Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

[Gatkowski]

There you go. Storm freely, but respectfully. No flames, no offenses.

[Valandar]

As I said, a possibility for these kinds of gameplay is slow advancement.

Basically, if a player stays in character exceptionally well, comes up ith a brilliant idea, does something spectacularly humorous, nearly sacrifices himself to protect someone, and so on, the GM's could decide to award them a point to upgrade their character's tech specs (subject to their approval, of course). Naturally any such act would have to be played WELL, in-character, and without going beyond the character's actual limits.

Or, if they do something dramatic, that point could be automatically assigned to a specific Spec. "You dove on top of an ionic plasma grenade to protect your buddies, and were nearly blown to scrap. Here, take a point of Courage for when he gets repaired."

And these bonus points could be stored up and saved for a "reformat". "Hey, Prime, I'm not Bumblbee anymore - I'm Goldbug!"

Just a bit of a suggestion, and not as important in a free-form game like this as it would be in a dice-based game.

[HardHead]

An interesting idea, but there are a few points i'd like to raise based on it.

1) Firstly, take any general character and then, over the course of a year's play they'll probably get six or seven upgrades in their lifespan. Now, the problem with this is that it would potentially create 'godlike' characters, especially if you're using characters with already high stats. Add this to the fact that this may develop into the point where all the 'powerful' characters are held by the veterans who have a significent difference between their characters and those of newcomers, then you're going to have a MMORPG-like situation where the newbies are just blitzed by the vets, causing a decline in people wanting to stick around in the RPG

2) Do you mean ALL characters, or just fanmades and/or canons? I'd like to have this clarified so we're on the same page. If you mean canons, then it's going to be too much trouble as i've found cannons shift around faster than hotcakes on the boards. Is it particularly fair for someone to pick up a 'powered up' canon from someone else? Is it going to become a problem for the mods to sort out any changes or adjustments as a result of such switches?


Personally, what i would believe would be more interesting is that everyone can start with a signiture character: that is, a character that starts off at half stats (a grunt, who'll go down quicker than a sack of spuds more often than not and counts as a recruit or grunt in the factions), who is then elegiable for such upgrades. That way, whilst canon and other 'fanmade' characters retain the same stats, this one grows and develops with time and actions. It would certainly be interesting, but i think would be too much hastle to implement.



Anyway, more recent-event focused words.. i'm guessing we're starting off from where we left off then aye?

[VkmSpouge]

The way to get around the first point would be to make it harder for more powerful characters to earn those extra stat points.

However I think it would be rather hard to keep track of what characters are earning what stats.

[WithoutMorals]

I was actually wondering about the whole 'stat-modification' thing myself. Back in the old RPG, I was going to begin a short storyline where Onslaught attempts to improve Brawl's intelligence to bring him up to the other Combaticons' level. With only 2 intelligence when the average is 5 or 6, it was a wonder Brawl even knew which way to aim half the time.

On another note, if we simply pick up where we left off, you wanna have the Throttlebots stumble onto Contrail, Spouge?

[Light Blade]

what if you set a limit past which it is almost impossible to gain Stat upgrades like 90 for example?
alternatively once people get past this point they have to be nominated to a guy who counts numbers of nominations for an award at the end of the year we vote and those with over a ceartin number of votes, or the top few from each side, (Say top three) get a stat upgrade (1 point in the area of thier choosing)
i wouldn't mind running that myself so what do you guys think.

[AxiomScion]

Valandar may be onto something, and the prementioned conserns can be worked out i believe.

1. I think there should be a cap on who and what can get aded points. To that end I'ld see fanon characters (starting at 75pts) able to gain 4 points in an 6 month period and cap off at 10 pts (maximum of 85pt for fanons) Though 80pts does sound like a happy medium. As for canon types, 5 more points could go a long way. I think heavy hitter canons start off in the 90s range. Naturally, this will all be to the moderators discreation.

2. Canon characters should only upgrade in the direction of there character as the moderators see. I couldn't see Skywarp getting smarter, but after some work maybe a little faster. One obvious direction would be that of there more powerful toy. Take Starscream. His pretender shell should boost his strength and endurance while in the shell as well as add the weapons to his arsenal. This could translate to +1 to Str, End, and Fpwr.

