Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

[william-james88]

And I only associate myself with the best.

So what's it like being friends with the pope?

[JazZeke]

I'm not sad, they brought this on themselves by not getting their writing in order, maybe they should hire actually talented writers next time...

I'm honestly finding it more sad that I just don't care. This franchise is literally my favorite thing on the planet, and I couldn't give a damn less that it's hurting right now. I haven't even seen the movie a second time. I watched AOE a whole 7 times in theaters, but I have no desire to see TLK again. They should have delivered on what they promised the first damn time.

At least now I know I'm not a fan of anything. I won't blindly defend these movies just because I like them. I've shunned and condemned entire goddamn properties I once loved and adored, all because they put out something I didn't like. Marvel, Star Wars, and most recently the Mass Effect games are among those properties. I'm just hoping Transformers doesn't join the ranks.

It's... okay to like something that isn't good. That's what "guilty pleasures" are.

[SlyTF1]

I'm not sad, they brought this on themselves by not getting their writing in order, maybe they should hire actually talented writers next time...

I'm honestly finding it more sad that I just don't care. This franchise is literally my favorite thing on the planet, and I couldn't give a damn less that it's hurting right now. I haven't even seen the movie a second time. I watched AOE a whole 7 times in theaters, but I have no desire to see TLK again. They should have delivered on what they promised the first damn time.

At least now I know I'm not a fan of anything. I won't blindly defend these movies just because I like them. I've shunned and condemned entire goddamn properties I once loved and adored, all because they put out something I didn't like. Marvel, Star Wars, and most recently the Mass Effect games are among those properties. I'm just hoping Transformers doesn't join the ranks.

It's... okay to like something that isn't good. That's what "guilty pleasures" are.

Nope. I look at everything from an objective point of view. If I say something is "the greatest thing of all time," it has to live up to those standards, otherwise, it ceases to be the greatest. And I only associate myself with the best.

But the very notion of "the greatest thing of all time" is objectively a subjective concept in and of itself.

Let's just say "the greatest thing of all time," in my world. If it disappoints me, it's no longer the greatest. I'll have to move on to a different world to find it.

And I only associate myself with the best.

So what's it like being friends with the pope?

Who said we were friends?

[Va'al]

Whatever the performance of Transformers: The Last Knight at the box office, the marketing train is still going strong around the world too - with the US' own Autobots Unite tour taking place at Walmarts, and the various Singapore, Hong Kong, and other events we've covered. Thanks to Facebook group Transformers Perù, the country's own display of toys, fans, cars from the movieverse, costumes, films and contests! Check out a selection of images below, and let us know if anything similar has taken place in your area!

[noctorro]

Anybody seen the Double Toasted review of The Last Knight?

That line from Corey keeps echoing in my mind.

"Not a goddamn original thought was put into this movie!!!"

That's why I haven't seen it a second and third time yet.

This movie is out of his goddamn mind. Wy 5 unoriginal out of Transformers
storylines + like 3 decent Transformers storylines in this movie?

Just focus on Nemesis Prime, Quintessa, Megatron being Megatron again.
Does Megatron have a spark? How did he become Megatron again?

[SlyTF1]

Anybody seen the Double Toasted review of The Last Knight?

That line from Corey keeps echoing in my mind.

"Not a goddamn original thought was put into this movie!!!"

That's why I haven't seen it a second and third time yet.

This movie is out of his goddamn mind. Wy 5 unoriginal out of Transformers
storylines + like 3 decent Transformers storylines in this movie?

Just focus on Nemesis Prime, Quintessa, Megatron being Megatron again.
Does Megatron have a spark? How did he become Megatron again?

Despite their hatred for these movies, I watch Double Toasted regularly. I do believe there to be original thoughts in the movie, but none of it was on the writers' parts. Every bit of originality came from Bay himself. People always claim Bay doesn't care about the franchise. He obviously cares. It's the writers who don't give a ****. Bay was the one who had to force the producers to put together a writer's room in the first place, and what did they give him? A bunch of hacks. I could have written a better script, and it the movie's budget probably would have been even lower.

