The Energon Pub

Sitcom shows you think got better or worse after a star left. Example: Richie from Happy days. Diane from Cheers.

Personally I loved the happy days episodes after Richie left. When the show was handed 100% to the fonze. the Happy days show just seemed more exciting & less country. the 100% fonzie happy days show had a cool edge to it.

I think the cheers show was leaps & bounds more awful when diane left. not due to diane being gone but due to how weird the other characters evoulved. I didn't care for the sam character after diane was gone. I didn't care to see sam recliam his bachelor dating glory days. I would have prefferd a few more years with diane & sam getting married,having a few kids & becomming a more family show. I also dis-liked woody getting more screen time+dialogue words spoken. While I think rebecca was way more beautiful than diane,the chemistry of rebecca being at the cheers bar never really made sense for cheer. I think my most dis-liked cheers member will always be diane. I thought the pairing of norm & cliff was well done.

Roseanne, while not exactly a great show to begin with, got exceptionally worse when John Goodman left. He provided a nice flip side to Roseanne, without him there, she just took even more of a centre stage, and that's never a good thing.

Burn wrote:Roseanne, while not exactly a great show to begin with, got exceptionally worse when John Goodman left. He provided a nice flip side to Roseanne, without him there, she just took even more of a centre stage, and that's never a good thing.

Ditto.

Of course, 2 and 1/2 Men took a dive after Charlie, and not because of Ashton Kutcher, but because of lame material. Alan is now the central character, and he's only more annoying. I admit I still watch the show out of respect for its 8 first quality seasons, hoping for an improvement, or, by a miracle, Charlie's return.

Also, most of you won't remember this, but Kathleen Kinmont left at the end of the 4th season of Renegade, because she divorced Lorenzo Lamas. The show still kicked ass, but she was missing eye candy.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Burn wrote:Roseanne, while not exactly a great show to begin with, got exceptionally worse when John Goodman left. He provided a nice flip side to Roseanne, without him there, she just took even more of a centre stage, and that's never a good thing.

Ditto.

Of course, 2 and 1/2 Men took a dive after Charlie, and not because of Ashton Kutcher, but because of lame material. Alan is now the central character, and he's only more annoying. I admit I still watch the show out of respect for its 8 first quality seasons, hoping for an improvement, or, by a miracle, Charlie's return.

Also, most of you won't remember this, but Kathleen Kinmont left at the end of the 4th season of Renegade, because she divorced Lorenzo Lamas. The show still kicked ass, but she was missing eye candy.

Wasn't john goodman in a few episodes of the last season of Roseanne. I remember John Goodman being in the first few episodes & the last episode. I always thought john goodman was way too busy with his movie career & he didn't have time to do that many episodes of the last season of roseanne.

I remember that john goodman got a bit upset when roseanne's husband tom arnold joined the cast for a few season. maybe this is why john goodman didn't do that many last season episodes. I think tom arnold wasn't in the last few seasons of the roseanne show. however tom arnold might have been annoying behind the scenes. as roseanne let tom arnold write a few script episodes,cater to the live crowd & whatever else.

Roseanne Barr hated John Goodman and the feeling was mutual. The success of the show really did go to her head.

Burn wrote:Roseanne Barr hated John Goodman and the feeling was mutual. The success of the show really did go to her head.

Why did they hate each other? I mean, I can understand him hating her because she was (and became and even bigger) annoying bitch, but he seems likable.

I would imagine he was the more popular one, let's face it. She had a sitcom. He starred on that sitcom plus had movie roles.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Burn wrote:Roseanne Barr hated John Goodman and the feeling was mutual. The success of the show really did go to her head.

Why did they hate each other? I mean, I can understand him hating her because she was (and became and even bigger) annoying bitch, but he seems likable.

This is my opinion below,i might be wrong.

I think it was 2 factors why john goodman hated roseanne bar. (1) when roseanne barr married tom arnold. roseanne added her husband tom arnold as a cast member on the show. even after tom arnold was no longer on the show. tom arnold was still hanging around the set by writting episodes scripts & entertaining the live audience crowd. roseanne forced & bullied to get her husband on the show/behind the scenes. this upset john goodman,as he cared about the show & didn't like taking orders from tom arnold. (2)Roseanne barr was in major control of the show. she called the shots,roseanne helped write the episode scripts. john goodman might have had no say in the direction of the show. john goodman didn't like being forced to work with tom arnold nor take orders from tom arnold.

