Before Bays Fansformers go on the attack, these are my views, you can disagree fair enough, but try to limit the personal insults if you can, they are only movies.
- the opening scene in China, with the executionbots. At that point, I knew that the scriptwriters didnt know what autobots were or what their moral stance was.
Lastjustice wrote:Before Bays Fansformers go on the attack, these are my views, you can disagree fair enough, but try to limit the personal insults if you can, they are only movies.
Ok fine I won't melt you down for your less than optimal assessments. (crosses off his name between Wheelie and Blurr off his list.)- the opening scene in China, with the executionbots. At that point, I knew that the scriptwriters didnt know what autobots were or what their moral stance was.
- Did you watch the 86 film right?.(Which Optimus destroys plenty during the 86 film that end up being rebuilt.Grimlock blows up one of the Decepticons and mercilessly crushes countless Sharkticons.) Beast Wars?(only 7 of the entire cast survive.) Animated? (Omega Supreme blows away armies of Decepticons.) Transformers get fragged in plenty of series besides the movies. Optimus Mows down nameless cons in Dawn war in the original series. They tried kill all the Decepticons by blowing up a mine with them in it in the very first episodes of more than meets the eye. The autobots shoved them all into hot lava in Heavy Metal War. Autobots had plenty of lethal intent towards the Decepticons...it just didn't usually kill them. Not from lack of trying due to saturday morning cartoon rules they play by most of the time. The consequences of violences were absense but there was plenty of it.
Honestly if the autobots weren't willing take their foes lives then they could never win a war.I dont get this Killing= not a hero mentality. I mean most people called War heroes literally means they were great at fighting and killing people.
War is hell, and brings out the wrost in people. I dont see why that reflects so badly on the autobots considering they weren't hunting them down on a neutral location. They were patrolling the no fly zone of Earth not busting into Decepticons homes and killing them on cybertron. They were at war, and there's no time for trials with this matter.
I mean what would you had them do with the Decepticons when they were clearly willing kill humans. Demolisher easily killed a dozen people during his escape. Sideways smashed through a house , and easily could have taken out the people inside it. They had no value of human life. Ultimately the Decepticon Cause was to exterminate all life on Earth for both films...which they were literally seconds from successing in ROTF. There's no reason for them to hold back on their foes when the stakes are that high. (and looks like Dark of the moon maintains those stakes with them trying conquest Earth....pictures Shockwave and the Decepticons on the moon saying as they wake up.."After 10,000 years I'm free..time to conquer Earth!")
I mean look what happened when someone did let their guard down....Megatron stabbed Prime in the back after ambushing him and Sam. Megatron ripped jazz in half without heistation. Why do these villains deserve a lick of sympathy from the autobots in return? They clearly aren't giving it to them when the shoe is on the other foot. There's no honor or war code on their side. (beyond say Jetfire whom defected anyways.)
So basically how much more death did the Decepticons need to commit before you were willing see them dead?
difference between animated movie 9which had its flaws no doubt) was that the cons were on berserker kill mode, so prime was merely defending him.
In rotf, he executed an escaping con. and before that he used a quip
thats what seems off for me. Again as a geen wuner, thats not my prime. not the prime who sacrificed himself because he killed characters in a video game (crazy i know, but showed his respect for all life)
.Chaoslock wrote:- Brutal autobots - Sideswipe killing a fleeing decepticon was the first step, but after that the execution was too much
- Reused models - Don't even start that Grindor is a separate con than Blackout, using one of the most memorable cons' models from the first movie again is cheap, and that movie was supposed to have a big budget.
- No memorable battles or scenes - at least not like in the first movie, where battles gave a frame to the whole movie: the base attack, the dam, the city - they were good scenes, just like Frenzys attack on Air Force 1, Barricades chase, and the autobots arrival. There were no such scenes in RotF.