3. This should all come down to Moderators calling for the advancement and not the players. Some characters may not be available for upgrades (pretty powerful as is..) and it would need to be worked in to the story smoothly not forced like Sixshots seventh altmode. The stats gained should be noted in there profile accordingly. I doubt the Mods want to see "the beast" when the insecticons find the Dinobots either...

4. Shame be on any who claim more points than they should have

but really the creativity with playing the character is what makes them well.. the character

As W/o morals pointed out with Brawl, I played him once too , I was wondering how dumb is dumb? If Skywarp is a 5 and not too bright then Brawl being a 2 is a bit harder to grasp. I don't see/play Skywarp as an idiot though, just not that bright in a fight or insanely creative with his options, unless he's planning a prank. There are a few characters beloow the 5 intell that i've wondered how to play?

Also as i was looking at Tapout being labled semi-canon and thus in the fanon section i think it's only fair to do the same with Bugbite... Though i may try that slow upgrade with him to 75pts if the mods allow it.

[GrimSqueaker]

I had an idea to help keep the game moving and to aid new players- Want ads!!!!

there should be a thread where players looking for jobs for their characters (possibly as entry for a new character?)
or looking for a particular type of character to fill a role can place an Ad. i have found getting into the game kinda tricky and this i believe would help, and make area of teh game more balanced as characters join where they are needed most. it could also help take some stress off of the mods!

[Devastron]

I don't think adding stat points is a good idea for the game. There are several points I have against it.

1. I have never supported making any major changes to canon characters and adding additional stat points does just that. For instance, boosting Brawl's intelligence from 2 to say 5-6 is a major alteration to him. Brawl has always been the belligerent and dumb Combaticon, giving him even average intelligence changes the character. Even if you made changes that are more in-line with the character you alter them pretty radically. Things get pretty nasty if all of the seekers have strength and/or dexterity 10, or if all of the Dinobots have strength and endurance 10.

2. This system could be used to effectively eliminate weaknesses in either canon or fanmade characters. Say I have a character whose weakness is that he is extremely slow, like speed 1 or 2. Under this stat point system I could gradually move that speed up to 6 or 7 or even higher, depending on what cap was put on it. A speed of 6 or 7 is certainly not slow and now a weakness has been removed from the character.

3. How would this be explained in the game? Do we abruptly decide to take the character in for an upgrade? Did they just now discover how to make someone faster or stronger? How do you upgrade someone's intelligence or charisma?

4. There are certain rules that limit certain stats. Characters with high strength or endurance are limited in how high their dexterity is. Now the moderators will have to monitor the profiles all the time, which brings me to my next point..

5. This system adds a lot more work for the moderators. They will have to figure out how much 'good posting,' a pretty subjective thing, should result in a stat upgrade. What makes a good post? Does the guy who posts every day with short posts that move things along better than the guy who posts every few days with longer and more detailed posts? The moderators will also have to read every post in every thread, which is a pretty tall task. Then you will have the inevitable complaints from some players. 'I think my character deserves and upgrade because I have been posting for so long,' or 'why did so-and-so get an upgrade and I didn't' etc. You guys know this will eventually happen.

6. This game has always been more about how well you write and interact with other people than about the stats. If you want to play a game that lets you add stats and modify your character freely, thats what HMW is for. I for one, do not want to see this game morph into something like HMW in any shape or form.

Now all of this isn't to say that characters can't get upgrades occasionally, but I think it should be kept to special or exceptional cases and not made into some uniform system of advancement. People should want to make good posts because they enjoy it, not because they want to gain stat points.

[Ecto]

When I read about the stats modifications I was being put off about this RP site indefently. So in accordance with Devastron I agree that stats modification should stay with HMW and that RP is not about the stats but more about how someone writes and interact as their character with others. So I am against the modification.

[Philcom]

I've been a part of two games that handed out stat points and at least for me it didn't matter too much. Overall I think it'll be too much of a bother to hand out stat points as the only reward for playing well. I just think that if a person plays well enough it should enable the player more room for upgrades in the future. The stat restrictions for fan made character does limit what those fan mades are able to do. If a player wants to upgrade their fan made in the future it should be taken on a case by case basis.

I think a player should be allowed if they've been in a game a while and played a fan made well, the player should have the ability to submit a profile for the upgraded character and add a few extra stat points. If stat points are just given out some people may just not do anything with them.

I think generally rewards for good playing should be all done on a case by case basis.

