The Energon Pub

Welcome to The Forbidden Fruits of Fandom.

This is where I primarily focus on things that stir hate and anger among Transfans.

My first subject would be the hot topic of Transformers Sexuality.
We all know that Transformers are robots and do not have sex, and if they do it would look like a configuration graph of an old computer.

But we all know that in some cases, Transformers have relationships with one another. The best noted are BW Silverbolt and Blackarachnia, the infamous Arcee-Springer-Hot Rod love triangle, and of the alledged gay relationship between Soundwave and Megatron.

Some of these relationships have been expressed to the most hilarious degree. (Superlink Mirage)

But what makes these things controversial?

Tell me why or just rant if you Want.

Springer-Hot Rod-Arcee triangle? Never saw anything about that in the cartoon or Marvel comics. Is it in one of the more recent comic series? And I would have though Prime-Elita 1 would be the most famous relationship.

I don't think there is anything controversial in the relationships themselves, it's when fans project human values onto them that you get problems. Transformer relationships can't be that much like human ones, if you think about it. They're not driven by the urge to procreate for one thing. But when people start writing fanfic where characters get together to make a "baby," that's where it gets controversial.

People think such matters are controversial because Transformers are machines, and thus not sexual beings in the classic sense we understand the subject. Me personally I think there is something to the notion, although it would naturally have to be something entirely different than what we take as "the norm"....I do, however, believe that since they are sentient beings, they are capable of passionate love as much as any of the rest of the universe's sentient beings...and people have, throughout the past 20 plus years, have come up with countless brainstorms as to how this happens..and I am one of those fan-based brainstormers.

That is my two-cents worth on the subject!

Sledge wrote:Springer-Hot Rod-Arcee triangle? Never saw anything about that in the cartoon or Marvel comics. Is it in one of the more recent comic series? And I would have though Prime-Elita 1 would be the most famous relationship.

I don't think there is anything controversial in the relationships themselves, it's when fans project human values onto them that you get problems. Transformer relationships can't be that much like human ones, if you think about it. They're not driven by the urge to procreate for one thing. But when people start writing fanfic where characters get together to make a "baby," that's where it gets controversial.

The '85 movie implies a relationship between Arcee and Hot Rod, but after that she's seen pairing with Springer as somewhat of a love interest. (Even a Wrecker needs some love!)

I think that a Transformers Relationship does work the same way as a human realtionship.

Transformers, like all creatures, feel the need for companionship. I think that even though they cannot procreate they still need something like a life partner.

That primarily explains the theory many people had about Megatron and Soundwave's alleged gay relationship.

BTW Arcee rocks out loud and you know it.

Kid_Kapatilsm wrote:The '85 movie implies a relationship between Arcee and Hot Rod, but after that she's seen pairing with Springer as somewhat of a love interest. (Even a Wrecker needs some love!)

Er, when does this happen? I must have missed this blatant passion every time I've watched the movie over the last twenty years.

That primarily explains the theory many people had about Megatron and Soundwave's alleged gay relationship.

No, that's just a load of crap. Sorry, but there's just nothing to suggest Megatron has any interest in anyone, least of all Soundwave.

BTW Arcee rocks out loud and you know it.

Arcee was the most pointless TF ever introduced.

Kid_Kapatilsm wrote:BTW Arcee rocks out loud and you know it.

LOL!

Sledge wrote:

Kid_Kapatilsm wrote:The '85 movie implies a relationship between Arcee and Hot Rod, but after that she's seen pairing with Springer as somewhat of a love interest. (Even a Wrecker needs some love!)

Er, when does this happen? I must have missed this blatant passion every time I've watched the movie over the last twenty years.

it's pretty obvious if you ask me

Sledge wrote:

Kid_Kapatilsm wrote:That primarily explains the theory many people had about Megatron and Soundwave's alleged gay relationship.

No, that's just a load of crap. Sorry, but there's just nothing to suggest Megatron has any interest in anyone, least of all Soundwave.

here, here. megatron gives a crap about no-one but himself!

Sledge wrote:

Kid_Kapatilsm wrote:BTW Arcee rocks out loud and you know it.

