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Posted: **Sun Apr 09, 2017 1:36 am**

Sodan-1 wrote:I get fed up with people hating on him because "HE GOT OPTIMUS KILLED!"

I don't hate him for that. I hate him because they expect us to believe he's a better leader than Magnus.

Magnus also had the better toy.

Who has the better modern figure?

Magnus.

Face it. Magnus is just better, Rodimus just sucks. :-P

Posted: **Sun Apr 09, 2017 1:42 am**

Agree with lots on this list tho I feel kup and ironhide a bit too samey in a way. My personal list would've included ultra Magnus and mirage... reluctant warriors. Gears the grump... and grapple who perhaps I'm biased because I loved the toy so much but I liked his treatment as an architect so blinded by his need to create something beautiful that he ends up getting hoodwinked...

It's a pity that not enough cons had the same amount of characterisation that the autobots had... few others that aren't on the list come to mind as being memorable. Maybe octane or swindle because of their double crossing nature.. all the others were a variety of cannon fodder or weasels scurrying about.

Posted: **Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:31 am**

So if this is a G1 list, that means the comics as well, right? If so, I agree with the list with a couple of exceptions: I would take out Ironhide and Kup, and replace them with the comic versions of Fortress Maximus and Scorponok. They were done rather well in the books. Especially Spike's reluctant relationship with Max.

Posted: **Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:43 am**

Yeah, a lot of the Decepticons in the cartoon were given the shaft of basically being a thug. Thundercracker and Skywarp, the Cassettes, Reflector, the Coneheads, the Triple Changers, most of the Combiner teams...

Megatron, Starscream, Soundwave, Shockwave and some of the Combaticons were the only ones really saved from that fate before the Movie and Season 3. And even then that only really gave us Galvatron being awesome and Blitzwing's sudden betrayal.

And then fast forward to The Rebirth where half the new 'cons didn't even get lines :lol:

Guess we can chalk up Zarak though, he was decent.

Posted: **Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:45 am**

Rodimus Prime wrote:So if this is a G1 list, that means the comics as well, right? If so, I agree with the list with a couple of exceptions: I would take out Ironhide and Kup, and replace them with the comic versions of Fortress Maximus and Scorponok. They were done rather well in the books. Especially Spike's reluctant relationship with Max.

It's all subjective but personally I'd separate the comics from the cartoon. They were very different mediums with very different tones and writing, it's just not fair to compare the two. The cartoon may be more iconic, but from what I've heard the Marvel characters would take up all 10 spots here.

Posted: **Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:47 am**

Huh? Generation One had characters?! :shock:

Posted: **Sun Apr 09, 2017 9:02 am**

PrymeStriker wrote:Huh? Generation One had characters?!

This is why we need a like button

Posted: **Mon Apr 10, 2017 6:07 am**

Figured I'd put my own here

10 - Blitzwing

A relatively minor villain, but still managed more character development than 90% of the rest of the G1 cast, though that might not be saying very much. His eventual realization that Galvatron was insane (or just a d!ck) finally drove him to turn traitor and help save the Transformers race from the machinations of the Quintessons.

9 - Wheeljack

Everyone's favorite plot-device. The Decepticons often end up with the Autobots over a barrel, but Wheeljack will always conveniently invents something to turn the situation around. Plus he also was instrumental in creating the Dinobots.

8 - Starscream

Outside of Megatron, he was really one of the only Decepticons in season one that had much of a personality, save for a few lines from other members - most of them were reduced to 'grunt' status. He was usually a good fore-shadowing tool for the writers, because he'd frequently point out the flaws in Megatron's plans before they blew up in his face. Plus he added a large amount of comic relief to the show.

7 - Optimus Prime

The uncle\dad\Mary-Sue figure with a shoot-first-ask-questions-later attitude. Optimus is iconic and exemplifies the word "hero" and goes on to prove it by laying his life down to save his friends. He wasn't without flaws and even put Cybertron first when forced to choose between it and Earth (Ultimate Doom). He'd be higher on the list, but simply - hes a bit too perfect and it sometimes makes him bland.

6 - Alpha Trion

Alpha Trion, (or Merlin as he could be called). With so much of the G1 lore wrapped up around the guy, I always find him an easy addition to this kind of list. To many Autobots he is leader, father-figure and sage. His dotted appearances through the series show how Transformers age and give small insights into the non warlike side of the race.

