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[AllNewSuperRobot]

But since Japan always treated the cartoons as the same world, this discovery of Wheeljack's serves to explain how, in the Japanese version, sparks did always exist, just unknowingly by the Autobots and Decepticons until Primacron's trial in 2011. Wheeljack was inspired by Primacron's vague words about his having created robotic life with real souls, and so spent the next 14 years investigating this matter, not unveiling his own spark until 2025 (and doing so with a Beast Machines spark extractor in that art, too).

There was far too much "Primacron" in that canon, for my liking. I'd prefer him relegated to a one-off oddity, like Autobot X.

So does the second train bot connect to the first one or do we have to wait for a third to come along?

Shouki is the upper torso. Getsuei is one of the legs. Speculation is the lower Torso will be the last one released, making the full combination impossible until the very end.

That both sounds like a really dick move. While at the same time, being Very HasTak.

[o.supreme]

On Purpose: Quite Possibly

Jerk Move: I Don't think so

After all, their origingal Japanese Numbers were:



C-125 Shouki (C-354 re release 1990)
C-126 Getsuei (C-355)
C-127 Yukikaze (C-356)
C-128 Suiken (C-357)
C-129 Seizan (C-358)
C-130 Kaen (C-359)

C-131 was the Raiden giftset, which was not re released in 1990.

Heck even the Diaclone Trains, released in two different color schemes followed this release order IIRC, just giving them all different names for each release.

I mean this is ONLY the second reveal, they may show up in a different order, but releasing them:

Upper Torso (Leader), Legs Together (similar engineering), arms together (similar engineering), lower Torso (last). Seems to have some logic to it.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

Yet, by the same token. If it turns out to be the case. It would be them saying you don't get the gestalt at all, until the very last release.

[TF-fan kev777]

It is really all perception. Even if the release order is intentional, the intention may not be to prevent fans from combining things early. It could easily be because they are still working out the lower torso, which I believe was the exact case with SS Devy. This being the first MP combiner, I can see them wanting to get the lower torso right and needing the most time on that to figure out how strong any hip joints will need to be.

For me, the order doesn't really matter. I like the "surprise" of getting to see the combined mode in all its glory once I get the final figure. Even back to SS Devy and all of CW, I didn't make the combiner until I had all the official parts. It was like an extra bonus after getting the last figure getting to build the combiner. Building it part way while there may still be a year until the final part is available just seems like torture to me.

If they went with both torso bots first, legs next and arms last, would many people really be satisfied by a 1 armed or no armed Raiden? I sure wouldn't, but I'm sure some would. To me it would make the wait seem longer.

[primalxconvoy]

In the Japanese anime, lower ranked bots called their superior by rank (e.g, Optimus is the “Shireikan”, an equivalent of Commander). Only higher rank bots like Optimus call all other bots by their name. This is consistent with Asian culture where we address our elders and superiors by position rather than name.

Japanese Transformer toys (esp G1) have their rank and name on the packaging. This has not been carried over to Western releases as far as I am aware of.

At this point, I believe we are well beyond the age of Hasbro deliberately changing the names of Japanese characters for the Western market. That was more of a thing during the Aaron Archer era. The John Warden era saw many Japanese characters retain their names, despite any and all sense (or lack thereof) some of their names made in English. The few that were changed during the Warden era were done so merely for Trademark and PC reasons, and likely would have been retained otherwise.

What's more, when the Ask Vector Prime Facebook was given the opportunity to finally explore the in-universe origins of the Trainbots, since their existing backstory cited them as natives to Japan, it was decided to leave their names as they were so as to better emphasize the fact that they were the first new Autobots fully built and brought to life on Earth in Japan (the Binaltech project was just new bodies for existing Autobots instead of new ones brought to life for the first time), with each named by a Japanese scientist from various Transformers series:

Doctor Ōnishi, a huge fan of vintage trains, asked that he be allowed to name the DE10 diesel locomotive. He named him Kaen, a blaze that would burn brightly in the service of Japan and all mankind. Doctor Ishihara, born and raised in Tokyo, chose to name the Tōkai-type 153 express from her home metropolis. Proud of her proficiency with martial arts, named Suiken after her favorite style of martial arts. Doctor Gō, as the youngest member of the team, was given the newest model of train to name, the 200 Series Shinkansen. He chose Yukikaze, after the wind of his native Hokkaido. Doctor Fujiyama, who was born in Kyushu, chose to name the 485-200 series engine. He named him Seizan, after the mountains of his home region. Doctor Takahashi expressed little interest in which mech she would name, and was given the EF65-1000 by default. She chose Getsuei, for the Trainbots would have the capacity to travel to the moon and beyond. Last, though certainly not least, Doctor Yoshikawa was given the honor of naming the team leader, the original Shinkansen. As a fan of military history, he decided that Shouki would be a dignified and powerful name.

