Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

[Sentinel_Primal]

I honestly don’t understand the “ugh, G1 design” sentiment I keep seeing.

Can't speak for everyone that uses it, but generally speaking, whenever I use it I'm typically meaning "I wish we'd get new or different designs or characters rather than the same flat nosed truck, tank, and jet." I'd be saying the same thing if we got Beast Wars, Armada, or even Animated updates every year. It mostly stems from there not being much of a break between iterations of a character like Optimus or even Starscream to a degree.

But, unfortunately there's not really a way to fix it. Obviously Hasbro can't give every series they've made the Studio Series treatment where they get their own line, but they also can't give every line it's own year with it going G1, JG1, G2, BW, RID, UT, Animated, Prime/RID 2015, and then back to the start. It'd be way too long a wait to get back to someone's preferred era and thus they'd lose customers. The best they can do is what they're currently doing with making figures of those characters in a line that's mostly focused on one era.

Like I said, I do wish we'd get new designs or better yet, different characters instead of another Optimus, Megatron, or Starscream, but this is the best they can reasonably do. They need to keep general characters that people know one shelves and so that we can get some of the weirdos like Spinister, Apeface, and Punch/Counter-Punch who need their own molds to do the original designs for those characters justice.

[Skritz]

G1, G2 and UT and other lines had plenty of Optimuses (Optimii?) and Megatrons. Its just starting with the post-Animated era did we see designs get standardized more.

[Wolfman Jake]

G1, G2 and UT and other lines had plenty of Optimuses (Optimii?) and Megatrons. Its just starting with the post-Animated era did we see designs get standardized more.

Which was a very deliberate move on Hasbro's part, because they wanted core characters in the mythos to have instantly recognizable, "evergreen" designs, so that no matter what new Transformers series is on the shelves, you can spot the major characters and realize immediately that "this is a Transformers toyline."

[Skritz]

G1, G2 and UT and other lines had plenty of Optimuses (Optimii?) and Megatrons. Its just starting with the post-Animated era did we see designs get standardized more.

Which was a very deliberate move on Hasbro's part, because they wanted core characters in the mythos to have instantly recognizable, "evergreen" designs, so that no matter what new Transformers series is on the shelves, you can spot the major characters and realize immediately that "this is a Transformers toyline."

Yeah but its boring.

[Nathaniel Prime]

Addressing the comments above, I can see where you're coming from. Y'all are tired of getting the same things over again. For me, it's not that simple.

For WFC, it's been pretty great, to the point where it's nearly perfect. I dont mind G1, or even GEEWUN, if it has some variety in it. Siege Skytread, Spinister, Impactor, GUOP, all those are the good kind of characters I like to see. These are guys that dont usually get figures, and are getting them now for us to enjoy. For guys like Siege Optimus and Starscream, the Cybertronian altmodes make them unique in my collection. This is the kind of G1 I want. ER Prime only appeals to me for two reasons: the trailer and the matrix. Otherwise, I prefer the look and maybe even the altmode of Siege OP.

[aronjlove]

For guys like Siege Optimus and Starscream, the Cybertronian altmodes make them unique in my collection. This is the kind of G1 I want. ER Prime only appeals to me for two reasons: the trailer and the matrix. Otherwise, I prefer the look and maybe even the altmode of Siege OP.

Last week I would have disagreed with you as I didn't even want Siege Optimus. Then I started realizing how long I had to wait for ER so last week I picked up Siege Optimus and sweet Jesus is the figure the bees knees! The complex transformation! The articulation! The solidness of the alt-mode! So glad I picked him up

[Nathaniel Prime]

For guys like Siege Optimus and Starscream, the Cybertronian altmodes make them unique in my collection. This is the kind of G1 I want. ER Prime only appeals to me for two reasons: the trailer and the matrix. Otherwise, I prefer the look and maybe even the altmode of Siege OP.

Last week I would have disagreed with you as I didn't even want Siege Optimus. Then I started realizing how long I had to wait for ER so last week I picked up Siege Optimus and sweet Jesus is the figure the bees knees! The complex transformation! The articulation! The solidness of the alt-mode! So glad I picked him up

Exactly! So many people take issue with him that I cant even wrap my head around why! There's even a Reprolabels kit that turns his Cybertronian truck into an "Earth" truck that somehow looks less convincing than the original

[Sentinel_Primal]

For guys like Siege Optimus and Starscream, the Cybertronian altmodes make them unique in my collection. This is the kind of G1 I want. ER Prime only appeals to me for two reasons: the trailer and the matrix. Otherwise, I prefer the look and maybe even the altmode of Siege OP.

