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TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Nemesis Destron » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:01 am

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Kung Fu Man wrote:They're both back in stock, but their price jumped up $10 as a result. Circuit and Jackpot by comparison jumped down by the same amount, making them *cheaper* than buying them from the club.


WTF BBTS?? That's a total dick move jacking up the price like that!! :-x :VEHI:
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby metaphorge » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:09 am

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Slipstream & Scourge out of stock again.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Gauntlet101010 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:10 am

Nemesis Destron wrote:
Kung Fu Man wrote:They're both back in stock, but their price jumped up $10 as a result. Circuit and Jackpot by comparison jumped down by the same amount, making them *cheaper* than buying them from the club.


WTF BBTS?? That's a total dick move jacking up the price like that!! :-x :VEHI:

Yeah, WTF, BBTS? Just when I'd forgiven you for the instant markup on Hercules too.

Like most I want Slipstream and Scourge. That's about $200. The club subscription is about $300 and there you at least get Ultra Mammoth too, who's a pretty worthy buy on his own.

Uh, BBTS? I think you need to rethink your prices. Because, as tempted as I am to get the two figures from you the money says it really isn't worth it.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby metaphorge » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:26 am

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Perhaps it would behoove us to start deluging the fan club with requests for an ample supply of Slipstreams and Scpurges as singles. Obviously they won't confirm that they'll do this until after the closing date on the subscription (to keep the information from negatively impacting scales), but they're simply throwing money away by not making a number of extra Scourges to sell separately.

I'd actually like three total myself (one to display in truck mode, one without and one with the Maketoys armor in robot mode.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby gavinfuzzy » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:46 am

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Upon heavy consideration: I'll pass. It's just not worth it. I evaluated how much I actually wanted this figure and this is what I found:

Breakdown: The only one I want and have a spot for in my collection.
Scourge: Looks nice, but my SDCC fills the "nemesis" spot and looks great too.
Slipstream: Look nice, Don't really need it.
Circuit: :SICK:
Jackpot: Originally wanted it as my animated Kick-Off, but it'll not fit in too well with my Animated nor Classics colelction.
Ultra Mammoth: Colours are not working for me, I don't collect Beast Wars.

In conclusion, I don't really need um and I might get Breakdown and Scourge at some point... Oh, and I learnt that I need Big Convoy too... no matter, Big Convoy's just $45. :D

Unless I magically get $285 before September 9... then I know that's a sign to buy it. :lol:

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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Mkall » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:54 am

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Nemesis Destron wrote:
Kung Fu Man wrote:They're both back in stock, but their price jumped up $10 as a result. Circuit and Jackpot by comparison jumped down by the same amount, making them *cheaper* than buying them from the club.


WTF BBTS?? That's a total dick move jacking up the price like that!! :-x :VEHI:

It's pretty standard BBTS practice actually. I'm not defending them or anything, I'm just surprised when people still get PO'd at it.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Stormrider » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:21 am

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I really don't understand the strategy of the service subscription other than it allows TFCC to sell figures that otherwise wouldn't do well selling on their own.

It seems like Slipstream, Scourge, and Breakdown are hot commodities. And Jackpot and Circuit are not that hot. So my question to TFCC - why bother producing figures that are not that interesting to fans? It just seems like their marketing and research regarding what the fans are interested is off the mark 50% of the time.

Personally, I am only interested in Breakdown. To me, it's worth it to buy/preorder the figure from another retailer than to play this silly subscription and membership service fee at TFCC. I am getting more and more annoyed with each news update from TFCC.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Gauntlet101010 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:41 am

What I don't understand is the timing and the limited time offer. There's a huge con going on this month that I'm going to. I budgeted for THAT. I'm not sure paying $300 for this right on the heels of that is a fantastic idea. I didn't expect such a limited time offer to come from TFCC.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby NamelessOne » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:51 am

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.... And I managed to snag a Scourge off BBTS before they went out of stock again. Phew, crisis averted, for now!

The price markup is obviously to cover the 'bath' they'll be taking on Circuit and Jackpot.

Hell, I stuck in a preorder for Breakdown just for the hell of it, mightn't even get it when it comes out, depends on how flush I am at the time next year, after the MPs, FP and TFC stuff coming out..

