Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

News Credits: 2 · by **Stumpybot** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:43 pm

screw it, they look cool. Pre-ordered. fingers crossed they dont get held up at customs like my last BBTS package.

Got 2 of the Crossfire kits arriving this week, soon as they get sold on ebay i can actually afford these. Must be karma

by **dirkmagirk1** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:52 pm

i cant believe this thing is only 12.6 in long and 7.5in high...how tall is his alt mode? (i will also go halves on one of these, but also only want the green one)

News Credits: 5749 · by **El Duque** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 1:15 pm

Mkall wrote:If someone only wants the Prime and wants to split the set, I only want th egreen one.

Wanna go halfsies?

Same here, if anyone just wants the red and blue version I'd be willing to split a set.

News Credits: 1 · by **Sodan-1** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 2:49 pm

Let's think this through as if we were Xovergen. This is there first product to be mass produced, so they need it to make money. How better to do that than make people buy two of them. This is pretty extreme, and has solidified my decision to not get them.

News Credits: 3 · by **Torneira** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 2:51 pm

I was just about to have a look at Kapow Toys, since I got their email stating that they have it for pre-order on their site also, just when I saw the price here mentioned to be $ 180 ???????

What the... my wallet is like Megatron being sucked by Unicron into oblivion!

For that money I would rather order another MP Rodimus at Robotkingdom! Or the new 2010 Reissue of Prime, but no way I am ever going to pay up that price what they are asking!

News Credits: 5 · by **--B--** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 3:05 pm

Counterpunch wrote:What a joke.

And not even a funny one. I hope they are only going to produce as many sets as there are pre-orders, cause at that price they are not going to sell too many after that. That would be crazy even for an established company like FP.

by **starboykb** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 3:47 pm

Wow! Skip for better 3rd party toys and save for others.

Website · by **RK_Striker_JK_5** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 3:49 pm

I was gonna get one... but not now. As Counterpunch said, what a joke. And it's on them, too. Come on Protector.

News Credits: 402 · by **Mkall** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:30 pm

Let's remember that this is BBTS's decision to sell them as a pair, not XOvergen.

Lay the blame where it should be

News Credits: 3 · by **Midnight_Fox** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:44 pm

I find it funny that BBTS is worried about favourites(seemingly regarding people getting traditional over the green) and yet most of the requests for going halfsies in this thread seems to be people wanting the green and not red/blue.

Also, preordered mine(green for me, R/B for my old roomie).

News Credits: 5 · by **alexison** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:02 pm

Well thank you BBTS. Now I can't buy one even if I wanted.

News Credits: 1235 · by **LOST Cybertronian** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:05 pm

This is so tempting but I think I will have to wait for a review first.

by **moneycon** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:28 pm

That's just not going to work....it's a set up for failure...if I were xovirgin :grin:

I'd make sure bbts was happy selling them separate.

News Credits: 9 · by **Editor** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 8:22 pm

Midnight_Fox wrote:I find it funny that BBTS is worried about favourites(seemingly regarding people getting traditional over the green) and yet most of the requests for going halfsies in this thread seems to be people wanting the green and not red/blue.

I have a feeling if they sold them on their own that they would be moving numbers closer to equal than they think.

News Credits: 1452 · by **Blurrz** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 9:03 pm

Sadly, you've got to pay to play, and when it comes to third party figures making their own toys, this price is just the premium. Why is Xovergen being bashed, when let's say.. FansProject's Defender is 90+, iGear's Arcee is over a hundy, the aforementioned Impossible Toy Arcee mold is $70 and that's shoddy in size. MMC's stuff ranges in the $90, and people are sucking up HeadRobot's and CrazyDevy's small add-ons for #30. Look, ****'s not going to change overnight. A third party's out to make profit, and especially when one's new on the scene, they need to make $$$ so the rest of the projects can be funded.

Through some drama in the MMC corporation, Xovergen was created. Needless to say, Xovergen's products are going to be top quality. Having talked several times with people who've actually seen STCP in person, it's the robot mode is the size of Classics Prime, and the trailer makes it even a bit bigger.