Last week I would have disagreed with you as I didn't even want Siege Optimus. Then I started realizing how long I had to wait for ER so last week I picked up Siege Optimus and sweet Jesus is the figure the bees knees! The complex transformation! The articulation! The solidness of the alt-mode! So glad I picked him up

Exactly! So many people take issue with him that I cant even wrap my head around why! There's even a Reprolabels kit that turns his Cybertronian truck into an "Earth" truck that somehow looks less convincing than the original

Honestly I prefer thinking of it as that G1 Prime skin from the FOC game

[Nathaniel Prime]

For guys like Siege Optimus and Starscream, the Cybertronian altmodes make them unique in my collection. This is the kind of G1 I want. ER Prime only appeals to me for two reasons: the trailer and the matrix. Otherwise, I prefer the look and maybe even the altmode of Siege OP.

Last week I would have disagreed with you as I didn't even want Siege Optimus. Then I started realizing how long I had to wait for ER so last week I picked up Siege Optimus and sweet Jesus is the figure the bees knees! The complex transformation! The articulation! The solidness of the alt-mode! So glad I picked him up

Exactly! So many people take issue with him that I cant even wrap my head around why! There's even a Reprolabels kit that turns his Cybertronian truck into an "Earth" truck that somehow looks less convincing than the original

Honestly I prefer thinking of it as that G1 Prime skin from the FOC game

That's...actually a great idea! I still dont like it, but I can appreciate it better now!

[Sentinel_Primal]

For guys like Siege Optimus and Starscream, the Cybertronian altmodes make them unique in my collection. This is the kind of G1 I want. ER Prime only appeals to me for two reasons: the trailer and the matrix. Otherwise, I prefer the look and maybe even the altmode of Siege OP.

Last week I would have disagreed with you as I didn't even want Siege Optimus. Then I started realizing how long I had to wait for ER so last week I picked up Siege Optimus and sweet Jesus is the figure the bees knees! The complex transformation! The articulation! The solidness of the alt-mode! So glad I picked him up

Exactly! So many people take issue with him that I cant even wrap my head around why! There's even a Reprolabels kit that turns his Cybertronian truck into an "Earth" truck that somehow looks less convincing than the original

Honestly I prefer thinking of it as that G1 Prime skin from the FOC game

That's...actually a great idea! I still dont like it, but I can appreciate it better now!

I thought of it the second we heard reference to a hover mode! Plus it helps me justify using FOC figures on the Siege shelf instead of spending $110 on the new Seekers

[Nemesis Primal]

Addressing the comments above, I can see where you're coming from. Y'all are tired of getting the same things over again. For me, it's not that simple.

For WFC, it's been pretty great, to the point where it's nearly perfect. I dont mind G1, or even GEEWUN, if it has some variety in it. Siege Skytread, Spinister, Impactor, GUOP, all those are the good kind of characters I like to see. These are guys that dont usually get figures, and are getting them now for us to enjoy. For guys like Siege Optimus and Starscream, the Cybertronian altmodes make them unique in my collection. This is the kind of G1 I want. ER Prime only appeals to me for two reasons: the trailer and the matrix. Otherwise, I prefer the look and maybe even the altmode of Siege OP.

Oh don't get me wrong, Siege is fantastic, to the point where I definitely got less externally annoyed about getting more G1. You just voiced basically my exact opinion on Siege: all the uncommon/obscure characters are great, and the changes they made to the reoccurring characters are unique enough for me to get some of them. The tetrajet mold has been the only time I've actually been interested in a full-on G1-based Seeker mold, I just had to wait for them to put it out as the Rainmakers so I could get it as unique characters instead of another Starscream (and then my girlfriend bought Starscream anyway). Shockwave going on sale led me to finally upgrade from the DotM one with his limited arms, and having an actually jet-black Soundblaster as opposed to the charcoal grey from the FoC one is so great, and with better proportions to boot. There is no Siege figure I think shouldn't have been made or is a wasted slot outside of mayyyybe Springer, I only have suggestions of more I want to see, like Demolishor from the Impactor mold and Deadlock or Drift from said Springer.

That's part of why I'm tentative about Earthrise, it's dropping a lot of the things I like about Siege: the unique alt modes, the stylized G1 look as opposed to blatant G1, and at least in Wave 1, the varied character choice. Wave 1 of Siege had Cog, and Skytread, and a G1 Ultra Magnus with an alt mode from a different Ultra Magnus, whereas Wave 1 of Earthrise has....Ironworks. And two characters we literally just got in Siege. The first look at Siege assuaged a lot of my fears about it, while the first look at Earthrise really didn't.

