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TulioDude wrote:But didnt we get the information before,that the Bumbleebee movie would be a soft reboot and would be used as a base for future films?

A soft reboot is not the same thing as a hard reboot.

For example, AOE was also a soft reboot, but was clearly not a hard reboot.

I only have one request and one request only. In the final film chronologically when the war is finally over can we please get the credits song be "Brother my Brother" by Blessid Union of Souls

TrypticonCarne wrote:I only have one request and one request only. In the final film chronologically when the war is finally over can we please get the credits song be "Brother my Brother" by Blessid Union of Souls

Like in the English version of Pokemon: The First Movie?

Sabrblade wrote:

TrypticonCarne wrote:I only have one request and one request only. In the final film chronologically when the war is finally over can we please get the credits song be "Brother my Brother" by Blessid Union of Souls

Like in the English version of Pokemon: The First Movie?

Yes that movie does use the song but the lyrics are what matters here
"Brother, my brother
Tell me, what are we fighting for?
We've got to end this war
We should love one another
Oh, can't we just pretend
This war never began
We can try
Brother, my brother
We face each other from different sides
The anger burns can't remember why
It's kind of crazy to cause such pain
Our foolish pride makes us hate this way
We watch our world fall apart
Tell me what good is winning
When you lose your heart
Brother, my brother
Tell me, what are we fighting for?
Isn't life worth so much more?
We should love one another
Oh, can't we just pretend
This war never began
Tell me why
Brother, my brother
Yes
We can try
Brother, my brother
Yes
Let's take a moment and look deep inside
And say we're willing to give love a try
We're not as different as we seem to be
There's so much more to me than what you see
You don't have to be this way
Think about the consequences
Turn around and walk away
Brother, my brother
Tell me, what are we fighting for?
Isn't life worth so much more?
We should love one another
Oh, can't we just pretend
This war never began
Tell me why
Brother, my brother
Yeah
Tell me why
Brother, my brother
Oh, what are we fighting for?
Isn't life just worth so much more?
Love one another (Tell me why, oh)"

I mean it sounds like the perfect finale song for a franchise who's modern theme is about war and the dangers of it

i dont care, ill watch them no matter what people say
if they suck then they suck but i dont care if they suck

I was hoping TLK wouldn't be the last film, it ended on a cliffhanger. I hate that. I just hope that a competent writer is hired to make some sense of the story up to now, and handle Unicron at least decently. I won't compare this iteration to G1, because it's a different universe. Unicron could have a totally different origin.

As for a sequel to the Bee movie, my initial reaction is to pass on it altogether, I didn't care for the movie. At all. But I'll see who they cast, and if it won't be a SJW circle jerk this time around and there are more TF characters, I'll give it a shot.

Rodimus Prime wrote:I was hoping TLK wouldn't be the last film, it ended on a cliffhanger. I hate that. I just hope that a competent writer is hired to make some sense of the story up to now, and handle Unicron at least decently. I won't compare this iteration to G1, because it's a different universe. Unicron could have a totally different origin.

As for a sequel to the Bee movie, my initial reaction is to pass on it altogether, I didn't care for the movie. At all. But I'll see who they cast, and if it won't be a SJW circle jerk this time around and there are more TF characters, I'll give it a shot.

i yeah i dont get why they made unicron this unusable character like if this thing came to life it would mean the earth would be destroyed then whats the point
i would rather unicron be this outside force that threatens everything than it already here we just dont wake him

Dinobot4ever wrote:

TulioDude wrote:But didnt we get the information before,that the Bumbleebee movie would be a soft reboot and would be used as a base for future films?
I think we should wait for more info.


We did as a major news release ...

https://www.yahoo.com/amphtml/movies/bu ... 39482.html

The info out of this interview is certainly confusing. Larry “D” strikes again.

Might want to give that a reread, there's no quote in it from Hasbro stating its a reboot.

