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It's no secret that I despise all of the IDW comics. I have feelings of disgust and hatred for all of their titles. Even Deviations was a massive letdown because the dialogue was off and the characters were way out of character. I post what I don't like about a certain book and then people choose to comment about me, saying stuff like "you haven't liked anything since '84!" and "stop reading!" or "They're not for you!" Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Well, here's what I would do if I had the Transformers license. You can comment on my ideas or post your own because IMO anything is better than what IDW is squelching out now.

Most Transformers would speak and act exactly as they did on the G1 cartoon, Dreamwave managed to pull this off very well, so it works. Some exceptions would be Mirage, who in my world would be a snob and much more of a deserter than a traitor. Mirage's "high priced friends" would be Autobot's like Tracks or the famous architech Grapple. Mirage would consider Autobots like Sunstreaker to be "new money" types that made their fortunes in the pits and wasted most of it in the Energon bars and Auto spas. Mirage's cloaking ability would be the result of a very expensive upgrade he purchased when he had no choice but to fight to survive as the war escalated. Bluestreak, who because of his Tech Specs courage rating of 2, would secretly be a coward leaving his fellow Autobots to get scrapped because he was scared to shoot or too nervous to enter the battle at all.

The Quintessons would be the creators of the Transformers. The Quints sold the Decepticon military line to alien warlords who desired warriors who transformed into Jets and Tanks, or spies and assassins who could disguise themselves as inanimate objects. The Quintessons marketed the Autobots as mostly cars you could drive around inside of,and who could transform into a bodygaurd to protect you if needed. Autobots built to mimic inanimate objects served as hidden bodyguards. Like the Decepticons, they also had the ability to shrink down small enough to a size where they could be carried in a pouch. Decepticon cars served as "curbside assassins" who would either lay in wait for their targets, or were built to resemble their targets' transports for purposes of abduction. Some customers desired Transformers with a more feminine design, which is the reason why female Transformers exist and why there are so few of them. Autobots like Hot Rod or Orion Pax would be attracted to them without knowing why. Factories would continue to produce new Autobots and Decepticons long after the Quintessons were driven off because no Transformer knew how to create another Transformer from scratch. They only knew how to upgrade and remold the Quints designs. During the great war, Transformer assembly plants were important military objectives to either be captured or destroyed. Some were relocated underground or off planet. A pass key like the Creation Matrix would have to be obtained to operate one.

There would be two main titles. The first title would start in 1984 and feature the '84 and '85 characters with the Aerialbots, Stunticons and Combaticons added in as the series progresses (i'll get to the Protectobots later). The Autobots and humans would be the permanent underdogs against the might of the Decepticons. Air warriors would be used to swell the ranks of the Decepticons. Megatron's primary objective would be to convert Earth's resources into Energon to power his army, most of whom previously had to be put in stasis until a new source of energy could be found. Victories would be far and few, with the Autobots grateful for just being able to prevent the Decepticons from getting what they wanted, or surviving against them. Since the series would start in '84, Soundwave and his cassettes alt modes would not have to be changed or explained. The writer would be free to progress the story months or years ahead if they wished, with the human characters aging appropriately.

The second title would take place hundreds of years from now and star most of the '86-'91 characters. The Autobots will have mostly won control of the Earth, but lost Cybertron and the rest of the universe to the Decepticons. The whereabouts and final fates of the characters of the first title would be known to the stars of the second, but just not known to us, the readers. We would see older versions of surviving characters like Grimlock who would be wiser, or more efficient and deadly like the Combaticons. It would be fun to see a newer group like the Protectobots outfitted with futuristic (to us) alt modes and sent off to face a battle tested group like the Combaticons who will have had centuries more experience fighting on Earth as a unit. Hot Rod (or Rodimus) Ultra Magnus, Kup, Arcee etc. could travel from Cybertron to Nebulos and beyond fighting or liberating worlds from Decepticon control. They would occasionally draw the attention of the Decepticon elite, consisting of Galvatron, Cyclonus and Scourge. Starscream would be a ghost who disrupts plans and generally irritates Galvatron.

