The Energon Pub

Well. I need help. I recently had the chance to buy the DVD set of Beast Machines. $45. I have never seen this, but was told that it's a darker version of Beast Wars, with a poopy ending. I love Beast Wars, and I remember seeing Beast Machines toys when it first came out, and not being impressed. So, I need opinions and recommendations from TF fans who know what's going on with this series to help me decide whether I should get it or not. $45 is a lot to take a chance on. Thanks.

Beast Machines, well, it is a weird series, without spoilers: while it is a good continuation of Beast Wars in one point of view (the fate of the maximals and Megatron are very awesomely written) and the animation of machines in the series is good, the downside of the series is the maximals abilities and transformation: they are practically morphing rather transforming, and have quasi-magical abilities... And the most negative turn had Rattrap, they completely changed him...

If I had to rate, this series is better than any japanese series, but worse than BW, G1 or Animated.

From the price I can't say it's good or not, where I live, it would be a fair price (but we need to import almost everything)

Beast Machines ... ahhhh the series that is loathed by many.

It has it's flaws, yet overall I didn't mind it. It was different, the good guys were the underdogs, Megatron was truly truly evil, and a little insane, building on the madness that BW Megatron had.

The ending, yeah, the ending sucked.

$45, well not sure if that's a good price for the boxset, I had to buy the four individual volumes here in Australia and that worked out to roughly the same price.

Just go for it, it's not that bad of a series, but it's a series your best forming your own opinion of and not going off someone elses.

Burn wrote:Beast Machines ... ahhhh the series that is loathed by many.

It has it's flaws, yet overall I didn't mind it. It was different, the good guys were the underdogs, Megatron was truly truly evil, and a little insane, building on the madness that BW Megatron had.

The ending, yeah, the ending sucked.

$45, well not sure if that's a good price for the boxset, I had to buy the four individual volumes here in Australia and that worked out to roughly the same price.

Just go for it, it's not that bad of a series, but it's a series your best forming your own opinion of and not going off someone elses.

Same opinion as you Burn I just wish that Madman got the rights instead of Sony as we would got a cool crapload of extras.

Its a good continuation of beastwars, not as good as beastwars was, but still well written and much darker.
my only 2 complaints would the the suckage we got for an ending, and the quasi-morphing that the maximals had for transforms.

If you buy it be prepared, I think I've found like 2 jokes in it the rest is depressing darkness.
It's basically the show you've always wanted as a TF fan, dark, mature, no nonsense with death, hell the show starts with total homicide.
I like it, kinda but yea Rattrap sucks in the show.

Actually it was more genocide than homicide.

Beast Machines; a great series in theory, but not executed as well as it could have been. Still very much worth your while in watching. It is a dark series, in terms of both story and animation (no joke there are some scenes where you cannot see anything without turning the brightness levels right up).

Not sure that $45 is a good price, guess it is up to each individual as to what each series is worth paying for.

If you have seen the toyline before, you know that this is most likely the one Transformers series that will set your wallet back the least amount of $$$ when it comes to buying the showcast.

Hey,
I highly recommend Beast Machines. Everybody here is right, It takes a bit o' getting used to, but man. For me, it was worth it. They really took care in how they were writing it, for better or for worse. They also took some chances that got wildy mixed opinions from fans. It is dark, they go interesting places(and make some great homages) with/to TF mythos; I don't want to give anything away. I'll mostly agree with those here who said the ending was lackluster, but it wasn't terrible. Personally, I just wanted more after such storytelling(there was a cartoon due to pick up where it left off, but that cartoon was scrapped pre-pro in favor of 'Car Robots/RID'.
I feel, also, what they did with the characters was great. Primal, Megatron, and Ratrap, especially, stood out for me. I thought everyones' maturations worked well, and Ratrap found himself and a more 'lego-y' place on the team.
Done preachin', hope this helped. I'd totally pay $45 for the set.

OK, thanks everyone. Helped me a great deal. BTW, for me, spoilers welcome. I am not one who is afraid of them Anyway, I think I will get it, but maybe look up some eps on YouTube.

Most people tend to hate Beast Machines and I offten feel like I'm the only one who actully likes the series. Or at least I'm in a minority group.

Yes, they're ugly designs and they don't really "transform" rather they morph from one mode to another. But once you get passed the design aspect of the series it's fine.

