Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

Dead Metal wrote:No sorry, you're confusing me with you,

Chill out, no need to be hostile. =D

Dead Metal wrote:I'm not stating that everything points to "my" conclusion, I'm saying it points to the official conclusion.

It's still your conclusion. You merely share it with Hasbro.

Dead Metal wrote:You're ignoring the official word and the inconsistencies WFC and FOC have with all G1 continuities, which are even larger than the the ones it has with Prime, especially considering that Prime even has an episode devoted to retelling the main story points of WFC as its history.

I'm not ignoring Hasbro's word, I'm simply acknowledging that inconsistencies take precedent in saying that the fictions are in different continuities over Hasbro's word. The similarities of the different fictions is irrelevant.

Dead Metal wrote:Almost every incarnation of G1 has had its own history via stories set in those times or flashbacks, or even history footage from those times.
WFC jives with non of them.

That doesn't matter to the issue here.

Dead Metal wrote:You could make a better case of Animated sharing the same history as G1 due to the "history video" easter egg in the first episode, but please don't restart that one.

Isn't Animated a G1 universe though? That was my understanding. Then again, I haven't watched it enough to come to a solid viewpoint yet.

Dead Metal wrote:Here have it from Archer at a BotCon panel from last year.
http://www.seibertron.com/news/index.ph ... _sponors=y
Scroll down to Modern Continuity.

I'm well aware what they said. But again, it's irrelevant.

Dead Metal wrote:

orangeitis wrote:I'm not necessarily on the "WFC=G1" side. I'm just trying to be reasonable here.

Erm, no actually not. Yes there are inconsistencies but looking at the points from earlier, well.

Yes, I am trying to be reasonable. You seem like you're assuming that I'm not because you don't agree with my open-minded view.

I'm not trying to say that Exodus/Exiles, WFC/FoC, or Prime isn't set in the same universe. I'm saying that it's very unlikely from a continuity perspective, and that(from what Matt Tieger said about it leading into G1) WFC/FoC could also be set in a new G1 universe, where the timeline branches out.

Dead Metal wrote:

orangeitis wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:Arguing against that makes you on par with the kind of people who believe that Reptoids have been simultaneously guiding and working towards destroying our species for the past 10 thousand years or so.

Yeah... no.

I'm sorry, it does.

No, it does not. I'm presenting logic and evidence for my case. You have just made a claim that doesn't make any sense. Reptiles aren't sapient, so they are incapable of actively wanting to destroy the human species. Your reasoning is becoming increasingly irrational.

Just because you don't understand the other side's view don't mean that their view is as flawed as you perceive it to be. It just means that you're arguing without investigation, and are ignorant to the logic of the one(s) you're talking to. The very fact that you made such a comparison is evidence that you're being unreasonable, and if you're not gonna take your side of the issue on faith and refuse to take the time to understand, then you've already lost the argument.

orangeitis wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:You could make a better case of Animated sharing the same history as G1 due to the "history video" easter egg in the first episode, but please don't restart that one.

Isn't Animated a G1 universe though? That was my understanding. Then again, I haven't watched it enough to come to a solid viewpoint yet.

I've seen you use the term "Primax" to refer to G1-related media. Animated has its own universal cluster called "Malgus", which is very much separate from Primax.

Sabrblade wrote:

orangeitis wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:You could make a better case of Animated sharing the same history as G1 due to the "history video" easter egg in the first episode, but please don't restart that one.

Isn't Animated a G1 universe though? That was my understanding. Then again, I haven't watched it enough to come to a solid viewpoint yet.

I've seen you use the term "Primax" to refer to G1-related media. Animated has its own universal cluster called "Malgus", which is very much separate from Primax.

Ah, that's right. Thanks for clearing that up. =)

orangeitis wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:I'm not stating that everything points to "my" conclusion, I'm saying it points to the official conclusion.

It's still your conclusion. You merely share it with Hasbro.

No it's only my conclusion because it comes from the people who make Transformers. I mean how can you just completely ignore the word of those who are responsible for the thing we're debating here?
That's like going up to a family and argue against them belonging together, just because you first thought that their children where those of the neighbours.

Hasbro wrote up the new aligned bible as something new, a new starting off point to be used from now on, if they say it's not connected to G1 then it damn well isn't.

Dead Metal wrote:You're ignoring the official word and the inconsistencies WFC and FOC have with all G1 continuities, which are even larger than the the ones it has with Prime, especially considering that Prime even has an episode devoted to retelling the main story points of WFC as its history.

I'm not ignoring Hasbro's word, I'm simply acknowledging that inconsistencies take precedent in saying that the fictions are in different continuities over Hasbro's word. The similarities of the different fictions is irrelevant.

So just cos it's inconsistant means it voids HAsbro's word?
Cool, that means that every episode of the old G1 cartoon are their own continuities and have no real connection to each other.

Dead Metal wrote:Almost every incarnation of G1 has had its own history via stories set in those times or flashbacks, or even history footage from those times.
WFC jives with non of them.

That doesn't matter to the issue here.

It does, because you're trying to make it fit in.

Dead Metal wrote:You could make a better case of Animated sharing the same history as G1 due to the "history video" easter egg in the first episode, but please don't restart that one.

Isn't Animated a G1 universe though? That was my understanding. Then again, I haven't watched it enough to come to a solid viewpoint yet.

I don't even want to comment on that one.

Dead Metal wrote:Here have it from Archer at a BotCon panel from last year.
http://www.seibertron.com/news/index.ph ... _sponors=y
Scroll down to Modern Continuity.

I'm well aware what they said. But again, it's irrelevant.

I'll save this for later, it comes in handy.

Dead Metal wrote:

orangeitis wrote:I'm not necessarily on the "WFC=G1" side. I'm just trying to be reasonable here.

