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SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

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SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Diem » Sat Jun 18, 2011 7:06 pm

Okay, please be warned that this is a conversation only for those who have read the novelization/comic of DOTM or those who don't mind spoilers, because there will be serious spoilers below...





SPOILERS










Okay, I just finished the book and that was insane. The death count for both sides is incredible (though you'll notice there's only one significant human death). The twins appear and die in a vaguely heroic way 5 minutes later? Wheelie helps to save the day? Crankcase dies in a faintly embarrassing fashion? MEGATRON BECOMES A GOOD GUY?!? A Starscream who isn't Armada Starscream actually dies?

I have to say that the scale seems a lot better in this movie. The Decepticons seem like a really credible threat. For a while it almost seems like the Autobots won't win. Weirdly this has made me really excited for the movie. On the other hand Sam seems to still be the same annoying hyperactive dick from the first two movies, not having matured at all.

So what do you guys think?
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Rodimus Prime » Sat Jun 18, 2011 7:23 pm

Motto: "I Stand Alone"
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I read it and loved it. I hope they stick to it as much as they can, and I want to see the Twins in the film just for their death scene. And I think Wheelie and Brains are hilarious. Except Wheelie will do the leg humping. Again. Anyway, I was disappointed that Shockwave wasn't in the story very much, just at the beginning and the end. Hopefully he will get more screen time. Same with Megatron. This seems to be a story of Optimus vs. Sentinel. I never got into the character of Sentinel, so that's kind of a bummer. I was really hoping it would be Optimus and Megatron vs. Shockwave and Sentinel. And it seems Sam's parents are only in it for a few moments, and they manage to thoroughly embarrass him anyway.

Overall, it's probably the most action packed and fastest moving of the 3 films, but I wouldn't put it above the first film. The book was good, though I hoped for a prequel just like the previous 2...
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby starscreamprime1010 » Sat Jun 18, 2011 7:43 pm

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loved it... and oddly my least favorite character was Sentinal. I did like how soome of the novel was told through Optimus Primes mind, really gave it emotional depth... so far its my favorite of the three.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Capt.Failure » Sat Jun 18, 2011 8:24 pm

MEGATRON BECOMES A GOOD GUY?!?


I'll wear my asbestos, lead lined suit for when the fans found out about that. The ensuing cries of RuinedFOREVER!!! will be beyond our comprehension.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Starscream GaGa » Sat Jun 18, 2011 9:32 pm

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The awkwardness is that Optimus really comes off as a self-centered dick in the last scene.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Rodimus Prime » Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:24 am

Motto: "I Stand Alone"
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Capt.Failure wrote:
MEGATRON BECOMES A GOOD GUY?!?


I'll wear my asbestos, lead lined suit for when the fans found out about that. The ensuing cries of RuinedFOREVER!!! will be beyond our comprehension.


He doesn't really become a good guy. He just decides to help Optimus in the end. Because even he admits, Sentinel could have and would have kicked the shit out of him.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby KingEmperor » Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:56 pm

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Megatron becoming a semi-good guy is kind of old news to me. It takes me back when he's fought alongside and had truces with Optimus Prime in the old comics and cartoons. So it's not really a huge bummer when I found out about this.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby zenosaurus_x » Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:06 pm

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Haven't read the book but I've picked up a few spoilers by now so nothing here was too bad.

In this continuity at least, it kinda makes sense for Megatron's changed, I think he's the only Megatron who was once a legitimate Decepticon who turned into the Megatron we know. The rest were already pretty crazy, though I may be missing some.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Starscream GaGa » Sun Jun 19, 2011 7:47 pm

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I think it makes most sense for this Megatron because, ever since he got to Earth, nothing has really gone right for him. Giving up and wanting to go back to Cybertron is the logical conclusion anyone would come to.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Diem » Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:28 pm

Rodimus Prime wrote:
Capt.Failure wrote:
MEGATRON BECOMES A GOOD GUY?!?


I'll wear my asbestos, lead lined suit for when the fans found out about that. The ensuing cries of RuinedFOREVER!!! will be beyond our comprehension.


He doesn't really become a good guy. He just decides to help Optimus in the end. Because even he admits, Sentinel could have and would have kicked the shit out of him.

But in this case it's not just "team up against a common foe", Megatron actually decides to try for peace even if he has to fight his fellow 'Cons for it.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Capt.Failure » Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:05 pm

Starscream GaGa wrote:I think it makes most sense for this Megatron because, ever since he got to Earth, nothing has really gone right for him. Giving up and wanting to go back to Cybertron is the logical conclusion anyone would come to.


That and it kind of makes Megatron...ya know, a three dimensional character rather than Saturday morning cartoon variety, "BLARGH I'M SO EVIL I MUST BE EVIL!" :twisted:
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Starscream GaGa » Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:55 am

Motto: ""I'm a free Decepti-bitch, baby!""
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..And it only took them until the last scene of the third movie.

Optimus Prime, on the other hand stays disturbingly monstrous throughout.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Rodimus Prime » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:51 am

Motto: "I Stand Alone"
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Yeah, that's true. He does say he's tired of fighting and he's going to go home and rebuild Cybertron even if he has to go through his own troops to do it. And when Optimus says he's staying on Earth, Megatron pretty much tells him he's welcome back to Cybertron any time.

