Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

Sid Burn wrote:bait much? The G1 argument has been done to death, we all have warm feelings for G1, you dont HAVE to defend it with every post.

And nor do I. However, if someone posts something blatantly stupid, I fail to see how it's wrong to point that out. Has the franchise moved on? Of course. And there have been some fantastic developments. But I don't see why that means anyone should have to "let go" of what started it all, or pretend that it's no longer relevant.

G1 was and is great but it could not have supported TF for 20+ years alone.

No, but then I never said that. So you're attacking a point I never made. Is your faith in what you think so weak you have to attack what I think via strawman arguments? And G1 is still a strong part of the TF line, whether we're talking toys or comics. Ultimately, what other toyline is still being reissued exactly as it was after 20 years?

As with most fans, I look at each line as it comes out and like some parts, dislike others. Bottom line is, why do some people seem to think that embracing modern TFs means forgetting the past? And where is the cutoff point? Beast Wars is ten years old now, is it time people "got over" that?

Sledge wrote:

The Master Blaster wrote:Your nephew seems able to accept what most of the fandom can't or won't.


Times change. G1 has had it's day,

As is apparent by how difficult it is to buy reissues of the G1 toys, or DVDs of the G1 cartoon. Or how Hasbro totally ignored G1's influence with their Classics line. Or how comic companies won't produce G1 comics. Yeah, G1 is dead and buried.

Way to take a point out of context!


We all love G1, and will always remember it, but things are shifting forwards now. They (Hasbro) aren't making new reissues, and G1 influence is restricted to the Classics line for us.

The comics have never changed, but did I say they had? Have I even mentioned comics at any point? I don't read them, so I will not comment on them.

And it is all very well talking about tf availability, but more often than not that is down to people selling their old stuff.




Please, don't take what I say out of context again. I always will love G1 for what it is and was. But I seriously doubt Hasbro will bring G1 back full-fledged. Classics is a (successful) attempt at appeasing the fans while they churn out the new aged stuff for the general public.


Takara on the other hand....

Sledge wrote:

Sid Burn wrote:bait much? The G1 argument has been done to death, we all have warm feelings for G1, you dont HAVE to defend it with every post.

And nor do I. However, if someone posts something blatantly stupid, I fail to see how it's wrong to point that out. Has the franchise moved on? Of course. And there have been some fantastic developments. But I don't see why that means anyone should have to "let go" of what started it all, or pretend that it's no longer relevant.

G1 was and is great but it could not have supported TF for 20+ years alone.

No, but then I never said that. So you're attacking a point I never made. Is your faith in what you think so weak you have to attack what I think via strawman arguments? And G1 is still a strong part of the TF line, whether we're talking toys or comics. Ultimately, what other toyline is still being reissued exactly as it was after 20 years?

As with most fans, I look at each line as it comes out and like some parts, dislike others. Bottom line is, why do some people seem to think that embracing modern TFs means forgetting the past? And where is the cutoff point? Beast Wars is ten years old now, is it time people "got over" that?

Step back from the computer, take a deep breath, and try again.


I have never said that G1 is done, finished.
Saying that G1 has had it's day does not mean that it's dead and buried. It means that it's been done, and now Hasbro are gonna concentrate on something new.



Stop being so eager to post and read what people are writing.
THEN comment.

Saying something "has had it's day" is something I have always taken as meaning it is finished, dead, etc. If that's not what you meant, I apologise. However, I stand by what I said.

plasmawave wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:

Whiner-tron wrote:

Zombie Starscream wrote:

Damolisher wrote::shock: Counterpunch NOT being a douche? What has this world come to?!!!!

Run! Its one of the signs of the Apocolypse!!!

If it's the Apocolypse,... where are we supposed to run?

To the ships, there our only chance!

OK you feel the same way I do, but I just stoped whatching TF a long time ago, I gave the movie a chance it got my respect, I'll give TFA a chance, I just read the comics and collect the toys, and watch my G1 DVDs.

quick to the douch krusher

Who do you mean if you mean me well you've got another thing coming.

If we get back to the point, we've got a guy here who's been a TF fan since before some of you were born. He's not interested in anything past the Beast era, even thought he's given it a chance. I don't think the attitude of "Hey, don't be so square, daddy-o. Get with what the kids are down with" is really helping. What's wrong with saying "This new stuff isn't my scene. I've given it a go, it's not for me. I'm just going to carry on with the part of the universe I'm happy with"?

Sledge wrote:If we get back to the point, we've got a guy here who's been a TF fan since before some of you were born. He's not interested in anything past the Beast era, even thought he's given it a chance. I don't think the attitude of "Hey, don't be so square, daddy-o. Get with what the kids are down with" is really helping. What's wrong with saying "This new stuff isn't my scene. I've given it a go, it's not for me. I'm just going to carry on with the part of the universe I'm happy with"?

