Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

Thanks guys. If I decide to bite a bullet, at least it'll be nice to know the truth.

That's an awesome page that G.B. Blackrock put together. Stuff I forgot about, stuff I remember, new info I had no idea about. Pretty cool!

itscramtastic wrote:That's an awesome page that G.B. Blackrock put together. Stuff I forgot about, stuff I remember, new info I had no idea about. Pretty cool!

Would you say...

...it's cramtastic?

*patiently waits to get banned by Burn*

Mindmaster wrote:

itscramtastic wrote:That's an awesome page that G.B. Blackrock put together. Stuff I forgot about, stuff I remember, new info I had no idea about. Pretty cool!

Would you say...

...it's cramtastic?

*patiently waits to get banned by Burn*

I would, but would that qualify as self promotion?

itscramtastic wrote:That's an awesome page that G.B. Blackrock put together. Stuff I forgot about, stuff I remember, new info I had no idea about. Pretty cool!

Thanks! I'll, of course, have a few updates to make once FunPub puts items on the club store (thereby verifying that toys didn't sell out at the convention). Then, I'll have some decisions to make about how to handle future conventions (assuming they come to exist).

D-Maximus_Primal wrote:

Dr Va'al wrote:We could've been twinses!

Don't insult her like that

I would love to be an alpha bravo twin!

xRotorstormx wrote:

D-Maximus_Primal wrote:

Dr Va'al wrote:We could've been twinses!

Don't insult her like that

I would love to be an alpha bravo twin!

Abhex Twin!

The leftover toys and re-ordered merch are now on the website!

https://www.toyarama.com/store/transformers-featured-products-c5.php?page=1

Of note are not only the new run of Magnaboss stickers, but also the G1 Ratchet stickers for the assembled Class Kit toys! So now you can label up your Ratchets rather than worry about painting all those ambulance details!

Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaan should I buy Reflector?!

And the autograph stuff?!

And the things?!

If I'm gonna get charged for shipping I might as well make it worth it!

So I guess the rumors were true about most everything selling out.

Emerje

TF_JW wrote:The leftover toys and re-ordered merch are now on the website!

https://www.toyarama.com/store/transformers-featured-products-c5.php?page=1

Of note are not only the new run of Magnaboss stickers, but also the G1 Ratchet stickers for the assembled Class Kit toys! So now you can label up your Ratchets rather than worry about painting all those ambulance details!

I don't see the Magnaboss stickers. Just two releases of the Ratchet ones.

EDIT: Nevermind. I see them packed with Tigatron and Unit-3.

itscramtastic wrote:Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaan should I buy Reflector?!

And the autograph stuff?!

And the things?!

If I'm gonna get charged for shipping I might as well make it worth it!

Don't you also have to be a club member to buy from the store?

And as always "buy all the things"!

carytheone wrote:

itscramtastic wrote:Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaan should I buy Reflector?!

And the autograph stuff?!

And the things?!

If I'm gonna get charged for shipping I might as well make it worth it!

Don't you also have to be a club member to buy from the store?

And as always "buy all the things"!

I was earlier this year, not sure if it still counts as my subscription expired AFTER they stopped renewing. Like, last week

itscramtastic wrote:

carytheone wrote:

itscramtastic wrote:Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaan should I buy Reflector?!

And the autograph stuff?!

And the things?!

If I'm gonna get charged for shipping I might as well make it worth it!

Don't you also have to be a club member to buy from the store?

And as always "buy all the things"!

I was earlier this year, not sure if it still counts as my subscription expired AFTER they stopped renewing. Like, last week

If you were a member as of March 18th, you should be good to go to buy from the club store now, even if your subscription was due to expire in April. The only thing you no longer get is the magazine automatically mailed to you.

G.B. Blackrock wrote:

itscramtastic wrote:

carytheone wrote:Don't you also have to be a club member to buy from the store? And as always "buy all the things"!

I was earlier this year, not sure if it still counts as my subscription expired AFTER they stopped renewing. Like, last week

If you were a member as of March 18th, you should be good to go to buy from the club store now, even if your subscription was due to expire in April. The only thing you no longer get is the magazine automatically mailed to you.