I still wish it was a full-fledged partnership between them throughout the movie, though. And Shockwave should have been given much more to do. I really think Ehren Kruger and Michael Bay missed the boat on the whole "Optimus and Megatron vs. Shockwave and Sentinel" thing.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Bleak5170 » Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:47 am

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I am curious to see just how closely the novel follows the movie script. I have read other movie novels which ended up being drastically different than the actual film. I'm kind of hoping at least one thing doesn't happen in the movie.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Diem » Mon Jun 20, 2011 9:19 am

Rodimus Prime wrote:I still wish it was a full-fledged partnership between them throughout the movie, though.


That may have been Hasbro's influence. I can imagine them saying they don't want kids to be confused about Megatron being a good guy.

But then again they're making an expensive toy of a character who gets unceremoniously killed, so what do they know?
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Diem » Mon Jun 20, 2011 10:55 pm

The thing that really gets me is how much of the plot resembles G1 cartoon episodes. The plot is totally taken from Megatron's Master Plan (hints of this were in ROTF too) and The Ultimate Doom. There are also elements of Dark Awakening (respected hero comes back to life but turns traitor) and Return Of Optimus Prime (villain helps heroes against a common foe, calls for peace at the end).
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Autobot032 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:01 am

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Diem wrote:The thing that really gets me is how much of the plot resembles G1 cartoon episodes. The plot is totally taken from Megatron's Master Plan (hints of this were in ROTF too) and The Ultimate Doom. There are also elements of Dark Awakening (respected hero comes back to life but turns traitor) and Return Of Optimus Prime (villain helps heroes against a common foe, calls for peace at the end).


Thank you, thank you, thank you. Finally, someone sees it.

Folks, we're getting G1-fied movies. As much as you hate to admit it, ROTF had a few G1 elements. This film is loaded with them and screaming for a comparison.

We asked, we got. Now, please don't whine about this one. Please?

It really is a good story, and a lot of fun. Please give it a chance.

Oh, and celebrate the handiwork of Kruger, he did an excellent job here. I see spots in the story where Orci & Kurtzman would've ruined this film.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Starscream GaGa » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:45 am

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I think the similarities to Ultimate Doom are a coincidence, rather than intentional.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Capt.Failure » Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:04 am

Autobot032 wrote:
Diem wrote:The thing that really gets me is how much of the plot resembles G1 cartoon episodes. The plot is totally taken from Megatron's Master Plan (hints of this were in ROTF too) and The Ultimate Doom. There are also elements of Dark Awakening (respected hero comes back to life but turns traitor) and Return Of Optimus Prime (villain helps heroes against a common foe, calls for peace at the end).


Thank you, thank you, thank you. Finally, someone sees it.

Folks, we're getting G1-fied movies. As much as you hate to admit it, ROTF had a few G1 elements. This film is loaded with them and screaming for a comparison.

We asked, we got. Now, please don't whine about this one. Please?

It really is a good story, and a lot of fun. Please give it a chance.

Oh, and celebrate the handiwork of Kruger, he did an excellent job here. I see spots in the story where Orci & Kurtzman would've ruined this film.


I tried to point that out on another forum in 2009 and got banned for even suggesting RotF was anything like G1. Goes to show you Transformers fans never know what they want, even when they get it. :roll:
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Autobot032 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:05 am

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Starscream GaGa wrote:I think the similarities to Ultimate Doom are a coincidence, rather than intentional.


Image

Coincidence? I think you should rewatch Ultimate Doom, reread the novel and come back after having a refreshed view of the whole thing.

Anyone who is in the know and watches this film or reads this book is going to say "Oh. The Ultimate Doom. Hmm."
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Starscream GaGa » Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:18 am

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I saw the Ultimate Doom quite recently, while there are similarities in teleporting Cybertron to Earth and having human slaves and yes, that is a very G1 plot, the rest of the movie is completely new.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Tekka » Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:21 am

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Even if the movies share one or two similar story elements with other series, claiming "omfg, neo G1" is horrendously stupid when taking the content of the movies into account as a whole. Personally I can't even begin to imagine how you'd justify this comparison to yourselves.

But if you are just using it as another excuse to tell people to "stop whining",
I guess every little rock counts as a hit, no matter how little damage it does in reality.
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Autobot032 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:10 pm

Weapon: Switch Blade Tail
Starscream GaGa wrote:I saw the Ultimate Doom quite recently, while there are similarities in teleporting Cybertron to Earth and having human slaves and yes, that is a very G1 plot, the rest of the movie is completely new.


:-X ...you might want to edit part of that...
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby starscreamprime1010 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:48 pm

Motto: ""You may lose your faith in us, but never in yourselves..""
Weapon: Null-Ray Rifle
Autobot032 wrote:
Starscream GaGa wrote:I think the similarities to Ultimate Doom are a coincidence, rather than intentional.


Image

Coincidence? I think you should rewatch Ultimate Doom, reread the novel and come back after having a refreshed view of the whole thing.

Anyone who is in the know and watches this film or reads this book is going to say "Oh. The Ultimate Doom. Hmm."

that was exactly my face. Ehren Kruger actually tried to give us a G1 based storyline and people are refusing to believe it? Fans these days :BANG_HEAD:
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Re: SUPER SPOILERS: DOTM Novelization

Postby Starscream GaGa » Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:54 pm

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It's not that I don't like the plot of the movie,m I think it's much better than the other two's, it's just I fail to see any evidence that it IS more than a coincidence.

Even the focuses are different Ultimate Doom was more about mind-controlled slaves tan anything else whereas the movie is more about Sentinel Prime and the war on Earth. I think it's less of a case of people refusing to see it as a homage and more of a case of people tricking themself into it being a homage.

It doesn't really matter if it's a homage or not anyway.
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