Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

Posted: **Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:47 pm**

*grabs popcorn*

Posted: **Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:48 pm**

Seibertron wrote:Not surprised about Megaupload. Curious to hear more about it.

Just remember ... we weren't advocating stopping the US government from stopping known piracy websites. We were advocating against stopping SOPA and PIPA which could hurt all sites. If the government wants to legally go after sites that are havens for pirated music, movies, etc ... they can have at it and they should have at it.

Agreed. Just how they did it seems like a violation of personal rights to me.

Posted: **Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:58 pm**

Megauploads demise is a prime example of one of the sore issues with the bills we are fighting. As soon as DCMA was served they removed the content but Megaupload constituted 4% of the entire Internet (source:Megauploads own promotional video), how can any site be expected to filter that much data?

On this basis the accusation that it was a 'haven for pirates' was made and the Feds shut it down. Removing and prosecuting pirates I'm ok with. Taking down a massive resource such as that in this way? Not cool.

Posted: **Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:07 pm**

I'm all for shutting down sites that provide a safe haven for the illegal downloading of pirated music, software, movies, etc. I'm all for the government shutting down sites that violate the law in a legal manner. I'm not informed enough about the MegaUpload situation to have a firm opinion of it but I'm sure a PR firm would probably agree with me that the timing of what the govt did was very poor timing and a very poor decision, especially after the highs of yesterday and while everyone had a protest mentality. I'm against the Anonymous hacker group attacking government websites in retaliation.

Posted: **Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:18 pm**

Just wanted to say that I don't agree with attacking sites that allow people to download music or movies, since this is a resource for people who, through some bad fortune, lost the original movie or music or software that they purchased.
I'm sure a lot of the people who download music or movies probably aren't going to spend that money on the artist even if they could't download it for free, due to being poor to begin with. On top of that, they're basically killing a form of marketing that could serve them in making their name popular, or giving people a reason to love their movies/music/whatever enough to buy it. As for cracking games, well... there aren't enough people with the time/expertise to crack a lot of current games since they are much more complex than previous years, so there isn't much of a dent in funds as a result. (BTW I don't just mean downloading and installing a cracked game, I'm talking about actually getting that downloaded cracked game to work with your particular rig)

Its just greed, plain and simple. I believe people shouldn't have their IP copied blatently to be resold, but thats not the same thing as sites that allow the free download of media.
/rant

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:36 am**

Seibertron wrote:Nice to see fellow Transformers fansites TFormers.com and Allspark.com join the battle as well. Allspark.com is redirecting everyone from their domain to sopastrike.com.

YouTube personality Optibotimus shut his YouTube account down for the day. http://www.youtube.com/optibotimus

Kudos to everyone who does their part to bring attention to this issue!

I signed the petition on wiki or google(can't remember which it was, I was so tired) and will be contacting my rep. I am glad to see some other tf sites partake as well. I wonder why tfw2005 didn't? They just seemed to delete any mention of it from their site.

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:02 am**

The blackout is over, but we are going to keep the petition up.

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:08 pm**

http://www.engadget.com/2012/01/20/pipa ... shed-back/

Looks like the blackouts haven't gone unnoticed. Democracy lives!...for now.

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:53 pm**

Jesterhead wrote:http://www.engadget.com/2012/01/20/pipa-and-sopa-votes-pushed-back/

Looks like the blackouts haven't gone unnoticed. Democracy lives!...for now.

Good that the blackouts went on record.

Judging by the shock that they got, its going to make them think again.

But in seriousness, if they are going to stop illegal activity, shouldn't they first look at themselves? I mean I read earlier on that Simone had commented on the senate being offered 98 million to make a bill that would ultimately shut off everything? Surely being a politician and taking a monetary payment outside of your own ridiculous salary is classed as a bribe? Illegal much?

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:52 pm**

It's over. We win.

Washington, D.C. — House Judiciary Committee Chairman Lamar Smith (R-Texas) today issued the following statement in response to the Senate decision to postpone consideration of legislation to help combat online piracy.

Chairman Smith: “I have heard from the critics and I take seriously their concerns regarding proposed legislation to address the problem of online piracy. It is clear that we need to revisit the approach on how best to address the problem of foreign thieves that steal and sell American inventions and products.