Iamwarhorse wrote:^Yeah, it took the movie verse Transformers to make me into a fan. The cartoon was beyond cheesy for my tastes. I want bad ass robots. And, with Demolisher, Optimus was being merciful. He put the poor thing out of his misery!
The crucial difference you're ignoring, and as shamone quite rightly states, is that it was a cold, honor-less execution that took place in ROTF. It wasn't a battle between Prime and a Decepticon fully able to fight back, it was disabled, completely unable to defend itself in any shape or form.
toothdoc wrote:If you hated the movies so much why are you here posting? It just doesn't make sense to a sane person when someone supposedly hates something, but yet they try to partcipate in a discussion about that very thing they hate. I suggest you seek the guidance of a good shrink to find out what your issues are.
shamone wrote:By the title i mean, was there a scene in the movies which made you realise, yeah this is not for me
for me there were moments in both flicks
in transformers
- opening scene was fine, good introduction of serious threat, transforming sound was good, action seemed ok, could be good
however the next scene wiped all that out. I understand movie editing and pacing, and that you need to bring the audience down after a high tempo opening, but
- The logic in the class room scene. Sam is selling his GF's stuff to purchase a car. Cut to next scene he is buying said car, having not sold them, huh ?
- One more scene wiped me out then, Bunblebee upgrading to new model. His parents didnt note that sam had a crappy camaro, and suddenly its a brand new one. Yet no questions asked, huh ?
In ROTF it didnt take as long
- the opening scene in China, with the executionbots. At that point, I knew that the scriptwriters didnt know what autobots were or what their moral stance was.
Before Bays Fansformers go on the attack, these are my views, you can disagree fair enough, but try to limit the personal insults if you can, they are only movies.
shamone wrote:difference between animated movie 9which had its flaws no doubt) was that the cons were on berserker kill mode, so prime was merely defending him.
In rotf, he executed an escaping con. and before that he used a quip
thats what seems off for me. Again as a geen wuner, thats not my prime. not the prime who sacrificed himself because he killed characters in a video game (crazy i know, but showed his respect for all life)
toothdoc wrote:If you hated the movies so much why are you here posting? It just doesn't make sense to a sane person when someone supposedly hates something, but yet they try to partcipate in a discussion about that very thing they hate. I suggest you seek the guidance of a good shrink to find out what your issues are.
SlyTF1 wrote:So, Shanghai, the forest battle, The Fallen's arrival, the Nemesis scene, the warehouse scene, Megatron's revival, the Well of Allsparks, Optimus's rebirth, Devastator's transformation, Optimus jumping out of a freaking airplane, Jetfire and Optimus combining, and I'm pretty sure there are ass loads more; never happened. Ok.
And the battles in the first movie did not give frame to the movie. Every fight scene with robots was either shaky as hell, or cut to humans running in the middle. At least in ROTF we got to see some robot ass kicking instead of blurry images of giant piles of car parts zooming past the camera, with people running in the foreground and explosions going off behind them.
Iamwarhorse wrote:^Yeah, it took the movie verse Transformers to make me into a fan. The cartoon was beyond cheesy for my tastes. I want bad ass robots. And, with Demolisher, Optimus was being merciful. He put the poor thing out of his misery!
Capt.Failure wrote:Considering Demolisher just killed about a dozen NEST soldiers and who knows how many civilians when he plowed through Shanghai, I think a bullet to the brainbox was being a little too merciful.
And I agree, why post on these forums if you're just going to stirr up trouble about how much you hate the movies? You're either trying too hard to be a troll, or you're secretly in denial that you like them.
Autobot032 wrote:Two of you making personal insults? Why? I'm a big supporter of the movie verse as a whole, especially ROTF, but this isn't necessary. Not cool dude, not cool.
Lastjustice wrote:The crucial difference you're ignoring, and as shamone quite rightly states, is that it was a cold, honor-less execution that took place in ROTF. It wasn't a battle between Prime and a Decepticon fully able to fight back, it was disabled, completely unable to defend itself in any shape or form.
