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War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby MINDVVIPE » Fri Nov 04, 2011 12:33 am

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chuckdawg1999 wrote:
Shadowman wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:Before I hear the podcast, I gotta ask why is Jazz's mough all cracked apart? :???:

He looks like ROTF Alice during mid-transformation. :SICK:


You wanna know how he got these scars? His father was...a drinker...and a fiend.


Dude it's 2011; Dark Night references are so 09.


I believe you are referring to Dark Knight :-B


*shoots himself for saying that*
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby chuckdawg1999 » Fri Nov 04, 2011 1:00 am

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MINDVVIPE wrote:
chuckdawg1999 wrote:
Shadowman wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:Before I hear the podcast, I gotta ask why is Jazz's mough all cracked apart? :???:

He looks like ROTF Alice during mid-transformation. :SICK:


You wanna know how he got these scars? His father was...a drinker...and a fiend.


Dude it's 2011; Dark Night references are so 09.


I believe you are referring to Dark Knight :-B


*shoots himself for saying that*


*Sigh* That's what I get for trying to be funny after 2 AM
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Shadowman » Fri Nov 04, 2011 1:33 am

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chuckdawg1999 wrote:
Shadowman wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:Before I hear the podcast, I gotta ask why is Jazz's mough all cracked apart? :???:

He looks like ROTF Alice during mid-transformation. :SICK:


You wanna know how he got these scars? His father was...a drinker...and a fiend.


Dude it's 2011; Dark Night references are so 09.


Dark Knight references are forever. Until Dark Knight Rises comes out and almost invariably give us a whole new mess of memes.

Sabrblade wrote:Guess I didn't get a close enough look at it.

Still don't like it, though.


Me neither, actually. It's fine for, say, the movie designs, where it's all a bunch of parts that shift and move as the Transformer talks or emotes. But here, it just looks like parts for the sake of parts, just to look more robotic.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Sabrblade » Fri Nov 04, 2011 11:13 am

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Unless he got suckerpunched in the jaw and hasn't repaired it yet or something, I won't be happy about it. [-(
If you've read Exodus, wanna read the War For Cybertron comic? PM me.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Sabrblade » Fri Nov 04, 2011 2:25 pm

Motto: "FOR THE EARTH!!!"
Weapon: Saber Blade
dp
If you've read Exodus, wanna read the War For Cybertron comic? PM me.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Sabrblade » Fri Nov 04, 2011 3:32 pm

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Podcast Q&A summary

Q1: Does one have to play WFC in order to understand the FoC story?
A1: Nope. But doing so may give you an extra level of enjoyment.

Q2: Which TFs did not make it into the game, and where would they want the series to head next?
A2: Arcee. Being a female character, her animation skeleton would have required twice as much animation, which was too much for their system. Also, no Primus (as Cybertron's robot mode) or Unicron. As for where the series would go, there's a big gap of time between the TFs leaving Cybertron and arriving on Earth, so there's that to explore. And it'd be awesome to flesh out the era of the Thirteen, either Knights of the Old Republic-style or RPG style. Then again, Hasbro is very precious with that timeperiod.

Q3: Will there be any FoC toys?
A3: Hasbro has been quiet about that, so it's not yet known.

Q4: Were there parts of the FoC game written to connect to the Prime cartoon?
A4: No. There are a couple of things that they did to connect with Prime, but not necessarily in the story. They create the story, and then work with Hasbro to make sure it doesn't violate what goes on in the Prime series. But they did grab some things from Prime in the visual development of certain things like Cliffjumper's head, Optimus's gun, some ship designs, some melee weapons, etc. etc.

As an aside, they reiterated that the show and the two games are seen as part of the same overall continuity.

Q5: Any thoughts about single-player DLC for this game?
A5: There have been talks. They're still going through the finances of that that and haven't committed to anything yet. But they are interested and are trying to see where they're going with this.

Q6: With Teletraan I being in this game, will gamers be able to access it and learn some history info of the TFs in this continuity? Will there be any attempts in this game to decompress the narrative and add some text files (like in Arkham Asylum and Mass Effect) to expand out the lore for those who are interested.
A6: Short answer, "Yes." WFC had an okay story that didn't need to expand on the things that most non-TF fans wouldn't care about. But, there is still that hunger for that next layer down of backstory, audio logs, text logs, concept art, that was not satisfied with WFC. So, they're looking at a number of ways to give this extra info in this game should it be wanted. Don't know if it'll be done through Teletraan, but they're looking at several options.