Hooray!! I thought there was something about that somewhere. I should've changed my renewal date so I'd still get the magazine, as I am sad that I missed out.

AND, only a $9 increase for Reflector from the show to the online store!

This is what Hasbro had to say abot the future of Botcon:

Q: With this being the last year for the Club, and the last BotCon we’re gonna get, what’s up with that and what’s next?
Ben: I hope the cheering means that everyone has enjoyed, hopefully, a lot of us’ve been to the last 10+, 11 now. BotCon has been part of the Collector Club and it has been good, and hopefully you all enjoyed and appreciate that. For us, yeah, as we said, in the Fun Pub team, Brian was saying, we do not intend to walk away from you guys. I hope you see in the presentation we have downstairs, what we showed here, what we’re doing with Machinima, we’re not walking away from this brand, this property, all the future stories, the future of the toys. We have more Generations toys now than we’ve ever had in this brand, so we are in no way walking away saying “See ya.” But we are not prepared at this point in time to share what the future of a collector club and/or fan convention will look like or be. But what we’re looking into is that we will be bringing you guys the opportunity to still be participants in our brand at events and in programs like the Collectors Club. So stay tuned, we’ll have more to share on that front in the near future, but again, I know it’s change, change happens, there’s anxiety, disturbance, confusion, and all the other feeling and emotions that go through that, but we’re committed to you guys in a big way, we come out here, we prepared a lot for this event, and this is as important for us as it is hopefully for you guys. I know you’d like a direct answer, but the answer is we’re here, we’re committed to doing this stuff with you guys in the future.

william-james88 wrote:This is what Hasbro had to say abot the future of Botcon:

Q: With this being the last year for the Club, and the last BotCon we’re gonna get, what’s up with that and what’s next?
Ben: I hope the cheering means that everyone has enjoyed, hopefully, a lot of us’ve been to the last 10+, 11 now. BotCon has been part of the Collector Club and it has been good, and hopefully you all enjoyed and appreciate that. For us, yeah, as we said, in the Fun Pub team, Brian was saying, we do not intend to walk away from you guys. I hope you see in the presentation we have downstairs, what we showed here, what we’re doing with Machinima, we’re not walking away from this brand, this property, all the future stories, the future of the toys. We have more Generations toys now than we’ve ever had in this brand, so we are in no way walking away saying “See ya.” But we are not prepared at this point in time to share what the future of a collector club and/or fan convention will look like or be. But what we’re looking into is that we will be bringing you guys the opportunity to still be participants in our brand at events and in programs like the Collectors Club. So stay tuned, we’ll have more to share on that front in the near future, but again, I know it’s change, change happens, there’s anxiety, disturbance, confusion, and all the other feeling and emotions that go through that, but we’re committed to you guys in a big way, we come out here, we prepared a lot for this event, and this is as important for us as it is hopefully for you guys. I know you’d like a direct answer, but the answer is we’re here, we’re committed to doing this stuff with you guys in the future.

Is this just what they had to say at the convention itself? It sounds familiar.

Personally, this statement is just a whole lot of nothing, IMHO. It's just "trust us" with very little actual substance. And certainly no assurances that Transformers isn't going to get swallowed up by some "all brands" convention that might be great for other Hasbro brands, but will inevitably means less TF presence at the official convention.

G.B. Blackrock wrote:

william-james88 wrote:This is what Hasbro had to say abot the future of Botcon:

Q: With this being the last year for the Club, and the last BotCon we’re gonna get, what’s up with that and what’s next?
Ben: I hope the cheering means that everyone has enjoyed, hopefully, a lot of us’ve been to the last 10+, 11 now. BotCon has been part of the Collector Club and it has been good, and hopefully you all enjoyed and appreciate that. For us, yeah, as we said, in the Fun Pub team, Brian was saying, we do not intend to walk away from you guys. I hope you see in the presentation we have downstairs, what we showed here, what we’re doing with Machinima, we’re not walking away from this brand, this property, all the future stories, the future of the toys. We have more Generations toys now than we’ve ever had in this brand, so we are in no way walking away saying “See ya.” But we are not prepared at this point in time to share what the future of a collector club and/or fan convention will look like or be. But what we’re looking into is that we will be bringing you guys the opportunity to still be participants in our brand at events and in programs like the Collectors Club. So stay tuned, we’ll have more to share on that front in the near future, but again, I know it’s change, change happens, there’s anxiety, disturbance, confusion, and all the other feeling and emotions that go through that, but we’re committed to you guys in a big way, we come out here, we prepared a lot for this event, and this is as important for us as it is hopefully for you guys. I know you’d like a direct answer, but the answer is we’re here, we’re committed to doing this stuff with you guys in the future.

