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craggy wrote:thanks njb, I've not intentionally dismissed anyone who is a fan of the films. I don't really like them, but they've brought a lot of money to the franchise, and have potential to be really good. I'm willing to admit that a lot of stuff I like would probably be considered rubbish by a lot of folks as well, and don't get hung up on it. It's pretty obvious a lot of people do like them, or we wouldn't be getting a 4th.

I've enjoyed most of TFPrime, as I've felt the bot/human mix is pretty good, as is the range of the stories. I'd like more of that slant to the films, or better yet, a full-on robot only film.

Apologies if I seemed hostile. I was coming off a shouting match with D-340. I can respect your opinion even if my own counter opinion seems harsh. At least you didn't drop the "it's not Transformers!!!" fallacy.

craggy wrote:I don't find that the Transformers characters get nearly any character development across the films. I can't think of a single character arc any of them goes through. Even Optimus Prime who dies and is resurrected by a holy artifact (!) barely mentions it and is in no way affected by it. Meanwhile we get Simmons evolution across the series and even Sam's parents grow more as people than any of the Autobots.

I'll admit to that being a problem. The impact of it, at least to me, is dulled by the fact that I know these characters since I was a child. DotM at least gave Optimus and Sentinel a character arch. I'm hoping if the rumors of filming 4-6 back to back are true we can get more character development across the board. One single storyline gives more time to develop characters than episodic films like the last trilogy.

Capt.Failure wrote:

craggy wrote:thanks njb, I've not intentionally dismissed anyone who is a fan of the films. I don't really like them, but they've brought a lot of money to the franchise, and have potential to be really good. I'm willing to admit that a lot of stuff I like would probably be considered rubbish by a lot of folks as well, and don't get hung up on it. It's pretty obvious a lot of people do like them, or we wouldn't be getting a 4th.

I've enjoyed most of TFPrime, as I've felt the bot/human mix is pretty good, as is the range of the stories. I'd like more of that slant to the films, or better yet, a full-on robot only film.

Apologies if I seemed hostile. I was coming off a shouting match with D-340. I can respect your opinion even if my own counter opinion seems harsh. At least you didn't drop the "it's not Transformers!!!" fallacy.

It's hard for me to tell if it's Transformers or not, they're all so vaguely there in the background

Kidding. I'm really not a fan of the physical designs for them, but they'd have won me over if I felt the robotic characters were actual people rather than just plot devices to allow for explosions though. They're alien, transforming robotic people, but they're people. I should be able to tell that from watching the films. They feel very one dimensional to me.

There is always the excellent potential there, and it annoys me to see it (in my opinion) wasted.

Kelsey Grammer? A bit of an unorthodox choice, but I'll reserve my judgment for until after I see the movie.

Honestly, if Shia and those government agent goons with their stupid jokes couldn't make me abandon the TF movies, nothing will...as long as they keep up with the gorgeous transformation scenes and give us more fights that at least equal OP's legendary forest fight scene. And with "The Beef" finally gone, things can only get better for the movies--I hope. Hopefully, they'll tone down the idiot gags as well.

craggy wrote:I've enjoyed most of TFPrime, as I've felt the bot/human mix is pretty good, as is the range of the stories. I'd like more of that slant to the films, or better yet, a full-on robot only film.

I totally agree, and I'd love to see a full-on TF movie with TF's only. But until the cost of rendering such realistic CG models goes way down, that's not likely to happen.

before I go, let me say again that I did like Duhamel's army guys in the films. I just thought they'd be much better as GI Joes. In a GI Joe film. They should have been drafted for the sequel.

SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Kelsey Grammer? A bit of an unorthodox choice, but I'll reserve my judgment for until after I see the movie.

Honestly, if Shia and those government agent goons with their stupid jokes couldn't make me abandon the TF movies, nothing will...as long as they keep up with the gorgeous transformation scenes and give us more fights that at least equal OP's legendary forest fight scene. And with "The Beef" finally gone, things can only get better for the movies--I hope. Hopefully, they'll tone down the idiot gags as well.

craggy wrote:I've enjoyed most of TFPrime, as I've felt the bot/human mix is pretty good, as is the range of the stories. I'd like more of that slant to the films, or better yet, a full-on robot only film.

I totally agree, and I'd love to see a full-on TF movie with TF's only. But until the cost of rendering such realistic CG models goes way down, that's not likely to happen.

Try watching Boss(if you haven’t already) , I think you'll see where they got the idea for Grammer. Oh and not to mention that it's a good show!

craggy wrote:before I go, let me say again that I did like Duhamel's army guys in the films. I just thought they'd be much better as GI Joes. In a GI Joe film. They should have been drafted for the sequel.