[Deadput]

Despite their hatred for these movies, I watch Double Toasted regularly. I do believe there to be original thoughts in the movie, but none of it was on the writers' parts. Every bit of originality came from Bay himself. People always claim Bay doesn't care about the franchise. He obviously cares. It's the writers who don't give a ****. Bay was the one who had to force the producers to put together a writer's room in the first place, and what did they give him? A bunch of hacks. I could have written a better script, and it the movie's budget probably would have been even lower.

It's not even the writers it's Lorenzo who is the absolute core of the problems of these films.

Instead of listing them myself with my poor writing skills I'll let someone else who could explain it way better then I ever could. Ra88 of the Tfw2005 boards wrote a general list of all the stuff he has done.

But yeah. A lot of this came out on the Don Murphy boards. He was one of the fan friendly production members (and the guy who also along with Tom DeSanto was is responsible for even convincing Paramount to do these movies). He constantly was in direct communication with TF fans, but this also put him at odds a lot with people because he had a really explosive personality.

Anyways, it was through that board and input from DM that a lot of Lorenzos antics came to light. Such as:

* Not even wanting Autobots to be in the movie.
* Changing the base attack scene from a forest to the middle eastern desert. Also removing Soundwave and Ravage and replacing them with Incinerator (who would go on to be renamed Grimlock/Vortex/Blackout) and Scorponok (which totally pissed off Don Murphy, so Lorenzo got nick named Scorponok on the boards).
* Replacing Soundwave (a humvee in this) with Barricade.
* seeing a pattern yet? Because guess who Frenzy was at first.
* The Autobots almost didn't have any personalities beyond the robotic because he felt that was dumb. And this is after the "didn't want them to speak" thing.
* Wanted Megatron to be a cannibal who got power from eating sparks. (Shares this blame with Orci and Kurtzmann though).
* Actively fought against Welker and Cullen to reprise their roles. Especially Cullen. He wanted Liam Neeson for the star power.
* Once the movie came out and was a smash hit, he took credit for a lot of it.

There's more, but I can't remember all of it right now.

Also there is more to the Cullen thing Lorenzo actually went out of his way to sabotage Peter's audition for the 2007 movie by not having the guy that was meant to interact with Cullen in the audition show up at the right time luckily Peter improvised and Bay who sought Peter Cullen out brought him in but Lorenzo made Peter stick to only Optimus and not Ironhide as well.

Also this guy is the prime reason for this movie being convoluted he took two different scripts and smashed them together he is the one everyone should be angry at not Bay or the writers although their not completely innocent either.

And it doesn't matter if Bay leaves and the Transformers movies are rebooted as long as Lorenzo is involved he is going to screw things up.

[SlyTF1]

Despite their hatred for these movies, I watch Double Toasted regularly. I do believe there to be original thoughts in the movie, but none of it was on the writers' parts. Every bit of originality came from Bay himself. People always claim Bay doesn't care about the franchise. He obviously cares. It's the writers who don't give a ****. Bay was the one who had to force the producers to put together a writer's room in the first place, and what did they give him? A bunch of hacks. I could have written a better script, and it the movie's budget probably would have been even lower.

It's not even the writers it's Lorenzo who is the absolute core of the problems of these films.

Instead of listing them myself with my poor writing skills I'll let someone else who could explain it way better then I ever could. Ra88 of the Tfw2005 boards wrote a general list of all the stuff he has done.

But yeah. A lot of this came out on the Don Murphy boards. He was one of the fan friendly production members (and the guy who also along with Tom DeSanto was is responsible for even convincing Paramount to do these movies). He constantly was in direct communication with TF fans, but this also put him at odds a lot with people because he had a really explosive personality.

Anyways, it was through that board and input from DM that a lot of Lorenzos antics came to light. Such as:

* Not even wanting Autobots to be in the movie.
* Changing the base attack scene from a forest to the middle eastern desert. Also removing Soundwave and Ravage and replacing them with Incinerator (who would go on to be renamed Grimlock/Vortex/Blackout) and Scorponok (which totally pissed off Don Murphy, so Lorenzo got nick named Scorponok on the boards).
* Replacing Soundwave (a humvee in this) with Barricade.
* seeing a pattern yet? Because guess who Frenzy was at first.
* The Autobots almost didn't have any personalities beyond the robotic because he felt that was dumb. And this is after the "didn't want them to speak" thing.
* Wanted Megatron to be a cannibal who got power from eating sparks. (Shares this blame with Orci and Kurtzmann though).
* Actively fought against Welker and Cullen to reprise their roles. Especially Cullen. He wanted Liam Neeson for the star power.
* Once the movie came out and was a smash hit, he took credit for a lot of it.