Roseanne barr most likely hated john goodman because he complained too much about her & her husband. roseanne barr was also most likely jealous of john goodmans popularity & the fact he was beccoming a bigger star than she was on the roseanne show,in movies & elsewhere.

Rodimus Prime wrote:Of course, 2 and 1/2 Men took a dive after Charlie, and not because of Ashton Kutcher, but because of lame material. Alan is now the central character, and he's only more annoying. I admit I still watch the show out of respect for its 8 first quality seasons, hoping for an improvement, or, by a miracle, Charlie's return.

I am not a kutcher fan so I have not seen any new episodes. I hope the show is cancelled now as Sheen WAS the show IMHO..

Cyber Bishop wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:Of course, 2 and 1/2 Men took a dive after Charlie, and not because of Ashton Kutcher, but because of lame material. Alan is now the central character, and he's only more annoying. I admit I still watch the show out of respect for its 8 first quality seasons, hoping for an improvement, or, by a miracle, Charlie's return.

I am not a kutcher fan so I have not seen any new episodes. I hope the show is cancelled now as Sheen WAS the show IMHO..

Yeah, Charlie was definitely the reason the show did well. But its decline in quality is not due to Kutcher, but the lack of direction of the show. It's like they're recycling stuff just because a new guy is there.

NewsRadio after Phil Hartmann was killed. Jon Lovitz was great on the show, but Phil Hartmann was greater. I guess the same could be said for SNL.

I'm gonna go obscure here and say the the "Sanford and Son" series. The actor? Demond Wilson AKA Lamont Sanford.


You ever heard of "Sanford and Son"? Probably - yes. One of the funniest shows ever on American TV!

You heard of the spin-off/follow-up "Sanford" (without Lamont)? I'm guessing no. Hell, I didn't even know it existed until a year or two ago.

Good topic, although I hated later Happy Days and loved later Cheers.

I know we have a lor of Star Trek fans here - DS9 got much worse during the final year after the great Dax swap. Also, even though it was later "fixed", what about the Dukes of Hazard when they shipped out Bo and Luke?

Married... With Children was a lot funnier with Jefferson than with Steve.

Rodimus Prime wrote:Married... With Children was a lot funnier with Jefferson than with Steve.

Very true. Ted McGinley did much better on that show than Happy Days. Jefferson was funny, Steve was just creepy.

Delicon wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:Married... With Children was a lot funnier with Jefferson than with Steve.

Very true. Ted McGinley did much better on that show than Happy Days. Jefferson was funny, Steve was just creepy.

Though Steve's later guest appearances were really funny, especially when he pretended to be a big shot even though he was a limo driver.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Delicon wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:Married... With Children was a lot funnier with Jefferson than with Steve.

Very true. Ted McGinley did much better on that show than Happy Days. Jefferson was funny, Steve was just creepy.

Though Steve's later guest appearances were really funny, especially when he pretended to be a big shot even though he was a limo driver.

I liked the steve persona more & dis-liked the jefferson persona.

I felt the over-all show suffered & went down hill when steve left.

I think the real reason steve left was because he didn't like the way his character was being drastically changed during the show's progress.

dinogeist wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Delicon wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:Married... With Children was a lot funnier with Jefferson than with Steve.

Very true. Ted McGinley did much better on that show than Happy Days. Jefferson was funny, Steve was just creepy.

Though Steve's later guest appearances were really funny, especially when he pretended to be a big shot even though he was a limo driver.

I liked the steve persona more & dis-liked the jefferson persona.

I felt the over-all show suffered & went down hill when steve left.

I think the real reason steve left was because he didn't like the way his character was being drastically changed during the show's progress.

Maybe my memory is rusty, but I don't remember a lot of changes in the character during his run as a regular. He started creepy and was always creepy. When Jefferson replaced him, you not only got someone who was much funnier than Steve, but also gave the other characters someone better to play off of.