For even in the Japanese fiction do their names stand out for being so intrinsically Japanese, unlike their fellow Autobots whose names sound much more alien and western to the native Japanese speaker.

That's not completely correct. In Japan, although generic "titles", such as "sensei" do exist, they are used that way in a similar way to that in western countries. For example, when we don't know their names, we can say "Sensei", just as we can say "Sir/Doctor/Officer" when addressing people in various occupations in the UK, US, etc. Also, when we know the first/last names of someone in Japan, we use an honorific and name combination in a similar way to western countries, such as "Doctor Stevens", "Professor Watkins" "Officer Peterson", etc. In (admittedly rarer) cases where the first name is used, such as when some foreigners, or even Japanese prefer/use them, they can be referred to as "Tom sensei", or "Mr Akira". Even rarer still, the honorific "kun" (which is usually reserved when speaking down to male children or as an insult to, say, male convicts) can be used, as in the TV celebrity (and famous marine biologist), "Sakana Kun", which is a stage name meaning something like "Young Master/Little Mr Fish".

[chuckdawg1999]

I hate to think that if these don't sell well we may end up with a bunch of parts that we really can't do anything with. I mean this is how I would do things, I'm just that type of guy.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

I hate to think that if these don't sell well we may end up with a bunch of parts that we really can't do anything with. I mean this is how I would do things, I'm just that type of guy.

That's the flipside of leaving the important connecting part til last. If they don't sell in the numbers they are expecting, given the expense of a Masterpiece combiner, would they cut the line short? Just like the failed HasLab projects...

"Enjoy your 5/6 of an MP Gestalt."

[Jelze Bunnycat]

I hate to think that if these don't sell well we may end up with a bunch of parts that we really can't do anything with. I mean this is how I would do things, I'm just that type of guy.

That's the flipside of leaving the important connecting part til last. If they don't sell in the numbers they are expecting, given the expense of a Masterpiece combiner, would they cut the line short? Just like the failed HasLab projects...

"Enjoy your 5/6 of an MP Gestalt."

I wouldn't think so. Some companies do prioritize customer satisfaction, even if only to boost their image. Imagine what would happen if the line was cut short by TakaraTomy...

[AllNewSuperRobot]

I hate to think that if these don't sell well we may end up with a bunch of parts that we really can't do anything with. I mean this is how I would do things, I'm just that type of guy.

That's the flipside of leaving the important connecting part til last. If they don't sell in the numbers they are expecting, given the expense of a Masterpiece combiner, would they cut the line short? Just like the failed HasLab projects...

"Enjoy your 5/6 of an MP Gestalt."

I wouldn't think so. Some companies do prioritize customer satisfaction, even if only to boost their image. Imagine what would happen if the line was cut short by TakaraTomy...

It's good we know HasTak isn't one of them. Even a subsidiary of the Number one toy maker in the world, still values money over all things. If the Raiden project doesn't sell. They wouldn't think twice about pulling the plug. Remember of course this is even more of a niche market item than the regular Transformers lines.
Also that Takara has slept on anything Raiden related for the better part of over three decades. They won't lose sleep over it's failure either, or any minority backlash.

[Jelze Bunnycat]

I hate to think that if these don't sell well we may end up with a bunch of parts that we really can't do anything with. I mean this is how I would do things, I'm just that type of guy.

That's the flipside of leaving the important connecting part til last. If they don't sell in the numbers they are expecting, given the expense of a Masterpiece combiner, would they cut the line short? Just like the failed HasLab projects...

"Enjoy your 5/6 of an MP Gestalt."

I wouldn't think so. Some companies do prioritize customer satisfaction, even if only to boost their image. Imagine what would happen if the line was cut short by TakaraTomy...

It's good we know HasTak isn't one of them. Even a subsidiary of the Number one toy maker in the world, still values money over all things. If the Raiden project doesn't sell. They wouldn't think twice about pulling the plug. Remember of course this is even more of a niche market item than the regular Transformers lines.
Also that Takara has slept on anything Raiden related for the better part of over three decades. They won't lose sleep over it's failure either, or any minority backlash.

Hasbro may not be one (debatable), but TakaraTomy is in a different country with a different culture and different values. I don't think they would have even started Raiden if they didn't plan on finishing it, plus there's that trains are a big thing in Japan.

