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last time I checked -metal lasts longer than plastic. Re: G1 vs. modern.

I like G1 and modern toys, but I'm very picky on modern and mainly get leader class, MP, and occassionally smaller figs (dlx Warpath, cyberverse powerglide).

My gripe with both is the articulation. As sophisticated as the modern toys are - you still can't move the waists/torsos of many of the LC. Prime and Sentinel Prime namely. They'd be killer if they had that. Hasbro needs to work on incorporating this. At least with G1, you know you're not getting a lot of articulation off the bat. I think they do have a durability advantage partly because of this.

vectorA3 wrote:last time I checked -metal lasts longer than plastic. Re: G1 vs. modern.

Yes metal lasts longer, but it also sheds paint like crazy, due to the metal expanding and shrinking, in other words working, differently than the paint and therefore chipping it off.
Which is sad, since metal gives the toy a nice bit of heft and feel.

I like G1 and modern toys, but I'm very picky on modern and mainly get leader class, MP, and occassionally smaller figs (dlx Warpath, cyberverse powerglide).

My gripe with both is the articulation. As sophisticated as the modern toys are - you still can't move the waists/torsos of many of the LC. Prime and Sentinel Prime namely. They'd be killer if they had that. Hasbro needs to work on incorporating this. At least with G1, you know you're not getting a lot of articulation off the bat. I think they do have a durability advantage partly because of this.

Yea, I totally agree on the articulation here, that's why I'm not particularly fond of LC, due to the stupid electronics and other gimmicks getting in the way of the articulation.
But what is durability worth, if there is nothing to move and play with? It's kinda like a fat guy arguing that the T-shirt he can't wear, due to it being too small for him, is awesome due to the printed-on picture never washing out.

Dead Metal wrote:No not, really. The designs where made and then sent to Hasbro to be made into toys, all the toy designers did with the final designs was, to make slight revisions so that they work better as toys. For instance Animated Prowl, the toy designer asked the concept artist to put the wheels from the shoulders onto his legs because he had a great idea for a new transformations sequence.

And with the Movies in particular Hasbro just let them be fgor a long while and then turned concept art into toys.

But generally they only say "yes", "No", "kinda OK, but...."
While before, up to Cybertron, Hasbro designed the toys and the cartoon guys went and redesigned them to work better as cartoon characters.

I've read conflicting reports about just how much input the toy designers had and just when they get involved with the modern toys..

That's an urban legend

[quote="Dead Metal] You didn't anger me, I just wanted to show you why it's stupid to have a preference for something in particular over something else and trying to prove it with your own biassed opinions.[/quote]

Thanks for 'showing' me. I think what you're actually trying to say is that I'm biased, surely you wouldn't be saying it's stupid to have a preference for things, Who doesn't? BTW, there are levels of bias, hey, if you want to be open-minded or not, that's your own issue.

Two different time periods, two different crowds, different toy-making tech, you name it, the periods are different. I suspect you were probably born around 1990, which is fine, but it irks me to no end, the stalwarts who fail to have a bit of reverence for their forbears. What do you think the modern TF were inspired from?

It's irresponsible running around calling names, saying things are "stupid" or people are "too stupid", nobody will take you seriously if you can't sit still and interject yourself into everyone's comments, and since you will ultimately have an unshakeable need to have the last word, I guess we will all await your next installment of G1 hater.

Screamfleet wrote:See, at this point I may still agree with the sentiment that Marvel can do it and Transformers cannot. The Marvel characters are getting to be 50 years old soon.

WOT!!!!! Sorry, just couldn't let this one go - probably because back in 1984 I was 13 and I'm nowhere near 50 yet!

I've never personally met a G1 Hater, but there are plenty of people nowadays who only have the Michael Bay movies to reference from. So, I would imagine, based on the designs of the figures being vastly different from the bricky, boxy, blocky originals from 1984, recent TF fans may find older series and figures as archaic and cheesy. If said newer fans care to explore the past, I think they'd appreciate the older stuff as the foundation of something that's grown into what it is today.

I would say a G1 hater would be a person who only knows the MB movies and TF Prime and who doesn't care enough to find out where this all started by going back and giving the past a chance. Which is fine. They will never know what they're missing.

cagey wrote:

Dead Metal] You didn't anger me, I just wanted to show you why it's stupid to have a preference for something in particular over something else and trying to prove it with your own biassed opinions.[/quote]

Thanks for 'showing' me. I think what you're actually trying to say is that I'm biased, surely you wouldn't be saying it's stupid to have a preference for things, Who doesn't? BTW, there are levels of bias, hey, if you want to be open-minded or not, that's your own issue.