Q7: Is Megatron fought by the player as an Autobot?
A7: A straight answer for this wasn't permitted to be given. Instead, it was described how Megatron plays an important role in the game as a character who's to be seen from many perspectives, as are a lot of the charactrs in the game. The first game was an Autobot story and a Decepticon story, while this game is a Cybertron story. It's about Cybertron itself and many play key roles of importance in its story.

Q8: More Starscream?
A8: There is definitely more Starscream in this one.

Q9: With the Insecticons showing up, will they all be mindless swarming bots or will some individual Insecticon characters (a la Bombshell/Shrapnel/Kickback) be featured?
A9: The Insecticons are in the game, but as far as for any named Insecticons, that's classified. Wait and see.

Q10: Wheeljack's presence: confirm or deny?
A10: Again, can't say yes or no.

Q11: Do all the characters that have been shown up to this point cover the basis of all the playable characters in the game?
A11: Absolutely not. There are more characters than what have been talked about. There will be more playable characters released as they go through.

As an aside, Matt Tieger asked how many Transformers there are. They figured since there's so many, at least several thousands, that they can't possibly please everyone by putting everyone's favorites in the game since there's just too many to pick from.

Q12: In WFC, one often ran out of ammo too quickly. How will this be improved in FoC?
A12: Several ways to fix this. In the first game, there wasn't enough ammo, and it wasn't easy to find. This time, however, the equipment sizes are significantly larger so you can carry more ammo with you. The ammo design has been changed and have been put in more easy-to-find places. And, the AI enemies will now drop ammo when you kill them. But they did not add a self-fulfilling ammo overheat system for the guns. Plus, there is also now the Teletraan Store placed all throughout the game's world where you can buy and upgrade weapons, and one upgrade you can buy will automatically refill all your ammo every time you go into the store.

Q13: Will there be a cover system in this game?
A13: No.

Q14: What new and interesting things are being done with boss fights and boss characters in this game? Will there be boss fights in FoC?
A14: There are some that are different from what would be called a traditional boss, but different in a good way. The experiences in this game may surprise people. They're what one might call "Transformer-y".

Q15: Difficult question. Will FoC have the same campaign length as WFC, or longer?
A15: Depends on the person. Some felt WFC's campaign was too short, while others felt it was too long. It might be about the same as WFC, but can't say for sure.

Q16: This game looks a lot more colorful than the first. What drove this design decision?
A16: They wanted to go places where they haven't been before and really push what the visuals of Cybertron could be. They really put a lot more effort into the looks of all kinds of metals that have opened up the color palette a little bit. And when making a game like this, it really needs that kind of color variety.

Q17: Will the game come to PC?
A17: Sadly, no PC version. They focused on delivering the highest quality experience as possible, which is in the console department. They wanted to support the PC community, but they weren't able to do so like they wanted to. They wish it were possible and are bummed about this, but at the same time it was a hard decision and they feel it was the right call.

Q18: What is High Moon doing to increase online mutliplayer longevity for FoC to make gamers play it longer than WFC?
A18: Beg them to play it longer. :lol: But seriously, they're trying to address the issues people had with the online multiplayer of WFC and figure pout how to make the community even greater than before.

Q19: Will one be able to customize weapons in multiplayer? Will the customizations of single player be able to carry over into multiplayer? Will Dinobots be playable in multiplayer?
A19: Can't answer about the customization of weapons because nothing is certain of it yet. for Dinobots, their skeletons are completely different form the other TFs. Their scale is huge compared to the others. Putting them with the others would detract from the gameplay experience. If they were scaled down to be better match with the others, then they would look silly (Grimlock would be a tiny T-Rex). And Grimlock cannot transform willingly, so it wouldn't work well in multiplayer. So, it's better that they aren't in multiplayer. It's not that it's a bad idea, but that it just can't be done.