I've been doing a lot of FunPub bashing here, but it still stands - I'd rather pay well over the odds for Scourge on its own from a reputable retailer (when it's in stock, to boot) rather than shell out over $500 as an international member, hand over photocopies of my personal data, and wait for months for these clowns to (maybe) not screw the pooch on this one.

Hell, if I even wanted the whole lot, I'd prefer to pay over the odds through BBTS, or any other avenue, if my order was likely to be honoured.

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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby lonrac » Sat Aug 18, 2012 1:20 pm

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so it is obvious that Slipsteam and Scourge are the carriers of the line,

and the 'sharing' idea may not work, as all parties probably just want those two.

so don't get mad at BBTS just because it signs up for the package, and by the laws of supply and demand, sells the figures individually at different rates, because they realise they would be left with a lot of neo-delic animated musclecars.

If I get the toys I do, If I don't get the option, I won't get too bothered , honestly, My collection is nothing to brag about anyway.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Mkall » Sat Aug 18, 2012 1:45 pm

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Gauntlet101010 wrote:What I don't understand is the timing and the limited time offer. There's a huge con going on this month that I'm going to. I budgeted for THAT. I'm not sure paying $300 for this right on the heels of that is a fantastic idea. I didn't expect such a limited time offer to come from TFCC.

They need to give the Chinese factories concrete production numbers if they want to meet their estimated ship date of January.

Stormrider wrote:I really don't understand the strategy of the service subscription other than it allows TFCC to sell figures that otherwise wouldn't do well selling on their own.

It seems like Slipstream, Scourge, and Breakdown are hot commodities. And Jackpot and Circuit are not that hot. So my question to TFCC - why bother producing figures that are not that interesting to fans? It just seems like their marketing and research regarding what the fans are interested is off the mark 50% of the time.

Because the TFCC isn't simply going to sell what 90% of the fandom want. They're trying to get 100% coverage, which includes fans that collect past lines such as Animated, Beast Wars and others. Don't want Jackpot? Neither do I, but I know that there are Animated collectors out there who do so I'll sell mine off at cost to recoup the costs.

Don't want Ultra Mammoth? I do because I have a completed Beast Wars collection, that for the first time in over 10 years has a figure I can add to it. That excites me and other Beast Wars collectors.

Don't want Circuit? I do because he's a homage to a niche G1-ish figure. To some that isn't enough to warrant the money. To others, it sure is. Heck I'm going to find a second Circuit to be my Shattered Glass Axor.

So yeah, one group's wants/needs doesn't equal that of the fandom. The Club is trying to cater to us all; not just us Classics fanboys.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby KNM2012 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 2:53 pm

Mkall wrote:
Nemesis Destron wrote:
Kung Fu Man wrote:They're both back in stock, but their price jumped up $10 as a result. Circuit and Jackpot by comparison jumped down by the same amount, making them *cheaper* than buying them from the club.


WTF BBTS?? That's a total dick move jacking up the price like that!! :-x :VEHI:

It's pretty standard BBTS practice actually. I'm not defending them or anything, I'm just surprised when people still get PO'd at it.

I'm not these days. >:oP

Because to be honest, it is a bad business practice on their behalf. BBTS should have learned by now that this practice should have been done AFTER these items are no longer being made. And since they did not do that, I can understand their potential customers venting for the fact it should not have been done so soon.

Besides... I buy from TFsource because they do not do this BS practice. That, and I prefer their customer service as well. But that is a different story. :-B
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby craggy » Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:02 pm

Mkall wrote:
Gauntlet101010 wrote:What I don't understand is the timing and the limited time offer. There's a huge con going on this month that I'm going to. I budgeted for THAT. I'm not sure paying $300 for this right on the heels of that is a fantastic idea. I didn't expect such a limited time offer to come from TFCC.

They need to give the Chinese factories concrete production numbers if they want to meet their estimated ship date of January.

Stormrider wrote:I really don't understand the strategy of the service subscription other than it allows TFCC to sell figures that otherwise wouldn't do well selling on their own.

It seems like Slipstream, Scourge, and Breakdown are hot commodities. And Jackpot and Circuit are not that hot. So my question to TFCC - why bother producing figures that are not that interesting to fans? It just seems like their marketing and research regarding what the fans are interested is off the mark 50% of the time.

Because the TFCC isn't simply going to sell what 90% of the fandom want. They're trying to get 100% coverage, which includes fans that collect past lines such as Animated, Beast Wars and others. Don't want Jackpot? Neither do I, but I know that there are Animated collectors out there who do so I'll sell mine off at cost to recoup the costs.