Nothing atall, I never said anything of that sort.
I agreed with him on one point and understand him completly, you can't just force a man to do something he doesn't like, well you could but that would be the NAZI way.

Sledge wrote:Saying something "has had it's day" is something I have always taken as meaning it is finished, dead, etc. If that's not what you meant, I apologise. However, I stand by what I said.

I would never let the thought enter my mind. It was and is the best, and always will be!



But you are right. G1 isn't finished and probably won't ever be. Sure, it's not in the lime-light anymore. Hasbro aren't centred on it anymore, but each line (Energon in particular) has more than a passing cameo of many G1 faves.





I hope Omnus enjoys the Classics and Alternators lines though. While most of the new lines are no good for the G1 fanboy (like me, but I'm extremely flexible when it comes to toys), there are still a few lines that are for our more selective group.



Either that, or why not go back and buy all your old faves? Get the old comics?


If you don't wanna go forwards, there's plenty to go back on! ^_^

Wow, just, wow.
That's so many of my thoughts, so much of the subtle turmoil that I've had since the movie came out-all rolled into a perfectly put speech. I keep coming here less and less, all of the sites less and less, the magic of the coming movie waning as the months go on. Personally, just me gang, it didn't do it for me. Armada, a lot of the stuff he mentions, just didn't rekindle the fire. And that's ok. I really do hear what he's saying. All through the post-Beast Wars stages it's been fading, for me. I don't think it's just growing up or going through life changes either, it's just a personal change. I will always love, adore, and hold in my soul what I believe Transformers to be, no matter what...GOD THAT SOUNDS SO DAMNED CORNY AND LAME but it's so damned true at the same time. I'm so happy for all of you who grew up with Beast Wars, who grew up with RID. Bless all of you guys and gals. I'm so flippin' happy you found it and enjoyed it. Rock and FREAKIN' roll. It's because of you (in great part) that TF's is even still around and continuing to evolve. I will never have a deaf ear or blind eye for the 'new project' on the horizon.
Never. I'll still check back from time to time. That's just the undying fan in me.
But I will never be as involved, as whole heartedly craving that next, coming thing. I don't have it in me anymore. And it's not anyone's fault, it's not any continuity's or toy's fault, it's just mine. Transformers will always kick a**, Transformers will always be the most f*****g awesome thing EVER. But, times have changed, and so has my love of the hobby.
What I take comfort in is knowing that it's as popular, probably MORE popular than it has been since I first saw a big red robot turn into a big rig truck, and made my jaw hit the floor.
That's something spectacular.
They're something spectacular.
To all the new fans, and the fans growing up and being introduced to them (TF'S) by this new live action movie, or shoot, maybe the new cartoon coming up, have fun. Hell, have the best freakin' time ever. Get to a Botcon. Go to several. Buy a shirt saying you were there. Make a costume that can transform. Make a diorama.
Take all this in and make it what you want it to be.
I did.
Trust me, this is some of the coolest s*** you've ever seen.

I'm not saying he should change his views on the new stuff. (I did say that there are some positives to the new stuff though)

I'm not saying he should hate G1.

I'm saying he shouldn't give all of it up because of the new stuff or the movie. He shouldn't quit being a fan and give up G1 as well all because Hasbro has moved on from G1 and that era.

That's ridiculous. That's taking something waaay too far. There's no middle ground or gray area with him.

On one end, TFs became his life (you can clearly see this from his post). On the other end, he wants to give it all up just because the current state doesn't fit his whim.

That I have a problem with. That's carrying it way too far. It's his right, and he's entitled to it, but it's ridiculous to think that way. I could see him giving it all up for legitimate reasons, but this? Come on.

I don't like TF:A at all. In fact, I hate it. It's not enough to cause me to give up collecting and being in the fandom.

If he can give up all of it...then he wasn't the fan he's claimed to be.

Sledge wrote:Is your faith in what you think so weak you have to attack what I think via strawman arguments? And G1 is still a strong part of the TF line, whether we're talking toys or comics. Ultimately, what other toyline is still being reissued exactly as it was after 20 years?

You need to get over yourself sledge, the only one attacking anyone is you. We were debating the subject and you have to chime in with your sarcastic flame bait, adding nothing to the thread.

Back on topic, if the guy is finished with TF, thats a shame. Hasbro/Takara really do bend over backwards to please all their markets, collectors, kids, casual and hardcore fans etc.

There is plenty of fiction and toys being released that cater to his love of G1, but as he mentioned, his mind is made up.