Two different time periods, two different crowds, different toy-making tech, you name it, the periods are different. I suspect you were probably born around 1990, which is fine, but it irks me to no end, the stalwarts who fail to have a bit of reverence for their forbears. What do you think the modern TF were inspired from?

It's irresponsible running around calling names, saying things are "stupid" or people are "too stupid", nobody will take you seriously if you can't sit still and interject yourself into everyone's comments, and since you will ultimately have an unshakeable need to have the last word, I guess we will all await your next installment of G1 hater. [/quote]

lol, how about you go read my first post, where I acknowledge all the points from this post, but since you seem to be unable to click a simple link:

[quote="Dead Metal wrote:I'm one, kinda.

I grew up with G1 and loved it, I still like the characters and concepts and designs but I just grew up to dislike the following:
the toys
the original comics

Don't get me wrong, I still like the cartoon, mostly due to my nostalgia towards it, and I do understand and respect everything G1 for what it is and having started it all, but I just can't stand the old toys and the comics.
I recently got out my reissues and the few originals I still have and just looked at them questioning why I didn't just throw them away or why I bought the reissues in the first place instead of better, more modern toys which are cheaper anyway.
Comics wise (G1), I never liked them I've tried getting into them a couple of times but never managed to really enjoy myself while reading them or even care enough to read following issues.

G1 really only has nostalgic and "historic" value for me any more, for instance I would prefer it that HasTak would stop reissuing G1 toys and just focus on making better modern representations of the characters.

I always burst out laughing when someone mentions that G1 (as in 80s comics, cartoon, toys) is superior and made with more love than things like Beast Wars, Prime, Movies, Animated etc....


It's kinda odd really, but I guess I just grew out of it now.

Hope that helped, if you still can't read it, ask someone to read it to you and explain what the words mean.
And that's it really, that is all I have to say on this topic.

Stormer wrote:

Screamfleet wrote:See, at this point I may still agree with the sentiment that Marvel can do it and Transformers cannot. The Marvel characters are getting to be 50 years old soon.

WOT!!!!! Sorry, just couldn't let this one go - probably because back in 1984 I was 13 and I'm nowhere near 50 yet!

He said Marvel comics characters are near 50 years old....not TF characters.

WOT!!!!! Sorry, just couldn't let this one go - probably because back in 1984 I was 13 and I'm nowhere near 50 yet!

I made no comments about TF fans ages. You're mixed up with what I said, calm down and read it again.

I just thought of something that may be in line with this. There is that new Resuce Bots cartoon coming. So, what if it is also part of the Aligned continuity? I mean, the description for it states that the Rescue Bots are a team of four who have been assigned by Optimus Prime to combat lesser threats such as "floods, fires, and everything in between." That means that they are a secondary group operating under Optimus' authority, but not directly under him. So, if the Rescue Bots are a different branch from Team Prime stationed elsewhere, then that would make two consecutive series in the same continuity dealing with two different protagonist teams airing side by side each other.

See, at the same time, Marvel has their own younger kids show too. The Super Hero Squad. Which has all kinds of heroes. They're not excluding those that are on the Avengers cartoon. It shows, that Marvel is not concerned with having multiple continuities. It is hopeful that they're doing rescue bots and maybe it could lead to two young adult TV shows, as well as the younger kids show. Like I said though, hasbro has to show interest in doing it, and so far, they seem not to be.
It's funny though, Iron Man is on like, 4 different cartoons these days. I certainly don't want to see the same for optimus prime.

Screamfleet wrote:

WOT!!!!! Sorry, just couldn't let this one go - probably because back in 1984 I was 13 and I'm nowhere near 50 yet!

I made no comments about TF fans ages. You're mixed up with what I said, calm down and read it again.

Oh, please! Just because you can't see my facial expressions over a post doesn't mean I'm really mad! I was just poking at you! I guess the whimsically offensive sentence just wasn't clear enough for me - thanks for setting me straight. After all, I'm old...

Dang, some crowds are just so darn sensitive these days...

Stormer wrote:

Screamfleet wrote:See, at this point I may still agree with the sentiment that Marvel can do it and Transformers cannot. The Marvel characters are getting to be 50 years old soon.

WOT!!!!! Sorry, just couldn't let this one go - probably because back in 1984 I was 13 and I'm nowhere near 50 yet!

I've never personally met a G1 Hater, but there are plenty of people nowadays who only have the Michael Bay movies to reference from. So, I would imagine, based on the designs of the figures being vastly different from the bricky, boxy, blocky originals from 1984, recent TF fans may find older series and figures as archaic and cheesy. If said newer fans care to explore the past, I think they'd appreciate the older stuff as the foundation of something that's grown into what it is today.

I would say a G1 hater would be a person who only knows the MB movies and TF Prime and who doesn't care enough to find out where this all started by going back and giving the past a chance. Which is fine. They will never know what they're missing.