“The problem of online piracy is too big to ignore. American intellectual property industries provide 19 million high-paying jobs and account for more than 60 percent of U.S. exports. The theft of America’s intellectual property costs the U.S. economy more than $100 billion annually and results in the loss of thousands of American jobs. Congress cannot stand by and do nothing while American innovators and job creators are under attack.

“The online theft of American intellectual property is no different than the theft of products from a store. It is illegal and the law should be enforced both in the store and online.

“The Committee will continue work with copyright owners, Internet companies, financial institutions to develop proposals that combat online piracy and protect America’s intellectual property. We welcome input from all organizations and individuals who have an honest difference of opinion about how best to address this widespread problem. The Committee remains committed to finding a solution to the problem of online piracy that protects American intellectual property and innovation.”

The House Judiciary Committee will postpone consideration of the legislation until there is wider agreement on a solution.

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:55 pm**

The House Judiciary Committee will postpone consideration of the legislation until there is wider agreement on a solution.

And by that, they mean they'll try to slip it in 6-12 months later when everybody forgets and the SOPA buzz has died down.

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:55 pm**

WE WOOOOON???? :APPLAUSE:

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 2:42 pm**

Jesterhead wrote:And by that, they mean they'll try to slip it in 6-12 months later when everybody forgets and the SOPA buzz has died down.

From what I read they may just try to slip it in with the anti-child porn bill that's coming up.

And no one's going to oppose an anti-child porn bill.

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 2:49 pm**

Burn wrote:
Jesterhead wrote:And by that, they mean they'll try to slip it in 6-12 months later when everybody forgets and the SOPA buzz has died down.

From what I read they may just try to slip it in with the anti-child porn bill that's coming up.

And no one's going to oppose an anti-child porn bill.

People are already serving hard time for child porn, what's a new bill going to do?

EDIT: Good Lord, "Hard Time" was the worst possible choice of words. Serving time in prison.

Posted: **Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:24 pm**

A relevant, and killer track:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyOw6bWy8X8

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 5:38 am**

Shadowman wrote:
Burn wrote:
Jesterhead wrote:And by that, they mean they'll try to slip it in 6-12 months later when everybody forgets and the SOPA buzz has died down.

From what I read they may just try to slip it in with the anti-child porn bill that's coming up.

And no one's going to oppose an anti-child porn bill.

People are already serving hard time for child porn, what's a new bill going to do?

EDIT: Good Lord, "Hard Time" was the worst possible choice of words. Serving time in prison.

Edit: Actually I looked it up. H.R.1981? It's supposed to keep kids who have... well you know, from having their information on the internet. Child and witness protection stuff for the most part. Also fighting money laundering. If this is the one mentioned, I'll do a little research and keep watching to see if they try ****.

Don't forget SOPA can slipped in with something else or they can overrule the president. THIS IS NOT A VICTORY! And also do not forget about PIPA and S.978 which are still out there.

Also what with MegaUpload down it means no more TV Nihon for my brother. He's kinda infuriated.

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 9:53 am**

Vicalliose wrote:
Shadowman wrote:
Burn wrote:
Jesterhead wrote:And by that, they mean they'll try to slip it in 6-12 months later when everybody forgets and the SOPA buzz has died down.

From what I read they may just try to slip it in with the anti-child porn bill that's coming up.

And no one's going to oppose an anti-child porn bill.

People are already serving hard time for child porn, what's a new bill going to do?

EDIT: Good Lord, "Hard Time" was the worst possible choice of words. Serving time in prison.

Edit: Actually I looked it up. H.R.1981? It's supposed to keep kids who have... well you know, from having their information on the internet. Child and witness protection stuff for the most part. Also fighting money laundering. If this is the one mentioned, I'll do a little research and keep watching to see if they try ****.

Don't forget SOPA can slipped in with something else or they can overrule the president. THIS IS NOT A VICTORY! And also do not forget about PIPA and S.978 which are still out there.

Also what with MegaUpload down it means no more TV Nihon for my brother. He's kinda infuriated.

SOPA could be slipped in with pretty much any other legislation, but its not over yet. The awareness of this bill is now to the point where its being covered in the mainstream media worldwide (BBC even had an article about it in yesterdays lunchtime news) and this will make it much harder to get to slipped through under the radar, even if crowbarred into an unrelated anti- child-porn bill, with the likes of Google, Reddit and Wikipedia watching.

The other thing that the Americans can do is work remove those responsible for this bill from Congress such as Lamar Smith (Also the bill sponsor for H.R.1981). Why would you want someone that's so easily bought by Hollywood representing you, especially when you know that he is only representing whoever pays him the most?