5 - Bumblebee

Our little yellow ball of cheerfulness. Whilst most Autobts either filled a more paternal role or the one of older brother - Bumblebee was clearly the one penned at being your buddy. Small, not very strong but brave, I've always felt in the show he represented that civilian side of the Autobots - essentially the very thing they were fighting to protect.

4 - Megatron

Our original black y-fronted menace. His schemes were often bonkers and riddled with flaws, but it was clear he was the only guy around with enough respect or dominance to actually lead the Decepticons. Its not until the 1986 movie they really showed his utterly ruthless nature. He ranks higher than Optimus for me, because he is a more 'complex' character - at least, more flawed.

3 - Spike

The human element. Essentially representing the 9-year-old viewer, Spike tags along often enough to give the aspect of threat from the Decepticons that might have been lacking if it were just faceless humans running scared or just Autbots getting blasted at. Plus, on more than one occasion, it was Spike who gave Autobots the gusto to carry on when Optimus or Rodimus weren't available. His combination with Cerebros later on to become Fortress Maximus was a clever plot device and one that finally put him on a par with his Autobot friends.

2 - Rodimus Prime

Shacked by the guilt of causing the death of Optimus, who was clearly his idol, Rodimus was profoundly more interesting than his predecessor. He never felt ready for leadership, questioned his decisions and always felt he had something to prove, even going as far to feel like running from his responsibility. Yet despite all this, he still led the Autobots with conviction and I've always found him to be a much more rich character when compared to Optimus.

1 - Zarak

Thats right. My number 1 choice is a Nebulon. Firstly, he has already conquered his home planet and generally ruling it with a rod (tentacle) of iron (steel). Firstly, he abducts the Decepticons that were giving chase to the Autobots and forced them into a partnership that gave the Decepticons their Head\Target Masters, but he also built Scorponok and became its head. He succeeded in chasing off the Autobots from his world and finally, when he came into contact with Galvatron managed to not only prove to be enough of a threat that Galvatron didn't wrestle command of the Head\Targetmasters from him, but at the very end of Rebirth - it seems pretty clear that Galvatron has not only lost his mind again, but Zarak is very much in charge.

Zarak: "Who will rule the Galaxy?"
Galvatron: "ME!"
Zarak: "We shall see Galvatron, we shall see"

Posted: **Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:58 pm**

In regards to Starscream:

I reason that he did put on a bit of a show to try to make himself look less of a threat than he actually was. He's an excellent stratagist, and that was likely why megatron kept him on. But because he was a good strategist, he likely down-played his intelligence and skills a little because megatron likely would have killed him.

Megatron had been entirely corrupted by power which was blinding him as well. Starscream frequently pointed out errors in his plans, reported readings to which Megatron usually ignored. And more often than not, Starscream was correct.

People seem to forget what Starscream's job is.
- To ensure the leader is fit to lead
- to step in when necessary
- to bring problems and issues to the leader attention.

For example. If megatron starts behaving in a manner that is detrimental to the Decepticon cause - Starscream can declare himself in command until the situation is resolved.

Starscream should know most, if not all of Megatron's plans so when Megatron is unable to issue commands (for whatever reason) Starscream can say - Decepticons I am leading, hear me. For the most part, Starscream's declaration of leadership was to indicate he's deemed megatron unable and is taking over in that position.

Yes we know he wants command, and yes he has actually taken action to take command, however those situatons are different from a "Megatron has fallen and I now lead." And yes from time to time Starscream realised he made a colossal error and questioned the respect his peers would ever give him.

Megatron probably keeps him on because:
He needs someone with the gumption to try.
He needs his own well being tested and questioned. It keeps Megatron fit and healthy.
He Needs a good strategist.

Finally it's a kids cartoon, and you need a whipping boy. Starscream was exactly that. Starscream was like a child who wanted to please his father and constantly got belittled and beaten for it, hence he grew to hate him with a passion.

Posted: **Fri Apr 14, 2017 4:51 am**

Burn wrote:
Sodan-1 wrote:I get fed up with people hating on him because "HE GOT OPTIMUS KILLED!"

I don't hate him for that. I hate him because they expect us to believe he's a better leader than Magnus.

Magnus also had the better toy.

Who has the better modern figure?

Magnus.

Face it. Magnus is just better, Rodimus just sucks.

I love Ultra Magnus. I've always felt something of a kinship with him more than any of the other leadership figures. He is a better soldier and military commander, but I'd argue he lacked the personality and social skills* to be the figurehead of the Autobot cause.