Transformers has always done a great job of honouring its roots while staying fresh and innovative

Unicron's Head wrote:Wow, just, wow.
That's so many of my thoughts, so much of the subtle turmoil that I've had since the movie came out-all rolled into a perfectly put speech. I keep coming here less and less, all of the sites less and less, the magic of the coming movie waning as the months go on. Personally, just me gang, it didn't do it for me. Armada, a lot of the stuff he mentions, just didn't rekindle the fire. And that's ok. I really do hear what he's saying. All through the post-Beast Wars stages it's been fading, for me. I don't think it's just growing up or going through life changes either, it's just a personal change. I will always love, adore, and hold in my soul what I believe Transformers to be, no matter what...GOD THAT SOUNDS SO DAMNED CORNY AND LAME but it's so damned true at the same time. I'm so happy for all of you who grew up with Beast Wars, who grew up with RID. Bless all of you guys and gals. I'm so flippin' happy you found it and enjoyed it. Rock and FREAKIN' roll. It's because of you (in great part) that TF's is even still around and continuing to evolve. I will never have a deaf ear or blind eye for the 'new project' on the horizon.
Never. I'll still check back from time to time. That's just the undying fan in me.
But I will never be as involved, as whole heartedly craving that next, coming thing. I don't have it in me anymore. And it's not anyone's fault, it's not any continuity's or toy's fault, it's just mine. Transformers will always kick a**, Transformers will always be the most f*****g awesome thing EVER. But, times have changed, and so has my love of the hobby.
What I take comfort in is knowing that it's as popular, probably MORE popular than it has been since I first saw a big red robot turn into a big rig truck, and made my jaw hit the floor.
That's something spectacular.
They're something spectacular.
To all the new fans, and the fans growing up and being introduced to them (TF'S) by this new live action movie, or shoot, maybe the new cartoon coming up, have fun. Hell, have the best freakin' time ever. Get to a Botcon. Go to several. Buy a shirt saying you were there. Make a costume that can transform. Make a diorama.
Take all this in and make it what you want it to be.
I did.
Trust me, this is some of the coolest s*** you've ever seen.

Amazing post man, really great. You captured exactly what is special about TF, that every generation that falls in love with TF is just as valid as the generation that loved its beginnings.

So many members here seem to have forgotten why they collect TF, The reason SHOULD be because TF makes them happy. Some posters are so busy shitting on everything that I often wonder why TF is their hobby since it clearly brings them grief.

again, great post

Tell you what, Sid Burn: we'll agree to differ. You stick to your version of events, I'll stick to the truth.

Autobot32: I think we're getting at the same point. There's no sense in giving up the hobby (if hobby it is) because you don't like the modern stuff. The point I've been making is there's enough commercial support for the older lines that you don't HAVE to be a fan of Cybertron/Movie/Animated/whatever comes in 2009 to be a Transformers fan.

Of course, if someone wants to quit, that's their choice. But quitting because you only like one version of what's always been a large and diverse universe is... silly.

I think Unicrons' Head is right, really. So much of our turmoil and discontent came from the post-movie era, and it's fairly obvious that there is a vast gulf of opinions over the movie. No matter what though it does seem like fans who prefer G1 are always on the defensive, but maybe that's becuase so many people keep saying we need to move on and stop living in TF past. No, we don't. I love G1, it's what got me started. That does not make it any better or worse than people who got into TFs becuase of Armada or the new movie. I can appreciate how fans of older stuff can get annoyed by the banter of how the new movie was godly and the new movie toys are the alpha and omega of TF toys as spread by people who got involved because of said items. But movie Ironhide is not the Ironhide that I first knew, and although I love movie Ironhides' plastic incarnation, his movie counterpart was not so great, and I still would prefer G1 Ironhide as a character. I'm not wrong for saying or believeing this, no more so than someone would be because they prefer movie Ironhide. Seems to me one of our big problems is that we all have to be so defensive nowadays and all because some people fly off the handle when you disagree with them, so rather than freely trade opinions we are spending most of our time apologizing.
Ultimately, I don't have to like anything I don't like, whether it be TFs or the real world. Sometimes I most likely come across as being confrontational, but I really don't mean to be, and we all come across that way from time to time. But that doesn't change the fact that I don't have to like something that I don't like, and I don't have to hold G1 in the same regard as I do Armada. Fortunately we have so much in the TF universes to choose from.....

Sounds like the guy just fell out of love for them, it happens. He'll still care and think about them, but the passion isn't there.

Such is life, it happens. Wish him peace, wish him well, but I wouldn't personally try to change his mind. He's an adult who's made his decision.

Best of luck to you.

Thanks guys. It should always be said and never forgotten or downplayed that Transfans rock it harder and longer than any other fanboys out there. And the people who argue and pick comments apart, who express their interest for these awesome characters so intensely, nay, seemingly argumentatively, deserve just as much respect as anyone else. They're just as passionate about Transformers as the rest of us, if not more so. That's why it zings them, why it stings when people talk like the initial post here-because it matters so much to them. Remember that guys.