[Skritz]

Earthrise still has plenty of time to 'redeem' itself with some interesting designs or obscure characters. I'm just worried those hope will be dashed if it turns out Ironworks is like the only one.

[Deadput]

Earthrise still has plenty of time to 'redeem' itself with some interesting designs or obscure characters. I'm just worried those hope will be dashed if it turns out Ironworks is like the only one.

If Ironworks of all things is a thing in this line then I wouldn't be worried, Siege had plenty of obscure characters.

People focus way more on the negative aspects while not paying as much attention to the positive stuff.

Also the Micromasters and the Shield guy?

...okay, see, that right there is why you don't get that complaint: the thing that people who say that (which include me on certain days) are complaining about is exactly the thing you want, from what it sounds like. Multiple of these characters have received updates in those 30 years you mentioned, some of them multiple times, but I guess figures like T30 Springer, who's amazing, don't count as a "proper" Springer because he isn't a blocky lumpman 100% G1 accurate with nothing new?

Then again, I didn't grow up with G1, so I guess it's difficult for me to understand your point of view too. From my POV though, people who want just G1 updates get what they want right now and they STILL complain (who cares what color Earthrise Prime's HANDS are?!), while those who want more than JUST G1 S1-2 again or maybe don't even like G1 get thrown a bone with maybe....2-5% of what gets put out in Generations?

I don't think you understand either.

How is this




Faithful to this?




Thrilling 30 Springer is a fantastic Springer but it's not "the" original G1 design at all, that is the IDW comic design which is quite different.




Now this? This is a way more faithful version




You can make the same argument for characters like Jetfire, Ironhide/Ratchet, Omega Supreeme, Shockwave etc

They didn't have proper toys based on their original beloved G1 designs which tend to be the versions many people like, that's why there are complaints about Earthrise Prime's hands being not blue, blue hands is the proper color of the character and most people are not painters so it's a disappointment to them.

Basically the idea is that people want toys in the exact or close to designs of the characters that they love, it's like if people got a Star Wars Luke Skywalker action figure but it did not look like Luke at all.

[Nemesis Primal]

A long-ish post with valid points that I won't fully repost to save space

Oh yeah, I definitely forgot about Soundbarrier, he's one of the only 3 ER guys I liked with Ironworks and Wheeljack. I don't collect the Micromasters though, zero interest.

As for the Springer argument, I know that T30 Springer is based off the IDW design, I never said it wasn't. And I'm glad it is, because it's a better design/better version of the G1 design and it made Siege Springer an easy pass. The original argument was that Springer, among others, had not received a "proper" mainline figure in 30 years, despite T30 Springer very much being a mainline figure of the character Springer. My point is that their use of the word "proper" is their issue, and why they don't understand the G1 complaints, because it seems like to them if the figure is not a G1-with-knees direct update of the old design, it doesn't count. To people with a less selective definition of a "proper" figure, they have made more figures of Optimus, Megatron, etc. in those 30 years, they just weren't necessarily 100% G1 accurate in terms of design. That's why those people are saying "I'm tired of the same characters over again", while that person is saying "I don't get it, we only just got proper figures of them". Does that make more sense?

Heck, they straight up said we haven't gotten a proper mainline OPTIMUS in 30 years. I can't even count how many Optimus Prime figures one would have to ignore for that to be a factual statement. We got 5 mainline Optimus Primes and an exclusive one from Hasbro alone during the Prime Wars Trilogy, not even counting Takara stuff like Ginrai.

I would argue a more accurate analogy with Luke Skywalker there would be if I wanted a figure of Luke Skywalker from the very beginning of A New Hope when he hasn't left Tatooine yet, and Hasbro made figures of Luke in stormtrooper armor and from the later movies, and I took that and said "They haven't made a proper Luke Skywalker in blank amount of years". That wouldn't be true, the correct way to say it would be "They haven't made the Luke Skywalker design I want in blank amount of years".

[blackeyedprime]

Beefcake Luke looks more like Luke than Siege Springer looks like Springer

[Sentinel_Primal]

So, I think there is something that also needs to be said in terms of good things Siege has done. Instructions! Comparing instructions between WFC and Prime Wars, they actually have somewhat improved instructions for the better in my opinion. I've only struggled to understand one set of instructions from Siege, and that was mostly my own lack of observation, but in PW I had a few moments where I hust said "I'll work it out myself"

[SiegeFan]

Siege has been so successful because, in my view, you finally had widely available/affordable G1 designs from the War. The battle damage whether you liked it or not reinforced that concept, and let's be honest, that same concept falsely sold that Bumblebee trailer to a lot of us lol

You got a mix of Cybertronian modes, repaint Selects for those who wanted them, decent articulation and plastic, mini lines including little combiners and weapons, and a great blast effect gimmick.