1984forever wrote:Most Transformers would speak and act exactly as they did on the G1 cartoon

This is where I stopped reading. Any reasons you may have to support this idea are invalid, in my opinion, thus a waste of time to read. Reason being, you're trying to force 1 form of media to conform to another. It just won't work. The G1 cartoon was a 22 minute toy commercial. It had very light, if any, story structure, and rarely did 1 facet of a story go from 1 episode to the next. I'm not counting 2-parters or 3-parters here. The comics, especially the Marvel comics after Simon Furman took it over, were a concise series of interlocking stories that carried through multi-issue arcs. Bob Budiansky did it well, but Furman did it better. The cartoon writers couldn't even sniff that kind of depth. Not necessarily because they didn't have the talent, but because how the structure of the media was set up. There is no way a comic story could be comprehensible if it was in the format of the cartoon. A page, even a panel, of a comic can project and communicate much more than a piece of a cartoon episode of the equal amount, whatever that is.

Your hatred of IDW is understood, I felt the same way for a long, LONG time. I refused to read IDW for 7 years, until I picked up issue 81 of Regeneration One. After Regen was finished, with mixed reults for me, I decided to give a shot to More Than Meets The Eye, a comic I heard nothing but good things about. The fact that Rodimus was the main character certainly helped. I was not disappointed. The MTMTE comic is great, though not as good as the original Marvel comic. If it was a just a bit faster-paced, it would be on par. I haven't tried any other current or past titles from IDW, but once MTMTE is done, (supposed to go to 100 issues?) I will probably pick up the companion series as well. I'm not interested in Windblade or RiD or the other newer stuff. I might pick up AHM after I get the other series finished. But I'm not a fan of IDW in general either, it's sub-par compared to Marvel, and even Dreamwave. I was a huge fan of the Dreamwave titles, I had them all. Today I still have War Within and Armada, but none of the others. I'm planning on reacquiring the 6-issue G1 stories. But just because IDW isn't as good as what came before it, doesn't mean it's bad. And remember, it's just your and my opinion. Most fans love the IDW stuff.

I also agree with those who say "It's not for you" and "Stop reading" if you don't like it. That's exactly what you should do. If something is not to your taste, why keep eating it? Is it because there's no alternative? There aren't other companies publishing TF comics, as far as I know. Nonetheless, if you don't like it, just stay away from it, plain and simple. If you had thoroughly read them and kept disliking them, why keep reading them? I understand wanting to give a story or even a publisher more than 1 or 2 chances, but IDW has been in business since 2005, and they've put out a lot of stuff. You should know by now what you're getting.

As for "Nothing's been good since 1984" I hope you're not serious about that. I prefer G1 comics over any other comics, but that doesn't mean I'm totally closed-minded to what we have now. Like I said, I was. I wouldn't pick up IDW until 2012, because back in 2005 I did pick up an IDW title and I hated it. So I just didn't bother with time and money on it. I don't regret it, because the only things I like so far both started in 2012, but maybe I'll like something that was published earlier.

Bottom line, you're free to like whatever you want, but if you keep being disappointed by a certain product, stop consuming that product. "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result each time." I'm not sure if that phrase has any exceptions, but it seems that to you IDW isn't one. So just stop reading it and move on. Yes, it's unfortunate that we have no other option, but that's the way it is.

And one last thing: in my opnion, the Primus origin story from the Marvel comics is much more intriguing than the Quintesson origin from the cartoon. When AoE seemed to introduce creator characters seemingly similar to the Quints, the Bayverse movies became a total disaster for me. Until then, I was still willing to get through the crap parts of the previous films because there were enough other parts I enjoyed. But if the Quintessons become the creators in Bayverse going forward, then all the future live action movies and their writers can go f**k themselves.

^

You stopped reading at the second paragraph but somehow you know what is contained in the third paragraph?

Secondly, the Quintesson origin is much more original than the "Primus is the name of my god!" origin. There are plenty of other franchises where a God or gods created living beings, Primus weakens the entire Transformers franchise by not only watering down it's originality, but muddying up the original origin story. I don't need my Transformers to have Gods, or Knights for that matter, to be able to relate to them.

1984forever wrote:You stopped reading at the second paragraph but somehow you know what is contained in the third paragraph?

I managed to catch the word "Quintesson" as I scrolled down to the reply button. I knew where it was going.

Secondly, the Quintesson origin is much more original than the "Primus is the name of my god!" origin. There are plenty of other franchises where a God or gods created living beings, Primus weakens the entire Transformers franchise by not only watering down it's originality, but muddying up the original origin story. I don't need my Transformers to have Gods, or Knights for that matter, to be able to relate to them.

That's fine, it's your opinion. We both have ours and mine is different than yours.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

1984forever wrote:You stopped reading at the second paragraph but somehow you know what is contained in the third paragraph?

