Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby Sabrblade » Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:09 pm

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I could see Takara bookending the Trainbots with the two torso components, so Kaen might be saved for last.
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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby Emerje » Mon Oct 11, 2021 7:03 am

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Sabrblade wrote:I could see Takara bookending the Trainbots with the two torso components, so Kaen might be saved for last.

Agreed, make it impossible to combine until the end similar to how SS Devastator was done.

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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Mon Oct 11, 2021 1:18 pm

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Emerje wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:I could see Takara bookending the Trainbots with the two torso components, so Kaen might be saved for last.

Agreed, make it impossible to combine until the end similar to how SS Devastator was done.

Emerje


Interesting thoughts. Kaen is the last one if we're going by original ID numbers, with Shouki as the leader first:

C-125 Shouki
C-126 Getsuei
C-127 Yukikaze
C-128 Suiken
C-129 Seizan
C-130 Kaen

What's interesting is that the arms and legs are paired off: Getsuei and Yukikaze are legs, and Suiken and Seizan are arms. :-?
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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby Sabrblade » Mon Oct 11, 2021 1:22 pm

Motto: "Can't do a job halfway. What's worth doing is worth doing well, I say."
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ID order would be a good way to go. Really keep people anticipating the combination by releasing the upper torso and legs first (which can't combine with each other) before the arms and lower torso.
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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby o.supreme » Mon Oct 11, 2021 1:37 pm

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I don't know much about MP, other than that they are very expensive , and take a long time to develop. Looking at MP-53/54 and its variants, they are coming out around December, but Crosscut not until next June.

So, just for "what if" scenario it would be nice if they produced the arms, then legs together. If they ship together, that might be problematic price wise (has there ever been precedent for a MP 2-Pack, or any multipack?).

But if Shouki comes out June 2022. Lets say Getsuei & Yukikaze can be produced together (hopefully sold separately), and come out in December 2022. Then Suiken & Seizan for June 2023, and finally Kaen December 2023. Those like me that want Raiden are in for a 2 year commitment at minimum. It could be longer if they have to develop each arm and leg separately. But then again, the cost of this MPG might really hurt otherwise. I guess we are really all in it for the long haul! (no pun intended). Raiden is ultimately worth it, but this is definitely an argument against doing the majority of Combiners in MP scale.

Hopefully by the end of 2023 TT Selects, or another Haslab will offer a Generations style version of at least one other combiner on my want list.
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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Mon Oct 11, 2021 1:47 pm

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What does help is that G1 Getsuei and Yukikaze share transformation scheme, as do Suiken and Seizan. So each set of limbs can be designed as if they were pretools, which would cut down on development time. Both arms in one year, Both legs in the next, with the hips as the final piece. In a sense the limbs can be used as "padding" to make up for Kaen's longer development time.
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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby chuckdawg1999 » Mon Oct 11, 2021 7:44 pm

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Has anyone else seen the gif or something that makes a joke that Shouki is a heavy retool of Silverbolt?

Sabrblade wrote:
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Fingers crossed that if Raiden is successful enough. HasTak might turn their eye back on the only other train combiner team.
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Re: TakaraTomy's Mystery Raiden Project

Postby RK_Striker_JK_5 » Tue Oct 12, 2021 10:20 pm

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It looks cool... but I have no interest in the trainbots. Those who buy Raiden, I sincerely hope you love him. :)
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby TF-fan kev777 » Thu Oct 14, 2021 6:58 am

Looks like the price dropped a tiny bit more on Amazon.jp. I also think I might have an idea on the price weirdness and the differences Will, Emerje and I were seeing on the price.

I wonder if 1 or 2 things (or both) might be adding some tax for US customers.

First, I recall Trump installed some type of import tax for goods coming from Asia. I know it is affecting things made in China, but I'm not sure if something produced in Vietnam for a Japanese company might also get caught up in whatever tax requirements. That would potentially explain why Will is seeing no taxes and Emerje and I are.

I also wonder if for US sales tax purposes Amazon.jp is treated as an extension of Amazon and considered a company with a presence in the US that has to charge state sales taxes. That could explain why Emerje and I are getting different tax rates applied, about 4% for Emerje (Maine) and 9% for me (Illinois)
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby william-james88 » Thu Oct 14, 2021 5:46 pm

Motto: "'till All Are One"
TF-fan kev777 wrote:Looks like the price dropped a tiny bit more on Amazon.jp. I also think I might have an idea on the price weirdness and the differences Will, Emerje and I were seeing on the price.