Is this just what they had to say at the convention itself? It sounds familiar.

Personally, this statement is just a whole lot of nothing, IMHO. It's just "trust us" with very little actual substance. And certainly no assurances that Transformers isn't going to get swallowed up by some "all brands" convention that might be great for other Hasbro brands, but will inevitably means less TF presence at the official convention.

You're displaying the flip side of the coin - an instinct to reject whatever it is they're saying.

Maybe in a vacuum that would be justified, but if you look at what has been happening with the toys and overall brand over the last 3 years, and the investment the brand team has been making in engaging the fans, I think they've earned a certain degree of trust.

megatronus wrote:

G.B. Blackrock wrote:

william-james88 wrote:This is what Hasbro had to say abot the future of Botcon:

Q: With this being the last year for the Club, and the last BotCon we’re gonna get, what’s up with that and what’s next?
Ben: I hope the cheering means that everyone has enjoyed, hopefully, a lot of us’ve been to the last 10+, 11 now. BotCon has been part of the Collector Club and it has been good, and hopefully you all enjoyed and appreciate that. For us, yeah, as we said, in the Fun Pub team, Brian was saying, we do not intend to walk away from you guys. I hope you see in the presentation we have downstairs, what we showed here, what we’re doing with Machinima, we’re not walking away from this brand, this property, all the future stories, the future of the toys. We have more Generations toys now than we’ve ever had in this brand, so we are in no way walking away saying “See ya.” But we are not prepared at this point in time to share what the future of a collector club and/or fan convention will look like or be. But what we’re looking into is that we will be bringing you guys the opportunity to still be participants in our brand at events and in programs like the Collectors Club. So stay tuned, we’ll have more to share on that front in the near future, but again, I know it’s change, change happens, there’s anxiety, disturbance, confusion, and all the other feeling and emotions that go through that, but we’re committed to you guys in a big way, we come out here, we prepared a lot for this event, and this is as important for us as it is hopefully for you guys. I know you’d like a direct answer, but the answer is we’re here, we’re committed to doing this stuff with you guys in the future.

Is this just what they had to say at the convention itself? It sounds familiar.

Personally, this statement is just a whole lot of nothing, IMHO. It's just "trust us" with very little actual substance. And certainly no assurances that Transformers isn't going to get swallowed up by some "all brands" convention that might be great for other Hasbro brands, but will inevitably means less TF presence at the official convention.

You're displaying the flip side of the coin - an instinct to reject whatever it is they're saying.

Maybe in a vacuum that would be justified, but if you look at what has been happening with the toys and overall brand over the last 3 years, and the investment the brand team has been making in engaging the fans, I think they've earned a certain degree of trust.

Actually, I was thinking very much in terms of the fact that trust has to be earned, and the fact that I didn't feel that they have, but I'm not sure I'd characterize my doubts as "an instinct to reject whatever it is they're saying." Indeed, my whole point is that they actually say remarkably little, despite the mass of words.

But let me try to be a bit more charitable here. I do trust Hasbro to make great toys that appeal not just to kids, but to long-time fans like us. Indeed, as I've said elsewhere, this is a great time to be a fan of the Transformers brand.

Where my trust has not yet been earned is precisely in the area of interaction with fans at fan-events. Honestly, part of that is simply that this group hasn't yet developed a long track record in this specific area.

G.B. Blackrock wrote:

megatronus wrote:You're displaying the flip side of the coin - an instinct to reject whatever it is they're saying.

Maybe in a vacuum that would be justified, but if you look at what has been happening with the toys and overall brand over the last 3 years, and the investment the brand team has been making in engaging the fans, I think they've earned a certain degree of trust.