Don't want Ultra Mammoth? I do because I have a completed Beast Wars collection, that for the first time in over 10 years has a figure I can add to it. That excites me and other Beast Wars collectors.

Don't want Circuit? I do because he's a homage to a niche G1-ish figure. To some that isn't enough to warrant the money. To others, it sure is. Heck I'm going to find a second Circuit to be my Shattered Glass Axor.

So yeah, one group's wants/needs doesn't equal that of the fandom. The Club is trying to cater to us all; not just us Classics fanboys.


You've a lot of good points. However, these 6 figures are not gang-molded, so it'd be quite possible for them to sell the more niche figures under a made to order scheme, and if they're only shipping one a month, then I have to imagine that would in theory give them an extra month to supply info on how many of the 2nd figure need to be made, and so on. But they'd rather be all secretive about which one is being released when, in what I expect is a move to make people pay over the odds for the one or two figures they want from this set. Of course, it's nice that the shipping schedule is a secret, because that way anyone without the internet will not know what the first figure is 2 minutes after the first person receives theirs.

edit: for the record, whilst Scourge is the one I really WANT, I do like Circuit, for a few reasons, and Ultra Mammoth looks cooler every time I see him.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Burn » Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:13 pm

Simple solution ... stop supporting the club. >:oP
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby SW's SilverHammer » Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:18 pm

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Burn wrote:Simple solution ... stop supporting the club. >:oP


I like that Idea Burn :APPLAUSE: :APPLAUSE: :APPLAUSE: :APPLAUSE:
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Mkall » Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:46 pm

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craggy wrote:You've a lot of good points. However, these 6 figures are not gang-molded, so it'd be quite possible for them to sell the more niche figures under a made to order scheme, and if they're only shipping one a month, then I have to imagine that would in theory give them an extra month to supply info on how many of the 2nd figure need to be made, and so on. But they'd rather be all secretive about which one is being released when, in what I expect is a move to make people pay over the odds for the one or two figures they want from this set. Of course, it's nice that the shipping schedule is a secret, because that way anyone without the internet will not know what the first figure is 2 minutes after the first person receives theirs.

You're right too, I think the real reason the Club is going this route is they (and we as fans) have grown tired of mis-estimating the number of figs that they should sell. Punch/Counterpunch sold out in minutes the first time 'round, and the their Runamuck (or was it Runabout?) lasted 24 hours. Conversely their Airazor and Astrotrain took years to sell out.

Whether or not we like the method of distribution, from a business standpoint it's pretty good. They move a lot of product without worrying about over/understocking.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby NamelessOne » Sat Aug 18, 2012 4:38 pm

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Here's the original idea I thought was going to happen:

Firstly, you'd have to maintain membership to be able to order;

Say Breakdown was $100 to start off with - you'd put in $50 deposit to ensure you'd be paying at least that much.

The more popular Breakdown becomes, (second batches and so on) - price goes down 5,10% until a certain date that orders have to be placed by falls.

This way, demand from everyone who wants a Slipstream, Scourge or Breakdown drives *down* the price, while everyone who wants one, gets one -

The same works for the Jackpots and Circuits, prices for these may be held at $100, but limited numbers of these would still retain the value, as there would be

A) less of these in circulation, meaning collectors who missed the boat would be more than willing to deal;
B) Collection completists would have SERIOUS bragging rights; 'yeah, I got ALL of the club exclusives this year' would be a boast for some, not a millstone for all.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby craggy » Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:42 pm

Mkall wrote:
craggy wrote:You've a lot of good points. However, these 6 figures are not gang-molded, so it'd be quite possible for them to sell the more niche figures under a made to order scheme, and if they're only shipping one a month, then I have to imagine that would in theory give them an extra month to supply info on how many of the 2nd figure need to be made, and so on. But they'd rather be all secretive about which one is being released when, in what I expect is a move to make people pay over the odds for the one or two figures they want from this set. Of course, it's nice that the shipping schedule is a secret, because that way anyone without the internet will not know what the first figure is 2 minutes after the first person receives theirs.