There's more, but I can't remember all of it right now.

Also there is more to the Cullen thing Lorenzo actually went out of his way to sabotage Peter's audition for the 2007 movie by not having the guy that was meant to interact with Cullen in the audition show up at the right time luckily Peter improvised and Bay who sought Peter Cullen out brought him in but Lorenzo made Peter stick to only Optimus and not Ironhide as well.

Also this guy is the prime reason for this movie being convoluted he took two different scripts and smashed them together he is the one everyone should be angry at not Bay or the writers although their not completely innocent either.

And it doesn't matter if Bay leaves and the Transformers movies are rebooted as long as Lorenzo is involved he is going to screw things up.

I'm aware of his influence on the story, but the writers still could have found a better way to piece it all together.

[Deadput]

I'm aware of his influence on the story, but the writers still could have found a better way to piece it all together.

They really could of but the problem is that no one cared enough Not Lorenzo, not Bay, not the writers, not Paramount, not Hasbro and honestly that's mostly due to them making it all up as they go instead of making some sort of road map like starting with movie two or three.

I don't think we will ever get anyone that cares enough about continuity besides small basics and Easter eggs unless we get a reboot with everything carefully played out with extra backup plans.

[Deadput]

Pictures like this make me wish we could have something like a prequel movie or a video game with all of them together interacting with each other like Ironhide and Hound or something like that and it doesn't even have to be anything canon.

[SlyTF1]

Pictures like this make me wish we could have something like a prequel movie or a video game with all of them together interacting with each other like Ironhide and Hound or something like that and it doesn't even have to be anything canon.

A game like that would be great. One set in an alternate reality where all the Autobots and Decepticons are still alive, fighting it out on Earth. I still want a Transformers RPG, damnit.

[Barricade.it]

I think TLK is a good movie, much more then AOE and ROTF, not as good as 2007 or DOTM, which is my favourite.

The problem, in my opinion, is that they are trying to rethink and rethink and overload an idea which works well by itself. This stuff of medieval knights or the war between humans and TF (all TFs) is a dead end. I mean: We have a few strong robots capable of becoming almost anything. It's something a writer could do anything with! But the challenge is to do anything EXACTLY with it. A plot wich colud be right for a kind of fantasy-mistery movie (TLK) o for a super heroes movie (AOE) is not a transfromers plot: the challenge is to write a plot about sotriers only TFs could deal with. Ad the usual CRASH BOOM BANG Bayhem is not enough to cover this, it may even be a disadvantage.

I don't think TFs are at their end, but I'm sure that after Bee's 2018 the movie stuff should take a pause for reflections.

[Burn]

Wow, it took 10 years but people are finally acknowledging that Bay isn't solely responsible for all the problems.

Thanks for catching up at last!

[Deadput]

Wow, it took 10 years but people are finally acknowledging that Bay isn't solely responsible for all the problems.

Thanks for catching up at last!

I knew Lorenzo wasn't exactly the greatest mind in these movies before during the DOTM and AOE days but I assumed he was just rude to fans on the online forums which I could understand, I had no idea how much impact or how much stuff he actually did and I'm shocked and enraged that people are only starting to talk about this only now after movie number 5 flopped I feel like the movies could have at least had a somewhat better outcome if Hasbro had more say or if someone recognized that Lorenzo's ideas were not good for the brand.

Lorenzo should of been off by DOTM (ideally ROTF but I feel like realistically by the time anyone noticed and fired him he would have been too deeply involved in the pre-production of the movie)


I also never thought any of this was Bay's fault and I kinda still don't...he's not a perfect film maker but truth be told no one is and I think Bay has a mostly unique style for action films because I honestly can't see anyone else making the films like he did at least not the first three especially DOTM.

[Kurona]

I'm actually kinda glad TLK isn't doing well because this'll force them to put more effort into future movies. Until now they've had a really arrogant attitude that they can just put the same thing out and it doesn't matter; people will come and see it -- Bay's been quoted on saying "I don't care what you think, you'll still see it anyway". But now people aren't seeing it, so they actually have to put thought into these things.