Dinobot4ever wrote:

TulioDude wrote:But didnt we get the information before,that the Bumbleebee movie would be a soft reboot and would be used as a base for future films?
I think we should wait for more info.

We did as a major news release ...

https://www.yahoo.com/amphtml/movies/bu ... 39482.html

The info out of this interview is certainly confusing. Larry “D” strikes again.

Oh come on Dinobot, not you too. Did you even read that article before posting it? As it turns out, there is no quote saying it is a reboot. There isnt even a quote
And yet the article wrote a clickbait title like that and people just blindly passed it along without realizing they were propogating fake news brought about by piss poor journalism.

The misinformation from those articles was started by TFW, who are currently not newsing this new Bonaventura interview. I guess because that would mean they wrote a BS article all along which spread to major news outlets, and no one wants to admit that.

If it continues the Bayverse Saga, I'll make sure my family / friends don't go, it won't take much, they have a very low opinion of Transformers. Paramount is wasting their money.

SkyFire Prime wrote:If it continues the Bayverse Saga, I'll make sure my family / friends don't go, it won't take much, they have a very low opinion of Transformers. Paramount is wasting their money.

Bumblebee continues the bay verse saga. Plus I think we should rename the movies soon as bayverse won't be accurate if he's no longer involved in them directly. Plus don't write the new films off till you see who's writing them. Bay is often the target but the writers need to take the blame as well.

ZeroWolf wrote:

SkyFire Prime wrote:If it continues the Bayverse Saga, I'll make sure my family / friends don't go, it won't take much, they have a very low opinion of Transformers. Paramount is wasting their money.

Bumblebee continues the bay verse saga. Plus I think we should rename the movies soon as bayverse won't be accurate if he's no longer involved in them directly. Plus don't write the new films off till you see who's writing them. Bay is often the target but the writers need to take the blame as well.

"Movieverse" has been in effect for as long as "Bayverse" and "Bayformers" have.

ZeroWolf wrote:

SkyFire Prime wrote:If it continues the Bayverse Saga, I'll make sure my family / friends don't go, it won't take much, they have a very low opinion of Transformers. Paramount is wasting their money.

Bumblebee continues the bay verse saga. Plus I think we should rename the movies soon as bayverse won't be accurate if he's no longer involved in them directly. Plus don't write the new films off till you see who's writing them. Bay is often the target but the writers need to take the blame as well.

I'll give anything that continues what Bumblebee started a chance. If they intend to make something that continues on from TLK, then yes, I will absolutely judge it ahead of time. I said before and I'll say again, not even the greatest screen writer who ever lived can fix that disaster of a movie.

Burn wrote:

SkyFire Prime wrote:This site seems to lean heavily into Bayverse support.

I think you're confusing "site" with "member base" and you're still wrong.

He obviously wasn't here during the lead up to the first movie, remember those swell times?

william-james88 wrote:

Dinobot4ever wrote:

TulioDude wrote:But didnt we get the information before,that the Bumbleebee movie would be a soft reboot and would be used as a base for future films?
I think we should wait for more info.

We did as a major news release ...

https://www.yahoo.com/amphtml/movies/bu ... 39482.html

The info out of this interview is certainly confusing. Larry “D” strikes again.

Oh come on Dinobot, not you too. Did you even read that article before posting it? As it turns out, there is no quote saying it is a reboot. There isnt even a quote
And yet the article wrote a clickbait title like that and people just blindly passed it along without realizing they were propogating fake news brought about by piss poor journalism.

The misinformation from those articles was started by TFW, who are currently not newsing this new Bonaventura interview. I guess because that would mean they wrote a BS article all along which spread to major news outlets, and no one wants to admit that.

Will, no need to be insulting, my friend. Yes, I did read the article. And there is a quote from Hasbro ... ‘officially declared as a new storytelling universe’. Call that a reboot (hard, soft, something in between), refresh, reimagining, retooling, … whatever, Bumblebee is something cinematically and very largely substantively different than the Bayverse. A rose is a rose is a rose.