^This.

Oh, please! Just because you can't see my facial expressions over a post doesn't mean I'm really mad! I was just poking at you! I guess the whimsically offensive sentence just wasn't clear enough for me - thanks for setting me straight. After all, I'm old...

Dang, some crowds are just so darn sensitive these days...

Well, you did leave a facial expression in your post. One of these guys . It seemed like a "hey I'm upset" post. I don't know who I'd offend. I mean, is peter parker going to start posting here that I'm talking about his age? It's funny though, you're still coming off as upset, maybe you're not, but, I know old people tend to get grouchy easily. You read what I said wrong, it seems like you're still reading it wrong too. You were the one coming of as sensitive, I mean...you really are. You jump to saying how you're not near 50. Which really baffled me, I'm referring to fictional characters. Maybe you are a fictional character, in which case...well, I apologize. If anything, that seemed like a freudian slip on your part that you are sensitive about your age.

Screamfleet wrote:

Oh, please! Just because you can't see my facial expressions over a post doesn't mean I'm really mad! I was just poking at you! I guess the whimsically offensive sentence just wasn't clear enough for me - thanks for setting me straight. After all, I'm old...

Dang, some crowds are just so darn sensitive these days...

Well, you did leave a facial expression in your post. One of these guys . It seemed like a "hey I'm upset" post. I don't know who I'd offend. I mean, is peter parker going to start posting here that I'm talking about his age? It's funny though, you're still coming off as upset, maybe you're not, but, I know old people tend to get grouchy easily. You read what I said wrong, it seems like you're still reading it wrong too. You were the one coming of as sensitive, I mean...you really are. You jump to saying how you're not near 50. Which really baffled me, I'm referring to fictional characters. Maybe you are a fictional character, in which case...well, I apologize. If anything, that seemed like a freudian slip on your part that you are sensitive about your age.

I'm really not mad, and not that I've read the your post a little more closely (the eyes are getting a little bad these days...) I understand what it was saying. It was my poor attempt at humor. Plus, did you see that I posted other stuff too? I actually included a post subject reply. That was supposed to be the segway between me being pretend mad and getting down the the subject at hand. The only Seibertronian I've been real mad at is Shadowman....and even he's forgiven!

I thought about being sensitive about my age. Maybe, I'm turning 40 next Friday. I don't feel that age, I'm in pretty good shape, I got carded for booze the other day, and I got only one gray hair that stands on the top my head and waves at passersby...There's no way that I'm gonna be depressed about my age, and if disappointment slips out once in a while during a failed attempt at humor, well, point it out so I can be better.

Now, you just have to watch out for those really grouchy old people who really were 13 years old when Peter Parker first started snapping pictures!

I think we're both being tongue in cheek now and we're on the same page. It's just alarming to see someone seemingly get upset over something I didn't say, but we worked it out old timer.

Stormer, happy birthday in advance, I'm closing in on you! The gym is what keeps me young, I have a lot more aches & pains than in my 20s.

cagey wrote:Stormer, happy birthday in advance, I'm closing in on you! The gym is what keeps me young, I have a lot more aches & pains than in my 20s.

Awww, thanks! I agree - going to the gym or just going out for a walk around the neighborhood is a great way to stay young! I love hiking too, and with the snow piling up in the surrounding mountains, gonna be time to break out the snowshoes!

Screamfleet wrote:I think we're both being tongue in cheek now and we're on the same page. It's just alarming to see someone seemingly get upset over something I didn't say, but we worked it out old timer.

Yep! We're good!

Stormer wrote:

cagey wrote:Stormer, happy birthday in advance, I'm closing in on you! The gym is what keeps me young, I have a lot more aches & pains than in my 20s.

Awww, thanks! I agree - going to the gym or just going out for a walk around the neighborhood is a great way to stay young! I love hiking too, and with the snow piling up in the surrounding mountains, gonna be time to break out the snowshoes!

Screamfleet wrote:I think we're both being tongue in cheek now and we're on the same page. It's just alarming to see someone seemingly get upset over something I didn't say, but we worked it out old timer.

Yep! We're good!

OK, I have to ask...have you noticed that as the years go by and you spend more time on this site that you feel like the one Transformer that you relate to more than any other is Kup? Not poking fun seeing as how I'm in the same boat age-wise as you are but just saying that I seem to be experiencing this particular thing happening to me and was wondering if it was just me or if maybe I found someone I could commiserate with.

