,i believe that humans will age in the book by what Simon says ,and the character Circuit Smasher (look at one of the pics from the article ) seems to be Circuit Breakers son (does Marvel know ) or did she get a sex change ??? sneaky way to use an other company's character .Well so much for my rant ,i know a lot of people ( included me ) that could of done the continuation better ,we may have the skill ,but we don't have the name SIMON FURMAN .


Here's an idea, don't buy the book.
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Marcdachamp » Thu Jan 26, 2012 2:55 pm

michael alex kawa wrote:There is so many problems and holes in what Simon Furman has said i don't know where to begin :BANG_HEAD: .As anyone who knows me i hate the 21 years in the future already ,and Optimus having his (very familiar ) G1 body ,not his "Action Master " ( in appearance ) body he had in issue #80 .If Prime and Megatron has any type of confrontation ,then there is NO POSSIBLE (No matter your opinions on when the two series took place ) WAY TO CONNECT RG1 to G2 ,don't believe me ,then read G2 (not scan READ ) and tell me this is not one big hole .Now about the art ,i am a big fan BIG FAN of Wildman/Baskerville ,but the art so far looks like some amateur copied there style ,there is none of that detail i came to love from the team .I guess Rumble :CON: (Frenzy ? :CON:) decided to grow in the 21 years .Andrew claimed on his blog that IDW sent him some "More Then Meets the Eye" -Profile books from Dreamwave to give him some reference material ,and it shows .I don't know what he used back in the day (i tried to ask on his blog but you know artist) ,but i wish he would go back to his old ways .I feel he has become very lazy ,his other works coming out this year like "Horizon" look awesome ,but i feel his heart is not in to RG1 .I really hate to say this but maybe we (fans that signed the petition ,like me ) should of just let it be ,cause signing it was a big mistake .That Rumble :CON: (Frenzy :CON: ) is really bugging me ,so is the whole Headmaster thing ,i kind of see what he is getting at (IE - What about the original heads of the Headmasters, still on Nebulos? ) ,yes unanswered ,but yes resolved by The UK Annual from 1988 , -From the TFwiki -"Although it is explained that the Nebulans turn into heads that only resemble the original heads of the Headmaster Autobots, and that the original heads maintain radio contact with their Nebulan partners, the original miniseries never mentions what becomes of the original heads. However, "The Final Conflict" in the 1988 UK annual showed that Fortress Maximus, at least, stored his original head in a chest compartment" -http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Broken_Glass%21 ,plus does anyone care ,and does Fort Max still have his head while Spike (not Galen) is in control .Which brings up one more issue ,i believe that humans will age in the book by what Simon says ,and the character Circuit Smasher (look at one of the pics from the article ) seems to be Circuit Breakers son (does Marvel know ) or did she get a sex change ??? sneaky way to use an other company's character .Well so much for my rant ,i know a lot of people ( included me ) that could of done the continuation better ,we may have the skill ,but we don't have the name SIMON FURMAN .


Well, I don't work for IDW, but let's say we have two people looking for a job writing this comic. We'll call them Person A and Person B. Person A is the original series writer. Additionally, Person A has a lot of experience writing for the brand, and has a history with the company.

Now, let's take a look at Person B. Person B has never worked for IDW, never had any published Transformers work, and displays a tenuous grasp on the use of grammar.

Who would you hire?
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby Mat001 » Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:20 pm

That and the fact is that Furman and Budinsky (sp) were the two main writers for the Marvel series. The latter has no desire to continue, while the former does. And since the whole point of "Regeneration One" is to finish the storyline of that continiuity, who better than the guy who was writing the book?
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby wordmongerer » Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:15 pm

michael alex kawa wrote:If Prime and Megatron has any type of confrontation ,then there is NO POSSIBLE (No matter your opinions on when the two series took place ) WAY TO CONNECT RG1 to G2 ,don't believe me ,then read G2 (not scan READ ) and tell me this is not one big hole.


Furman has stated in many places that this is a continuation of G1 and so the events of G2 did not take place in this continuation (or perhaps not yet), however that does not mean that the themes and characters of G2 can't be used, and obviously Jhiaxus is shown in the preview as well as the TF's emerging from Cybertron, so that's already 2 G2 nods. I love G2 and I can understand that the decision to bypass G2 will disappoint some but the petition was for G1 issue 81 not G2 issue 13. Plugging the gaps between the two wouldn't make very interesting reading either as the conclusions would all be forgone. Also G2 was far less widely read than G1, the toys less widely available. The G2 story will always be on my bookshelf and I'll always be able to enjoy it though.