And there's just no point complaining about G1 getting rehashed; it hasn't done Hasbro any harm so far, has it? And frankly, some of the people complaining have almost certainly got a shelf full of Primes minimum FFS!

Every toy is someone's first, even if it's just their first Ironworks lol

[adamage1]

I honestly don’t understand the “ugh, G1 design” sentiment I keep seeing.

Can't speak for everyone that uses it, but generally speaking, whenever I use it I'm typically meaning "I wish we'd get new or different designs or characters rather than the same flat nosed truck, tank, and jet." I'd be saying the same thing if we got Beast Wars, Armada, or even Animated updates every year. It mostly stems from there not being much of a break between iterations of a character like Optimus or even Starscream to a degree.

But, unfortunately there's not really a way to fix it. Obviously Hasbro can't give every series they've made the Studio Series treatment where they get their own line, but they also can't give every line it's own year with it going G1, JG1, G2, BW, RID, UT, Animated, Prime/RID 2015, and then back to the start. It'd be way too long a wait to get back to someone's preferred era and thus they'd lose customers. The best they can do is what they're currently doing with making figures of those characters in a line that's mostly focused on one era.

Like I said, I do wish we'd get new designs or better yet, different characters instead of another Optimus, Megatron, or Starscream, but this is the best they can reasonably do. They need to keep general characters that people know one shelves and so that we can get some of the weirdos like Spinister, Apeface, and Punch/Counter-Punch who need their own molds to do the original designs for those characters justice.

Now that Siege (and likely the next two parts of the WFC trilogy) has provided us with a multitude of proper G1 figures, I would be perfectly happy to see a whole new roster of characters once this trilogy wraps up. My main point was that it took over 30 years to finally get these versions—yes, I grew up with G1, which certainly influences my view.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

G1, G2 and UT and other lines had plenty of Optimuses (Optimii?) and Megatrons. Its just starting with the post-Animated era did we see designs get standardized more.

Which was a very deliberate move on Hasbro's part, because they wanted core characters in the mythos to have instantly recognizable, "evergreen" designs, so that no matter what new Transformers series is on the shelves, you can spot the major characters and realize immediately that "this is a Transformers toyline."

Yeah but its boring.

This^^^

Generations. S. As in plural. Not just the one.

They have shown they can get creative (see weaponizers). include more of that. Do what the Studio Series is doing with regards to the 6 movies: spacing them out, not doing them all at once. Do a wave where it has half G1, a few Armada, maybe an RiD guy, and throw in a random Prime figure for fun.

[adamage1]

A long-ish post with valid points that I won't fully repost to save space

Heck, they straight up said we haven't gotten a proper mainline OPTIMUS in 30 years. I can't even count how many Optimus Prime figures one would have to ignore for that to be a factual statement. We got 5 mainline Optimus Primes and an exclusive one from Hasbro alone during the Prime Wars Trilogy, not even counting Takara stuff like Ginrai.

As in a proper representation of the G1 model of Optimus Prime in scale, which is 100% accurate. PotP was a kind of half-attempt, but was out-of-scale as a leader and utilized a gimmick of “shell armor” to create the silhouette, and not very well. Siege was the first real G1 model-based figure, in proper scale, with no gimmicks to create the final figure. Yes, it has a bit of kibble due to the “Cybertronian” style, but that’s understandable. In fact, Siege seems to be the first mainline offering that actually cares about scale between the figures, save for Jetfire who I would say is a bit too large (he is essentially on par with combiners).

[Microbot]

Earthrise still has plenty of time to 'redeem' itself with some interesting designs or obscure characters. I'm just worried those hope will be dashed if it turns out Ironworks is like the only one.

If Ironworks of all things is a thing in this line then I wouldn't be worried, Siege had plenty of obscure characters.

People focus way more on the negative aspects while not paying as much attention to the positive stuff.

Also the Micromasters and the Shield guy?

...okay, see, that right there is why you don't get that complaint: the thing that people who say that (which include me on certain days) are complaining about is exactly the thing you want, from what it sounds like. Multiple of these characters have received updates in those 30 years you mentioned, some of them multiple times, but I guess figures like T30 Springer, who's amazing, don't count as a "proper" Springer because he isn't a blocky lumpman 100% G1 accurate with nothing new?