Q20: What sort of customizations will there be for multiplayer?
A20: Four different classes: cars, trucks, tanks, planes. Each consists of six parts: head, chest, upper arm, lower arm, legs, (he couldn't remember the last part). You pick whichever parts you want. They'll all unlock as you play through the game and level up. The customization system is very complex. People spent hours making their own TFs out of these parts and colors. Severely better than the not-so-thorough WFC version.

Q21:Any possibility of AI bots in multiplayer?
A21: Said too much already about multiplayer, so this was not answered. But, they will make announcements later near the end of the year giving more info on the game.
If you've read Exodus, wanna read the War For Cybertron comic? PM me.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Wigglez » Fri Nov 04, 2011 4:50 pm

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I'm excited. I want to know more about the customization on multiplayer. it said it was severely different, so I'm getting excited. Customizing 6 different parts of the body would be awesome. I just hope that it's not shown super cool and then dull on the final copy like in WFC where they had alot of colors to choose from and then give us only 5. I feel the gameplay will be the same as WFC but I'm more excited about the customization of the characters
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby NatsumeRyu » Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:30 pm

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For Q21, I'm certain the sixth component Tieg couldn't remember was "wheels," which he mentioned in the roundtable.

I'm quite happy that in the roundtable Tieg brought up there is no autobot/decepticon in multiplayer, chassis wise. Colors differentiate, which is much better IMO. I remember Varia brought up that the optics and energon lines etc. could be the differentiating components, but I think I can live with the color restrictions.

One thing I am disappointed with is that the chosen parts for mp affect stats. I do not like that because I'm going to be fighting with myself for aesthetics versus stats. Uncharted 3 does fine without stats for character/parts choices, but again, my opinion. I'm sure it will help open up more differences between everyone in MP, and for that, I may be grateful.

Also very happy to hear the number of characters so far for chassis, and that aforementioned parts are unlockable versus all immediately available. Hope the level cap is higher as well. It gives some people reason to keep playing, as long as there's another level to reach. I wouldn't mind if they kept Prime mode as well. I thought that was a great idea on their part.

On AI: happy to hear all they said about that. Sounds like they're going in the right direction; hope they pull it off. :) Also very happy with what we saw for cutscenes, and level/character transitions. Very, very, exciting to me, and helps justify the lack of SP co-op. B: ALSO, VERY happy to hear more gameplay types integrated in more. I'm one of those people who prefer combining gameplay types versus sticking to one for sake of simplicity, and/or learning curve. Now let's wait and see if/how it affects MP. Likely not, but excited if it does.

And I totally can't remember whatever my last thing was going to be. Guess I'll edit if I remember it. :P
edit: ah, maybe this was it?:
It sound like vehicle modes do not change regardless of body parts chosen. A little disappointing if true, but I don't think they said this outright. The easiest way to make body parts affect vehicle mode is to actually make the transformations to some degree, so that parts can be reflected in alt mode - like fenders, spoiler, etc. same as was done with wheels. Very similar concept to the wheels. Hardest part, as always (it's not like they don't already need to deal with this in robot mode), is making it look good regardless of parts combination chosen. Lines don't have to exactly match up, strategic gaps can be made, and parts don't always have to correlate to the same part for a chassis. For instance, say we put some sort of fun curved, spikey shoulders on our character (ala deluxe DoTM Crankcase, sort of). Say this normally correlates to the front fenders of the vehicle, but these particular shoulders jut out from under the front of the vehicle instead. In transformation, the default front fenders ensure there's no weird lack of parts there, but you also get a cool spear sort of deal coming out of the front.
What if multiple parts have similar arrangements? Create a hierarchy of which part takes precedence in the transformation. It's not any more complicated than what it sounds like is already being done. It will only take more time/effort that we can only hope they have set aside before hand. Otherwise, we can always hope for a third installment. :S
A simpler way to appease me might just be some way to alter vehicle mode somewhat, like adding a spoiler or antenna (don't ask), spikes, etc. Just something to keep the costumization going outside of robot mode.

Oh yes, and I like that it sounds like you can switch shoulders (firing arm camera is hovering over) now!
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Wigglez » Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:46 pm

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I want to be able to customize my character completely. Meaning how the body looks and how the vehicle looks based on the body parts you have. And how the character transformers too. Because of this, I can make my vehicles looks super unique and that I can place where the wheels go on my character in robot mode, what the legs transform into etc. etc. In order to make a character truely mine, it has to be how I make him/her.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Baneblade » Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:11 am

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wigglez323 wrote:I want to be able to customize my character completely. Meaning how the body looks and how the vehicle looks based on the body parts you have. And how the character transformers too. Because of this, I can make my vehicles looks super unique and that I can place where the wheels go on my character in robot mode, what the legs transform into etc. etc. In order to make a character truely mine, it has to be how I make him/her.