Some give the demeanor on other third parties as "Oh but they should be more like FansProject!" - Bullfricking crap. FansProject took 2-3 years to establish themselves and they weren't perfect with half of their products being released. A rookie QB isn't going to win the Superbowl. A first time third party isn't going to make Transforming gold. Be patient.

If you're on the fence with this figure, just wait a bit. It's not going to go anywhere soon, you'll get alot of insight from fellow collectors who are nabbing this, and you might run into a sale down the road.

News Credits: 9 · by **Editor** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 9:21 pm

To be fair Blurrz,

I doubt many would really balk at the price, personally I have no issue dropping $90-odd for this guy. The issue is more that BBTS isn't giving the option for buying a single piece and many don't want or need both editions.

In my case I like the "Joe" one and would go for it simply on the fact I'm in the small group that would welcome a split Joe/TF line. On the other hand, the "prime" version just doesn't come off as interesting enough to warrant buying both.

by **Court Jester** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 11:25 pm

So the target audience is the Scrooge McDuck money pit swimming niche market... hmm, maybe after I'm done eradicating world hunger. Until then, a major goes without saying...

News Credits: 34 · by **Supreme Convoy** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 1:03 am

I'll have to wait to see the individual green figure go on sale.

News Credits: 5749 · by **El Duque** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:47 am

amcgrath929 wrote:Well thank you BBTS. Now I can't buy one even if I wanted.

I guess you can also thank Robot Kingdom since they are also only selling them as a set.

by **dirkmagirk1** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 7:52 am

yeah its not bbts or robot kingdom its definately xovergen.. so now if people buy the set put OP on ebay eventually the individual price of the green one will shoot up... but then again people can make optimus a custom nemesis prime repaint :-?

....

News Credits: 125 · by **Counterpunch** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:02 am

Blurrz wrote:Sadly, you've got to pay to play, and when it comes to third party figures making their own toys, this price is just the premium. Why is Xovergen being bashed, when let's say.. FansProject's Defender is 90+, iGear's Arcee is over a hundy, the aforementioned Impossible Toy Arcee mold is $70 and that's shoddy in size. MMC's stuff ranges in the $90, and people are sucking up HeadRobot's and CrazyDevy's small add-ons for #30. Look, ****'s not going to change overnight. A third party's out to make profit, and especially when one's new on the scene, they need to make $$$ so the rest of the projects can be funded.

Through some drama in the MMC corporation, Xovergen was created. Needless to say, Xovergen's products are going to be top quality. Having talked several times with people who've actually seen STCP in person, it's the robot mode is the size of Classics Prime, and the trailer makes it even a bit bigger.

Some give the demeanor on other third parties as "Oh but they should be more like FansProject!" - Bullfricking crap. FansProject took 2-3 years to establish themselves and they weren't perfect with half of their products being released. A rookie QB isn't going to win the Superbowl. A first time third party isn't going to make Transforming gold. Be patient.

If you're on the fence with this figure, just wait a bit. It's not going to go anywhere soon, you'll get alot of insight from fellow collectors who are nabbing this, and you might run into a sale down the road.

Pay to play is a phrase that I have long been a supporter of. I think it's the truth.

I think though, that things have changed over the past two years and it simply can't be a blanket defense anymore. The whole reason that phrase came around was because of the truly limited nature of certain collectables that were limited because of their intent...one time productions at BotCon, limited promotions in Japan, figures long gone from the public eye.

It was never meant to be a justification for the bar to be set high in the first place. It was more of a kick in the ass to avoid waiting for those high prices to come around.

The community and collectors do not need to support the research and development costs of small toy companies. This holds especially true for their first release or so when we have no idea if they will provide good or responsible product.

The issue becomes more complicated when we start to learn more about this 3rd party market and its practices. That iGear Arcee? It’s a $55 toy. iGear has set its price higher. That’s fine, that’s their decision. But it should make you look at this stuff a bit harder. Why are you paying $100+ for the iGear Arcee when FansProject can provide Explorer for $55? Pay for quality, pay for truly limited availability, and question when it appears you are paying a flat mark-up.

