The Energon Pub

I know I'm not the only one who was dissapointed in Grimlock's treatment in Season 3. For those who don't know what I'm talking about, here are just a few things we were treated to:

-Grimlock's intelligence seems to have decreased even further. Season 1 and 2 he wasn't the smartest Autobot, however he still showed a similance of military intelligence (War of the Dinobots, Atlantas Arise, Desertion of the Dinobots, etc.)
-Grimlock was also given the kiddied down treatment. He seemed more like the Autobot's mascot as opposed to the commander of one of the Autobot's most elite fighting groups. Imagine this Grimlock trying to wrestle leadership from Optimus Prime.
-Grimlock rarely reverted to his Robot mode. About 93% of the time he was in dinosaur mode. To my recolatio the 1 or 2 times we did see his robot mode, I don't remember him speaking.
-Grimlock also seem powered down in comparison to earlier times. There was a time that Grimlock's power rivaled Optimus Prime himselfl. Now he doesn't seem like a serious threat at all.

Obviously all this probably happened because since Dinobots were not on sale any more, there was no need to show case him as was done in the past, however due to his popularity I guess the writers decided to keep him around. Boooooo!!!!

Let's try this instead:
Acording to "Desertion of the Dinobots", it is stated that they do not have any Cybertonium in their bodies. Is it possible that "Cybertonium" is something that is essential for a Transformer's continued and long term effectiveness. Wheeljack and Ratched only made the Dinobots to be a sort of "weapon" for the Autobot team. They were never seen conversing or chillin out with the rest of the Autobots. They were called when necessary, they kicked butt, and they left. Even in the movie they seemed to still have their “power” when Optimus Prime commissioned them to “…destroy Devastator!” (Who had just finished decimating Autobot city almost single handly) Notice though, even though the Dinobots still were fearsome fighters, they started seeming more kiddy than we were used to. (“Me grimlock not kisser, me king.” Would we really see Season 1 or 2 Grimlock allowing Wheelie to ride atop him after using a sling shot to hurt his nose)
I think that it is possible that due to a lack of Cybertonium the Dinobots began to regress. Since they were not meant to be regular team members just battle field “big guns”, Wheeljack didn’t bother to find ways to deal with this situation, possibly because he didn’t know. Now in Season 3, the effects of the Cybertonium lack has rendered the Dinobots much less effective. Think about how many fights in Season 3 the Autobots could have won easily if the Dinobots of old were on the front lines. They rarely fought together by this point, and even in Call of the Primatives, all 5 seemed underpowered compared to the group that used to send Decepticons running. Notice that the only Dinobot robot mode we saw in Season 3 was Grimlock (and that was extremely rare). They could have possibly even lost the ability to Transform between modes. Like all weapons, I’m sure it was proposed to deactivate them, but by this point they’ve been around for so long, it is possible the Autobots decided to just keep them around.
When I look at things this way, it makes it easy for me to accept how one of my favorite elite Autobot teams turned into the Muppets of Transformers. Thanks for nothing Season 3.

Well, the Dinobots did tend to be in dino mode more often then not back in Seasons 1 and 2 as well, not a big surprise as it was their altmodes were more powerful and had better armor. Still, the longer a character is on a show the better the chances are of Flanderization kicking in, and the D'bots were pretty much the only characters to show up in all three seasons.

I can't see how the lack of Cybertonium, would effect the Dinobots in such a degrading way. In fact thinking about it, there are loads of other TF's supposedly built on Earth so technically don't have Cybertonium in them either. The Stunticons, Constructicons, Combaticons for example, and these guys haven't been effected significantly by the lack of Cybertonium.

It's not the absence of Cybertonium that's the problem in season three, its the absence of quality writing.

MightyMagnus78 wrote:It's not the absence of Cybertonium that's the problem in season three, its the absence of quality writing.

Unfortunantly that's so, so, true.

Neo Tallgeese wrote:

MightyMagnus78 wrote:It's not the absence of Cybertonium that's the problem in season three, its the absence of quality writing.

Unfortunantly that's so, so, true.

Agreed, the writers went lazy sue with all of the TF's that didn't have toys on the shelf during season 3.

MightyMagnus78 wrote:I can't see how the lack of Cybertonium, would effect the Dinobots in such a degrading way. In fact thinking about it, there are loads of other TF's supposedly built on Earth so technically don't have Cybertonium in them either. The Stunticons, Constructicons, Combaticons for example, and these guys haven't been effected significantly by the lack of Cybertonium.

It's not the absence of Cybertonium that's the problem in season three, its the absence of quality writing.

It was never said that the Constructicons were "CREATED" on Earth, unlike the other teams you mentioned.

Grimlock most obviously started from ambitious usurper to cuddly pet by the time we saw the 1986 movie. Could it be that after their so called resurrection in "Desertion of the Dinobots" that their brush with near permanent stasis lock deprived their brains of oxygen which lead to brai......err wait a munute, that happens only to organics depending on Oxygen, so maybe a close brush with death softens up even the toughest warrior.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:It was never said that the Constructicons were "CREATED" on Earth, unlike the other teams you mentioned.

