Screamfleet wrote:Sentinel was clearly not out to kill optimus. He spared him once, and was sparing him again, he didn't outright kill him. He was certainly trying to incapacitate him. Removing a limb, not his head.
Red 50 wrote:The way I see it (Not that anyone cares, though) is this:Megatron offers truce to Optimus, but in term that he'll be the leader. That obviously doesn't equal with freedom for which Optimus stands for. So he delivers Megatron what he had coming for a long time. Megatron is caught off his guard by this and he doesn't have even a slightest chance. Then Optimus turns to disarmed Sentinel, his predecessor, his idol, his brother autobot, who had betrayed not only him, but all Autobots and what they stand for. And his act, which caused deaths of countless lives, including a brethren Autobot Ironhide, gets punished by Optimus, including Sentinels greatest error: in attempt to do what he thought was right, he became the very thing he fought against: a tyrannical Decepticon. And what he said:"Can't you see that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few!"
does not make his errors less forgivable.
Maybe Optimus could have done something different: he could have executed Sentinel mercifully, less painfully, but after Megatron had beat him to almost death, it would have made little difference.
PS: Spoilered just in case.
Shadowman wrote:I will put forth the theory that it was the internet itself trying to punch him in the face.
Cheesinator wrote:Everyone's saying "Megs can't be trusted, the truce was obviously a lie".
So why did he make a point to save Optimus, instead of letting Sentinel kill him, and then dispatch Sentinel?
Megatron beat me nearly to death in Mission City. I was willing to sacrifice myself and leave him unharmed.
Two years later, he tries to kill my human friend by planning on sawing his brains out, and when I saved the kid, Megatron ran his sword through me, front to back and proceeded to shoot my spark chamber clear out of my chest.
Near this same point in time, he does succeed in killing the kid, the kid comes back with the Matrix, saves me.
Two years later, here we are... Megatron's death squads are mass murdering Chicagoans by the thousands, perhaps even a million have died so far. This world and it's people have kept us and protected us, and now he slaughters those I hold most dear. He's destroyed two cities, a priceless monument, and now he offers me a truce where he'll be in command, while he stands over me with my arm missing and he has a loaded gun, which he's just used on his partner in crime, after being double crossed.
He will surely destroy this planet and all of it's people. He will enslave what's left, and that includes us Autobots. And when it's done, he'll turn his weapons on us once more, and we will meet our doom.
He mustn't be allowed to live. He must die, if we and this world are to survive.
I trusted him. He raised me up as though I were his very own. He showed me compassion, he instilled virtues in my upbringing as a person and a soldier. I was led to believe I could trust him. Explicitly.
He conned us. He knew where the Allspark was all along, while we starved and suffered. He wrecked our last chance at hope when he crashed the Ark on the Moon, and then put the humans at risk. (And all along, putting them at risk was his plan.)
He helped slaughter innocent and defenseless humans. Men, women and children. All of them without a hope, all of them without a voice, all of them in agony as they vaporize right before my eyes.
He justifies it with "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few". He's wrong. This time? The needs of the many are outweighed by the needs of the few, or the one.
He murdered my friend, in cold blood, execution style. He killed two of my soldiers. Boys who didn't have their heads on straight, but their hearts were big and made of gold, and he dispatched them with no mercy.
He has already betrayed me, he has already betrayed his partner in crime. I'm standing here bleeding, because he severed my arm from my body. I have wounds from dragging myself towards a weapon, while he savagely beat me. My only saving grace was a madman who's offer was peace through tyranny.
After all that's happened, after all this destruction, he lies there on the ground and pleads for mercy, when he's owed none. They say "Mercy is the mark of great man." Well, I I want to be the man who does the right thing. The right thing is to end this and save these people who've given us a home.
The traitor is dangerous, this must come to an end. His spark shall be extinguished.
Tekka wrote:I don't think anyone really disputes the reasons why Sentinel and Megatron got killed, since nobody's forgotten that they're EVIL, but the lame way in which the scene was put together makes for a "What the hell just happened?" feeling. That's what I've been able to glean so far, anyhow.
There's bound to be a little criticism on the actions taken when we're struggling to come to terms with Op's revised personality, sure, but the major problem I can see thus far is that once again it all boils down to lack of focus on the Transformers' characters.
In this fan's humble opinion, this is the single weakest point of all the movies, and the one that the majority of fan division stems from. You need only look at the colossal differences in the ways the comics and cartoons handle the focus on relationships and motivations of the Transformers in comparison to the movies to see why it polarizes the fan camps so much.
When it's this drastic a difference it's easy to forget that we all want and expect different things from our favourite giant robots, especially when it comes down to differences between those brought in by the new movies and those who were not.