[o.supreme]

but TakaraTomy is in a different country with a different culture and different values. I don't think they would have even started Raiden if they didn't plan on finishing it.

THIS 100%. I cant speak for 3P companies, but I've never heard of a case of a combiner not being completed (CW and PotP non-dedicated teams not withstanding). Remember it was TT that went the extra mile in CW/UW to get the proper team members (or there proper modes) made.

I have no doubt that the project will be completed, aside from a total company collapse, in which basically ALL TT toys would come to an end.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

It is important to remember there is no precedent for MP Raiden. This isn't like other lines and to temper expectations accordingly. This is a "one of a kind" Masterpiece combiner set of a figure that hasn't been acknowledged since a single Japan exclusive re-release 32 years ago. Don't assume these Trainbots will be released regardless of the bottom line.

[Jelze Bunnycat]

It is important to remember there is no precedent for MP Raiden. This isn't like other lines and to temper expectations accordingly. This is a "one of a kind" Masterpiece combiner set of a figure that hasn't been acknowledged since a single Japan exclusive re-release 32 years ago. Don't assume these Trainbots will be released regardless of the bottom line.

It doesn't hurt to have a little bit of faith in them. Hope for the best, but don't automatically expect the worst either.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

It doesn't hurt to have a little bit of faith in them. Hope for the best, but don't automatically expect the worst either.

I'm a pragmatist though.

Since HasLab, I have nothing but cynicism for the business practices of Hasbro.

Since Blackarachnia, Bumblebee 2.0 and the decreasing quality of the ever more expensive MP line. I have similarly low expectations of too.

[ZeroWolf]

Yeah, this combiner will be released regardless, as I reckon it'll do well in Japan, which is Takaratomy only concern really. If sales aren't fantastic then there will be no other Masterpiece combiners for a while

[AllNewSuperRobot]

It is strange to compare this release to Unicron. I assume this project exists similarly because of the 3P option announced. I wonder if Raiden had been a crowdfunding thing, would TT have pulled a Hasbro on Moon Studios?

[chuckdawg1999]

At least they're not releasing one member a year, some of us might not have been around to see it finished.

[AllNewSuperRobot]

At least they're not releasing one member a year, some of us might not have been around to see it finished.

Why does this sound so familiar within the Masterpiece Line? Which started in 2003 and still hasn't finished representing Season One and Two of Sunbow...

[chuckdawg1999]

At least they're not releasing one member a year, some of us might not have been around to see it finished.

Why does this sound so familiar within the Masterpiece Line? Which started in 2003 and still hasn't finished representing Season One and Two of Sunbow...

Well, there's that too. With Masterpiece, I think they're trying to cover ALL of Transformers history, except for Armada. Cue my boy.

[primalxconvoy]

It doesn't hurt to have a little bit of faith in them. Hope for the best, but don't automatically expect the worst either.

I'm a pragmatist though.

Since HasLab, I have nothing but cynicism for the business practices of Hasbro.

Since Blackarachnia, Bumblebee 2.0 and the decreasing quality of the ever more expensive MP line. I have similarly low expectations of too.

What was bad about MP Black Atachnia, apart from the convoluted, almost impossible transformation scheme (like most official MP figures these days)?

[primalxconvoy]

Yeah, this combiner will be released regardless, as I reckon it'll do well in Japan, which is Takaratomy only concern really...

Apart from the official sales of TT MP products to Hasbro Asia, you mean?

[D-Maximal_Primal]

The next component looks pretty nice. I actually like that train mode more with the top pieces, but I think so far Shouki has my favorite robot mode. I'm hoping they do this thing where they release one every 3-4 months, i think that's spaced out enough.

Also, I like the idea of not doing Kaen till last. I actually really appreciated that with SS Devastator, it really helped you enjoy the individuals by preventing a combination that could stand until the last piece was out. And I would like that here too

[ZeroWolf]

Yeah, this combiner will be released regardless, as I reckon it'll do well in Japan, which is Takaratomy only concern really...

Apart from the official sales of TT MP products to Hasbro Asia, you mean?

I still don't think Takara was even banking on them, to them, a sale there would be a bonus and not something that could stand in the way of the other components

[AllNewSuperRobot]

What was bad about MP Black Arachnia, apart from the convoluted, almost impossible transformation scheme (like most official MP figures these days)?

The half-hearted and lazy altmode. As I've said elsewhere, many times. To be able to qualify for the descriptive of a "Masterpiece" figure. Just looking good in one mode, from the front, isn't good enough. Especially for the price point. Considering a regular retail line figure can do so. At a fraction of the cost.

[joevill]

I locked in Shouki so of course I am going to get this one. Looks great so far