Short of massive political upheaval or an upper limit to amounts that can be 'donated' through bill sponsorship that's really the only long term solution, but its something Amnerica as a whole needs to change, the netizens alone may not be enough.

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:03 am**

Vicalliose wrote:Don't forget SOPA can slipped in with something else or they can overrule the president. THIS IS NOT A VICTORY! And also do not forget about PIPA and S.978 which are still out there.

First off, SOPA hasn't even gotten to the point where it would need to be signed by the president; you can't overrule someone who hasn't even done anything yet. Second, PIPA is exactly as dead as SOPA is.

And S.978 is an amendment to an already-existing bill, about people making money off of streaming copyrighted content.

Vicalliose wrote:Also what with MegaUpload down it means no more TV Nihon for my brother. He's kinda infuriated.

You know they have their own site, right? He never needed to go through Megaupload for that.

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:39 am**

In other news, the 'net is starting to strike back in slightly more constructive ways.

Investment Firm Y Combinator Goes on Offensive Against Hollywood wrote:After the Stop Online Piracy Act and Protect Intellectual Property Act were shelved on Friday, some Web sites and venture capitalists went on the offensive against the people and companies behind the controversial piracy bills.

No idea how effective this will be, when Hollywood began there weren't any copyrighting laws so it was far easier, so isn't a resource these guys have available to them, but I wish them well and will support them any way I can.

This also amused me,

We the people wrote:Investigate Chris Dodd and the MPAA for bribery after he publicly admited to bribing politicans to pass legislation

Needs a few more names on it...

And finally,
Maddox, in probably one of the best SOPA blackout pages on the ney, makes a pseudo-anarchic but very relevant point. (NSFW language, because Maddox)

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 6:40 pm**

Shadowman wrote:First off, SOPA hasn't even gotten to the point where it would need to be signed by the president; you can't overrule someone who hasn't even done anything yet. Second, PIPA is exactly as dead as SOPA is.

I had gotten the impression he'd already vetoed it, but I've been out of the loop for a while so I'm assuming that was just Bull***t being spread around that I should not have listened to. But yeah SOPA has been dragged through the mud. Though considering what Happened to MegaUpload it shows there's already something seriously wrong with how our government views and enforces copyright infringement. Also I wouldn't exactly call SOPA "dead", it's currently lying dormant until a "consensus" can be made and will be brought up for debate later on. No amendments have been made and only three people have pulled from backing the bill.

Shadowman wrote:You know they have their own site, right? He never needed to go through Megaupload for that.

They hosted most of their content there according to him. I wouldn't know since I've never been there anyway.

Shadowman wrote:And S.978 is an amendment to an already-existing bill, about people making money off of streaming copyrighted content.

Define "profit." Edit: So I read the "amendment" on the Library of Congress and yes it really does not amount to much of anything. Yet people talk about it like it's the bill itself... This line here is what bugs me.

Library_of_Congress wrote: `(B)(i) the total retail value of the performances, or the total economic value of such public performances to the infringer or to the copyright owner, would exceed $2,500; or

`(ii) the total fair market value of licenses to offer performances of those works would exceed $5,000;';

Maybe I'm not reading this right, but it seems as though it does not matter whether or not the person is directly making profit off of the streamed content or not.

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 6:54 pm**

Vicalliose wrote:
Shadowman wrote:You know they have their own site, right? He never needed to go through Megaupload for that.
They hosted most of their content there according to him. I wouldn't know since I've never been there anyway.

I did, just to see what it was. It features both torrents and direct downloads, though it's possible the latter goes through Megaupload.

Vicalliose wrote:
Shadowman wrote:And S.978 is an amendment to an already-existing bill, about people making money off of streaming copyrighted content.
Define "profit."

"Making money." As in, "you give someone money, they give you pirated content." I suppose it's the internet equivalent of selling bootleg DVDs.

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 7:34 pm**

Shadowman wrote:
Vicalliose wrote:
Shadowman wrote:You know they have their own site, right? He never needed to go through Megaupload for that.
They hosted most of their content there according to him. I wouldn't know since I've never been there anyway.

I did, just to see what it was. It features both torrents and direct downloads, though it's possible the latter goes through Megaupload.

Vicalliose wrote:
Shadowman wrote:And S.978 is an amendment to an already-existing bill, about people making money off of streaming copyrighted content.
Define "profit."