[Deadput]

I'm actually kinda glad TLK isn't doing well because this'll force them to put more effort into future movies. Until now they've had a really arrogant attitude that they can just put the same thing out and it doesn't matter; people will come and see it -- Bay's been quoted on saying "I don't care what you think, you'll still see it anyway". But now people aren't seeing it, so they actually have to put thought into these things.

To be fair at the time he wasn't completely wrong.

[Kurona]

I'm actually kinda glad TLK isn't doing well because this'll force them to put more effort into future movies. Until now they've had a really arrogant attitude that they can just put the same thing out and it doesn't matter; people will come and see it -- Bay's been quoted on saying "I don't care what you think, you'll still see it anyway". But now people aren't seeing it, so they actually have to put thought into these things.

To be fair at the time he wasn't completely wrong.

He was correct, but it's still very arrogant and a really terrible attitude to have. Even if a lot of the complaints were ridiculous things like Optimus having flames or characters not looking like their G1 selves, it still shows a complete defiance of any sort of constructive criticism and a care for nothing but how much money you're going to give him. I don't wanna give money to someone like that; I wanna give it to someone who truly cares about what they're making and truly cares about giving the audience something they'll like -- if it's gonna crash and burn that's a shame, but at least lemme see you've put effort and care into it. It's a terrible attitude propagated by executive suits sitting round a boardroom table.

But now it's apparently coming back to bite 'em in the buttocks, because people aren't going to see it anyway. I just hope this means the Bumblebee movie and whatever comes after it are gonna be much better than what we currently have.

[Deadput]

He was correct, but it's still very arrogant and a really terrible attitude to have. Even if a lot of the complaints were ridiculous things like Optimus having flames or characters not looking like their G1 selves, it still shows a complete defiance of any sort of constructive criticism and a care for nothing but how much money you're going to give him. I don't wanna give money to someone like that; I wanna give it to someone who truly cares about what they're making and truly cares about giving the audience something they'll like -- if it's gonna crash and burn that's a shame, but at least lemme see you've put effort and care into it. It's a terrible attitude propagated by executive suits sitting round a boardroom table.

But now it's apparently coming back to bite 'em in the buttocks, because people aren't going to see it anyway. I just hope this means the Bumblebee movie and whatever comes after it are gonna be much better than what we currently have.

It's a horrible attitude yes but so are some of the fans reactions and attitude towards Bay himself so I assume he had that on his mind when he made the comment.

Not that it makes it alright or anything but people will occasionally vent or take a hostile attitude when their annoyed (cough-myself-cough)

Like I said I "assume".

[Kurona]

He was correct, but it's still very arrogant and a really terrible attitude to have. Even if a lot of the complaints were ridiculous things like Optimus having flames or characters not looking like their G1 selves, it still shows a complete defiance of any sort of constructive criticism and a care for nothing but how much money you're going to give him. I don't wanna give money to someone like that; I wanna give it to someone who truly cares about what they're making and truly cares about giving the audience something they'll like -- if it's gonna crash and burn that's a shame, but at least lemme see you've put effort and care into it. It's a terrible attitude propagated by executive suits sitting round a boardroom table.

But now it's apparently coming back to bite 'em in the buttocks, because people aren't going to see it anyway. I just hope this means the Bumblebee movie and whatever comes after it are gonna be much better than what we currently have.

It's a horrible attitude yes but so are some of the fans reactions and attitude towards Bay himself so I assume he had that on his mind when he made the comment.

Not that it makes it alright or anything but people will occasionally vent or take a hostile attitude when their annoyed (cough-myself-cough)

Like I said I "assume".

Yeah, a lot of people were rude, hostile and downright antagonistic -- I mean for Primus' sake, some of them actually sent Bay death threats. What the heck's that about? Why are we as a race like this? All he did was paint flames on a cab, for the love of...

But yes, I can understand that maybe that line was a reaction to the... less civil detractors of the movies, but it wouldn't kill him to have a bit more maturity and composure or at least pretend like he cares about giving people something they'll enjoy. It's a bit like if Hasbro responded to complaints about Trypticon's leg assembly issues with "I don't give a ****, you're still gonna buy it. Don't see why I should care."