I wonder if 1 or 2 things (or both) might be adding some tax for US customers.

First, I recall Trump installed some type of import tax for goods coming from Asia. I know it is affecting things made in China, but I'm not sure if something produced in Vietnam for a Japanese company might also get caught up in whatever tax requirements. That would potentially explain why Will is seeing no taxes and Emerje and I are.

I also wonder if for US sales tax purposes Amazon.jp is treated as an extension of Amazon and considered a company with a presence in the US that has to charge state sales taxes. That could explain why Emerje and I are getting different tax rates applied, about 4% for Emerje (Maine) and 9% for me (Illinois)


It's wierd that this tax is part of your toy's initial orice and notban added cost like shipping or duties is.
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby D-Maximal_Primal » Thu Oct 14, 2021 6:28 pm

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Saw a rumor that the combined mode will only be about a foot tall, in scale with CW regular sized combiners. If that really would be the case, I don't think I could justify the cost
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:17 pm

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D-Maximal_Primal wrote:Saw a rumor that the combined mode will only be about a foot tall, in scale with CW regular sized combiners. If that really would be the case, I don't think I could justify the cost


That would mean Shouki will be the size of a CW Deluxe Class figure. I quickly looked up the package size, W320×H120×D70mm or roughly W12.5" * H4.7" * D2.75" for you non-metric lot. This may mean he's packaged in train mode, so robot mode size is still up in the air. :lol:
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Thu Oct 14, 2021 10:06 pm

Motto: "Can't do a job halfway. What's worth doing is worth doing well, I say."
Weapon: Saber Blade
This pic shows Shouki to be around the height of the MP Autobot Cars:

Image
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby o.supreme » Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:27 pm

Motto: "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"
I saw the rumor about the Raiden height as well. I'm not sure. It may or may not be true. MP Prowl stands 6.5 inches or 16.5 centimeters. Which is also about the average height of a WFC Voyager. Older voyagers such as the UW Constructicons and PotP Predacons we're about an inch taller. But remember Predaking was only 5 bots, and came out the same size as Devastator due to integration leg extensions.

Raidens extra parts could bring him to the same height as UW/ CW Devastator, or perhaps slightly smaller, but I don't think it will look out of place.
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby Emerje » Fri Oct 15, 2021 12:29 am

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william-james88 wrote:
TF-fan kev777 wrote:Looks like the price dropped a tiny bit more on Amazon.jp. I also think I might have an idea on the price weirdness and the differences Will, Emerje and I were seeing on the price.

I wonder if 1 or 2 things (or both) might be adding some tax for US customers.

First, I recall Trump installed some type of import tax for goods coming from Asia. I know it is affecting things made in China, but I'm not sure if something produced in Vietnam for a Japanese company might also get caught up in whatever tax requirements. That would potentially explain why Will is seeing no taxes and Emerje and I are.

I also wonder if for US sales tax purposes Amazon.jp is treated as an extension of Amazon and considered a company with a presence in the US that has to charge state sales taxes. That could explain why Emerje and I are getting different tax rates applied, about 4% for Emerje (Maine) and 9% for me (Illinois)


It's wierd that this tax is part of your toy's initial orice and notban added cost like shipping or duties is.

Yeah it would be strange for them to charge my local sales tax (which is 5.5%, not 4%) as a hidden cost rather than an extra on the invoice.

About Raiden's size, we've seen rumors both ways about its size so I'll just wait until we hear something official. Shouki may fold in half to form the bulk of the torso, but he doesn't do it alone and the other bot also forms half the legs. I think there's still a good chance that Raiden will be closer to 18" than 12".

Also, when looking at the preview images I realized the silhouette image is just shadowed, not a true black silhouette which means invisible details should still be there. So I adjusted the colors and lighting and...

(click to enlarge)
Raiden adjusted.jpg

Image

Say hello to Raiden in (almost) all his glory. Shouki sitting on his chest was out of scale and I can't do anything about it, but we get a pretty clear look at his limbs this way. The arms are roughly half the bot thanks to the way they form and the upper legs are quite a bit shorter than on the original figure so maybe they are playing with the proportions to make a smaller bot?

Is it just me or do the hands look like they're actually integrated into the bot?

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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby TF-fan kev777 » Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:00 am

Okay, so more Amazon.jp price weirdness. I just checked this morning and I'm now only being charged 15888 JPY, so only 88 JPY in taxes, fees or whatever it is.