(*Again, a certain kinship. :-P

)

Posted: **Fri Apr 14, 2017 8:25 pm**

I'm gonna be honest, a number of these guys are overshadowed by their later incarnations from my perspective, and I'm not so sure it's solely due to me coming into the fandom during the Beast era. Starscream, in particular, is one with notably stronger showings post-G1; even as far back as his guest appearance on Beast Wars you can see a more cunning and proactive version of the character than the G1 cartoon showed, something which Cybertron took and ran with, and which continues to this day. (Megatron isn't even AROUND in RiD, and Starscream is STILL hellbent on taking him down! Guess bad habits are hard to break.

Decepticon Stryker wrote:Keep in mind that Star is a dad. Of a human. Adopted human but still,you don't see Optimus having a relationship like that. Mention Kiss Players and I'll send Death's Head after you.

)

What if I mention Tommy Kennedy? :lol:

Kurona wrote:
PrymeStriker wrote:Huh? Generation One had characters?!

This is why we need a like button

No, this is why we need a favorite button. :APPLAUSE:

Posted: **Sat Apr 15, 2017 7:53 am**

This list is clearly, and most definitely biased. It seems that the character most identified by people on their list depends on when they started watching or grew up loving. Most old people like me wouldn't pick roddhimus or hot rod being on the list. Almost every episode about roddimus was of him lamenting that he''s not a worthy leader, just like the newer comics about Optimus going on about how he was. It a good leader and blah blah. To me, the mentioned of G1 cannot automatically present itself without thinking of of Megatron and Optimus. They ARE the transformers. To place anyone before them is a crime

Posted: **Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:50 am**

President-prime wrote:This list is clearly, and most definitely biased. It seems that the character most identified by people on their list depends on when they started watching or grew up loving. Most old people like me wouldn't pick roddhimus or hot rod being on the list. Almost every episode about roddimus was of him lamenting that he''s not a worthy leader, just like the newer comics about Optimus going on about how he was. It a good leader and blah blah. To me, the mentioned of G1 cannot automatically present itself without thinking of of Megatron and Optimus. They ARE the transformers. To place anyone before them is a crime

william-james88 wrote:These are my opinions (just like movie or game reviews hosted by sites are still just the opinion of one person) so what matters most is what you guys think of the topic or list,....

I hope you realise that your explanation of why william-james88's list and everyone else's opinions is "biased" is exactly the same reason you place Megatron and Optimus in such high regard.

The only way we could get a completely non-biased list is to pass it on to a group of people who hate Transformers. (I've been told they actually exist. :shock:

)

Posted: **Sat Apr 15, 2017 9:53 pm**

President-prime wrote:This list is clearly, and most definitely biased. It seems that the character most identified by people on their list depends on when they started watching or grew up loving. Most old people like me wouldn't pick roddhimus or hot rod being on the list.

But isnt there only 2 years difference between being an 8 year old fan when Optimus is leader and being an 8 year old fan when Hot Rod becomes the leader? I dont see how being so much older makes much of a difference, there is only 2 years apart between their leadership.

In any case, if you (or anyone else) cares, I started watching the G1 cartoon in 2014 when I was 25.

Sodan-1 wrote:The only way we could get a completely non-biased list is to pass it on to a group of people who hate Transformers. (I've been told they actually exist. )

Even then, they would be biased in wanting to piss of tf fans and might just say Wheelie was the best character :lol:

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:36 am**

That's precisely my point. This list is too biased. Everyone has their favorite character. There's no standard for identifying the top 10 "best" G1 characters. You don't identify with certain characters because you haven't been through with them or see how important they are to people at some point in people's life. You identify with characters who are closer to you in some respect. I'm seeing skids, jazz, lazerbeak. Come on, agree or not, no one in this list is as important as Megatron and Optimus (my opinion). This list "is bad comedy."

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:47 am**

@william-James. I really don't agree with you. Like dog years, 2 years in cartoon years is a long time. In 2 seasons, "allegiance," could change. For two years, I ran straight home from school to catch my favorite transformers appear on tv. For two years, Optimus and Megatron have taught me much about life, about good and evil. I have learned from them, only to be taken away by a "hot roddin young punk," who can't understand that "that's Prime's Fight." How can one find that roddimus or hot rod ranked above the legendary leader of "Great War!" How can this, how can that?! Biased. And I mean it in the best way possible. There are no 10 best G1 characters!