1.) Permission to use extra stat points in upgrades for existing fan characters.
2.) Permission to use extra stat points in new fan characters.
3.) More allowance for in game activities.
4.) More confirmed hits in game fights.
5.) More responsibilities for the character in game.

As for canon character and upgrades... that should be handled in game completely. There has also been some room in the past to alter canon stats when they are first applied for, because many stats in the G1 profiles were actually in error (The first three seekers come to mind). An intelligence of 2 would make Brawl as dumb as a stump, so I'd say it should be no problem to fix it at application to 4 or so.

[Blackstreak]

I had brought up the very idea of awarding stat pointsfor character improvement back before the site crashed. It was pretty much shot down because its near impossible for moderators to judge every single post made. This aside there's been plenty of accusations going around about favoritism. Lets avoid that. I like the idea of there being some kind of award system but this isn't your typical dice 'n stats game either.
Here's what I did for a D&D online rpg at a friend's website: The very same thing in an actual dice 'n stats game. You award xp at the end of a particular adventure. It's not hard to figure out how much is needed, say to be awarded a stat point. The stat point can be used on stats or saved for a developing ability. BTW, I still plan on doing my decepticon version of Blackstreak. The crash didn't kill my idea.

[AxiomScion]

I really like the way Philicom and Blackstreak have presented the pro approach for awarding players. The idea of it is really good IMHO, but alas i've had a change of spark...

hmm.. as much as I seem to disagree with Devastron, after reading his reasons, along with some others, I think the stat mod idea should remain a no go.

i'm just as surprised as you Dev.

Experience points could work but ultimately this would equal more work on the moderators whose efforts are seemingly under appreciated as it is. The thought of them getting spammed with senarious from Devs point # 5 is rather unsettling. Again this all would rest on weather the moderators would even want to undertake the added arduous task.

[Gatkowski]

Okay, I'd like to settle the stat upgrade issue. There won't be any stat upgrades, period. The game system practically doesn't use the stats, they are just a guideline to show a character's approximate abilities.

If we start to beef the characters, there will be no end to it, and like some have already pointed out, sooner or later they will achieve god-like powers. Hottest ground for powergaming and abuse. No-no.

[GrimSqueaker]

Well that certainly fixed that! I dont mean to repeat myself, but since the last issue has been solved how about my idea,

a thread where players looking for jobs for their characters (possibly as entry for a new character?)
or looking for a particular type of character to fill a role can place an Ad.

So does this idea have any merit?

[AxiomScion]

Well that certainly fixed that! I dont mean to repeat myself, but since the last issue has been solved how about my idea,

a thread where players looking for jobs for their characters (possibly as entry for a new character?)
or looking for a particular type of character to fill a role can place an Ad.

So does this idea have any merit?

I think it's worth a shot. So long as players actually used it.

p.s. Sorry if it seemed we side stepped your idea GS

[WithoutMorals]

Er, we could still presumably increase stats through good old-fashioned RPing, right? I'd still like to try to pull off my side story of Onslaught trying to get Brawl's intelligence brought up more in line with the others. I mean, there's a huge gap between the 9s and 8s of the other Combaticons, then Brawl's 2.

'course, if we could simply have that stat modified in his profile to around 4 or so (enough brains to follow orders and such), there'd be no problem. Be a lot less fun, though.

No sigs in RPG forums please -Devastron

[Gatkowski]

Er, we could still presumably increase stats through good old-fashioned RPing, right?

Not fond of the idea. As I said, I wouldn't like to see every character beefed to god-like level.

'course, if we could simply have that stat modified in his profile to around 4 or so (enough brains to follow orders and such), there'd be no problem.

That could be workable, since the VSD profiles and other stuff aren't always in line with the RPG standards (like Piranacon's endurance of 6, or Grimlock's intelligence displayed inconsistently between 7 and 8 ).

[WithoutMorals]

Er, we could still presumably increase stats through good old-fashioned RPing, right?

Not fond of the idea. As I said, I wouldn't like to see every character beefed to god-like level.

I doubt it'd be very easy. For example, for my Brawl upgrade storyline, Onslaught would have had to petition Megatron for permission, which would mean proving the costs and benefits of the upgrade. Could've made for an interesting rp session, with Onslaught debating Megatron or whoever about the pros and cons. Maybe even have had the condition that the 'cons would provide a medic, but the Combaticons had to provide all the resources. That sort of thing.

'course, if we could simply have that stat modified in his profile to around 4 or so (enough brains to follow orders and such), there'd be no problem.