That's a bit of a far stretch. While I applaud your enthusiasm on the level of customization might be far streched for just a single disc copy. They would have to bundle a second disc with the game, and allow for a hella lot of programming.

I'm not knocking your ideas Wiggles, but it is a large task considering how much would have to be put into it.

Mind you, they managed to do it with the wwe games, but they don't have transforming. I don't think its going to be that difficult a challenge. I think it would be difficult is the custom build to transformation to vehicle and back.

It's too early for advanced thought lol
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Sabrblade » Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:13 am

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Weapon: Saber Blade
Baneblade wrote:
wigglez323 wrote:I want to be able to customize my character completely. Meaning how the body looks and how the vehicle looks based on the body parts you have. And how the character transformers too. Because of this, I can make my vehicles looks super unique and that I can place where the wheels go on my character in robot mode, what the legs transform into etc. etc. In order to make a character truely mine, it has to be how I make him/her.


That's a bit of a far stretch. While I applaud your enthusiasm on the level of customization might be far streched for just a single disc copy. They would have to bundle a second disc with the game, and allow for a hella lot of programming.

I'm not knocking your ideas Wiggles, but it is a large task considering how much would have to be put into it.

Mind you, they managed to do it with the wwe games, but they don't have transforming. I don't think its going to be that difficult a challenge. I think it would be difficult is the custom build to transformation to vehicle and back.

It's too early for advanced thought lol
you will get to customize the torso, head, upper arms, lower arms, shoulders, legs, wheels, etc. in this game. In all the times Tieger spoke of it, he described how everyone who tried out the customization spent an outrageous amount of hours just looking through the choices trying to pick out what they liked. It's that thorough and advanced a system this time around.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby MINDVVIPE » Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:17 am

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Weapon: Black Magic
Sabrblade wrote:
Baneblade wrote:
wigglez323 wrote:I want to be able to customize my character completely. Meaning how the body looks and how the vehicle looks based on the body parts you have. And how the character transformers too. Because of this, I can make my vehicles looks super unique and that I can place where the wheels go on my character in robot mode, what the legs transform into etc. etc. In order to make a character truely mine, it has to be how I make him/her.


That's a bit of a far stretch. While I applaud your enthusiasm on the level of customization might be far streched for just a single disc copy. They would have to bundle a second disc with the game, and allow for a hella lot of programming.

I'm not knocking your ideas Wiggles, but it is a large task considering how much would have to be put into it.

Mind you, they managed to do it with the wwe games, but they don't have transforming. I don't think its going to be that difficult a challenge. I think it would be difficult is the custom build to transformation to vehicle and back.

It's too early for advanced thought lol
you will get to customize the torso, head, upper arms, lower arms, shoulders, legs, wheels, etc. in this game. In all the times Tieger spoke of it, he described how everyone who tried out the customization spent an outrageous amount of hours just looking through the choices trying to pick out what they liked. It's that thorough and advanced a system this time around.


I think the main thing being discussed here is the fact that the changes to the robot form doesn't affect the appearance of the vehicle form in any huge way. And I agree with Baneblade, it would be a difficult task, and would severely limit the options until a really complex system was coded that, I honestly think, wouldn't be worth the time for developers. But hey, maybe Jagex's game will have this, and it will prove me wrong here.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Wigglez » Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:50 pm

Motto: "I refuse to breathe the breath of the failure!"
Weapon: Dual Bladed Sword
MINDVVIPE wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:
Baneblade wrote:
wigglez323 wrote:I want to be able to customize my character completely. Meaning how the body looks and how the vehicle looks based on the body parts you have. And how the character transformers too. Because of this, I can make my vehicles looks super unique and that I can place where the wheels go on my character in robot mode, what the legs transform into etc. etc. In order to make a character truely mine, it has to be how I make him/her.