Omnus:

I completely agree with you about Transformers as of late. But I will give you the top reason to remain a fan:

G1 STILL EXISTS!!!

Think about it: We have had a lot G1 goodness over the last few years:

1) G1 classics line
2) Megatron origins comic
3) Spotlight comics
4) TF: Mosaics
5) Lil' Formers
6) Them Funny Robots
7) BW comics tie-in to the series
TF Collector's club comics
9) Merchandise: Busts, PVCs, MegaPVCs, statues, globes, posters, etc.
10) G1 novels
11) G1 Japanese PS2 game (play as Snapdragon)

Yes, RID, and just about everything after that, has sucked. And the movie didn't really feel like G1 at all. But that doesn't at all negate how awesome G1 was (and still is). G1 still exists, and there are a lot of elements out there right now that rock.


My point is, I remember a time in the mid-90's when Transformers did not exist. There were no more toys. There was no TV show. No comics. No internet (or at least not like it is today). Not even TF:TM or episodes on DVD (all I had were my worn-out tapes from the 80's). I thought I was the only fan on Earth. But G1 was still very much alive in my memories and imagination.

Now, it's everywhere, and we have high standards for TFs. Sometimes TFs meets those standards (War Within comics, Beast Wars, etc.). There are sooo many elements of Transformers out there. Focus on the parts you love. Forget the rest.

Stormrider wrote:For some stuff yes - Takara tends to do a better job. Ex - listening more to the fans and doing characters that we want, doing better paint jobs, adding extras, adding more die-cast.

Takara has also stated recently that they will be gearing their Transformers for 20-30 year olds. While Hasbro seems to be trying to please the 8-18 year olds.

That is good. And the Masterpieces are a Takara thing orginally? As they look like they are for that age set.

Zombie Starscream wrote:

Stormrider wrote:For some stuff yes - Takara tends to do a better job. Ex - listening more to the fans and doing characters that we want, doing better paint jobs, adding extras, adding more die-cast.

Takara has also stated recently that they will be gearing their Transformers for 20-30 year olds. While Hasbro seems to be trying to please the 8-18 year olds.

That is good. And the Masterpieces are a Takara thing orginally? As they look like they are for that age set.

The original MP Prime was a joint venture between Hasbro and Takara.

Sledge wrote:Tell you what, Sid Burn: we'll agree to differ. You stick to your version of events, I'll stick to the truth.

The truth as you see it I guess, I think that there are two types of G1 purist. Those like the author of this thread that are willing to give new evolutions of TF a spin, and those who are so quick to downplay anything but G1 that they really do spoil the new fiction for themselves.

I think that is pretty sad, because there is great content to be taken from every reinvention of TF. Armada takes alot of crap because the cartoon was very painful to watch, but the actual concept itself was great and was better realized by the dreamwave comics. There were a lot of great molds in the armada toyline as well. Armada could be seen as a homage to the headmaster concept, again TF paying homage to its roots.

yeah I stopped collecting a few weeks ago. Ill check in every know and then to see if anything intresting hppens. BUT I am losing intrest in transformers.

MaikeruSama wrote:yeah I stopped collecting a few weeks ago. Ill check in every know and then to see if anything intresting hppens. BUT I am losing intrest in transformers.

I hope I never feel this way, but I can see how it would happen, you see people selling off their collections on Ebay all the time for a variety of reasons.

Are you a new fan or have you been collecting for years?

I'm sorry to hear that you lost interest. It does happen, with anything. It's a little jarring at first, but once the initial shock wears off, you just kinda move on with life.

Still...even with as much hatred as I have for TF:A...I still wouldn't quit. I'd even go back and buy G1 figures before I gave up. (That sounds crazy, I didn't word it right, but people get the gist.)

yes i was scheptical about how the tformers looked in the big screen at first when the concept images where rleased to the web as time went by i liked the new look of the transformers in the new movie megatron as for the new animated series goes im not against but i am not the with the new animated style for the robots though but when its does hit the tv waves i will see it and i will keep an opend about it.

the other series like rid, enrgon, cybertron, and the other jaapanes versions i like them oh yes the humans are very annyoing in the japanes versions i will admit to that but it has some comedy like beast wars like rat trap riding down that missle to the ground and saying yee ha in the one episode beast wars and beast machines was a dark series with some comedy put into it i wont go on anymore but i will say this when you do decide to comeback maybe you will be transoformer fan again just as as i was when i first seen the g1 series

dragons wrote:it has some comedy like beast wars like rat trap riding down that missle to the ground

Dr. Strangelove...

and that movie Dr. Strangelove is based off of...