I guess it just takes them a bit more time to figure out things for US customers?
Last edited by TF-fan kev777 on Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby o.supreme » Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:40 am

Motto: "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"
Greetings, so I finally took the plunge and ordered from Amazon Japan. I noticed HLJ Pre-order price was about the same however, but I assume they add on shipping later? I had the item in my cart at HLJ, and it was till not adding shipping. If anyone has ordered from HLJ before and understands their system, any clarification would be appreciated. Thank you.
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby william-james88 » Fri Oct 15, 2021 11:36 am

Motto: "'till All Are One"
Emerje wrote:
william-james88 wrote:
TF-fan kev777 wrote:Looks like the price dropped a tiny bit more on Amazon.jp. I also think I might have an idea on the price weirdness and the differences Will, Emerje and I were seeing on the price.

I wonder if 1 or 2 things (or both) might be adding some tax for US customers.

First, I recall Trump installed some type of import tax for goods coming from Asia. I know it is affecting things made in China, but I'm not sure if something produced in Vietnam for a Japanese company might also get caught up in whatever tax requirements. That would potentially explain why Will is seeing no taxes and Emerje and I are.

I also wonder if for US sales tax purposes Amazon.jp is treated as an extension of Amazon and considered a company with a presence in the US that has to charge state sales taxes. That could explain why Emerje and I are getting different tax rates applied, about 4% for Emerje (Maine) and 9% for me (Illinois)


It's wierd that this tax is part of your toy's initial orice and notban added cost like shipping or duties is.

Yeah it would be strange for them to charge my local sales tax (which is 5.5%, not 4%) as a hidden cost rather than an extra on the invoice.

About Raiden's size, we've seen rumors both ways about its size so I'll just wait until we hear something official. Shouki may fold in half to form the bulk of the torso, but he doesn't do it alone and the other bot also forms half the legs. I think there's still a good chance that Raiden will be closer to 18" than 12".

Also, when looking at the preview images I realized the silhouette image is just shadowed, not a true black silhouette which means invisible details should still be there. So I adjusted the colors and lighting and...

(click to enlarge)
Raiden adjusted.jpg

Image

Say hello to Raiden in (almost) all his glory. Shouki sitting on his chest was out of scale and I can't do anything about it, but we get a pretty clear look at his limbs this way. The arms are roughly half the bot thanks to the way they form and the upper legs are quite a bit shorter than on the original figure so maybe they are playing with the proportions to make a smaller bot?

Is it just me or do the hands look like they're actually integrated into the bot?

Emerje


Someone did something similar but in the pic without the writing

Image

And yes, while the feet look like a mess they are accurate.
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby Emerje » Fri Oct 15, 2021 12:52 pm

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TF-fan kev777 wrote:Okay, so more Amazon.jp price weirdness. I just checked this morning and I'm now only being charged 15888 JPY, so only 88 JPY in taxes, fees or whatever it is.

I guess it just takes them a bit more time to figure out things for US customers?

Mine dropped to 15,412jpy bringing me to the $135 point. I had about $10 in points saved up so my current final prices is $145 after shipping.

o.supreme wrote:Greetings, so I finally took the plunge and ordered from Amazon Japan. I noticed HLJ Pre-order price was about the same however, but I assume they add on shipping later? I had the item in my cart at HLJ, and it was till not adding shipping. If anyone has ordered from HLJ before and understands their system, any clarification would be appreciated. Thank you.

Most Japanese shops wont tell you the cost of shipping until it's ready to ship, Amazon is the odd one out, probably because if the shipping ends up being higher than estimated they can easily absorb the cost.

william-james88 wrote:Someone did something similar but in the pic without the writing

And yes, while the feet look like a mess they are accurate.

Neat, hadn't seen that before. Is there another picture out there without the text and an oversized Shouki sitting on it? The "wings" on the feet look to be made up of the underside of the trains, you can see the tiny wheels on them. I wonder if they can be repositioned or removed all together?

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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby william-james88 » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:20 pm

Motto: "'till All Are One"
Emerje wrote:Neat, hadn't seen that before. Is there another picture out there without the text and an oversized Shouki sitting on it? The "wings" on the feet look to be made up of the underside of the trains, you can see the tiny wheels on them. I wonder if they can be repositioned or removed all together?


There is no darkened pic of him without an oversized Shouki.
As for the shipping, I think Amazon is big enough that they prepurchase shipping deals (kinda like futures) to ensure that the client is always made aware of shipping costs when they make a purchase.

