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[AllNewSuperRobot]

As stated, I was three at the time and The Movie was that one film I would have put on multiple times a day and be thoroughly entertained.
I never saw The Movie as a "dark film" because even at 3, I appreciated they were robots and not real. If the deaths of Ironhide, Prowl etc were shown via people, even animated, it probably wouldn't have been released in the 80's.
I had a mental disconnect.
Naturally being that young is also why I don't hold Sunbow/Marvel G1 on a pedestal. Because I saw it retroactively much later as an adult, for what it is. As I've said elsewhere only the designs are worth acknowledgement today, the rest of the fiction at the time was just bad, even the toys.

Also the idea people have about popular to lesser characters is a false one. No one starts out as "popular". Some characters are pushed more than others, but they all debut at the same level. You make lesser characters popular by using them. If HasTak want to start a line using Slicer or Roadburner, promote them within the fiction. It's not rocket science...

[ZeroWolf]

I agree hence why I welcomed alpha bravo, off road and Rook with open arms as they were completely new and I thought they would be given spotlight in the comics...how wrong was I. The fan backlash was probably big enough to kill those ideas dead which is a shame as we need to go further with new characters.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

It's why sometimes 'fan reaction' should be ignored, as the short term thing it is. If you have a vision or direction you want to take a given series in, stick to your convictions. If a few fans don't like it, they can leave and be replaced by new fans who do. No one is irreplaceable, especially a fan base.

[ZeroWolf]

Again I agree, it's annoying that some can not be happy with the decision bit leave it at that while others take it to extreme lengths as though hasbro has a personal vendetta against them and their collecting styles. It sometimes comes up in the takara threads as well when talking about the different decos that get released for the toys.

[Rodimus Prime]

People have the right to their own opinions and personal views, especially when it comes to such things as fictional characters, regardless of whether others agree or not. And maybe the percentage of the fandom against those new characters was larger than the characters' supporters think, which is why those characters never got any further.

Unrelated question: why is G1 Megatron's helmet black in the comics and gray in the cartoon? Black looks much better. Is it to be toy-accurate?

[Jelze Bunnycat]

People have the right to their own opinions and personal views, especially when it comes to such things as fictional characters, regardless of whether others agree or not. And maybe the percentage of the fandom against those new characters was larger than the characters' supporters think, which is why those characters never got any further.

It's simple business, really. Everyone knows what happens when you alienate the fan majority, no matter the opinion. They want new characters? Stop rehashing the older ones. They want the older ones? Don't introduce (too many) new ones. It just makes sense. We had plenty of new characters in the 2010 lines with the likes of Tomahawk and Hailstorm, but they never stuck.

Unrelated question: why is G1 Megatron's helmet black in the comics and gray in the cartoon? Black looks much better. Is it to be toy-accurate?

Not quite. Some of the models were derived from prototype images. In the case of Megatron, that's the origin of his vertical barrel, and the different black helmet for the Marvel comics and the first toy commercials.

Microman Toy Catalogs courtesy of the Pre-Transformers Page.

He's in the 1983 ones, 10th down.

[Rodimus Prime]

In the case of Megatron, that's the origin of his vertical barrel, and the different black helmet for the Marvel comics and the first toy commercials.

So then why didn't they keep his helmet black in the cartoon?

[ZeroWolf]

Might have thought the Grey looked better or the toy had been finalised with the helmet being grey so the cartoon was changed accordingly. My question is why they changed the colours on ultra magnus I thought the powered convoy deco was much better

[Rodimus Prime]

My question is why they changed the colours on ultra magnus I thought the powered convoy deco was much better

I think it's because they wanted fans to associate Magnus with Prime, and he was red, white and blue.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

Again I agree, it's annoying that some can not be happy with the decision bit leave it at that while others take it to extreme lengths as though hasbro has a personal vendetta against them and their collecting styles. It sometimes comes up in the takara threads as well when talking about the different decos that get released for the toys.