Actually, I was thinking very much in terms of the fact that trust has to be earned, and the fact that I didn't feel that they have, but I'm not sure I'd characterize my doubts as "an instinct to reject whatever it is they're saying." Indeed, my whole point is that they actually say remarkably little, despite the mass of words.

Fair enough.

So what exactly would they have to do to earn your trust, or put another way, why would say that they haven't?

megatronus wrote:

G.B. Blackrock wrote:

megatronus wrote:You're displaying the flip side of the coin - an instinct to reject whatever it is they're saying.

Maybe in a vacuum that would be justified, but if you look at what has been happening with the toys and overall brand over the last 3 years, and the investment the brand team has been making in engaging the fans, I think they've earned a certain degree of trust.

Actually, I was thinking very much in terms of the fact that trust has to be earned, and the fact that I didn't feel that they have, but I'm not sure I'd characterize my doubts as "an instinct to reject whatever it is they're saying." Indeed, my whole point is that they actually say remarkably little, despite the mass of words.

Fair enough.

So what exactly would they have to do to earn your trust, or put another way, why would say that they haven't?

I perhaps answered some of this when I revised my remarks between my original post (which you've quoted) and seeing your response, but I'll try to go a bit deeper.

On some level, "lack of evidence to the positive" should be enough. Again, trust needs to be earned, not given. So a lack of "negative" evidence should not be significant. The burden is on Hasbro to win us over.

My deepest area of "mistrust" lies in the idea that I do not believe that Hasbro understands that Transformers fans are a specific breed. That trying to catch all of us at once at an "all brands" event is not the same as having us at an event specific to Transformers. That is my fear, and obviously, if and when I see that Hasbro responds to that concern, it will go some way to trusting them better.

Seeing their plans for a Transformers Club will help, too.

I'm trying to think of the fan-interaction I've seen thus far, such as it is, and most of leaves me cold. I'm not a fan of "fan built" characters, since the way they've done polls (and, granted, this was partly the previous regime) inevitably results in aggregates that no actual, individual, fans could possibly have asked for, or even imagined. It's really not a good way to gauge fan wishes. The Scorponok, Trypticon, Omega Supreme poll was kind of a hash, too, if a bit better. Part of it has been concern about limiting such polls and events to specific venues such as Facebook, or Twitter, or an app. Holding off on big news reveals for SDCC (admittedly a bigger event, but not one where there are necessarily more Transformers fans in attendance than BotCon) worries me, as well.

Again, they've done a great job on the toy-making side. I trust that will continue. The area of fan-interaction is where I need to see more.

G.B. Blackrock wrote:

megatronus wrote:Fair enough.

So what exactly would they have to do to earn your trust, or put another way, why would say that they haven't?

I perhaps answered some of this when I revised my remarks between my original post (which you've quoted) and seeing your response, but I'll try to go a bit deeper.

On some level, "lack of evidence to the positive" should be enough. Again, trust needs to be earned, not given. So a lack of "negative" evidence should not be significant. The burden is on Hasbro to win us over.

My deepest area of "mistrust" lies in the idea that I do not believe that Hasbro understands that Transformers fans are a specific breed. That trying to catch all of us at once at an "all brands" event is not the same as having us at an event specific to Transformers. That is my fear, and obviously, if and when I see that Hasbro responds to that concern, it will go some way to trusting them better.

Seeing their plans for a Transformers Club will help, too.

I'm trying to think of the fan-interaction I've seen thus far, such as it is, and most of leaves me cold. I'm not a fan of "fan built" characters, since the way they've done polls (and, granted, this was partly the previous regime) inevitably results in aggregates that no actual, individual, fans could possibly have asked for, or even imagined. It's really not a good way to gauge fan wishes. The Scorponok, Trypticon, Omega Supreme poll was kind of a hash, too, if a bit better. Part of it has been concern about limiting such polls and events to specific venues such as Facebook, or Twitter, or an app. Holding off on big news reveals for SDCC (admittedly a bigger event, but not one where there are necessarily more Transformers fans in attendance than BotCon) worries me, as well.

Again, they've done a great job on the toy-making side. I trust that will continue. The area of fan-interaction is where I need to see more.

Okay - that's the distinction you're drawing. Hasbro's been doing great in the toys department (I mean, just look at those Titan Returns leaks from yesterday - bang up work!), but you doubt they understand the fandom to the extent that they would be able to service us effectively, and you have been underwhelmed at their attempts to engage the fandom thus far.