I managed to catch the word "Quintesson" as I scrolled down to the reply button. I knew where it was going.

Secondly, the Quintesson origin is much more original than the "Primus is the name of my god!" origin. There are plenty of other franchises where a God or gods created living beings, Primus weakens the entire Transformers franchise by not only watering down it's originality, but muddying up the original origin story. I don't need my Transformers to have Gods, or Knights for that matter, to be able to relate to them.

That's fine, it's your opinion. We both have ours and mine is different than yours.

yup. I realized this morning that "Naturally occurring gears and levers" is the original origin. But it was so terrible that Marvel had to retcon it. Too bad it doesn't make the Quintesson story the original origin by default.

1984forever wrote:I realized this morning that "Naturally occurring gears and levers" is the original origin. But it was so terrible that Marvel had to retcon it. Too bad it doesn't make the Quintesson story the original origin by default.

Yeah, that started it all. That's how they originally presented the story, but it was never specified that the Transformers evolved into that. But I don't think the revelation of Primus was necessarily a retcon. Later the story delved further into the Transformers' creation, revealing that Cybertron was actually a living body of Primus, and the Transformers race was born right out of that body.

Real talk, you have some awesome ideas in there. I especially like your idea for the "86-91" title or however it's best phrased. If done right, that could be a really interesting way to approach an alternate timeline and flesh out some of those G1 characters that got in too late for the cartoon's glory days or too early for the deeper Furman Marvel arcs.

ScottyP wrote:Real talk, you have some awesome ideas in there. I especially like your idea for the "86-91" title or however it's best phrased. If done right, that could be a really interesting way to approach an alternate timeline and flesh out some of those G1 characters that got in too late for the cartoon's glory days or too early for the deeper Furman Marvel arcs.

G1 had too many characters for one book, or show. Putting old favorites in one title, and underused or unknown characters in the other would appeal to a wider range of fans. Because of the Transformers long function cycles, a younger Ultra Magnus would not be barred from the '84 title, and an older Cliffjumper could appear in the '86-'91 book for more character interaction. I also think that Beast Wars should have their own title set even further into the future (or past) instead of everything being mashed together.

Okay, so basically you want dreamwave 2.0 ? Also why, in your version of the comic, couldn't mirage just be how he was in the cartoon...like everything else you're suggesting. Also the autobots outnumbered the decepticons, after all good guys sell a lot better than baddies.

What you suggest wouldn't be for me, but I wouldn't stop other people from reading it, it could be a fun miniseries for idw, as long as it didn't take the spotlight away from their universe.

You would probably hate my ideas, as I'm not one to stick to the past, preferring to constantly strive for the future.

Oh and it turns out that there is precedence for gears occurring naturally in nature. As an insect actually has parts of its body shaped like gears to help it jump long distances. It's called the issus and it's a plant hopper insect. Google search the pictures, as they are quite spectacular.

ZeroWolf wrote:Okay, so basically you want dreamwave 2.0 ? Also why, in your version of the comic, couldn't mirage just be how he was in the cartoon...like everything else you're suggesting. Also the autobots outnumbered the decepticons, after all good guys sell a lot better than baddies.

What you suggest wouldn't be for me, but I wouldn't stop other people from reading it, it could be a fun miniseries for idw, as long as it didn't take the spotlight away from their universe.

You would probably hate my ideas, as I'm not one to stick to the past, preferring to constantly strive for the future.

Oh and it turns out that there is precedence for gears occurring naturally in nature. As an insect actually has parts of its body shaped like gears to help it jump long distances. It's called the issus and it's a plant hopper insect. Google search the pictures, as they are quite spectacular.

Draemwave 2.0? Exactly! There is a lot of unused potential in those old tech specs for characters like Mirage.

I always wanted to see more interaction between characters based on how their tech specs said they would act. For instance, I think Autobots like Cliffjumper, Sideswipe, Sunstreaker and almost all the Dinobots would get pretty restless on the Ark. They would probably start a fight club right under old Ironhide's olfactory sensors. Jazz would know about it, but wouldn't say anything. Ratchet would wonder why he is patching up 'bots when no battles are occuring. Smokescreen would convince one of the combatants to throw a fight, and make a ton of profit for himself before Prowl busted up the whole thing. Heck, Smokescreen would be the one to tip Prowl off!