The Constructicons's origins are murky in the extreme, but in Heavy Metal War, Megatron did say the they "were worth the time we spent building them in these caverns". To me that says they made the trip to Earth as personality components.

fenrir72 wrote:Grimlock most obviously started from ambitious usurper to cuddly pet by the time we saw the 1986 movie.

Maybe Wheeljack added a "Comic Relief" patch during one of his upgrades to the Dinobots firmware.

Skyfire77 wrote:The Constructicons's origins are murky in the extreme, but in Heavy Metal War, Megatron did say the they "were worth the time we spent building them in these caverns". To me that says they made the trip to Earth as personality components.

Their origins really arent all that "murky" when you apply basic logic to the events seen.

what you suggest is one possibility.

The Constructicons were able to function without Cybertonium in 'Desertion of the Dinobots', supporting the argument they were in fact built on Earth.

MightyMagnus78 wrote:The Constructicons were able to function without Cybertomian in 'Desertion of the Dinobots', supporting the argument they were in fact built on Earth.

Builted is not always synonymous with Created

I repeat, its never been said that the Constructicons were "created" on Earth.

And by the way, theres a major hole in your theory.

Only TF's that have been exposed to Earths atmosphere for millions of years would have been effective by the loss of Cybertomian.

The Constructicons, being new arrivals to earth,less then a year by that point, wouldnt have had any problems being fully functional.

The Constructicons in the Matrix vision in Five Faces is pretty clearly a metaphor, like Spock 'seeing' Vulcan's destruction in ST XI. Toss that one right out as an 'origin story'.

RK_Striker_JK_5 wrote:The Constructicons in the Matrix vision in Five Faces is pretty clearly a metaphor, like Spock 'seeing' Vulcan's destruction in ST XI. Toss that one right out as an 'origin story'.

An other possibility.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

MightyMagnus78 wrote:The Constructicons were able to function without Cybertomian in 'Desertion of the Dinobots', supporting the argument they were in fact built on Earth.

Builted is not always synonymous with Created

I repeat, its never been said that the Constructicons were "created" on Earth.

And by the way, theres a major hole in your theory.

Only TF's that have been exposed to Earths atmosphere for millions of years would have been effective by the loss of Cybertomian.

The Constructicons, being new arrivals to earth,less then a year by that point, wouldn't have had any problems being fully functional.

When were the Constructicons confirmed to have arrived on Earth? was their arrival ever confirmed in the narrative? Also in the episode 'The secret of Omega Supreme' the Constructicons clearly already had Earth mechanism alt' modes not Cybertonian alt' modes as you would expect, so had the Constructicons in fact already visited Earth by that point?

MightyMagnus78 wrote:When were the Constructicons confirmed to have arrived on Earth? was their arrival ever confirmed in the narrative?

You just answered 1 of your own questions.

While the exact date is never mentioned, "'The secret of Omega Supreme'" clearly stated that they came to Earth "AFTER" they learned that Megatron had resurfaced.

Which means it was after 1984.

Also in the episode 'The secret of Omega Supreme' the Constructicons clearly already had Earth mechanism alt' modes not Cybertonian alt' modes as you would expect, so had the Constructicons in fact already visited Earth by that point?

No.

Because the events we saw from Cybertron in 'The secret of Omega Supreme', meaning when they and Omega were friends, take place close to 9 million years ago.

Unless your suggesting time travel.

Whats going on here is that the animators didnt want to create cybertronion character models for the characters.

Either out of laziness or budget reasons.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

MightyMagnus78 wrote:When were the Constructicons confirmed to have arrived on Earth? was their arrival ever confirmed in the narrative?

You just answered 1 of your own questions.

While the exact date is never mentioned, "'The secret of Omega Supreme'" clearly stated that they came to Earth "AFTER" they learned that Megatron had resurfaced.

Which means it was after 1984.

Also in the episode 'The secret of Omega Supreme' the Constructicons clearly already had Earth mechanism alt' modes not Cybertonian alt' modes as you would expect, so had the Constructicons in fact already visited Earth by that point?

No.

Because the events we saw from Cybertron in 'The secret of Omega Supreme', meaning when they and Omega were friends, take place close to 9 million years ago.

Unless your suggesting time travel.

Whats going on here is that the animators didn't want to create cybertronion character models for the characters.

Either out of laziness or budget reasons.

Decepticons certainly had time travel technology, in 'War Dawn' for example they used a chronosphere to transport the Aerialbots back nine million years in the past. Time travel is a definite possibility.

However, the inconsistency in the continuity is down to poor writing. The real paradox is, there is no paradox.

MightyMagnus78 wrote:Decepticons certainly had time travel technology, in 'War Dawn' for example they used a chronosphere to transport the Aerialbots back nine million years in the past. Time travel is a definite possibility.

A possibility, but unlikely.

According to War Dawn the tech was new, as in just recently finished.

If the Constructicons had time traveled it would have had to bveen over 9 million years cbefore the tech was said to exsist.

However, the inconsistency in the continuity is down to poor writing. The real paradox is, there is no paradox.

There you go bud

I've been thinking about this from another angle, and I think that maybe some of Grimlock's mental regression could be down to partial brain damage he sustained during his battle with Devastator in the '86 movie.