Watch Hasbro actually do that.

[kurthy]

Yeah, a lot of people were rude, hostile and downright antagonistic -- I mean for Primus' sake, some of them actually sent Bay death threats. What the heck's that about? Why are we as a race like this? All he did was paint flames on a cab, for the love of...

But yes, I can understand that maybe that line was a reaction to the... less civil detractors of the movies, but it wouldn't kill him to have a bit more maturity and composure or at least pretend like he cares about giving people something they'll enjoy. It's a bit like if Hasbro responded to complaints about Trypticon's leg assembly issues with "I don't give a ****, you're still gonna buy it. Don't see why I should care."

Watch Hasbro actually do that.

Hasbro has always had this attitude. Look at 1989 to 1995.

I'm still going to place a lot of blame on Bay. His only concern is making it look cool. He's never made a great movie and most of his experience is creating music videos. Much like the head coach in football, he's not responsible for everything, but he's still going to shoulder a large part of the blame. Much as Shia Lebouf as the quarterback did. Lorenzo is more like a GM who insists the coach is fine and needs more fan attendance to improve the atmosphere. Paramount is slowly becoming the original Cleveland Browns.

But I checked out after DotM and haven't seen the latest installment.

[Ig89ninja]

Pictures like this make me wish we could have something like a prequel movie or a video game with all of them together interacting with each other like Ironhide and Hound or something like that and it doesn't even have to be anything canon.

A game like that would be great. One set in an alternate reality where all the Autobots and Decepticons are still alive, fighting it out on Earth. I still want a Transformers RPG, ######.

I. Am now wondering what devastator would look like if bonecrusher was added to his combined form

[cruizerdave]

Oh man, wouldn't it be great if this finally killed these stupid movies?


Look, this isn't a dig at you if you love Bayformers. If some pretty cinematography, big explosions, nifty special effects and almost always nearly incomprehensible action scenes are enough for you to enjoy these films, more power to you.


However, for me, I'd love to see the films die for a few years, and come back as something that has an actual narrative, treats the TFs as characters, and speaking of characters, has likeable characters.

Unfortunately, I think this movie is going to make just enough money to justify another one. Spoilers, the next one will involve some type of conspiracy, some type up to now hidden thing that ties TFs to Earth's history, a bunch of yelling, characters and plot points that have almost zero to do with the central story, porny shots of women's cleavage or butts, weird and offensive racial stereotypes, Optimus acting like a maniac, slow motion shots, Megatron not really having much to do with the story, thing from previous movies being ignored or contradicted, a high caliber actor slumming it for a pay check and plenty of idiotic, juvenile frat boy humor.

[noctorro]

Unfortunately, I think this movie is going to make just enough money to justify another one. Spoilers, the next one will involve some type of conspiracy, some type up to now hidden thing that ties TFs to Earth's history, a bunch of yelling, characters and plot points that have almost zero to do with the central story, porny shots of women's cleavage or butts, weird and offensive racial stereotypes, Optimus acting like a maniac, slow motion shots, Megatron not really having much to do with the story, thing from previous movies being ignored or contradicted, a high caliber actor slumming it for a pay check and plenty of idiotic, juvenile frat boy humor.

Damnit, why does your spoiler have to be 100% on point for Transformers 6?

I think you absolutely have it right here.

It's going to be humans made Transformers in the first place, or Transformers made humans + everything else you say. Oh yes and Unicron used to be human or something.

Mind blown with the Lorenzo posts up here. My Primus I did not know about this. Why does the man hate Transformers so much?

I really hope the Bumblebee movie will be awesome, that director gives me hope anyway.

[Deadput]

I'm still going to place a lot of blame on Bay. His only concern is making it look cool.

Like every director ever...

Why do people assume that the movie makers are going to care about the property as much as we do? Fan is short for fanatic for a reason.

He's never made a great movie and most of his experience is creating music videos.

First of all that is subjective and an opinion...not exactly a fact.

13 hours was a pretty good movie though and it came out in 2016 so he is able to make decent movies but not that many people are going to give him a chance because of his name.

[Stuartmaximus]

Btw the franchise that Bay could've done better with would've been M.A.S.K. & GI Joe