Delicon wrote:

dinogeist wrote:I think the real reason steve left was because he didn't like the way his character was being drastically changed during the show's progress.

Maybe my memory is rusty, but I don't remember a lot of changes in the character during his run as a regular. He started creepy and was always creepy. When Jefferson replaced him, you not only got someone who was much funnier than Steve, but also gave the other characters someone better to play off of.

He wasn't serious, he's just being a troll.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Delicon wrote:

dinogeist wrote:I think the real reason steve left was because he didn't like the way his character was being drastically changed during the show's progress.

Maybe my memory is rusty, but I don't remember a lot of changes in the character during his run as a regular. He started creepy and was always creepy. When Jefferson replaced him, you not only got someone who was much funnier than Steve, but also gave the other characters someone better to play off of.

He wasn't serious, he's just being a troll.

I wasn't trolling.

Personally from my point of view everyone on the married with children show was portrayed as creepy & weird. I honestly think steve was the only normal one of the bunch.

Here's a quicky run down of all the creepy & weird married with childred actors/actresses.

1-Al bundy,worked at a shoe store in the mall,made minium wage. drove a outdatted broken down car. put his hand down his pants when he watched TV. Made fun & laughed at almost everyone. Created that "no maam" club. had zero aspirations to get a diffgerent job. lived in the past. hated being married. treated his wife & kids with dis-respect. never bothered to feed his dog. wasn't that bright,once waited for a promised pizza for days starring at the door. borrowed money via a loan twice at steve & marcy's bank & got both of them fired,and the list goes on.

2-Peggy bundy,dressed like a steeet walker & her clothes were 30+years outdatted. never cooked,didn't care if the family ate or not. used all the money on herself. was cough potato to the extreme. was lazy didn't do any house work. went to male strip clubs with marcy.

3- bud bundy,was over obsessed with girls/women. got made fun of for not being appealing to the oppossite sex. made fun of & played cruel pranks on his sister. went to female strip clubs on a daily basis. got made fun of by the family for being the most inferior bundy of the lot.

4- kelley bundy,was a teenager & she dated men over the age of 18. she dated some older guys & used them for their money. she dressed like a street walker. wasn't that bright.

5-steve rhoades,had a high paying job at a bank.always over dressed. was smart,funny.

6-marcy rhoades,got meaner & more bossy as the series progressed.

7- Jefferson Darcy,Used marcy for her money,use to steal money & credit cards from marcy. got a weekly allowance from marcy.
never had a full time 40+hour weekly job. was a member of the "no maam" club. use to mock & make fun of marcy behind her back.

Someone get me a ban hammer. I'm sick of this idiocy.

Rodimus Prime wrote:Married... With Children was a lot funnier with Jefferson than with Steve.

It was inconsequential. The show was always about Al.

The final season of That 70s Show, with Eric gone and Kelso hardly there blew. That new guy just didn't have any real chemistry with the rest of the cast.

And The Office without Michael Scott (Steve Carrell) hasn't been as good. It would be okay if it was just Andy as the new boss (which makes sense since he's the most similar to Michael), and I don't like that new boss guy.

I'm currently working my way through M*A*S*H* and I liked Colonel Potter (RIP) and BJ Honeycutt, but I don't like it once they replaced Frank Burns with Charles Emerson Winchester III. He's a deeper character, but IMO Frank Burns was a more likeable bad guy.

dinogeist wrote:I think the real reason steve left was because he didn't like the way his character was being drastically changed during the show's progress.

Two things..

1.- It had nothing to do with him caring about his character being drasticly changed. David Garrison (Steve) first love was theater and his contract playing the role of Steve on married with Children was interferring with that. He asked to be let out of his contract early.

2.- How many times are you going to change your screen name?


Also i don't believe Steve was any more normal than any of the other characters. Steve was largly a pompass ass who thought he was better than everyone including his wife. If memorey serves me correct he even had a prised Mercades that he wouldn't even let Marcy breath on.
So i wouldn't exactly cast that as any more messed up than the rest of the cast characters.