It's like a friend once said to me, "Don't argue with a Fanboy, lest you become a Fanboy and there is nothing worse or more toxic than that."

Unrelated question: why is G1 Megatron's helmet black in the comics and gray in the cartoon? Black looks much better. Is it to be toy-accurate?

Connotation. Given the Cartoon was internationally sold, perhaps the colour change was to avoid obvious real world comparisons. Given its shape and what Megatron represents, with a black colour scheme comparisons could be drawn to a Kaiser Helmet.

In which case, the cartoon would be heavily censored to appear in Europe.

[Rodimus Prime]

But that's exactly what it was modeled after. Even his alternate mode was a German gun. But maybe that wasn't made clear in the cartoon? The comic and the toy definitely specified it. On the other hand, I understand why it would have been censored in Europe if it was made clear what Megatron was based on.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

But that's exactly what it was modeled after. Even his alternate mode was a German gun. But maybe that wasn't made clear in the cartoon? The comic and the toy definitely specified it. On the other hand, I understand why it would have been censored in Europe if it was made clear what Megatron was based on.

Also depends how the comic and toy bio were translated long term in Europe too. I suppose being the same grey as the rest of him, the assumption could be that it was just the shape of his head and not specifically a helmet?

[Rodimus Prime]

I suppose being the same grey as the rest of him, the assumption could be that it was just the shape of his head and not specifically a helmet?

You know I thought that when I was younger and started to read the comics, ironically. Even with the helmet being a different color. Then in issue 25 of the US Marvel comics, "Gone But Not Forgotten," Razorclaw rips the side of the helmet in the fight between Megatron and the Predacons and that's when it became clear that he had a helmet. So when I finally saw the cartoon years later, I just looked at it as a helmet. But I agree that it being the same color as his face and upper body makes it less obvious that it's a helmet.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

I suppose being the same grey as the rest of him, the assumption could be that it was just the shape of his head and not specifically a helmet?

You know I thought that when I was younger and started to read the comics, ironically. Even with the helmet being a different color. Then in issue 25 of the US Marvel comics, "Gone But Not Forgotten," the Razorclaw rips the side of the helmet in the fight between Megatron and the Predacons and that's when it became clear that he had a helmet. So when I finally saw the cartoon years later, I just looked at it as a helmet. But I agree that it being the same color as his face and upper body makes it less obvious that it's a helmet.

To be honest, I never gave it much thought when I was younger. I mean I only really took notice of Galvatron in G1, as he interested me more than any Megatron. I am 99% that, in his case, it's just his head shape and not head + helmet.
Really it wasn't until I read Megatron: Origin and the 'Fan Reveal' moment, that I thought "oh? it's a helmet". Not that IDWverse ever did anything with that revelation, nor address what purpose it was supposed to serve?

[Rodimus Prime]

Really it wasn't until I read Megatron: Origin and the 'Fan Reveal' moment, that I thought "oh? it's a helmet". Not that IDWverse ever did anything with that revelation, nor address what purpose it was supposed to serve?

IDW drops the ball on a lot of stuff, especially when that hack James Roberts is the writer.

As for Galvatron, being the upgraded version of Megatron, I just figured his helmet was changed as well.

Here's one thing I never understood: why was Omega Supreme used seldomly in G1? Especially the comics? For the longest time he was the most powerful Autobot character aside from Prime, and he didn't get much screen time or page space.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

As for Galvatron, being the upgraded version of Megatron, I just figured his helmet was changed as well.

But has Galvatron ever taken it off?

Here's one thing I never understood: why was Omega Supreme used seldomly in G1? Especially the comics? For the longest time he was the most powerful Autobot character aside from Prime, and he didn't get much screen time or page space.

He is a character that I find is always a bit off within the narrative. He's not a Prime, a Magnus or a City Bot. In some continuities he is the last of an veritable army of literal WMDs.