You're right too, I think the real reason the Club is going this route is they (and we as fans) have grown tired of mis-estimating the number of figs that they should sell. Punch/Counterpunch sold out in minutes the first time 'round, and the their Runamuck (or was it Runabout?) lasted 24 hours. Conversely their Airazor and Astrotrain took years to sell out.

Whether or not we like the method of distribution, from a business standpoint it's pretty good. They move a lot of product without worrying about over/understocking.

yeah, but lets say of the 6 figures, there's 5,000 people who want them all. (btw, a heads up here, I'm just going to pick up some relatively easily scalable numbers here, and have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA how much any of this stuff sells) now, obviously those 5,000 will buy the lot. Now, there might be another 5,000 people who want half of them. Lets pretend that the fates are kind and the planets align and that that breaks down to 2,5000 people who want a particular 3 and another 2,5000 who want the other 3 and that those people all club together to buy the sets in pairs and half them. that's 10,000 sales.

now, there's a very real chance that there'll be a few people who might not want all of the figures, but will pay the money for all of them for the ones they want, and might later recoup some of the costs via selling their unwanted figures on ebay. let's say that's another 5,000, just to keep things nice and round. 15,000 sales.

now, lets say there are 20,000 of us out there who want one figure in particular. there might be another 10,000 who don't want that figure, but want one of the other ones. there might be another 5,000 who want another one, and so on, and so on.

Now, looking through this thread, yes, there are some names being repeated often and by most people as ones we'd want. There certainly seems to be a heirarchy of popularity we could establish. One could, if say perhaps, we owned the website that these figures were being offered through, run a poll to see which are more popular. We could, if we were running some kind of club, and only selling to members, and as such had the email addresses of these members, send out an email asking how many of each particular figure each member would purchase. Granted, sometimes these numbers will change, but it would give a rough estimate.

For the people who buy the whole set, there should be a discount, I'd be happy with that, but I think that the individual toys being sold on their own, even if they required a club membership to purchase them, would encourage a lot of people to buy who might not otherwise. I might not like paying $200 for Depth Charge and Scourge, but I'd be far more likely to do that than pay $600 for all of them and have to wait on each coming out in order to find someone to sell the unwanted ones to.

There will be people who'll just buy these because they're there, but for many of us, considering the current economic climate, I think they'd get more overall sales if they allowed the purchase of individual figures, and then made them to order. Let members buy 5 Ultra Mammoths if they want, or a dozen Slipstreams. Looking at this, I'm not seeing the majority of people saying "ah screw it, I only want one but I got thousands of dollars and time to spare" I see people saying "well, I want x but I don't care about the rest". I imagine it's similar on other fan sites, and really, the internet fan site are the target market for these, unlike a mass retail wave where the power of kids and parents can theoretically screw up any assumptions we make about case assortments and the like.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby GetRightRobot » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:18 pm

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Perhaps the most cost effective way to deal with the circumstances as they exist, because they are unlikely to change, is to network with other collectors. One individual with an existing club account uses a prepaid VISA (lessons learned) orders the set. Start a thread and deal with members you trust (or even other social media or your local collecting group of peeps) and find the person who wants the pieces you don't. If you end up with an unwanted figure, ebay it.

As a completist, and owner of 5 original versions of these characters' toy and the two existing Mammoth Primes, I'm keeping them all. But that's me, I just love updates on obscure figs and little complete lists, like every version of a mold and such.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby craggy » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:32 pm

GetRightRobot wrote:Perhaps the most cost effective way to deal with the circumstances as they exist, because they are unlikely to change, is to network with other collectors. One individual with an existing club account uses a prepaid VISA (lessons learned) orders the set. Start a thread and deal with members you trust (or even other social media or your local collecting group of peeps) and find the person who wants the pieces you don't. If you end up with an unwanted figure, ebay it.

As a completist, and owner of 5 original versions of these characters' toy and the two existing Mammoth Primes, I'm keeping them all. But that's me, I just love updates on obscure figs and little complete lists, like every version of a mold and such.

honestly, they're not getting any money from me. Not directly. Not saying I might not purchase a figure off a fellow collector or even on ebay at some point but they're giving vague information in press releases, have an unreliable history when it comes to security and asking for me to send them information that no single other company I have ever bought anything from has asked for.