As to the TFW article being bogus, are there any vidoes of that panel available? I would be keenly interested in seeing it, so I can hear, with my own ears, what was said. If there was a misquote, I'll yield and be highly disappointed for the live action franchise moving forward. Any kind of continuation of the Bayverse will heavily cripple future storytelling and most likely mean the franchise will financially come to a quick halt. TLK was a big warning of that end ...

In all of this I don't get the continued argument of reboot vs. prequel and the fervent defense of the prequel stance. In discussions with casual TF fans or sci-fi/fantasy fans that know something about TF, or even just those who are novices to TF, almost invariably, the first thing out of their mouths is these Bayformer movies … and I wince every time. Not surprisingly, more times than not, it is not positive either. I distance myself from the Bayverse as much as possible and educate those who do not know any better. I have been successful on the latter several times and I feel GREAT about it.

The stereotyping, discriminatory overtones, crassness, minimal character development, lack of continuity, and weak (if non-existent) story and arcs are reasons enough to steer clear of these Bayformer movies. However the item I hold above all else as unforgivable is the abuse or flat out disregard of the TF cannon. I have said this before on Seibertron and other places on the web. When you change the cannon of a concept, it ceases to be that concept, hence the name "Bayformers." Just because you slap familiar names on characters, places, items, events, etc. doesn't mean they ARE these things if the cannon/story/development is not there to back it up. I could type out so many instances of this in the Bayverse, my fingers would probably start bleeding so I'll limit to a few very obvious examples to drive my point:


The Matrix of Leadersip not residing in Optimus' superstructure - he is not a Prime without it and would, in fact, still be Orion Pax.

Galvatron was created by a Steve Jobs-like character - he was created by Unicron.

The Allspark is a metaphysical, quasi-religous concept ... In Bayverse it is crossed up with an energon cube and given a physical existence.

A red European sportscar alt-mode character is introduced in the Bayverse called "Dino" when it should have obviously been Sideswipe. And to further screw things up, Sideswipe is introduced in the next movie ... as a silver Corvette concept alt-mode?!?


I better stop wish I could insert a disappointed head shaking emoji here. Bumblebee, while somewhat shackled by the Bayverse (understandable that Paramount wouldn't want to make too large a leap away from Bayformers ... those movies did make a lot a dough for them), had no cannon abuse. Couple that approach with a good story, human and bot character development, generally well received critical and movie-goer acclaim, and of course those magnificent Cybertron scenes, why would anyone want to go back to the Bayverse? I REALLY don't get it.

Reboot and move on in the same vein as Bumblebee. If not your thing, you have hours and hours of Bayverse to relish.

Dinobot4ever wrote:

The Matrix of Leadersip not residing in Optimus' superstructure - he is not a Prime without it and would, in fact, still be Orion Pax.

Galvatron was created by a Steve Jobs-like character - he was created by Unicron.

The Allspark is a metaphysical, quasi-religous concept ... In Bayverse it is crossed up with an energon cube and given a physical existence.

A red European sportscar alt-mode character is introduced in the Bayverse called "Dino" when it should have obviously been Sideswipe. And to further screw things up, Sideswipe is introduced in the next movie ... as a silver Corvette concept alt-mode?!?

1. Animated proves you don't need a Mcguffin in order to be Prime.
2. Not the first time Galvatron was created by someone other than Unicron: IDW, Robots in Disguise, and the Unicron Trilogy are good examples.
3. ...Yeah I agree with you on this.
4. This sounds very nitpicky, but Sideswipe was introduced into the Bayverse before Dino, and also it's not the first (and I doubt it'll be the last) time Sideswipe wasn't red.