The ending, who said it was a crappy ending? It was an epic Optimus vs. Megatron fight that we'll probly never see anything quite that cool ever again and I wish they'd make a toy of that Megatron. I'm not going to spoil it but I will say Megatron has a few different forms in Beast Machines and there is a toy of his finnal form but it's not a Megatron toy.

There is one huge major dissapointment in the story. If you're a Rhinox fan, don't get it. People have complained that Beast Machines ruined everyone's characters from Beast Wars but Rhinox is the only one I thought was really ruined. Everyone else changed but it was a more acceptible change I think like Cheetor being more mature than he was in Beast Wars.

Rodimus Prime wrote:OK, thanks everyone. Helped me a great deal. BTW, for me, spoilers welcome. I am not one who is afraid of them Anyway, I think I will get it, but maybe look up some eps on YouTube.

Rattrap's robot mode is basically Pinoccio on wheels and made of metal and organic material.

Rial Vestro wrote:The ending, who said it was a crappy ending? It was an epic Optimus vs. Megatron fight that we'll probly never see anything quite that cool ever again and I wish they'd make a toy of that Megatron.

I think you'll find most people are referring the scene AFTER the fight as the "crappy ending".

There is one huge major dissapointment in the story. If you're a Rhinox fan, don't get it. People have complained that Beast Machines ruined everyone's characters from Beast Wars but Rhinox is the only one I thought was really ruined. Everyone else changed but it was a more acceptible change I think like Cheetor being more mature than he was in Beast Wars.

I don't think they ruined Rhinox's character one bit. I feel it actually gave more depth to the character. He was probably the least fleshed out character in BW and BM gave us a deeper look at what makes Rhinox think, and shows us that he's not just a bot that follows the Maximal propoganda but can actually think for himself and take action to do what he feels is best for the great majority.

Burn wrote:I don't think they ruined Rhinox's character one bit. I feel it actually gave more depth to the character. He was probably the least fleshed out character in BW and BM gave us a deeper look at what makes Rhinox think, and shows us that he's not just a bot that follows the Maximal propoganda but can actually think for himself and take action to do what he feels is best for the great majority.

Re-conned by the official BotCon (and later Club) Fiction where it's part Megatron messing with his spark and part his own decision.

He later atones for his actions as Tankor in one of the stories.

I'm not sure I agree with him being poorly fleshed out in the BW stories either. He's the gentle giant who shows a great deal of loyalty to his friends. He's shown caring about nature in BW and believing in other wordly stuff at different and important times (like rescuing Primal's spark at the start of season 2).

It's a stretch to believe he's willing to tech out an entire world and steal the souls of millions of lifeforms.

ahh but I always felt he should have gotten more screen time in BW. He was a great character but they seemed to give more attention to all the others instead of him. Who knows what was going through his processor all the time.

If you have an open mind Beast Machines is by far the BEST Transformers TV show. It has great charcaters, action, suspense, and something that shows like RiD, Armada, Energon, Cybertron and Aminated all lacked: intellengce. If you have a closed mind then it's a waste of your time and money.

Burn wrote:

Rial Vestro wrote:The ending, who said it was a crappy ending? It was an epic Optimus vs. Megatron fight that we'll probly never see anything quite that cool ever again and I wish they'd make a toy of that Megatron.

I think you'll find most people are referring the scene AFTER the fight as the "crappy ending".

You mean the scene at the end where everything is technorganic and Waspinator appears to have adopted a new alt mode that looked like a size accurate wasp with Thrust's head. I'm actully a little bit suprised they didn't just use the design for Buzzsaw sence he was a technorganic Wasp and it would of allowed for Hasbro to make a Repaint.

There is one huge major dissapointment in the story. If you're a Rhinox fan, don't get it. People have complained that Beast Machines ruined everyone's characters from Beast Wars but Rhinox is the only one I thought was really ruined. Everyone else changed but it was a more acceptible change I think like Cheetor being more mature than he was in Beast Wars.

I don't think they ruined Rhinox's character one bit. I feel it actually gave more depth to the character. He was probably the least fleshed out character in BW and BM gave us a deeper look at what makes Rhinox think, and shows us that he's not just a bot that follows the Maximal propoganda but can actually think for himself and take action to do what he feels is best for the great majority.

Um... I think you need you need to rewatch both Beast Wars and Beast Machines. BW Rhinox was the team's medic and a verry capable fighter in battle though most of the time he choose to stay out of fights unless absolutly nessisary. You've allso said he didn't get enough screen time but that's not really accurate unless you only count battle sceens in which case he got about as much as Tigatron and Airrazor. Actully he got MORE screen time than both of them sence they never offically joined the Maximals. (as in they weren't liveing in the Axalon.)

