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The death of a marvel Icon (spoilers)

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Postby Duke of Luns » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:05 am

My brother actually told me abut this by accident today.

I've been collecting Cap since Vol. 3 #7, and I have pretty much ever issue of the main series since Heroes Reborn. It's the only comic series I ever collected monthly(besides Transformers), and if they're ending it, I'm ticked.

So, is there gonna be a Cap #26, or are they gonna do ANOTHER relaunch?

Either way, I'm going to the comic shop this Saturday.
Last edited by Duke of Luns on Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Senor Hugo » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:08 am

I don't buy it. If it was The Punisher who shot Cap, then why did he need two pretty lousy shots to drop him, a shot to the shoulder and one in the stomach. I doubt Punisher is that off his game to miss vitals like that.

Unless it's for an alterior reason. Like maybe Cap isn't really dead, just made a deal with the Punisher in order to make people think Cap is dead, so he can do some guerilla stuff.
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Postby Counterpunch » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:31 am

Motto: "...and I used to be such a nice guy."
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The SHIELD agent, the one Steve Rogers was in love with, she was the one that delivered the killing blow.

She was a sleeper agent, I have to assume of Red Skull.

Also, it occurs to me that this Cap is most likely a LMD (Life Model Decoy), which would set up Cap's return as Ronin later on.
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Postby DISCHARGE » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:32 am

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Senor Hugo wrote:I don't buy it. If it was The Punisher who shot Cap, then why did he need two pretty lousy shots to drop him, a shot to the shoulder and one in the stomach. I doubt Punisher is that off his game to miss vitals like that.

Unless it's for an alterior reason. Like maybe Cap isn't really dead, just made a deal with the Punisher in order to make people think Cap is dead, so he can do some guerilla stuff.

What about the shooter on the grassy knoll?
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Postby Rodimus_Lantern » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:33 am

Yeah there is no way that Cap is dead. Just won't happen. I am really liking the development of Punisher lately. Very interesting.
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Postby Wheeljack35 » Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:48 pm

Ok I have a dumb question

Didn't CA die a few years ago and make a comeback recently?
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Postby Counterpunch » Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:55 pm

Motto: "...and I used to be such a nice guy."
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Wheeljack35 wrote:Ok I have a dumb question

Didn't CA die a few years ago and make a comeback recently?


No, not really.

But over the past 50 years, there have been about 4 Captain Americas. The current one, is also the original one. The others have either gone nuts, or taken different mantles, ie US Agent
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Postby Duke of Luns » Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:56 pm

Wheeljack35 wrote:Ok I have a dumb question

Didn't CA die a few years ago and make a comeback recently?


I still don't know what to make of that. In Captain America Vol. 3 #50, Cap got a call from a "kid" saying that they found an unexploded bomb in an abandoned military base(or thereabouts, don't feel like digging out the issue). Well, Cap rushes to the scene, only to be swarmed by a whole bunch of really old Nazi's wearing Red Skull masks, and Cap doesn't want to hurt 'em, so he gets captured. They then tie him up, and set up a bomb, with the intent to kill Cap and themselves. Well, the bomb goes off, and the body isn't found, nor is his shield. The rest of the issue goes on about how Cap was a hero, and how other heroes(and in some cases, villains),and regular people, mourneed his passing. The issue ends with a page showcasing a lot of heroes around a casket. It was a really good issue, btw.

Well, Cap took a little hiatus, and came back a couple months later in "Dead Men Running", a three issue mini-series, with no allusions to how he made it out of the bomb. After that, there was another series that ran around 38 issues or so. I didn't like the majority of those issues, I found them boring, and most were five parters. The best issues were the four part alternate reality ish's(18-21 I think). Then they relaunched AGAIN with Brubaker as the writer, and that's the current series, and it's really good. And it had better not end at #25.

So, uh, did they ever address how he made it out? Cause like I said, the only Marvel comic I collect monthly is Cap. Any other comics besides Transformers I collect are strictly back-issues, which is fun cause they usually go pretty cheap.
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Postby Counterpunch » Wed Mar 07, 2007 2:08 pm

Motto: "...and I used to be such a nice guy."
Weapon: Jawbreaker Cannon
Duke of Luns wrote:
Wheeljack35 wrote:Ok I have a dumb question

Didn't CA die a few years ago and make a comeback recently?


I still don't know what to make of that. In Captain America Vol. 3 #50, Cap got a call from a "kid" saying that they found an unexploded bomb in an abandoned military base(or thereabouts, don't feel like digging out the issue). Well, Cap rushes to the scene, only to be swarmed by a whole bunch of really old Nazi's wearing Red Skull masks, and Cap doesn't want to hurt 'em, so he gets captured. They then tie him up, and set up a bomb, with the intent to kill Cap and themselves. Well, the bomb goes off, and the body isn't found, nor is his shield. The rest of the issue goes on about how Cap was a hero, and how other heroes(and in some cases, villains),and regular people, mourneed his passing. The issue ends with a page showcasing a lot of heroes around a casket. It was a really good issue, btw.

Well, Cap took a little hiatus, and came back a couple months later in "Dead Men Running", a three issue mini-series, with no allusions to how he made it out of the bomb. After that, there was another series that ran around 38 issues or so. I didn't like the majority of those issues, I found them boring, and most were five parters. The best issues were the four part alternate reality ish's(18-21 I think). Then they relaunched AGAIN with Brubaker as the writer, and that's the current series, and it's really good. And it had better not end at #25.