Just because it wasn't like the source material doesnt mean it's stupid. I could see a good story where humans being their typical idiotc selves accidentally upgrading Megatron's corpse into Galvatron. Now don't get me wrong, the Bayverse has hundreds of thousands of flaws; but it's still Transformers. Just a very very flawed version, like if Carnage in C Minor was the best thing to happen to Transformers kind of flawed.

Animated used the movieverse version of the All spark. As per Galvaltron, there's actually more instances at this point of Galvaltron not being made by unicron. BWII also has a galvy that isn't made of Unicron and isn't megs upgraded.

As for the matrix, IDW did it differently as well.

Also the 07 movie was never a live action G1, it was ir's own thing, same as rid 2000,the unicron trilogy, animated, Prime, Cyberverse etc

I reiterate:

Sabrblade wrote:But it's still not MY Transformers! It's still not catering to MY very specific narrow-minded tastes and opinions! If it isn't EXACTLY like how things were back when I was 5 years old, then it SUUUUCKS!!!

*sigh*

Count me as one of the people who was hoping the movie franchise would go purely in a direction more like Bumblebee from here on, but if they can somehow manage to make a direct sequel to TLK that avoids the biggest problems with Bay's five films (not just nonsense plot and stereotypes and sexism and whatnot, but the fact that almost every character was either a completely unlikable asshole or just not a character at all, and just overall the movies' uncomfortable meanspiritedness) while still tying together stuff from all five movies, and either wrapping that series up well or setting it in its own new direction that still holds those five movies in its core while remedying the problems, I'll absolutely applaud them.

Ironhidensh wrote:

Burn wrote:

SkyFire Prime wrote:This site seems to lean heavily into Bayverse support.

I think you're confusing "site" with "member base" and you're still wrong.

He obviously wasn't here during the lead up to the first movie, remember those swell times?

I'm just glad I wasn't Admin at the time.

I'm glad there is going to be a sequel to TLK. Just to not end the series in a cliffhanger...

The thing that bothers me the most, is the love that everyone profess to G1 and the hate they have to the movies.
"In the movies characters appears in the sequel without reason, explanation or presentation"
Yeah, same as G1 did, only between movies there are time gaps not "present" in the cartoon but somehow those characters appear suddenly in an episode and everyone acting like he was there since the start and is accepted.
"The continuity is all wrong, there are contradictions everywhere"
Unlike G1 right? The constructicons were created on Earth as new decepticons, but somehow they were friends with Omega Supreme 10 million years earlier.
"Characters are stupid, and make moronic things just because or to advance the plot"
They have been at war thousands of years, but somehow, Soundwave still can decieve the autobots by transforming into a street lamp or his boombox mode.
The autobots put lab coats on, and somehow the Decepticons think they are humans until the last moment.
Wheeljack creates the dinobots and deliverately make them stupid

I won't follow, to not make the post longer.
Are the movies good? Not really
Are they horrible creations that need to be erased from earth? No, there are lots of movies that are worse or that have entries that destroy the entire franchise

I'm not saying they're horrible creations that need to be erased from earth, because there's a movie for everyone. I'm just saying there's little heart and character development in those movies. Bumblebee is supposed to be the most human character with the most heart, just like in the cartoons. That's why many people love and relate to Bumblebee so much. It just wasn't portrayed in the past few movies. The movie Bumblebee is really the first time we get to know Bumblebee as a character.

Dinobot4ever wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Dinobot4ever wrote:

TulioDude wrote:But didnt we get the information before,that the Bumbleebee movie would be a soft reboot and would be used as a base for future films?
I think we should wait for more info.

We did as a major news release ...

https://www.yahoo.com/amphtml/movies/bu ... 39482.html

The info out of this interview is certainly confusing. Larry “D” strikes again.

Oh come on Dinobot, not you too. Did you even read that article before posting it? As it turns out, there is no quote saying it is a reboot. There isnt even a quote
And yet the article wrote a clickbait title like that and people just blindly passed it along without realizing they were propogating fake news brought about by piss poor journalism.