Then again, I didn't grow up with G1, so I guess it's difficult for me to understand your point of view too. From my POV though, people who want just G1 updates get what they want right now and they STILL complain (who cares what color Earthrise Prime's HANDS are?!), while those who want more than JUST G1 S1-2 again or maybe don't even like G1 get thrown a bone with maybe....2-5% of what gets put out in Generations?

I don't think you understand either.

How is this




Faithful to this?




Thrilling 30 Springer is a fantastic Springer but it's not "the" original G1 design at all, that is the IDW comic design which is quite different.




Now this? This is a way more faithful version




You can make the same argument for characters like Jetfire, Ironhide/Ratchet, Omega Supreeme, Shockwave etc

They didn't have proper toys based on their original beloved G1 designs which tend to be the versions many people like, that's why there are complaints about Earthrise Prime's hands being not blue, blue hands is the proper color of the character and most people are not painters so it's a disappointment to them.

Basically the idea is that people want toys in the exact or close to designs of the characters that they love, it's like if people got a Star Wars Luke Skywalker action figure but it did not look like Luke at all.

AMEN!

[Nathaniel Prime]

It's hard for a person like me to exist, because it's practically impossible to get a middle ground in things like this. I am a person who loves all of Transformers. So when things like this come up, I struggle to make a choice!

G1 Springer is great! And the Siege figure is awesome! But IDW Springer is also great! And the T30 figure is awesome!

If I could, I would get them all. If it looks cool and plays cool, I'm all for it. That's what I strive for in a toy. I dont care how accurate it is to the source, or what the altmode looks like, or whatever. Just gimme a cool, posable dude or dudette, and I'll be happy.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

It's hard for a person like me to exist, because it's practically impossible to get a middle ground in things like this. I am a person who loves all of Transformers. So when things like this come up, I struggle to make a choice!

G1 Springer is great! And the Siege figure is awesome! But IDW Springer is also great! And the T30 figure is awesome!

If I could, I would get them all. If it looks cool and plays cool, I'm all for it. That's what I strive for in a toy. I dont care how accurate it is to the source, or what the altmode looks like, or whatever. Just gimme a cool, posable dude or dudette, and I'll be happy.

Just have both if you want both! It's why I'm ok with so many movie Primes and Bees and such: many of them are doing very different things and looking very different.

I did not get Siege Springer because I have no connection to him, but I love T30 Springer cause that is my Springer. If I did care for G1 Springer, I would have gotten him and enjoyed both. there isn't really a "definitive" in my collection

[Nathaniel Prime]

It's hard for a person like me to exist, because it's practically impossible to get a middle ground in things like this. I am a person who loves all of Transformers. So when things like this come up, I struggle to make a choice!

G1 Springer is great! And the Siege figure is awesome! But IDW Springer is also great! And the T30 figure is awesome!

If I could, I would get them all. If it looks cool and plays cool, I'm all for it. That's what I strive for in a toy. I dont care how accurate it is to the source, or what the altmode looks like, or whatever. Just gimme a cool, posable dude or dudette, and I'll be happy.

Just have both if you want both! It's why I'm ok with so many movie Primes and Bees and such: many of them are doing very different things and looking very different.

I did not get Siege Springer because I have no connection to him, but I love T30 Springer cause that is my Springer. If I did care for G1 Springer, I would have gotten him and enjoyed both. there isn't really a "definitive" in my collection

Precisely my thoughts. I have little connection to characters beyond what they look like and what I've seen from the media. Beyond the '86 movie, I know next to nothing about Springer. I just like his look, and both the G1 design and IDW design look great to me, and both scream "Springer". I dont think I would have a definitive collection either. There's just too much greatness to decide on just one. That's why I've got multiple Primes

[Jelze Bunnycat]

It's hard for a person like me to exist, because it's practically impossible to get a middle ground in things like this. I am a person who loves all of Transformers. So when things like this come up, I struggle to make a choice!

G1 Springer is great! And the Siege figure is awesome! But IDW Springer is also great! And the T30 figure is awesome!

If I could, I would get them all. If it looks cool and plays cool, I'm all for it. That's what I strive for in a toy. I dont care how accurate it is to the source, or what the altmode looks like, or whatever. Just gimme a cool, posable dude or dudette, and I'll be happy.

T30 Springer has been redecoed as Cloud Hot Rodimus so while more expensive and harder to get, it'll take the edge of "but I already have a main version of that character!" if you just want the mold. Or just get Sandstorm and hope he won't get a remake