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:30 am**

All of Billy-Jim's lists are biased.

That's not a secret. That's a fact.

He (and others who guest contribute) put together these lists based on THEIR opinions. We then throw open the forums to discuss those opinions and to share their own Top X.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:20 am**

Though if we are talking from a non-biased objective standpoint; Rodimus would be the best character in the show purely because he's the only one that had any actual development. Optimus, Starscream, Zarak and Galvatron would also all be up there.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:24 am**

If you want to limit yourself solely to the cartoon, go right ahead.

But there's so much more, heck, factoring in comics, Longtooth was much more interesting than Rodimus Prime.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:26 am**

Burn wrote:If you want to limit yourself solely to the cartoon, go right ahead.

But there's so much more, heck, factoring in comics, Longtooth was much more interesting than Rodimus Prime.

Oh heck yeah, I still haven't read 'em yet (beyond the original 4-parter), but every character that got a smidgen of a spotlight in Marvel sounds far more interesting than anyone on the cartoon. Hence why it's probably not fair to compare them :-P

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:28 am**

Except I'm not comparing them. I based my comments across all mediums, something that's been lacking from this thread (Will even encourages people to NOT limit their opinions to the cartoon)

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:31 am**

Burn wrote:Except I'm not comparing them. I based my comments across all mediums, something that's been lacking from this thread (Will even encourages people to NOT limit their opinions to the cartoon)

True, but again, I just find it unfair to lump them in together - like I said earlier, Marvel would just take up every single slot on the list. It's almost like being asked to make a top 10 list of the best moments from Citizen Kane and the Thomas the Tank Engine movie. Not quite that extreme of course, but there's such a large disparity that I'd prefer to keep them separate.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:54 am**

Burn wrote:He (and others who guest contribute) put together these lists based on THEIR opinions. We then throw open the forums to discuss those opinions and to share their own Top X.

This is why I sometimes try to splice in my own top 10, which is exactly what I thought the whole point of the top 10\5 lists were for. Not some definitive list.

Kurona wrote:Though if we are talking from a non-biased objective standpoint; Rodimus would be the best character in the show purely because he's the only one that had any actual development. Optimus, Starscream, Zarak and Galvatron would also all be up there.

Development is exactly why I put Blitzwing in mine. Guy barely does anything in season 2, but shows a whole heap of depth in one episode in season 3. The comics, obviously, would seriously change the list, if I started putting Marvel, Dreamwave or IDW in.

I guess picking the G1 cartoon is a safe bet on targeting the broadest 'audience' of familiarity.

I love reading these lists, because other peoples opnions are cool and in fandom, you're never truly going to get 100% pure objective journalism.

Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:29 pm**

How did i miss this list?!? LOVE IT.

I especially dig the Top 5!

Posted: **Mon Jul 03, 2017 11:36 am**

Neat list! Starscream is definitely my absolute favourite- even if he's not exactly a deep and nuanced character, he was just so goddamn funny. RIP Chris Latta you magnificent man.

Others I'd nominate would be...
>Soundwave. He's just plain cool, and he has the best gimmick.
>Scrapper, at least in Heavy Metal War. He gets some pretty neat lines, and he delivers them perfectly. He actually sounds pretty menacing, all things considered- and he and Hook get some of the best lines ever.

"It's bad news, Scrapper. They've brought out the heavy artillery!"
"Then it's time we do the same! Only heavier!"

>Jazz. He's voiced by Scatman Crothers for crying out loud, AKA the Number One Super Guy himself. He just oozes coolness, helped by the fact he transforms into one of the most iconic racing cars ever made, and he was, IMO, the best "down with the humans" Transformer ever made. Like, who wouldn't want a Martini Porsche with the voice of Scatman Crothers as their friend?
>Arcee. She's like a cool big sister, and she's also completely adorable. Like, sure she's a stereotypical 80s obligatory action girl, but that's not an inherently bad thing, and she's one of the best of that archetype. She's not a deep, complex character, but she doesn't need to be- she's just a kickass but cute soldier girl who feels like one of the cast. No stupid "tragic" backstory, no over-emphasised character flaws, no Mary Sue features, no edginess or whatever, she's just a really likeable female character.
>Bumblebee. It's a shame the fandom have had quite enough of Bumblebee, because the G1 character was one of my favourites. He's not a 2kool4skool edgelord or an annoying squeaker, he's a trusty, dependable scout who knows how to think his way out of any problem. Plus, he's a VW Beetle!

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