Erm, no actually not. Yes there are inconsistencies but looking at the points from earlier, well.

Yes, I am trying to be reasonable. You seem like you're assuming that I'm not because you don't agree with my open-minded view.

I'm not trying to say that Exodus/Exiles, WFC/FoC, or Prime isn't set in the same universe. I'm saying that it's very unlikely from a continuity perspective, and that(from what Matt Tieger said about it leading into G1) WFC/FoC could also be set in a new G1 universe, where the timeline branches out.
[/quote]
This is where the point from earlier comes into play, you know the one where you state that what the creators say is irrelevant. How come Matt Tieger has more validly to you than the guys whose work and ideas it's based off? Remember, WFC and FOC are adaptations of the same source material as Exodus and Exiles.


It's not open-minded, it's insane. You can't make something fit for something it wasn't intended to. Hey how about we'll throw in the idea that WFC can also be shared by the Movie universe, although the movies and their material completely contradict it.

But hey, we're all open-minded here who says that WFC doesn't branch out into Prime, G1, Movie, RID, Armada, hell it could actually also be the back story to Ghostbusters and Go-Bots.

Dead Metal wrote:

orangeitis wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:Arguing against that makes you on par with the kind of people who believe that Reptoids have been simultaneously guiding and working towards destroying our species for the past 10 thousand years or so.

Yeah... no.

I'm sorry, it does.

No, it does not. I'm presenting logic and evidence for my case. You have just made a claim that doesn't make any sense. Reptiles aren't sapient, so they are incapable of actively wanting to destroy the human species. Your reasoning is becoming increasingly irrational.

You have just explained to me the point of the comparison I made. Because, there are people who believe everything that's on this page and that's who I compared you to.

Just because you don't understand the other side's view don't mean that their view is as flawed as you perceive it to be. It just means that you're arguing without investigation, and are ignorant to the logic of the one(s) you're talking to. The very fact that you made such a comparison is evidence that you're being unreasonable, and if you're not gonna take your side of the issue on faith and refuse to take the time to understand, then you've already lost the argument.

No no no no, I at first too though that WFC was a new G1, but it doesn't fit at all.
Adding to that that Tieger is always so eager to say "This is the first time that the history of the Transformers had been told" further proves that this can't be G1.
The G1 continuities have their own histories, that have all been told, heck the histories are part of their incarnations. That alone completely negates this as being the back story to any version of G1 ever.

Also, trying to figure out where something fits while ignoring the facts laid down by the frigen owners and creators is being unreasonable.

Also, that line of just taking faith and believing your side of the argument based on it, actually makes you the looser of the argument, you should look up what faith means before you try to use it as an argument winner.

Couldn't WFC also be the background for the Movies? Excluding the design aesthetic. Theres seems to be enough vagueness in the movies backgrounds to just attach them to WFC. Prime and Megatron used to be brothers, etc etc, last of the primes, etc, and then WFC is supposed to be connected to Prime, and then Prime is sort of supposed to be connected to the movies or some crap? Seems like such a mess.

Wait, why do I care about the movies.

MINDVVIPE wrote:Couldn't WFC also be the background for the Movies? Couldn't WFC also be the background for the Movies? Excluding the design aesthetic. Theres seems to be enough vagueness in the movies backgrounds to just attach them to WFC.

"Movie Prequel", "Defiance", "Tales of the Fallen", and "Foundation" say otherwise.

MINDVVIPE wrote:and then Prime is sort of supposed to be connected to the movies or some crap?

Prime has no ties to the movies.

Sabrblade wrote:

MINDVVIPE wrote:Couldn't WFC also be the background for the Movies? Couldn't WFC also be the background for the Movies? Excluding the design aesthetic. Theres seems to be enough vagueness in the movies backgrounds to just attach them to WFC.

"Movie Prequel", "Defiance", "Tales of the Fallen", and "Foundation" say otherwise.

MINDVVIPE wrote:and then Prime is sort of supposed to be connected to the movies or some crap?

Prime has no ties to the movies.

Gotcha. There is that one point someone brought up, about dark energon from WFC being different from Prime. How does that roll? is that just a flaw that Hasbro sorta overlooks for storytelling purposes and the 2 (prime and WFC) are connected regardless? Sorry if these questions seem simple compared to the crazy debate just previous, but I wanted to keep things simple as much as possible with all the crazy different things people are saying.

MINDVVIPE wrote:There is that one point someone brought up, about dark energon from WFC being different from Prime. How does that roll? is that just a flaw that Hasbro sorta overlooks for storytelling purposes and the 2 (prime and WFC) are connected regardless? Sorry if these questions seem simple compared to the crazy debate just previous, but I wanted to keep things simple as much as possible with all the crazy different things people are saying.

It was stated at BotCon 2011 that the differing effects between the Dark Energon of the games/books and the Dark Energon of the cartoon were due to the different time periods. Present-day Dark Energon acts differently from ancient Dark Energon, though both still hold the same corrupting properties.

Sabrblade wrote:

MINDVVIPE wrote:There is that one point someone brought up, about dark energon from WFC being different from Prime. How does that roll? is that just a flaw that Hasbro sorta overlooks for storytelling purposes and the 2 (prime and WFC) are connected regardless? Sorry if these questions seem simple compared to the crazy debate just previous, but I wanted to keep things simple as much as possible with all the crazy different things people are saying.

It was stated at BotCon 2011 that the differing effects between the Dark Energon of the games/books and the Dark Energon of the cartoon were due to the different time periods. Present-day Dark Energon acts differently from ancient Dark Energon, though both still hold the same corrupting properties.

Elves did it, gotcha.
I don't need so much reasoning to enjoy it anyway, just curious. Thanks.

MINDVVIPE wrote:Elves did it, gotcha.