We don’t know what we’re paying for with this Tactical Commander figure. It’s asking a very high entry price to the ‘Uncertainty Ride’. Factor in that the market is probably one or two figures away from being completely flooded with questionably high-end 3rd party transformer toys and ask yourself if there’s really any chance that limited availability is going to strike. It’s not like these companies who produce these toys for around $20 a pop, sell them to retailers for $50 a pop, which then turn around and sell them to you for $100+ a pop have any reason to not go back to the well of money.

So, I think the asking price of $180 for a set of these things, with limited pictures, no history to back them up, is a bit much. I think the market for high end TF Collectable stuff is due for a hard correction soon. There is too much, at too significant a cost, in too short a time for it to sustain itself. Factor in that Has/Tak has been doing some active undercutting of these companies (look at Classics Wreck-Gar) and I have a suspicion that the 3rd party fad is going to shake the money tree too hard this coming year.

News Credits: 5 · by **zodconvoy** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:14 am

Counterpunch wrote:So, I think the asking price of $180 for a set of these things, with limited pictures, no history to back them up, is a bit much. I think the market for high end TF Collectable stuff is due for a hard correction soon. There is too much, at too significant a cost, in too short a time for it to sustain itself. Factor in that Has/Tak has been doing some active undercutting of these companies (look at Classics Wreck-Gar) and I have a suspicion that the 3rd party fad is going to shake the money tree too hard this coming year.

Sadly, I have to agree with you. This ridiculously priced forced two pack appears to have crossed the line for me. It's well known that I'm both an Optimus Prime and 3rd Party collector but there's nothing here. It's based on a rejected Don Figueroa sketch of Optimus crossed with G.I.Joes Rolling Thunder whipped together to look like neither. The pics show you nothing of the robot mode capabilities other than its shoulders can slump forward slightly and it can stand. Great. And it ships in the next 2 weeks so everybody who wants it suddenly has to scrounge up a spare $200 at Christmas time.

I do also have to agree that this may be the final year of the large 3rd Party bubble. I'm a massive proponent of Fans Project but for the upcoming year they have shown me nothing I'm interested in. What we've seen of Causailty, the Shadow Scythe, the blacked out images of Glacialbot, none of it seems worth buying. iGear has the unused Alternator Bumblebee coming up. Huge surprise they're stealing an actual Has/Tak design again. I bought the Drift kit from Master Collector just before Hasbro announced they had Drift coming up so when MC came out with a kit for Wheeljack I passed. I was fine with E Downshift and Hasbro was probably going to make one anyway and lo and behold! It should be in our hands before Easter. Plus as a fandom we are getting very picky. You can't go into a thread and mention the Protector without people who haven't seen it in person harping about its neck. Would it even have been an issue as few as 2 years ago? I don't think so.

Basically, the 3rd Party company as a concept may be on it's last legs. The rising prices, the variety of random things available, the fact that Hasbro is actually giving us what we want for now. Hell, Hasbro putting out their own official G1 Arcee would render a half dozen kits from the past decade useless. I just hope we get the Fans Project notBroadside first.

Of course, I could be wrong.

by **moneycon** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:28 am

$90 absolutely, $180.00 no go.

by **trence5** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:27 pm

Hey look folks,

Sorry I'm late, but I have neeeeeever seen this one before so I gotta ask, is this "an" Optimus Prime?

If so he does look like that unused GI Joe vehicle/Optimus Prime mash-up Don Figueora created years ago

Website · by **Flux Convoy** » Wed Dec 15, 2010 4:50 am

FP didn't take years to ramp up. They made a few quality items before people really latched onto them with City Commander. Not fighting or arguing, just stating facts. By the by, this isn't just BBTS selling as a set, it's Robot Kingdom as well. So no, I don't believe it's BBTS mandating here. Being forced to buy a pair is rubbish. Paying to play doesn't really factor into it when you are forced to buy the item twice in only one deco you fancy. No one else has been that brazen thus far. Except perhaps Crazy Devy and their pricing madness.