"Making money." As in, "you give someone money, they give you pirated content." I suppose it's the internet equivalent of selling bootleg DVDs.

If people are actually paying a person directly for streaming the content I believe it should fall under jurisdiction of "infringement." But if we're simply referring to ad revenue (typically used to keep a stream running) then I do not see a problem. Either way, bootlegging typically is most common in places of the world where said bootlegged content is unavailable, or the official variation is too expensive for the person to pay for. This case is similar when said content is given out for free except it could also simply be one person sharing something of theirs with another. It's kind of hard to define "ownership" when so much content is digital now. Generally copyright enforcement is a slam to the lower-class. The concept that Hollywood and other corporate enterprises believe it to be a huge impact on revenue is mind boggling.

Anyway I looked at S.978. The reports were treating it like an entire bill, which it isn't. But if it's an amendment to a bill which already holds similar broad terms, I can see why Mr. Schmitz was arrested.

MegaUpload hosted the majority of direct downloads of subbed tv shows for TV Nihon. No more Kamen Rider for him I guess.

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 8:25 pm**

Vicalliose wrote:If people are actually paying a person directly for streaming the content I believe it should fall under jurisdiction of "infringement." But if we're simply referring to ad revenue (typically used to keep a stream running) then I do not see a problem.

Nope, it's the first one.

Vicalliose wrote:Either way, bootlegging typically is most common in places of the world where said bootlegged content is unavailable, or the official variation is too expensive for the person to pay for.

It's also available in America. In either case, not being able to pay doesn't justify anything.

Vicalliose wrote:It's kind of hard to define "ownership" when so much content is digital now.

No it isn't, it's easier than ever.

Posted: **Sat Jan 21, 2012 8:28 pm**

What brought MegaUpload down was the fact they were paying uploaders.

How did that work?

Simple. A person signs up, pays for a premium account, then uploads content. e.g. movies, tv shows, music etc.

That person then takes the links to the uploaded content and goes to the various forums/websites that are littered across the internet specifically for link sharing.

People then come along, click on the link, and download the uploaded content. The click then generates income for the uploader for which MU paid for.

It was a way to encourage to upload with them rather than one of the many other file hosting companies out there.

Trouble was though, there were plenty of legitimate users out there who have now suffered through MU's take down.

Posted: **Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:44 am**

Shadowman wrote:
Vicalliose wrote:It's kind of hard to define "ownership" when so much content is digital now.

No it isn't, it's easier than ever.

Wow. That's downright stubborn and closed-minded. You a business man yourself?

Hey, let's take a look at things like Steam where all products are directly linked to an identity which is governed by a single company. I do not define any of the content linked to Steam as something I actually own. In general I find it hard to define the ownership of digital content. Hey lets say I have an MP3 player I filled with music tracks I legitimately bought off of Amazon, I get tired of it, so I give it to a friend or family member, but I can still re-download those tracks off Amazon later. Does that friend own that music now or not? You remember back in the 80s when people made mix tapes? The internet has just provided a massive social center where people keep doing what they've been doing for years. In my opinion, if the entertainment industry cannot adapt they should die.

What's more, the fact that art forms have become an industry is just downright wrong to begin with. Art is something you're meant to create because your passionate about it and you want to share it with the world, it's not something people should have to spend money to see or hear, people are meant to give you money because they are also passionate about what you do and want to support you so you can keep doing it.

I suppose the fact that I hate how our economy is in terrible shape and I support reform in order to save it kinda makes my beliefs paradoxical. On the other hand, I simply believe that the world is screwed up in every way and that almost everything that's happened since the founding of America has been a huge mistake. By today's standards I'm basically insane, if the world was not always set on the status quo we've created for ourselves maybe that would not be the case.

Pfff, whatever. :roll:

Burn wrote:A person signs up, pays for a premium account, then uploads content. e.g. movies, tv shows, music etc.

That person then takes the links to the uploaded content and goes to the various forums/websites that are littered across the internet specifically for link sharing.

People then come along, click on the link, and download the uploaded content. The click then generates income for the uploader for which MU paid for.

It was a way to encourage to upload with them rather than one of the many other file hosting companies out there.

Yeah it makes sense. Just another case where going after the uploader would be fruitless so they simply go after the site's owner. Allot of sites provide revenue to people through ads and such, youtube for instance, but it really does not work unless heavily moderated.

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