Question regarding the character's name. The Katakana (at least through google translate from Amazon Japan) translates to Showki. So how come we call him Shouki instead?

And O.Supreme, there are more reasons to pick Amazon Japan even if it wasn't the best price. The returns are by far and large the easiest. Japnese sellers have indeed come through for me (happened with MP Dnobot which broke his head) but I had no guarantee. With Amazon, it is certain that they will come through for you as much as the US version would and returns are standardized.
Also, the shipping is second to none. I have consistently had the first reviews on the internet of the Beast Wars MPs, hence why the reviews for those toys are in house on Seibertron rather than us posting a youtube review. And I live at the other end of the world.
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby o.supreme » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:28 pm

Motto: "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"
All points are appreciated. Just to be clear, I was never against ordering from Amazon Japan (I order from Amazon.com all the time) It's just I wanted to do as much research as possible. New things are scary ;) . The order process was reassuringly easy, I cant wait to get the actual product next June.

william-james88 wrote:Question regarding the character's name. The Katakana (at least through google translate from Amazon Japan) translates to Showki. So how come we call him Shouki instead?



Mine actually translates it at "Shoki" :lol: . Transliteration from Japanese is difficult sometimes.

TFWikistates:

Though it is a little tricky to tell the true meaning of Shouki's name since it is "spelled" in phonetic katakana rather than kanji (鍾馗), it most likely comes from a mythological figure or a type of Japanese WWII fighter plane. Ask Vector Prime would make reference to the latter in detailing the Trainbots' origin.


I think the best quesiton to ask is, has TT ever translated any of the trainbot names in English Themselves in any print or online Media? Thy may come p with an official spelling different than any we've seen.

It's kind of like Toho with their Kaiju. Many of the official English Spellings and/or pronunciations Toho recognizes may not match the original Japanese, but they are formal, and consistently used:

Godzilla instead of Gojira
Mothra instead of Mosura
Rodan instead of Radon etc....
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:31 pm

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william-james88 wrote:Question regarding the character's name. The Katakana (at least through google translate from Amazon Japan) translates to Showki. So how come we call him Shouki instead?


Google Translate *sucks* for translating Japanese names, simply for doing too much at times for the sake of sounding smart. There are multiple systems for translating, but some result in loss of wordplay, or diverge too much from the intended meaning or etymology.

TakaraTomy uses "Shouki" as the official transliteration for ショウキ, as shown by his Generations release:

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Transformers Generations Shouki Gallery
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby o.supreme » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:38 pm

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^v Perfect, there is as I hoped an official English spelling on a TT product ;)^
Last edited by o.supreme on Fri Oct 15, 2021 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:59 pm

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o.supreme wrote:I think the best quesiton to ask is, has TT ever translated any of the trainbot names in English Themselves in any print or online Media?
In 1987, on the original toy's character card (botton-left corner of the image):

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Re: Takara Masterpiece Gattai MPG Discussion Thread

Postby william-james88 » Fri Oct 15, 2021 4:18 pm

Motto: "'till All Are One"
o.supreme wrote:All points are appreciated. Just to be clear, I was never against ordering from Amazon Japan (I order from Amazon.com all the time) It's just I wanted to do as much research as possible. New things are scary ;) . The order process was reassuringly easy, I cant wait to get the actual product next June.

william-james88 wrote:Question regarding the character's name. The Katakana (at least through google translate from Amazon Japan) translates to Showki. So how come we call him Shouki instead?



Mine actually translates it at "Shoki" :lol: . Transliteration from Japanese is difficult sometimes.

TFWikistates:

Though it is a little tricky to tell the true meaning of Shouki's name since it is "spelled" in phonetic katakana rather than kanji (鍾馗), it most likely comes from a mythological figure or a type of Japanese WWII fighter plane. Ask Vector Prime would make reference to the latter in detailing the Trainbots' origin.


I think the best quesiton to ask is, has TT ever translated any of the trainbot names in English Themselves in any print or online Media? Thy may come p with an official spelling different than any we've seen.

It's kind of like Toho with their Kaiju. Many of the official English Spellings and/or pronunciations Toho recognizes may not match the original Japanese, but they are formal, and consistently used:

Godzilla instead of Gojira
Mothra instead of Mosura
Rodan instead of Radon etc....


Oh yeah, I knew you werent against it, just pointing out more pros and why I havent ordered from elsewhere since
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