Mindwipe likes to talk to the dead right? Imagine the mayhem that would ensue if he decided to hold a seance in the middle of a fight on an old Cybertronian battlefield? Things could go wrong, the disgruntled spirits of Autobots could come back and tell Ultra Magnus that they thought the Autobot cause was complete rubbish. Decepticon poltergeist would twist Autobots into wrecks and scare the lubricants out of anyone with a specs rating low in courage, all while Perceptor or Brainstorm struggle to find a scientific explanation for the whole thing.

The point of me writing all this is that there is a lot of story potential right in the tech specs! So i don't understand why we get stories like "what if Bumblebee ruled Cybertron?" Or "what if Megatron joined the Autobots?" These stories are out of character and completely out of left field.

And yes, I know about the Grasshopper.

We get those stories because they are new unbroken ground. Taking characters new directions and allowing them to evolve.

I don't see why your ideas can exist side by side. Everyone gets what they want then

ZeroWolf wrote:We get those stories because they are new unbroken ground. Taking characters new directions and allowing them to evolve.

I don't see why your ideas can exist side by side. Everyone gets what they want then

My ideas couldn't exist as a mini series because IDW would turn it into a murderfest like Deviations or Regeneration one. That's just what they do with alternate universes.

The whole Autobot Megatron VS the DJD could have still happened in much the same way had Megatron been replaced with Thundercracker. It would have been even more believable because Thundercracker's crimes aren't as severe as Megatron's, and Thundercracker's defection would have been in character. In RiD any other Decepticon looking to hide out, adopt a dog and write screenplays could have taken his place. There are no shortage of traitors in the Decepticon army.

Breaking new ground is nice, but there was already so many things in the TF universe that could have been fleshed out. IMO IDWs decision to kill Ramjet and Thrust and bring them back as Gundam is not as interesting as having them as guards at the smelting pool along with Dirge. The reader could have got a look at the day to day operations of the smelting pool. I know Dirge would have been in 7th heaven.

Wherever IDW stationed Straxus is also not as interesting as having him at the pool. What would Straxus do if Shockwave came and demanded he turn over his prisoners for lab experimentation? Hubcap could have been one of those prisoners. As a communications officer he could have found a way to broadcast the horrors of Shockwave's labs to the other Autobots. How would a lab assistant like Nacelle feel about the atrocities being committed there? Etc.

I'm just disappointed in how IDW goes for unnecessary arcs like "Dark Cybertron" where the whole universe is at stake. There are more character driven stories to be told.

This stories are what the writers wished to tell, just as these are the stories you wish to tell. Though these ones seem less cartoon and more marvel run.

Have there been blunders with idw of course, look at all hail megatron and how they worked combiner wars. But then again they haven't gone bankrupt so they have that in their favour

ZeroWolf wrote:This stories are what the writers wished to tell, just as these are the stories you wish to tell. Though these ones seem less cartoon and more marvel run.

Have there been blunders with idw of course, look at all hail megatron and how they worked combiner wars. But then again they haven't gone bankrupt so they have that in their favour

Dreamwave did a pretty good job of mashing together cartoon, toy and comic. I liked it.

IDW on the other hand extinguishes sparks before we even get a chance to enjoy the character. Most of the Technobots and Blot are dead and I just don't see how their deaths add anything to the comics.

I don't remember blot dying Last I saw him it was in the wind blade miniseries.

You have a point about death but I do prefer things where death means death but I'm just waiting for idw to announce the return of bumblebee

ZeroWolf wrote:I don't remember blot dying Last I saw him it was in the wind blade miniseries.

You have a point about death but I do prefer things where death means death but I'm just waiting for idw to announce the return of bumblebee

I'm hearing that both Triggerhappy and Blot were slain together by Arcee in the same book. Too much death to keep up with.

It's a war, they're not going to live forever.

I never understood how robots that were still mostly intact were kicking the bucket.

I liked a lot of your ideas 1984forever. It seems to me the writers at IDW sometimes have a little to much carte blanche with world building, character and plot development. Then Hasbro co opts the story to promote a new line and makes things worse. The way you would like to adhere to what has been historically documented in tech specs and character profiles seems reasonable and probably preferable to some in the fandom.

Sometimes I believe the writers tweak and change the characters so much that they are no longer recognizable to G1 fans. Remember what Optimus was like in the cartoon and the marvel comics? Is he anything like that now? He's been turned into a scared little wu$$ compared to the guy that attacked a Decepticon fortress to obtain combiner technology.

Who the heck does the IDW Optimus appeal to now?

I actually like what they are doing with optimus right now also which universe did they storm a decepticon fortress as I don't recall that in the g1 cartoon (which was standard Saturday morning fare) or the marvel comic.