They should have been the stars of the TF movies instead of Shia, except Spielberg wanted his own little ET homage and "suggested" the idea of a boy and his first car/alien robot to the writers.

njb902 wrote:Try watching Boss(if you haven’t already) , I think you'll see where they got the idea for Grammer. Oh and not to mention that it's a good show!

Thanks for the recommendations--I'll give the show a try! I think HBO is currently airing the first season.

Those scrambled eggs are causing him to be a villain, apparently.

Dr. Arkeville? ... Please?

Yet another actor I've never heard of.

The history buff in me screams "Richard Nixon" when I look at his image.

hmm.. Greg Burger?

Good choice? No. Excellent choice. I hope they give him some room to chew up the scenery.

Guys, guys, guys...and gals if you're out there,

COME ON...CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG?!?

I am not going to quote or add anyone to my little speech here, but I have to throw an olive branch out there...

We are ALL Transformers fans here, and I KNOW we ALL LOVE our bots, no question about that... That being said, did we ALL forget that the Transformers are on EARTH?? There WILL be humans UNLESS they make a Cybertron only movie and that ISNT gonna happen. Let's face it, us TF fans would be the ONLY ones to go see that movie. Hell, I HATED Spike and Sparkplug during the G1 era...I hated Danny in the damn 1986 movie... But HUMANS are a fact of life on EARTH...add into that studios are in the business of MAKING $$$$ . It pains me to say it, but our beloved Welker and Cullen will not bring in $1Billion+... We are LUCKY to have QUALITY actors being signed on for this go round.


The fact we have fans out here that don't know who Kelsey Grammer is, others that keep calling Mark Wahlberg "Marky Mark," is kinda disturbing every time I get out here...I am a G1 fanboy through and through, but I embrace Transformers in whatever form they may take...I don't always LIKE it, but it's good to see the concept and history be passed on... I have ALOT of negative things to say about the Bay movies, but thanks to them MY TRANSFORMERS live on... Hell, I even have a toddler Optimus for my four year old austistic son. How AWESOME IS THAT?!?!


Bottom line is...1) Quit whining about something that isn't even done yet , 2) The humans we DO have to endure are looking to be top notch, 3) It's Transformer guys!!! This one is going to be IMAX, 3D, NEW bots... and as much as The Bay movies left me a little empty, he HAS gotten some movies RIGHT in the past... After all is said and done, NOTHING compared to the first time Optimus Prime rolled up in that alley, transformed and I heard that ever so familiar sound of transforming from my youth as he went from truck to bot. My GOD, what Transformer fan DIDNT SMILE AND GETS CHILLS?!?!

Have a little Faith guys...

I always hated Frasier so it will be cool if we get to see him get blown up.

BeastProwl wrote:hmm.. Greg Burger?

That was my first thought, but who knows.

How about Zarak?

Damn, I go for a little while and it's turned into fan vs. fan.

Craggy: My fault, reading what I said it came out a little different than I intended. Didn't mean to sound like you HAD to leave a positive comment. I meant more to suggest that we've all already made that complaint (Well, not ALL of us, but I know I did). Sorry aboot that!

What sucks is that there's not going to be any Josh Duhamel or John Turturro. They were the best human characters.

Superwheeljack wrote:Okay...never heard of him, but okay......
Oh well, tf 4 is probably going to be focused on the humans again

uh...Cheers, Frasier, Beast from X-Men 3... doesn't ring a bell? WOW!

Still can't believe folks haven't figured it out by now.
For the last f'ing time... It's too cost prohibitive to do an ENTIRELY CGI TF film at this point and that is the ONLY way that we'll get a film that has nothing to do with Earth or its inhabitants. Until then, since there are over 7.5 BILLION humans on the planet, there are going to be F'ing HUMANS in the film! Now... unless you can foot the bill for an entirely CGI TF film yourself...stop bitching about it!
Seriously, the majority of you fans out there piss me off and utterly disgust me with your insanely selfish, narrow-minded, egotistical POV! And it's not just about the human aspect, it's about the fact that many of you still can't seem to understand that, just because you seem to think a film sucked that doesn't give you the right to sh** all over everyone else and tell them they're wrong and treat them like crap. Those of you offended by my abruptness in this matter... guess what? If you're offended then that means you rightfully have a guilty conscience.

Capt.Failure wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Capt.Failure wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Capt.Failure wrote:

D-340 wrote:Can't have talk like that 'round here. What are you thinking? Only unconditional love for all things Micheal Bay when it comes to commenting on the movies.

Cry me a river?

Ugh, really? Can't even crack a joke around here without gettin' all the movie fanboys all riled up and their underwear in twist. Get a sense of humor.

No my sense of humor is perfectly fine. I just enjoy how you throw yourself on the ground kicking, screaming, and crying over how people like something you don't. It amuses me.