The misinformation from those articles was started by TFW, who are currently not newsing this new Bonaventura interview. I guess because that would mean they wrote a BS article all along which spread to major news outlets, and no one wants to admit that.

Will, no need to be insulting, my friend. Yes, I did read the article. And there is a quote from Hasbro ... ‘officially declared as a new storytelling universe’. Call that a reboot (hard, soft, something in between), refresh, reimagining, retooling, … whatever, Bumblebee is something cinematically and very largely substantively different than the Bayverse. A rose is a rose is a rose.

As to the TFW article being bogus, are there any vidoes of that panel available? I would be keenly interested in seeing it, so I can hear, with my own ears, what was said. If there was a misquote, I'll yield and be highly disappointed for the live action franchise moving forward. Any kind of continuation of the Bayverse will heavily cripple future storytelling and most likely mean the franchise will financially come to a quick halt. TLK was a big warning of that end ...

Hey man, thanks for the reply and I didnt mean to be insulting. That article just ticks me off as a (fan website) journalist because it really reeks of clickbait. Sadly, there is no recording, but even if there was and we heard something along the lines of what was written, I still wouldnt feel comfortable declaring a reboot to anything for a few reasons. The first being that the word reboot was not said and the second being that the toy department at Hasbro (where this supposedly came from) is not involved with the films. Misquoting the toy department and newsing their words as facts has happened before and already lead to misinformation: https://news.tfw2005.com/2018/02/18/joh ... ure-359410

All I am saying is that if any of us want the truth, then why dont we look to the people who actually made the film? I know why of course, its because many like you are sick of Bayverse so when everyone involved with the film's scripting states that Bee is part of Bayverse (including the director or producer), we would rather not pay it any mind. Basically, this is a big case of confirmation bias. Those who want to hear Bee is a prequel and will lead to a reboot hear that and those who dont will hear the opposite. I am just here to discern the facts. And when it comes to what was said at Toyfair, there is no actual quote. What the article you posted quotes TFW, not Hasbro (with no mention of who even said anything, which is essential for a quote) and TFW doesnt even provide a quote themselves. Just words they inferred and words that no one can corroborate. People were at Toyfair (friends of mine) and did not hear what could be inferred to as a reboot. Because trust me, if they did, then we would have that quote and have made a nice news story for you all Anyways, you dont have to trust me, others who attended the same talk at Toyfair have stated that they cant corroborate what TFW wrote: https://www.tfw2005.com/boards/threads/ ... t-16694316

But like I said, doesnt really matter either way since I would look more towards what people involved with the films would have to say since that's the primary source.

And thats all besides the point because I think the bayverse as we once knew it is dead. And by that I mean films made by Bay. Bumblebee proved that a film within this movieverse does not have to reek of Bay (even though it is literally a Bay film, as shown boldly in the ending credits). Sure Bee had that Bay face and there was the military involved and lots of humans but it had heart and character and fun clear action scenes. I think we will get more of that. And in the end, thats all anyone wanted. We dont need a reboot to get away from bay, we just dont need Bay And Bumblebee proved all that. So with this lesson learnt for Paramount, I think we can be optimistic about the future.

Take care all!

SkyFire Prime wrote:

steals_your_goats wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:As usual, Bay haters conveniently forget that the Bayverse put back transformers in the mainstream and brought in a whole new generation of fans. Even geewun veterans like me, who gave up on transformers in 1988.

We can appreciate what the movies did for the franchise and still think that they're all piles of steaming hot garbage (except Bumblebee). The two aren't mutually exclusive.

The Truth!

So true!

william-james88 wrote:

Dinobot4ever wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Dinobot4ever wrote:

TulioDude wrote:But didnt we get the information before,that the Bumbleebee movie would be a soft reboot and would be used as a base for future films?
I think we should wait for more info.