Also a lot of fans on here are quite happy with idw efforts. Besides which it could always be worse.

ZeroWolf wrote:I actually like what they are doing with optimus right now also which universe did they storm a decepticon fortress as I don't recall that in the g1 cartoon (which was standard Saturday morning fare) or the marvel comic.

Also a lot of fans on here are quite happy with idw efforts. Besides which it could always be worse.

Marvel TF #19. We'll have to disagree about Optimus. But, just to add a little perspective, My Little Pony is selling better than MTMTE.

misfire19d wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:I actually like what they are doing with optimus right now also which universe did they storm a decepticon fortress as I don't recall that in the g1 cartoon (which was standard Saturday morning fare) or the marvel comic.

Also a lot of fans on here are quite happy with idw efforts. Besides which it could always be worse.

Marvel TF #19. We'll have to disagree about Optimus. But, just to add a little perspective, My Little Pony is selling better than MTMTE.

Rather than 'adding perspective', youre further obfuscating the issue.

MLP is one of IDWs best selling comics, dude. If it were a comic no one cared about, then you would have a point, but its one of IDWs best sellers because theres hundreds of thousands of Bronies willing to purchase it.

When the comic was newer and there were more Bronies, around 2013 I think, IDW's MLP comic was in the top 100 best selling comics in the states for a few months, which I don't think any TF comic has done at least since the 80s, if ever.

The only comics that do better for IDW are TV associated stuff like Orphan Black and such.

So saying "But, just to add a little perspective, My Little Pony is selling better than MTMTE." means absolutely nothing, because if you havnt noticed, if you exclude people who only like the Michael Bay films, there are probably more Bronies than TF fans, and the comic is selling very well because of that. Oh and there are probably at least a few little girls who read it too.

Considering that most of IDWs comics don't sell as well as MLP, I don't understand how 'selling less than MLP' is a bad thing when its got so much company like G I Joe and Ninja Turtles (I havnt actually checked how well that one sells so I may be wrong on that one, but im pretty sure MLP sells more than that too).

Anyway, to go back to 1984Forevers posts, realize that most people in the mainstream dont give a damn about G1, while MTMTE has attracted at least some outside attention from people who are not already TF fans.

Does anyone here really expect a G1 Sunbow fanwank comic to sell well in todays market? Not even all Transformers fans would be interested in what 1984forever is saying. Among other things, what he is proposing means no beasts

What 1984forever is proposing would only interest him and the ever decreasing number of GWUNers, im afraid.

By the way, I do have a question. Does anyone know where I can find out how well the old Dreamwave comics sold? Would be nice to compare that to MTMTE's numbers

Some how I'm not surprised, as my little pony has taken on a new life in its current incarnation. Which by the by, is nothing like it's old self, which works against your argument of being closer to the past.

But that is something I have trouble understanding, why do some people want more of the same, why they want the past instead of moving forward, and embracing the new status quo.

ZeroWolf wrote:Some how I'm not surprised, as my little pony has taken on a new life in its current incarnation. Which by the by, is nothing like it's old self, which works against your argument of being closer to the past.

But that is something I have trouble understanding, why do some people want more of the same, why they want the past instead of moving forward, and embracing the new status quo.

I would embrace the new stuff if I felt it was better than what came before. There was a time when I thought that MTMTE were the best comics I had ever read, even though it didn't really feel like Transformers. After that I got my hands on a full set of Dreamwave G1 and hated MTMTE ever since. With the exception of the 1st story arc, I felt DW pretty much nailed it.

Ah, I see what I'm arguing against now. Well, people that say "newer is better" is trying to sell you something. I'm not interested. DW Transformers (vol 2, armada and RI cover) sales was around 180K issues a month in 2002. MTMTE hard copy sales was 8500 in February. There's no possible universe in which eComic sales make up the difference. Go ahead and add your My Little Pony sales too if you wish.

MTMTE is dangerously close to the sales number G.I. Joe v Transformers was when it was cancelled. Right now I believe it is being kept afloat by superb art, a good writing style and a relatively small group of loyal and zealous readers.

I don't believe Roberts knows how to write good battle scenes involving tactics, strategy and grit. The same goes for Barber. He's got Optimus flying around the planet recycling water bottles and handing out iPads. The Decepticons are now living on a hippie commune.

I'll just go ahead and say it. It's time to bring back Furman and his crew. They are a big reason why we still have Transformers around today.