5150 Cruiser wrote: As far as the whole Megan Fox issue, i don't see any stabs at her. Sam said she dumped him. How's that a stab?
Optimus Primevil wrote:5150 Cruiser wrote: As far as the whole Megan Fox issue, i don't see any stabs at her. Sam said she dumped him. How's that a stab?
not that it's a stab but it is kinda weak to say she just dumps him for no stated reason. at least this is one case that it would've been better to killed a character off.
Tekka wrote:I don't think anyone really disputes the reasons why Sentinel and Megatron got killed, since nobody's forgotten that they're EVIL, but the lame way in which the scene was put together makes for a "What the hell just happened?" feeling. That's what I've been able to glean so far, anyhow.
Bonecrusher27 wrote:Optimus Primevil wrote:5150 Cruiser wrote: As far as the whole Megan Fox issue, i don't see any stabs at her. Sam said she dumped him. How's that a stab?
not that it's a stab but it is kinda weak to say she just dumps him for no stated reason. at least this is one case that it would've been better to killed a character off.
Actually Sam says something to the effect of "left me for someone better". And later on, of Carly he says "I've finally found someone who loves me for me." or somesuch. That's dirt cast on memory of the Mikaela character. More directly at Megan Fox, did you notice that scene with at Sam's workplace where his boss is arguing with a Megan Fox-type character? Maybe it's just me, but that scene seems to be a direct thumbs down to Mega Fox.
bumble_bee_68 wrote:Don't really care about Megan Fox.
Get over it.
That ship has sailed.
I liked the new girl better
As for Megatron, even if he wanted a truce and helped Optimus out for a brief minute.
He was nothing but Sentinel's b**ch, anyway.
Pottermus_Prime wrote:
I really didnt like the new girl, its 1 of 2 things i didnt like about the movie, i think she was pretty darn poor, megan wasnt fantastic but she worked better imo.
Counterpunch wrote:Cheesinator wrote:Everyone's saying "Megs can't be trusted, the truce was obviously a lie".
So why did he make a point to save Optimus, instead of letting Sentinel kill him, and then dispatch Sentinel?
Because he couldn't.
Megatron was weakened to the point he could only help bring down Sentinel and then MAYBE beat a 50% Prime. Megatron cut his loses, pure and simple.
If Prime had agreed, I can 100% see Megatron shotgunning him in the back asap. Why not? He'd never have a better opportunity and without Prime, he could win that war right then and there.
Cheesinator wrote:
And that's the main issue with the final scene. Most people would have much preferred to see Megatron try to kill Optimus, which would make his subsequent death totally justified and pretty awesome. It would even have been fine for him to save Optimus purely to kill him by his own hands, but he doesn't even do that. He saved Prime's life to lay the groundworks for a truce, and Prime responds by ripping his spine out.
Cheesinator wrote:... I actually very much dislike that Megatron was suddenly being so level headed and reasonable in those final minutes (while in his intro, he seems to be trying to intimidate elephants), while Optimus went into some kinda bloodrage. The whole scene was messed up, IMO. Not just Optimus being overly violent.
Cheesinator wrote:You've misunderstood the issue so much I'm actually kinda impressed.
Everyone accepts Megatron should die. Only reason anyone was surprised is because the book ends differently. What people are annoyed about is that, with no build-up or anything, Megatron basically turns good at the end of the movie. Then, despite this, Optimus kills him in quite a brutal manner.
If Megatron had attacked Optimus, it would have been fine.
If Megatron had just randomly shown up after Optimus kills Sentinel, it would have been fine.
If killing Megatron served any sort of purpose beyond 'Optimus justice', it would have been fine
If Optimus had said a few lines about how Megatron can never be trusted, or something to that effect, it would have been fine.
Cheesinator wrote:You've misunderstood the issue so much I'm actually kinda impressed.
Everyone accepts Megatron should die. Only reason anyone was surprised is because the book ends differently. What people are annoyed about is that, with no build-up or anything, Megatron basically turns good at the end of the movie. Then, despite this, Optimus kills him in quite a brutal manner.
If Megatron had attacked Optimus, it would have been fine.
If Megatron had just randomly shown up after Optimus kills Sentinel, it would have been fine.
If killing Megatron served any sort of purpose beyond 'Optimus justice', it would have been fine
If Optimus had said a few lines about how Megatron can never be trusted, or something to that effect, it would have been fine.
As it is, Megatron goes out of his way to save Optimus' life, was not being aggressive in any way to Optimus, and was offering peace. Optimus' response was to rip his head off. That's what annoys some people.
I for one am more annoyed that Megatron did what he did at all. I'd rather he tried to kill Sentinel purely in order to have a shot at Optimus himself, and then Optimus goes all Sub-Zero on him.
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