I can't afford to be a completist and I'm sure there are plenty of others who can't. Sure, they're a business and they want to make money. I like the idea of updates of obscure older toys as much as anyone. Hell, my most requested character is Stampede! I'm just saying that I think they'd sell more, and thus, make more money, so that they continued to be around to make these obscure characters into toy form, if they were a bit smarter and more flexible with it.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby GetRightRobot » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:43 pm

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craggy wrote:I can't afford to be a completist and I'm sure there are plenty of others who can't. Sure, they're a business and they want to make money. I like the idea of updates of obscure older toys as much as anyone. Hell, my most requested character is Stampede! I'm just saying that I think they'd sell more, and thus, make more money, so that they continued to be around to make these obscure characters into toy form, if they were a bit smarter and more flexible with it.



I hear you. It is not a great fit for many collectors. Some piece of mind can be found in the fact that the traditional secondary market price hikes will not be as effective immediately. With the production numbers being made to order, the mark up on ebay and such will be less consumer driven. I hope you get the figures you want and it doesn't hurt the wallet too badly. I do not blame you one bit for the lack of trust and general desire to do zero direct business with this "club". I understand completely.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Stormrider » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:47 pm

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Mkall wrote:
craggy wrote:You've a lot of good points. However, these 6 figures are not gang-molded, so it'd be quite possible for them to sell the more niche figures under a made to order scheme, and if they're only shipping one a month, then I have to imagine that would in theory give them an extra month to supply info on how many of the 2nd figure need to be made, and so on. But they'd rather be all secretive about which one is being released when, in what I expect is a move to make people pay over the odds for the one or two figures they want from this set. Of course, it's nice that the shipping schedule is a secret, because that way anyone without the internet will not know what the first figure is 2 minutes after the first person receives theirs.

You're right too, I think the real reason the Club is going this route is they (and we as fans) have grown tired of mis-estimating the number of figs that they should sell. Punch/Counterpunch sold out in minutes the first time 'round, and the their Runamuck (or was it Runabout?) lasted 24 hours. Conversely their Airazor and Astrotrain took years to sell out.

Whether or not we like the method of distribution, from a business standpoint it's pretty good. They move a lot of product without worrying about over/understocking.


I just don't get why these are being packaged as a subscription. Now that they are partnering with e-Hobby, they should pick up some cues from e-Hobby and set each one up as a separate pre-order. Why are they making this more complicated than it needs to be?
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby Burn » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:51 pm

Stormrider wrote:I just don't get why these are being packaged as a subscription. Now that they are partnering with e-Hobby, they should pick up some cues from e-Hobby and set each one up as a separate pre-order. Why are they making this more complicated than it needs to be?


hmmmm ... let's see ... store member credit card details on unsecured server, have someone steal said credit card details, deny at first before admitting it and upgrading to a more modern system which requires international members to provide photo i.d.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the answer to your question is in fact, they have no idea what they're really doing and are making it up as they go along.
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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby GetRightRobot » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:53 pm

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Burn wrote:hmmmm ... let's see ... store member credit card details on unsecured server, have someone steal said credit card details, deny at first before admitting it and upgrading to a more modern system which requires international members to provide photo i.d.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the answer to your question is in fact, they have no idea what they're really doing and are making it up as they go along.



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Re: TFCC Subscription Service Details Revealed

Postby craggy » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:56 pm

Burn wrote:
Stormrider wrote:I just don't get why these are being packaged as a subscription. Now that they are partnering with e-Hobby, they should pick up some cues from e-Hobby and set each one up as a separate pre-order. Why are they making this more complicated than it needs to be?


hmmmm ... let's see ... store member credit card details on unsecured server, have someone steal said credit card details, deny at first before admitting it and upgrading to a more modern system which requires international members to provide photo i.d.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the answer to your question is in fact, they have no idea what they're really doing and are making it up as they go along.

hey, we've all been in that situation at some point in our lives, right? (no? just me?)

but what I do is just copy everyone else...

in this case, I'd say someone like BBTS would be the people to copy. they've supposedly got a secure system for credit cars now, so just get everyone to commit up front, to how many of each they're buying. charge them when the figures are shipping.

it's not rocket surgery.
assembling a Neo-G1/TF:TM cast. Please PM if you have (or know of) the following at a reasonable price: Classics or Henkei Astrotrain, Sunstreaker, Sideswipe, Blurr, or 3rd Party iGear Ratchet and Ironhide.
Also looking for Universe Repugnus and Overbite, Frostbite and Longhorn and any Webdiver toys.
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