So, uh, did they ever address how he made it out? Cause like I said, the only Marvel comic I collect monthly is Cap. Any other comics besides Transformers I collect are strictly back-issues, which is fun cause they usually go pretty cheap.


Cap punched Hitler.

old nazis + Tied up + bomb =/= Dead Cap.

Lovers shooting Cap in the stomach = Dead Cap.
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Postby Wheeljack35 » Wed Mar 07, 2007 2:17 pm

Counterpunch wrote:
Wheeljack35 wrote:Ok I have a dumb question

Didn't CA die a few years ago and make a comeback recently?


No, not really.

But over the past 50 years, there have been about 4 Captain Americas. The current one, is also the original one. The others have either gone nuts, or taken different mantles, ie US Agent


Wow I never knew this Thanks for the info
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Postby Ironhidensh » Wed Mar 07, 2007 2:17 pm

I read somewhere that he didn't actually die, but is being "worked" on in the raft.


Won't get to the comic shop till Fri. so I really don't know.
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Postby ionacus » Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:02 pm

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i wont get my new books tilltomorrow so i will have to suffer. but with counterpunchs' theory about cap being ronin is sound. but in last months new avengers the new ronin says "i didnt know their was banter. i dont do banter."
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Postby Rodimus_Lantern » Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:14 pm

Yeah after reading it he isn't dead. I'll scan it if anyone wants me too.
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Postby .op. » Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:17 pm

Sad if they really kill him. He is an icon for Marvel.
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Postby Dynamax » Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:42 pm

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_America

Seems there were two shooters...Sharon Carter (mind control) and Crossbones.
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Postby Counterpunch » Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:59 pm

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Dynamax wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_America

Seems there were two shooters...Sharon Carter (mind control) and Crossbones.


Yea, Sharon as a sleeper agent finds the wounded Cap and shoves a gun into his belly, pulling the trigger.

Cap looks pretty dead at that point.

(I think the body is. I also am 90% positive that the dead 'Cap' we've seen is a LMD)
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Postby Burn » Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:46 am

Rodimus Lantern wrote:I'll scan it if anyone wants me too.


Already done. :grin:
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Postby God Sunstreaker » Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:37 am

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Postby jprime69 » Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:15 am

I believe Marvel has stated that Cap is dead. But as the old saying goes, in comics, when does anyone stay truly dead? And come on, this is friggen Cap!
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Postby Rodimus_Lantern » Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:14 am

jprime69 wrote:I believe Marvel has stated that Cap is dead. But as the old saying goes, in comics, when does anyone stay truly dead? And come on, this is friggen Cap!

Read all of the Comics that came out this week. He isn't dead people!!!!!!!!!
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Postby God Magnus » Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:24 am

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Rodimus Lantern wrote:
jprime69 wrote:I believe Marvel has stated that Cap is dead. But as the old saying goes, in comics, when does anyone stay truly dead? And come on, this is friggen Cap!

Read all of the Comics that came out this week. He isn't dead people!!!!!!!!!


Did that. He still seems pretty dead to me. I think it's funny that people on politically heavy news shows are saying that it was irresponsible for Marvel to kill Captain America in a time of war.
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Postby Duke of Luns » Fri Mar 09, 2007 10:22 pm

God Magnus wrote:
Rodimus Lantern wrote:
jprime69 wrote:I believe Marvel has stated that Cap is dead. But as the old saying goes, in comics, when does anyone stay truly dead? And come on, this is friggen Cap!

Read all of the Comics that came out this week. He isn't dead people!!!!!!!!!


Did that. He still seems pretty dead to me. I think it's funny that people on politically heavy news shows are saying that it was irresponsible for Marvel to kill Captain America in a time of war.


Whew, I found out that Cap will still be published after #25

from the forums of marveltoys.net
"Captain America will continue to be published despite the very real death of Steve Rogers.


And while I still haven't gotten the issue yet, why would the comic live on if the title character was dead? Steve Rogers and Captain America are synonimous with one another, they wouldn't drop a new Cap in there like that. However, if they did, it would be a gutsy move. Even more gutsy than the well written revival of Bucky.
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Postby Burn » Fri Mar 09, 2007 10:59 pm

Duke of Luns wrote:Steve Rogers and Captain America are synonimous with one another, they wouldn't drop a new Cap in there like that. However, if they did, it would be a gutsy move. Even more gutsy than the well written revival of Bucky.


Gutsy?

Nah. Stark will just choose a replacement, someone he can control. Heck, Stark'll just clone Steve and use him as propoganda for The Initiative.
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Postby Shadowman » Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:48 am

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A Wiseman once wrote:Absolutely NO ONE in comic books stays dead.


Yeah, he'll be ressurected eventually. Everyone in DC has died at least once, right? Marvel can do it too. They brought Uncle Ben back to life, and his death was the most important thing to happen to Spider-Man.
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Postby Supreme Convoy » Sat Mar 10, 2007 4:18 pm

:BOT: I thought this was an stellar issue! Ed Brubaker is one hell of a writer. I've been following this since #1 and I can't get enough of it.

As for Captain America's death...

Ed Brubaker said that Cap's dead and there are 2 more years worth of the Captain America book! So he's building up some kinda grand mystery.

Of course I don't buy that Steve's dead. Bendis killed off Hawkeye and he returned a year later. Even Brubaker killed Foggy Nelson but elegantly brought him back from the "dead" (we assume he's dead but he's actually in the witness protection program).

Brubaker keeps his readers on his toes so we'll learn what really happens in #26's autopsy.

It's a bold move for Marvel. I hope they don't screw this up. :CON:
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