Allthough Rhinox wasn't seen in many battle scenes he was seen makeing repairs to his friends, the Axalon, and even the original Optimus Prime. Rhinox allso built and installed the Axalon's security system.

Rhinox wasn't one to belive that violence was the answer, he spent ALOT of time thinking up other possible solutions to problems resorting to battle ONLY when there was no other choise.

BM Rhinox was the exact OPPISITE of all that. He used his weapons alot more than his brain and when he did use his brain it was to either create or steal more weapons. He had Rhinox's voice, and inteligence but that character was no longer BW Rhinox. He was corrupted by Tankor's programming.

I think Silverbolt was corrupted a little bit too but not nearly as bad and/or he was just remorcefull of what he did as Jetstorm. At any rate his character was not like he was in BW but he was still a Maximal and he got back togeather with Blackarachnia at the end.

At any rate, I do not belive for an instant that the same Maximal who saved the lives of not 1 but 2 Optimus' could ever try to obliterate and entire race.

I wched the ending of the final episode on YouTubve. It wasn't bad. I thought Primal and Megs would have a bigger fight, but whatever. What i like in a series is an intriguing story with some mystery and action comedy. Beast wars had all that. Looks like I will be buying this.

Rial, please don't patronise me by telling me to watch BW & BM again, i've done so numerous times.

You have your opinion of Rhinox, I have mine. Neither are necessarily right, nor are they necessarily wrong. You perceive him in one way, I perceive him differently. It's that simple.

End of discussion.

Burn wrote:Rial, please don't patronise me by telling me to watch BW & BM again, i've done so numerous times.

You have your opinion of Rhinox, I have mine. Neither are necessarily right, nor are they necessarily wrong. You perceive him in one way, I perceive him differently. It's that simple.

I didn't say that to patronize you or because I dissagree with your opinion.

I said it because you talk about BW Rhinox as if he was some backround character who never got screen time. I could name off a list of characters who had less screen time than Rhinox and still were more fleshed out characters than you made Rhinox out to be.

Hell throughout all of the best Erra, while Predacons have come and gone the Maximals continued to have the same core cast for the entire series. Optimus Primal, Cheetor, Rattrap, and Rhinox. Granted he was a Vehicon for the last part of his career but the 4 Maximals who started the seires were there till the end.

So sence when does a core cast member not get enough screen time? He had just as much time on screen as the other 3.

You can have your own opinion on him but if that opinion is going to be based on a belife that Rhinox didn't get enough screen time then I'm going to correct you on it. It's not your opinion that I'm saying is wrong, it's the statement that Rhinox didn't have as much screen time as the other Maximals. Maybe that's your opinion too but it looked like you were stateing it as a fact to me and the real fact is, Rhinox had just as much screen time as the other 3 core cast members.

If I remember correctly, one of the shows Beast Machines was competing with was Gundam Wing. Which got very slow and heavy and serious, especially _Endless Waltz_ (oh my GOD it felt endless!). That was doing super well over on Cartoon Network, so it's possible that the writers felt that a 'funny' series was not right to compete--that they should try to be just as heavy and dark and serious as the Gundam stuff.

Minus, of course, the bishonen.

HK, always gotta bring up the bishonen.

Lol even Simon Furman thinks Beast Machines was too serious and dark.

The story is by far the best thought out and fleshed out I have seen in mythos. As much as I love several of the others. Beast Machines is well written and animated.
When I watched it I actually didnt like it because the designs were so wildly different. and yes they morph. lol
As has been said already most dont like the ending. But in my opinion it was my favorite episode of BM for two reasons. EPIC fight. and "Till all are one" comes to fruition and wraps up the G1 cartoon continuity

You know, as I think about it, beating up Beast Machines for the ending is kind of unfair. As far as my memory serves, it seems that most TF cartoon series have ended rather hastily/lamely/abruptly. About halfway through the last season of Beast Wars, for example, you could practically hear someone in the production room yelling, 'hey, chop chop! let's wrap it up!'. And the *entirety* of Season Three of TFA had that hasty-sloppy feel.

HK, but maybe I just like Strika.

I strongly recommend Beast Machines, simply for its brilliant story telling as well as its a great sequal to Beast Wars. The only cons of it being that Rattrap's robot mode is abit of a downer and Rhinox went pure evil.

Nevertheless the series is still worth watching.