No you're both wrong. G1 Prime tried kill all Decepticons (which killed 3 unnamed seekers whom were never seen again.) in first episodes of More than meets the eye 2, with a bomb. Hows that any more honorable than putting down a critically wounded foe? if anything it was an act of mercy given how badly damaged Demolisher was after Ironhide blew his wheels off and he crashed.
Demolisher fell in battle after killing dozens of people and millions of dollars in property damage. He scooped up a car along the way and tossed it that he didn't need to destroy to escape. What would you have Prime do after he was a pile of junk? Really blasting him and putting an end to him was only real option there. I mean were the autobots just supposed to let the Decepticons run free on the planet doing whatever they like? Next you'll say Hotrod should have let Unicron live too right?
I don't think you understand what means be a soldier if you somehow chalk up Not killing= Virtue. If you point a weapon at something, you better be prepared to destroy it otherwise you're a coward. If you're a warrior on the battlefield you know what you signed up for. Whatever happens out there is between you and your enemy. Why they say in the old west.. there's the quick and dead.(as Prime said himself, there's a thin line between a hero and memory.) Honor is just a quaint idea that has little room in real combat. All bay films did was make the violence have more realistic results. It's always been there.
Tekka wrote:Lastjustice wrote:The crucial difference you're ignoring, and as shamone quite rightly states, is that it was a cold, honor-less execution that took place in ROTF. It wasn't a battle between Prime and a Decepticon fully able to fight back, it was disabled, completely unable to defend itself in any shape or form.
No you're both wrong. G1 Prime tried kill all Decepticons (which killed 3 unnamed seekers whom were never seen again.) in first episodes of More than meets the eye 2, with a bomb. Hows that any more honorable than putting down a critically wounded foe? if anything it was an act of mercy given how badly damaged Demolisher was after Ironhide blew his wheels off and he crashed.
Demolisher fell in battle after killing dozens of people and millions of dollars in property damage. He scooped up a car along the way and tossed it that he didn't need to destroy to escape. What would you have Prime do after he was a pile of junk? Really blasting him and putting an end to him was only real option there. I mean were the autobots just supposed to let the Decepticons run free on the planet doing whatever they like? Next you'll say Hotrod should have let Unicron live too right?
I don't think you understand what means be a soldier if you somehow chalk up Not killing= Virtue. If you point a weapon at something, you better be prepared to destroy it otherwise you're a coward. If you're a warrior on the battlefield you know what you signed up for. Whatever happens out there is between you and your enemy. Why they say in the old west.. there's the quick and dead.(as Prime said himself, there's a thin line between a hero and memory.) Honor is just a quaint idea that has little room in real combat. All bay films did was make the violence have more realistic results. It's always been there.
You're spouting nonsense to cover your own ignorance. I'm not interested in what Demolisher did or did not do, or what Hotrod did or did not do in the '86 movie. Or how many purple Seekers disappeared during MTMTE, especially when we're all acutely aware of how rife the series is with characters appearing and disappearing or even switching sides and colours at random.
I'm informing you that you're incorrect in your statement that the attitude of the movie Prime equates to that of the G1 Prime. It is a simple matter of fact, the cartoon Prime would not have put down Demolisher in that fashion, the cartoon Prime WOULD have let him limp away to freedom as much as that might shock you, that's the kind of series G1 was. Cartoon Prime was never directly responsible for anyone's death, even Megatron didn't die as a result of his battle with Prime because he became Galvatron.
So I shall reiterate it clearly one more time before you decide to tell me that the Headmasters were justified in burying Galvatron under an iceberg with a care bear stare, the movie Prime's attitude DOES NOT match that of the cartoon Prime.
Tekka wrote:So I shall reiterate it clearly one more time (...) the movie Prime's attitude DOES NOT match that of the cartoon Prime.
Tekka wrote:I'm not quite sure what you were trying to do there, but thanks for agreeing with me.
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