That's a bit of a far stretch. While I applaud your enthusiasm on the level of customization might be far streched for just a single disc copy. They would have to bundle a second disc with the game, and allow for a hella lot of programming.

I'm not knocking your ideas Wiggles, but it is a large task considering how much would have to be put into it.

Mind you, they managed to do it with the wwe games, but they don't have transforming. I don't think its going to be that difficult a challenge. I think it would be difficult is the custom build to transformation to vehicle and back.

It's too early for advanced thought lol
you will get to customize the torso, head, upper arms, lower arms, shoulders, legs, wheels, etc. in this game. In all the times Tieger spoke of it, he described how everyone who tried out the customization spent an outrageous amount of hours just looking through the choices trying to pick out what they liked. It's that thorough and advanced a system this time around.


I think the main thing being discussed here is the fact that the changes to the robot form doesn't affect the appearance of the vehicle form in any huge way. And I agree with Baneblade, it would be a difficult task, and would severely limit the options until a really complex system was coded that, I honestly think, wouldn't be worth the time for developers. But hey, maybe Jagex's game will have this, and it will prove me wrong here.

I agree with you guys. My idea is too advanced for this date, but I'm saying maybe in the next gen system era. I'm thinking like RPG style customization where this is just pick your body parts. But even my idea is a bit advanced for RPG style. But I would like to see my idea come to life eventually to where your character is completely yours. Like say they give you the program in the game to design your character completely like we saw in the video of the lead disgner showing off how Jazz was built. If they put a program like that IN the game, then yeah. I guess I'd spend more time building characters than actually playing with them in maps. I like how HMS did gameplay in multiplayer for WFC. What if they said scratch campaign mode and made the game just all multiplayer. Or like how Baneblade said, first disk juust campaign and the second disk would be straight multiplayer. I don't really know how Sony would do that putting it on bluray disks. maybe all on one disk or even two. Anyhow, you'd think that would happen then?
Last edited by Wigglez on Wed Nov 09, 2011 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby MINDVVIPE » Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:57 pm

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wigglez323 wrote:I agree with you guys. My idea is too advanced for this date, but I'm saying maybe in the next gen system era. I'm thinking like RPG style customization where this is just pick your body parts. But even my idea is a bit advanced for RPG style. But I would like to see my idea come to life eventually to where your character is completely yours. Like say they give you the program in the game to design your character completely like we saw in the video of the lead disgner showing off how Jazz was built. If they put a program like that IN the game, then yeah. I guess I'd spend more time building characters than actually playing with them in maps.


Theres a program like that, its called Maya :P Yea, I too hope to see that level of customization some day.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Baneblade » Wed Nov 09, 2011 7:42 pm

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MINDVVIPE wrote:
wigglez323 wrote:I agree with you guys. My idea is too advanced for this date, but I'm saying maybe in the next gen system era. I'm thinking like RPG style customization where this is just pick your body parts. But even my idea is a bit advanced for RPG style. But I would like to see my idea come to life eventually to where your character is completely yours. Like say they give you the program in the game to design your character completely like we saw in the video of the lead disgner showing off how Jazz was built. If they put a program like that IN the game, then yeah. I guess I'd spend more time building characters than actually playing with them in maps.


Theres a program like that, its called Maya :P Yea, I too hope to see that level of customization some day.


bops MindVVipe upside his batty head* heheh

the level of customisation is already there - i kinda posted at stupid o'clock in the morning and my coffee hadn't kicked in. But yes the deep customisation is there - just look at World of Warcraft and the recent WWE games. The transformation customisation is the only part that will be the clincher.

I say give it a year and we will have it in the next Transformers game - or it could be in an update for the game in a few months time.

Technology moves at such a rapid pace these days (hence why i got out of the it/webdesign game after a year - i couldn't keep up), so do not be surprised that they release a patch update that allows for the customisations to run deep into the alternate modes for our custom robots.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Wigglez » Fri Nov 11, 2011 8:42 pm

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Speaking of complete customization, I say it'd be cool to make our own weapons also. Like choose from which barrel and other parts of a gun I don't know the names of to use to your own crosshairs.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Shadowman » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:30 am

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wigglez323 wrote:Speaking of complete customization, I say it'd be cool to make our own weapons also. Like choose from which barrel and other parts of a gun I don't know the names of to use to your own crosshairs.