That could be workable, since the VSD profiles and other stuff aren't always in line with the RPG standards (like Piranacon's endurance of 6, or Grimlock's intelligence displayed inconsistently between 7 and 8 ).

Yeah, I've noticed that. Especially with things like speed.

No sigs in RPG forums please -Devastron

[DeathCaller]

Here's a little question to help my brainstorming: XD

In the RPG, are we allowed to add areas within a city that are originally in the Cybertronian history, but aren't listed in the areas at the beginning of the RPG? Am I clear with this question? If not, let me know. XD

Ex. In Iacon, we've got the Command center, some Landing Bays and things that are listed when the thread is introduced. If maybe they didn't have a part of the city on the list that's still major or can at least be used to other characters publically (say if Maccadams wasn't on the list), we could add that when we please?

No sigs in RPG forums please -Devastron

[Gatkowski]

Here's something for you to ponder on:

The new game setup will most likely be plot dependant. Meaning, that instead of a whole load of locations with just some random action going on, each thread will accomodate one, separate storyline from beginning to end. With only the characters involved present in that thread.

The story ideas would be approved much like the character applications. With story outline, characters to involve, etc. indicated.

Also, we are thinking about opening a "free for all" area, where people can write more freely, for example, monologues of their character that just popped out of their head, or setting up battles in an area like environment, etc., etc.

Thoughts and comments on this?

[Darth Vegeta]

Did we reset yet again?

[Gatkowski]

Did we reset yet again?

Nope. We'll continue where we left off.

[GrimSqueaker]

Well that certainly fixed that! I dont mean to repeat myself, but since the last issue has been solved how about my idea,

a thread where players looking for jobs for their characters (possibly as entry for a new character?)
or looking for a particular type of character to fill a role can place an Ad.

So does this idea have any merit?

I think it's worth a shot. So long as players actually used it.

p.s. Sorry if it seemed we side stepped your idea GS

Ill forgive u, this time

[The J Writer]

Here's something for you to ponder on:

The new game setup will most likely be plot dependant. Meaning, that instead of a whole load of locations with just some random action going on, each thread will accomodate one, separate storyline from beginning to end. With only the characters involved present in that thread.

The story ideas would be approved much like the character applications. With story outline, characters to involve, etc. indicated.

Also, we are thinking about opening a "free for all" area, where people can write more freely, for example, monologues of their character that just popped out of their head, or setting up battles in an area like environment, etc., etc.

Thoughts and comments on this?

I think this may be a fine idea. Certainly I have selfish reasons as a moderator, since this should cut down on some of the tedious "Hey, you can't do that there...edit plz!" aspect of moderation, but I think it makes sense as well from a writing standpoint...containing the stories and planning them out a bit more thoroughly will likely make for better stories.

On the stat-modification front, I'm not a fan. Good RPing can change your Rank or your status within a faction, but I don't think beefier stats should be a reward for good play. As I've said about things like special abilities and so on, it isn't the profile that makes a character a lethal warrior or a masterful spy: it's how the character is played, and how he uses what he has. Bumblebee, for example, has very few stat-based or "natural" advantages, but is somehow a master scout - how'd that happen? He used what he's got. He didn't get upgraded into a master scout. Same deal with someone like Sunstreaker. Yeah, he has one or two impressive stats, but he's a lethal warrior because he's a cold S.O.B. who doesn't pull punches. It's as much attitude as it is physical ability that makes him nasty.

As for altering the stats of certain canon characters to reflect oddities in the VSD stats or whatever, we do that already. We always have. But we do it very carefully and as little as possible, because a lot of those stats make sense - Piranacon's Endurance 6 makes sense when you consider that it's Endurance 6 by gestalt standards. He's got average Endurance for a gestalt, which is still waaaaaaaay tougher than a normal-sized TF with above-average Endurance. Brawl's Intelligence of 2 doesn't particularly merit change in my mind, because it fits his character - mud-stupid, belligerent, and probably not a 100%-safe bet to follow every order to the letter. The guy's motto is "I was built to be wild." Not exactly the words of a perfectly obedient soldier.

In the past, alteration of canon stats led to a lot of "arms races" - such-and-such 'Con is this, so such-and-such 'Bot needs this upgrade. Kind of a waste of time. Other than really, really glaring issues, the tech spec stats needn't and shouldn't be altered.