Anywho...as to the subject of G1 haters, as folks before me have mentioned it is likely the younger crowd that came in long after G1 times that is most likely to dislike everything about G1. My oldest boy used to have quite the fascination with it but that wore off fast. He's part of the "high-tech, instant gratification, no respect whatsoever for anything that came before" generation and therefore anything like the G1 toys, cartoons and comics that doesn't have the cool designs, massive amounts of articulation or most jaw dropping, realistic appearance is deemed crap and of absolutely no use to him and has no right to even exist. The number of kids today that think along these lines is just appalling but if you want to find your true "G1 Haters", that's the place to find them. Turbo revvin' young punks is what they are...

Do there exist G1 haters?

Yes. Their names are Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, and Michael Bay.

Haha. Word.

Should we throw Ehren Kruger in there too?

cotss2012 wrote:

Do there exist G1 haters?

Yes. Their names are Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, and Michael Bay.

Okay, I laughed.

T-Macksimus wrote:OK, I have to ask...have you noticed that as the years go by and you spend more time on this site that you feel like the one Transformer that you relate to more than any other is Kup? Not poking fun seeing as how I'm in the same boat age-wise as you are but just saying that I seem to be experiencing this particular thing happening to me and was wondering if it was just me or if maybe I found someone I could commiserate with.

That's great! I'm gonna start talking like Kup- maybe I'll even take up smoking cygars! But, yes, I'm thinking this is one and the same kind of experience. Just remember, if Kup is our mascot now, we gotta be tough just like him! There is no substitute for experience!

cotss2012 wrote:

Do there exist G1 haters?

Yes. Their names are Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, and Michael Bay.

That's really too bad, as we - collectively as Transformer fans - contributed to their wealth.

vectorA3 wrote:Haha. Word.

Should we throw Ehren Kruger in there too?

Kruger showed some respect for G1 by incorporating elements of "The Ultimate Doom", "City of Steel", and "Megatron's Master Plan" into the plot of DotM, so that it almost actually felt like a Transformers movie. He also got rid of the Jar-Jar Twins, which by itself absolves him of any sins that he may have committed. I'm letting him off the hook - for now.

cotss2012 wrote:

Do there exist G1 haters?

Yes. Their names are Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, and Michael Bay.

My opinion below,i state nothing as fact.

If anyone is the G-1 MORE haters,It's all the IDW TF Comics writters minus Simon furman.

At the very least robert,alex & micheal made billions for the TF francise & bought in newer fans/viewers/money. they made transformers more popular & helped hasbro sell more TF toys.


S
P
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S
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Please don't read further if you don't want to be spoiled.

In issue #30 of the TF G-1 Ongoing by IDW,They killed off 3 faction leaders who fans/hasbro regards as Stars of the francise. in one singular issue #30,galvatron,megatron & optimus prime got killed. they probably won't be in any 2012 TF IDW G-1 on-going comics,maybe in flash backs but not in present time.

IDW,Also made bumblebee the autobot supreme faction leader in the TF G-1 On-going comic.

Galvatron & megatron are 2 different persona's/sparks/beings.

Goldbug & bumblebee are not the same persona/spark. similar to megatron & galvatron their different beings/sparks/persona's.

IMHO,The Chaos saga was pure garbage. it looks like it was written by a 5 year old or by those TFCC comic book writters.

Worst of all,in issue #29 of the TF G-1 On-going. the earth bound decepticons appear on cybertron out of the blue. later it's explained when megatron got his new body,the decepticons built a space bridge inside his body. that space bridge in megatron's body is how the earth bound decepticons arrived on cybertron.

Currently issue #31 of the IDW TF G-1 on-going refers to optimus prime as dead. even though it's extremly clear optimus used the matrix to defeat the D-VOID & pushed him back to where the D-void came from. then optimus followed the D-void to his home & killed him with the matrix of leadership. SO OPTIMUS IS CLEARLY "MIA" not dead.

I find it kinda funny/ironic ironhide refers to megatron as MIA but optimus he refers to as dead. it was abundantly clear Megatron got a huge blast thrown at him by the Deceptigod & megatron got vaporized into dust.

I just can't get to excited about the 2012 IDW TF G-1 On-going Comic year. as three faction leaders are gone. bumblebee is in command of the autobots.

At best i'm looking forward to simon furman's Re-generation TF comic book series that will consist of 80.5 thru 100 comic issues.

Tidalwavex wrote:in one singular issue #30,galvatron,megatron & optimus prime got killed.

Well, yeah. Optimus has to die every few years. It's an unwritten franchise law.

Tidalwavex wrote:IDW,Also made bumblebee the autobot supreme faction leader

Quit screwing with us. Who's really Prime now?

cotss2012 wrote:

Tidalwavex wrote:in one singular issue #30,galvatron,megatron & optimus prime got killed.

Well, yeah. Optimus has to die every few years. It's an unwritten franchise law.

Tidalwavex wrote:IDW,Also made bumblebee the autobot supreme faction leader

Quit screwing with us. Who's really Prime now?

Alfred E. Neuman.