Andrew claimed on his blog that IDW sent him some "More Then Meets the Eye" -Profile books from Dreamwave to give him some reference material ,and it shows .


Actually you can see on his blog that his drawing table is covered in the original trade paperbacks and the original Transformers Universe guide. This is very clear in the flashback's shown, even down to things like Prime's head attached to a machine that looks identical to the one Shockwave used in the first few issues. But any characters appearing in present day can look however they need to be interpreted and that will include characters that never appeared in the original comics or G2 so the MTMTE guides would be the only comic book style source material available.

i kind of see what he is getting at (IE - What about the original heads of the Headmasters, still on Nebulos? ) ,yes unanswered ,but yes resolved by The UK Annual from 1988 , -From the TFwiki -"Although it is explained that the Nebulans turn into heads that only resemble the original heads of the Headmaster Autobots, and that the original heads maintain radio contact with their Nebulan partners, the original miniseries never mentions what becomes of the original heads. However, "The Final Conflict" in the 1988 UK annual showed that Fortress Maximus, at least, stored his original head in a chest compartment"


The UK comics while they tried for some time to sync with the UK comic had huge chunks of stuff that didn't agree with the US comic. As this is directly following the US run, if it wasn't established there the same pick and choose from UK G1 continuity would apply. I just went through the 1988 UK annual and I can't see the reference to the original heads. Also after a few years of connection, why would it be assumed that they could easily go back? Prime's powermaster process ended up having a merging effect and unexpected consequences after a few short years after all.

According to the third issue of All-New Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe A-Z's entries on Death's Head, the events of the Marvel UK Generation 1 comics take place on Marvel Earth-120185. The universe is named after the publication date of the first Marvel UK-exclusive story, "Man of Iron". According to the Marvel Universe Appendix, the events of the Marvel US comics take place on Marvel Earth-91274. So even Marvel consider these 2 strands as not being dependant on one another.


the character Circuit Smasher (look at one of the pics from the article ) seems to be Circuit Breakers son


He isn't. It wouldn't make any sense for a child to inherit technology that she herself wasn't born with. They aren't the same character either.

Before judging who could have written this better I think its fair to say that you'd actually need to have read the comic. Having read some, I don't think anyone could have written this better
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby michael alex kawa » Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:34 am

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Great points from all (especially on my bad grammar :P ) .But i still feel that the art looks rushed and not up to Wildman standards ,he is my favorite Transformers artist (if you don't count comics from Japan ;) ) ,and i am just not feeling it .I should wait till i read the whole run ,and by the way ,i am not going to buy the first issue ,since it is .....FREE :lol: :lol: :)) :DANCE:
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Re: Simon Furman Talks Transformers Regeneration One

Postby F Prime » Mon Jan 30, 2012 3:55 pm

Motto: "math...thrash...Math....Thrash...MATH....THRASH..."
Weapon: No Weapon
wordmongerer wrote:
michael alex kawa wrote:If Prime and Megatron has any type of confrontation ,then there is NO POSSIBLE (No matter your opinions on when the two series took place ) WAY TO CONNECT RG1 to G2 ,don't believe me ,then read G2 (not scan READ ) and tell me this is not one big hole.


Furman has stated in many places that this is a continuation of G1 and so the events of G2 did not take place in this continuation (or perhaps not yet), however that does not mean that the themes and characters of G2 can't be used, and obviously Jhiaxus is shown in the preview as well as the TF's emerging from Cybertron, so that's already 2 G2 nods. I love G2 and I can understand that the decision to bypass G2 will disappoint some but the petition was for G1 issue 81 not G2 issue 13. Plugging the gaps between the two wouldn't make very interesting reading either as the conclusions would all be forgone. Also G2 was far less widely read than G1, the toys less widely available. The G2 story will always be on my bookshelf and I'll always be able to enjoy it though.


Well said.

wordmongerer wrote:It wouldn't make any sense for a child to inherit technology that she herself wasn't born with. They aren't the same character either.


Do we know anything about this character other than the name? I wouldn't assume it's her son, but I wouldn't count it out, either. Couldn't Josie make a suit for her son (or anyone she wants...at least, I don't think you *had* to be paraplegic to use it.)
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