The problem with that is threat assessment. The trick to designing multiplayer, as I've stated before, is creating an even playing field. Part of that is being able to identify other players--team, class, and load-out. It's why everything has to remain distinct and identifiable, otherwise combat boils down to a coin-toss for whether or not you rushed an enemy much stronger than you.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby MINDVVIPE » Sat Nov 12, 2011 2:00 am

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Shadowman wrote:
wigglez323 wrote:Speaking of complete customization, I say it'd be cool to make our own weapons also. Like choose from which barrel and other parts of a gun I don't know the names of to use to your own crosshairs.


The problem with that is threat assessment. The trick to designing multiplayer, as I've stated before, is creating an even playing field. Part of that is being able to identify other players--team, class, and load-out. It's why everything has to remain distinct and identifiable, otherwise combat boils down to a coin-toss for whether or not you rushed an enemy much stronger than you.


Uhm, knowing the type of gun they have is barely as important visually than it is in effect. You don't tell he's a sniper by seeing the barrel, you see him standing still with occasional bullet trails... Changing gun appearance doesn't matter for threat assessment. If someone has a huge ion cannon though, its obviously a fair assesment they're packing heat.

I think gun customization is a great idea, visually or physically; Grenade laucher that can fire long distances as explosive sticky darts as ammo... works for me.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Shadowman » Sat Nov 12, 2011 2:35 am

Motto: "May God have mercy on my enemies, because I sure as hell won't."
MINDVVIPE wrote:
Shadowman wrote:
wigglez323 wrote:Speaking of complete customization, I say it'd be cool to make our own weapons also. Like choose from which barrel and other parts of a gun I don't know the names of to use to your own crosshairs.


The problem with that is threat assessment. The trick to designing multiplayer, as I've stated before, is creating an even playing field. Part of that is being able to identify other players--team, class, and load-out. It's why everything has to remain distinct and identifiable, otherwise combat boils down to a coin-toss for whether or not you rushed an enemy much stronger than you.


Uhm, knowing the type of gun they have is barely as important visually than it is in effect. You don't tell he's a sniper by seeing the barrel, you see him standing still with occasional bullet trails... Changing gun appearance doesn't matter for threat assessment. If someone has a huge ion cannon though, its obviously a fair assesment they're packing heat.

I think gun customization is a great idea, visually or physically; Grenade laucher that can fire long distances as explosive sticky darts as ammo... works for me.


If you're standing there waiting to tell what weapon a guy is using by watching him use it you have already made a huge tactical error. "What gun is he using? Ah, judging by my lack of a torso, it appears he's using a fusion cannon."

If you can't tell what your opponent is using until he's shot you, that's a design flaw.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby MINDVVIPE » Sat Nov 12, 2011 2:44 am

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Shadowman wrote:If you're standing there waiting to tell what weapon a guy is using by watching him use it you have already made a huge tactical error. "What gun is he using? Ah, judging by my lack of a torso, it appears he's using a fusion cannon."

If you can't tell what your opponent is using until he's shot you, that's a design flaw.


Hahaha. I don't give a **** what my enemy is using; I see an enemy that I can prey on, I go for it. If he opens fire with a grenade launcher, I begin to keep my distance... if I JUST killed a bunch of enemies, and I know they're probably spawning, AND I see a stationary target at a window, I assume he's a sniper and try to kill him before he does any damage to me or my team. Seeing the weapon fire is ongoing additional data you collect to make decisions. Identifying the gun in a game like WFC is DEFINITELY not a high priority with how fast the game is (and only factors in during the start-mid combat, such as the exchange of fire, letting you know what guns your up against), and how far away targets can be seen. Not to mention, the gun he has makes no difference in regards to allegiance, so what does it matter what it looks like, its a gun. Be ready to adapt. Weapon customization shall never be hindered by the factors you mentioned.

And, if you are a useful sniper, you are standing still somewhere (atleast momentarily) and it should be your top priority to take out other snipers, lest they achieve a ton of frags thanks to your own vanity in going for easy sniper kills.