Yeah, that's actually not what I'm doing at all

Didn't you say this to Burn about how he liked the films in another thread?

D-340 wrote:Quit deluding yourself, if you wanna settle for schlock, settle for it. But know, you don't have to, you choose to.

That sounds like saying that people only enjoy the films because they're delusional. The words of a child who can't accept that people think differently than him. So very very sad.

You resort to calling names, yet I'm the child. Yes, yes I did say that to Burn, but of course, you took it out of context. It started with comparing the TF movies the the Dark Knight Trilogy. And as far as shouting match, that's hilarious. Thought it was a debate, 2 fans debating over opinion(which is what forums are for) yet, I'm a sad child. Oh, oh I'm sorry Capt. Failure, you figured me out. I'm a butt hurt little fan boy, a crying, screaming child.

Hmmmmmph.........once again, have the last word, and trash me. Whatever, I got my opinion, got yours. I'm done with this. Agree to disagree. But when you're gonna quote someone, at least quote em in context. But then again, I shouldn't expect any less, with the name calling and all. Later.

I'm only going to say this once, and rest assured, warnings will be issued otherwise.

Enough talk about how good or bad the previous movies were (that's not what this thread was about)
Enough talk about how movie likes hate on movie haters and vice versa (that's not what this thread was about)
Enough insults, insinuations and other petty jabs (that's not what this thread is about)

Stick to what this thread is about. The casting of Kelsey Grammar, be it good or bad. But FFS, spare us the pettiness and bitching about the previous movies. There's a thousand other threads for that.

Autobot032 wrote:Good choice? No. Excellent choice. I hope they give him some room to chew up the scenery.

Personal wish: He's a scientist who discovers the Quintessons and through them, Unicron, and becomes the human leader of an apocalypse cult that worship them as the harbingers of the end times.

if they said he was playing burger. i would be interested.

Capt.Failure wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:Good choice? No. Excellent choice. I hope they give him some room to chew up the scenery.

Personal wish: He's a scientist who discovers the Quintessons and through them, Unicron, and becomes the human leader of an apocalypse cult that worship them as the harbingers of the end times.

Sounds like an awesome idea. It'd be great if TF4 (and a possible 5 and 6) would reveal more details and the "true" origins of the Transformers instead of just the cube creating them.

If the TF4,5,6 trilogy decided to go that way, I'm curious to see what the live action movie's take is on the TF's origins, if it'll go with the original G1 story with the Quints creating them as slaves, or if they'll go with the Primus vs Unicron thing, or a mix of both.

Kelsey Grammer is a good actor. He's got a great villain voice, and demeanor to match. I do feel, however, that he is slightly on the... boring side. The plot has got to twist and unfold, showing how twisted he really is, and give him some really dark depth to being a villain, and then, I think, the boring aspect will be overcome.

Quick note about all the Bay news involving humans. I agree that I cannot help getting a nauseating feeling everytime I see the Bay news, because it is never about a Transformer character instead of a human. I don't mean voice actors, but instead, "Bay says new TF4 movie villain is Straxus". Now thats something that would help restore my faith. Do you movie fans, realism in budget and the movie industry aside, disagree with me? Not trying to derail the thread, just wanted to find some common ground.

MINDVVIPE wrote:Quick note about all the Bay news involving humans. I agree that I cannot help getting a nauseating feeling everytime I see the Bay news, because it is never about a Transformer character instead of a human. I don't mean voice actors, but instead, "Bay says new TF4 movie villain is Straxus". Now thats something that would help restore my faith. Do you movie fans, realism in budget and the movie industry aside, disagree with me? Not trying to derail the thread, just wanted to find some common ground.

Yeah, I agree. I keep hoping to see some news about the TF's themselves, instead of just the human cast.

That said, I think since the cast of bots in TF4 are undergoing a rather extensive overhaul, they're probably still working on the brand-new character designs. And as we all know, Bay loves to stash little surprises here and there, like Sentinel's betrayal and Soundwave turning out to be the Mercedes Carly drives.

I won't be surprised if the concept art only starts showing up in the final days before the movie releases, if not after.

MINDVVIPE wrote:Not trying to derail the thread, just wanted to find some common ground.

Start the discussion in a new thread then?

RiddlerJ wrote:

BeastProwl wrote:hmm.. Greg Burger?

That was my first thought, but who knows.

How about Zarak?

Yup, this. Before I read that he would play 'Harold Attinger, a counter intelligence guy', my first hope was that he would play some form of Lord Zarak. He'd be perfect for that role! Considering that TF3:DotM took quite a few plot-points from the original cartoon and comic, perhaps he can still be squeezed into a comparable role.