But even the toys reflect a huge level of engagement with the fandom and what it takes to make more people happy. All of that is positive evidence. While I agree the fan-built Windblade & Victorion initiatives were a bit weird/wonky, I take your statement that these resulted in "aggregates that no actual, individual, fans could possibly have asked for, or even imagined" as an amazing thing. I wouldn't want something just one person wants or can imagine - that's basically how the Club operates now. The way Hasbro has supported these new characters with toys, story, and other media while allowing for fan input has helped lend the brand new life and relevance.

I was also really satisfied with the Trypticon-Scorponok-Omega poll. Those are 3 characters people want, and I appreciated being able to pipe up and say "I want Trypticon first." These kind of things - which you might consider misleading or token - go a long way towards earning my trust.

How this engagement translates to a Club or Convention is unclear, and I think that uncertainty is just cause for anxiety, and maybe even fear or disappointment. But the brand is NOT where it was 10, or even 5 years ago. The Club's model, on the other hand, has basically stood in place. Your assertion that Transformers fans are a specific breed similarly feels outdated. There's a constellation of sub-segments and breeds, and plenty of crossover. I also collect Marvel Legends and Star Wars Black Series, and would love to see all my favorite brands in one place, so long as sufficient service is paid to each. I know not everyone feels the same way, but I do have a good amount of trust that Hasbro can pull it off, even if it takes a couple years to get the formula right.

Yeah, I don't quite get the assertion of the fan-built girls being a product of a mis-mash of different ideas being a bad thing either. Like, you can certainly argue that Windblade and Victorion turned out awful - though personally I love them both - but surely the very concept of a variety of different opinions and options from the fans to create a new character slash group of characters is something great that implies a good level of fan connection? I think the only problems could be found in execution.

To some degree, I think we've reached the point where we just have to agree to disagree on our terms of what's important. That's fine. But I do want to clarify one point that I feel you may have misconstrued.

megatronus wrote:But even the toys reflect a huge level of engagement with the fandom and what it takes to make more people happy. All of that is positive evidence. While I agree the fan-built Windblade & Victorion initiatives were a bit weird/wonky, I take your statement that these resulted in "aggregates that no actual, individual, fans could possibly have asked for, or even imagined" as an amazing thing. I wouldn't want something just one person wants or can imagine - that's basically how the Club operates now. The way Hasbro has supported these new characters with toys, story, and other media while allowing for fan input has helped lend the brand new life and relevance.

The point wasn't that the result wasn't something that some specific, single, fan wanted. It's that the result was completely unrecognizable from what any fan, or even any group of fans, wanted, or could even have imagined. Think, for example, about how many people said "Yes, I voted for those colors, but I didn't think they'd look like that!" I don't see that as a case of "be careful what you wish for," so much as "we didn't ever really even know what we were voting on." Another thing in the case of the fan combiner, the way the poll was conducted precluded even making "next step" decisions based on previous results. The results, as given, gave us two helicopters, for example. But if fans knew that a helicopter was already winning one of the limb polls, would we have voted for a second? Maybe we might have, but there's no way to make that assertion the way it was done. We very well could have said, collectively, "Thanks for the helicopter mold. Now we can move on to what other mold we want next!"

At least with the Scorponok, Trypticon, Omega Supreme vote (which I still contend was clumsily executed and thus didn't reflect actual fan sentiment well), we knew more or less what we were voting for.

Kurona wrote:Yeah, I don't quite get the assertion of the fan-built girls being a product of a mis-mash of different ideas being a bad thing either. Like, you can certainly argue that Windblade and Victorion turned out awful - though personally I love them both - but surely the very concept of a variety of different opinions and options from the fans to create a new character slash group of characters is something great that implies a good level of fan connection? I think the only problems could be found in execution.

Perhaps the execution is the real problem. I could ask whether you meant the execution of the polls or the toys is intended, but from context I assume you mean the latter. Personally, I think the polls, themselves, were poorly thought-out and executed. Polls can be a great way to interact with fans, but I've yet to see it done well by Hasbro (or FunPub, for that matter).