I feel like I shouldn't have to explain this...
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Wigglez » Sat Nov 12, 2011 4:37 pm

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Shadowman, you're thinking way off. Of coarse it's going to be even between the teams. I'm not saying I should be able to build a gun that blows the other team away with just one shot. I'm just saying we should build our own guns inside out on how it shoots, what it looks like, and so on. And wasting your time just trying to figure out what gun someone has is suicide. You figure it out while dodging bullets and go build a tactic on how to take him out.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Shadowman » Sat Nov 12, 2011 5:54 pm

Motto: "May God have mercy on my enemies, because I sure as hell won't."
wigglez323 wrote:Shadowman, you're thinking way off. Of coarse it's going to be even between the teams. I'm not saying I should be able to build a gun that blows the other team away with just one shot. I'm just saying we should build our own guns inside out on how it shoots, what it looks like, and so on.


I'm not sure why you're bringing this up, since I never said any of that.

wigglez323 wrote:And wasting your time just trying to figure out what gun someone has is suicide. You figure it out while dodging bullets and go build a tactic on how to take him out.


And rushing an enemy using a weapon you don't recognize, or waiting for them to shoot you is also suicide.

I know Valve agrees with me, at least. They specifically design everything to be easily and instantly recognizable, Team Fortress 2 in particular. I guess that's what I'm using as an example. They made everything so distinct that you can easily see an enemy's team, class, and weapon at a glance. I can predict my chances against an opponent before anyone fires a shot, then act accordingly based on my class and load out.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby MINDVVIPE » Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:48 pm

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Weapon: Black Magic
Shadowman wrote:And rushing an enemy using a weapon you don't recognize, or waiting for them to shoot you is also suicide.


Suicide if you can't adapt. So what do you do about vehicle mode bots? just never pursue them because you don't know what gun they're going to have when they transform? What about the fact that any player on a killstreak can out of nowhere summon the POKE, or the saved up fusion nucleon shock cannon. Adapting is the name of the game.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby Shadowman » Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:58 pm

Motto: "May God have mercy on my enemies, because I sure as hell won't."
MINDVVIPE wrote:
Shadowman wrote:And rushing an enemy using a weapon you don't recognize, or waiting for them to shoot you is also suicide.


Suicide if you can't adapt. So what do you do about vehicle mode bots? just never pursue them because you don't know what gun they're going to have when they transform? What about the fact that any player on a killstreak can out of nowhere summon the POKE, or the saved up fusion cannon. Adapting is the name of the game.


Vehicle modes will use one of two weapons, both of which are highly predictable, so when an enemy transforms I make a plan around assuming they'll use the more powerful of the two. POKE has a distinct appearance, so I can see what it is and make a plan (IE Run like hell) before they have a chance to use it which is, by the way, my entire point this whole time, thanks for giving me ammo there.

Adapting is the name of a game. My game is perception; figuring out an enemy's skills and weapons before they've had a chance to use them. Try it some time, it'll serve you much better than rushing in blindly.
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Re: War for Cybertron 2: The Fall of Cybertron Revealed

Postby MINDVVIPE » Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:10 pm

Motto: "One look from me and you've lost"
Weapon: Black Magic
Shadowman wrote:Vehicle modes will use one of two weapons, both of which are highly predictable, so when an enemy transforms I make a plan around assuming they'll use the more powerful of the two. POKE has a distinct appearance, so I can see what it is and make a plan (IE Run like hell) before they have a chance to use it which is, by the way, my entire point this whole time, thanks for giving me ammo there.

Adapting is the name of a game. My game is perception; figuring out an enemy's skills and weapons before they've had a chance to use them. Try it some time, it'll serve you much better than rushing in blindly.


The more powerful of the 2? I have seen fusion cannon users (earlier, when I mentioned fusion cannon, I really meant the huge gun that makes you move slowly) suck, and I've taken them down with a few shots with the battle pistol, so you obviously can't sum up the danger of the gun unless you've had some time in combat with the enemy to asses their skill.
POKE is distinctive, but when the player has an assault rifle which you deem weak, you go in close. BOOM, he executes poke, it's too late, and your dead, since you're poor at adapting.
Adapting is obviously part of the entire scheme, including using all of your appropriate senses, but it is the key factor that can turn a defeat into victory... The battlefield changes constantly; assuming what you know from far away will hold true to the end will lead to death. Stop assuming (in-game, and on forums regarding the expertise of other gamers), it'll serve you better in life.
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