..Then there's this
I think with him, as opposed to the usual "phase out an old toy", No one really knows what to do with him long term. He is probably the least fleshed out of the Super Robots and no one seems to want to change that, nor know how to?

[ZeroWolf]

About the head fans on megs I always took that to be a visual flourish by the artist as it's easily something that could have been added to fill a page or its something that Furman thought was cool (as he was the main writer at that point) as to why it was never brought up again..why would it? It was out if place then and I think they knew it was a one off.

Now omega, he's more interesting as again they made him too good in the cartoon so had to come up with reasons as why the Autobots couldn't just get him to do all the fighting for them, hence him breaking very easily or just being completely forgotten *which happened a lot to different G1 characters* I also wonder if this had something to do with the fact that he was from a different toy line originally.

As for omega in IDW I think he was dropped because there wasn't much else to do with him and bigger characters were coming like metroplex, so like the dead universe, he was phased out. Though given the call backs they are doing in the comics as of late, Omega could reappear.

Seriously though the best omega is still in Animated, and it's criminal that no toy was ever made.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

About the head fans on megs I always took that to be a visual flourish by the artist as it's easily something that could have been added to fill a page or its something that Furman thought was cool (as he was the main writer at that point) as to why it was never brought up again..why would it? It was out if place then and I think they knew it was a one off.

I always wondered what Furman was saying with it? Was he saying there was more than one Megatron? That the idea used for MTMTE Ultra Magnus existed here? That the helmet was a symbol/mantle passed down?? Certainly that idea would have been a more interesting one to pursue for Roberts and Barber than dismantling IDW Magnus...

I always despair when I see potentially thought provoking concepts explained away by their creators as "because it looked good".

Seriously though the best omega is still in Animated, and it's criminal that no toy was ever made.

Agreed. Probably one of the best 'reimagined' designs I've ever seen.

[ZeroWolf]

I never thought about megs helmet being like that, it would have been good if it was the case.

I mean imagine this scenario:

During chaos megs is killed off, and they left it there...now flash forward a year and have a named con (or a random one) get given a package and the final frame of the issue is them staring at the helmet of megatron, and all that it means. Flash forward a bit again and introduce everyone to the new megatron.

You could ask the following questions like: who decides who becomes the new megs, and why have they done this to keep the name alive? How many megatrons has there been? Does the helmet contain tech that overwrites the personality or does the new bearer of the name just try to act the same best way he can but allowing subtle differences.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

Following on further, "Megatron" as a mantle, could potentially be akin to a Pretender Shell. Host to multiple Decepticon Commanders across generations. Maintaining the illusion of The Mighty/Invincible Decepticon Leader, as an ever present threat.

Quick segue, Should Broadside be a Super Robot? EG the same size as Omega Supreme??

[ZeroWolf]

Given one of his alts, you would have thought so but he's not since for some reason they thought it best he be the same size as the other triple changers

[AllNewSuperRobot]

Given one of his alts, you would have thought so but he's not since for some reason they thought it best he be the same size as the other triple changers

But that's just it, he doesn't work on the standard Triple Changer scale. Too much of a size gap between his altmodes. That's why in every single Broadside toy, the jet mode is horrendous. If they officially made Broadside a Super Robot, they would have a lot more figure to be able to craft a decent Triple Changer from.

Imagine Tidal Wave's Carrier Mode with MP Star Saber's Jet Mode and a Bot Mode on par with a Gestalt.

[ZeroWolf]

Oh I agree completely, maybe who ever handles him next will make that move

[AllNewSuperRobot]

Oh I agree completely, maybe who ever handles him next will make that move

Indeed. Also to tie it back to what Rodimus was saying. Having another bot on that level could encourage writers etc to make better use of Omega Supreme. If nothing more than there would be someone on his level he could interact with.

[ZeroWolf]

That is also true though they could bring back the omega sentinel idea so there would be more of them, or make him a headmaster so tiny os can talk to the others on their level