We did as a major news release ...

https://www.yahoo.com/amphtml/movies/bu ... 39482.html

The info out of this interview is certainly confusing. Larry “D” strikes again.

Oh come on Dinobot, not you too. Did you even read that article before posting it? As it turns out, there is no quote saying it is a reboot. There isnt even a quote
And yet the article wrote a clickbait title like that and people just blindly passed it along without realizing they were propogating fake news brought about by piss poor journalism.

The misinformation from those articles was started by TFW, who are currently not newsing this new Bonaventura interview. I guess because that would mean they wrote a BS article all along which spread to major news outlets, and no one wants to admit that.

Will, no need to be insulting, my friend. Yes, I did read the article. And there is a quote from Hasbro ... ‘officially declared as a new storytelling universe’. Call that a reboot (hard, soft, something in between), refresh, reimagining, retooling, … whatever, Bumblebee is something cinematically and very largely substantively different than the Bayverse. A rose is a rose is a rose.

As to the TFW article being bogus, are there any vidoes of that panel available? I would be keenly interested in seeing it, so I can hear, with my own ears, what was said. If there was a misquote, I'll yield and be highly disappointed for the live action franchise moving forward. Any kind of continuation of the Bayverse will heavily cripple future storytelling and most likely mean the franchise will financially come to a quick halt. TLK was a big warning of that end ...

Hey man, thanks for the reply and I didnt mean to be insulting. That article just ticks me off as a (fan website) journalist because it really reeks of clickbait. Sadly, there is no recording, but even if there was and we heard something along the lines of what was written, I still wouldnt feel comfortable declaring a reboot to anything for a few reasons. The first being that the word reboot was not said and the second being that the toy department at Hasbro (where this supposedly came from) is not involved with the films. Misquoting the toy department and newsing their words as facts has happened before and already lead to misinformation: https://news.tfw2005.com/2018/02/18/joh ... ure-359410

All I am saying is that if any of us want the truth, then why dont we look to the people who actually made the film? I know why of course, its because many like you are sick of Bayverse so when everyone involved with the film's scripting states that Bee is part of Bayverse (including the director or producer), we would rather not pay it any mind. Basically, this is a big case of confirmation bias. Those who want to hear Bee is a prequel and will lead to a reboot hear that and those who dont will hear the opposite. I am just here to discern the facts. And when it comes to what was said at Toyfair, there is no actual quote. What the article you posted quotes TFW, not Hasbro (with no mention of who even said anything, which is essential for a quote) and TFW doesnt even provide a quote themselves. Just words they inferred and words that no one can corroborate. People were at Toyfair (friends of mine) and did not hear what could be inferred to as a reboot. Because trust me, if they did, then we would have that quote and have made a nice news story for you all Anyways, you dont have to trust me, others who attended the same talk at Toyfair have stated that they cant corroborate what TFW wrote: https://www.tfw2005.com/boards/threads/ ... t-16694316

But like I said, doesnt really matter either way since I would look more towards what people involved with the films would have to say since that's the primary source.

And thats all besides the point because I think the bayverse as we once knew it is dead. And by that I mean films made by Bay. Bumblebee proved that a film within this movieverse does not have to reek of Bay (even though it is literally a Bay film, as shown boldly in the ending credits). Sure Bee had that Bay face and there was the military involved and lots of humans but it had heart and character and fun clear action scenes. I think we will get more of that. And in the end, thats all anyone wanted. We dont need a reboot to get away from bay, we just dont need Bay And Bumblebee proved all that. So with this lesson learnt for Paramount, I think we can be optimistic about the future.

Take care all!

Understand fully. When someone sullies your craft, profession, passion, etc., it gets you upset. Can't blame you there. I won't belabor the matter any more.

We are good, Will. We are of the same frame of mind, semantics aside. I genuinely hope better days are ahead for the live-action franchise because it has been tough to stomach prior to Bumblebee. I am optimistic but guardedly so.