Arcee was the most pointless TF ever introduced.

yes and no! yes because hasbro were only trying to appeal to a female audiance in an attempt to increase viewer ratings. no because it adds more depth, to the race as a whole, than just having them as 'war machines'!

who says females can't be "war machines"? Many females pride themselves in being manipulative, conniving plotters....a good trait for a "war machine"

And chicks do dig big guns!

Thunder Thruster wrote:here, here. megatron gives a crap about no-one but himself!

Megatron on occasion did seem to treat Soundwave with the respect of a friend.

This can translate to the closest thing Megatron has to a love interest

but thats up to speculation

Thunder Thruster wrote:yes and no! yes because hasbro were only trying to appeal to a female audiance in an attempt to increase viewer ratings. no because it adds more depth, to the race as a whole, than just having them as 'war machines'!

Amen

Pyrostrata wrote:who says females can't be "war machines"? Many females pride themselves in being manipulative, conniving plotters....a good trait for a "war machine"

And chicks do dig big guns!

Yes but adding a female Transformer showed that they had diversity and therefore something a bit more human-like in their culture.

ThunderThruster wrote:it's pretty obvious if you ask me

Ok. Based on what? Hell, the two are barely on screen together for more than thirty seconds in the whole damn film.

yes and no! yes because hasbro were only trying to appeal to a female audiance in an attempt to increase viewer ratings. no because it adds more depth, to the race as a whole, than just having them as 'war machines'!

Elita-1 and here crew added depth to the race. Arcee stood around being pink. A totally pointless character.

Sledge wrote:

ThunderThruster wrote:it's pretty obvious if you ask me

Ok. Based on what? Hell, the two are barely on screen together for more than thirty seconds in the whole damn film.

the concern arcee shows when hot rod and kup are gonna get locked out of the city, the banter the 2 share whilst shunting the launch into place, as well as the whole ' you'd better stay close to me' fiasco!

Sledge wrote:

ThunderThruster wrote:yes and no! yes because hasbro were only trying to appeal to a female audiance in an attempt to increase viewer ratings. no because it adds more depth, to the race as a whole, than just having them as 'war machines'!

Elita-1 and here crew added depth to the race. Arcee stood around being pink. A totally pointless character.

i dont think getting in the way of a shot, that would have killed spike, therefore meaning that fortress maximus isnt created and he cant restore the golden age of cybertron, is pointless!

pointless characters are what i call the clones, why do you need to identical looking bots that have different alt modes? thats pointless

Not saying anything.

ThunderThruster wrote:the concern arcee shows when hot rod and kup are gonna get locked out of the city, the banter the 2 share whilst shunting the launch into place, as well as the whole ' you'd better stay close to me' fiasco!

See, my problem there is that you could put any other character in place of Arcee and the scene wouldn't play any different. Any Autobot would be concerned that two of their comrades were still outside the city. And the whole "you'd better stay close to me" thing would work the same with any character perceived as weaker than Hot Rod. That sequence doesn't show any romantic interest, it highlights that Hot Rod is over-confident and prone to boasting.

i dont think getting in the way of a shot, that would have killed spike, therefore meaning that fortress maximus isnt created and he cant restore the golden age of cybertron, is pointless!

pointless characters are what i call the clones, why do you need to identical looking bots that have different alt modes? thats pointless

Again, what did Arcee do that another character couldn't?See, Arcee was introduced to put a female character in Transformers. Sadly, Season 2 introduced a bunch of female characters who were actually competant. They'd survived on Cybertron for millions of years, and proved themselves the equal of the male Autobots in a fight. TFTM introduced Arcee, who... was pink. That's it. She did nothing. She contributed nothing. She was bland and pointless.

Sledge wrote:

ThunderThruster wrote:the concern arcee shows when hot rod and kup are gonna get locked out of the city, the banter the 2 share whilst shunting the launch into place, as well as the whole ' you'd better stay close to me' fiasco!

See, my problem there is that you could put any other character in place of Arcee and the scene wouldn't play any different. Any Autobot would be concerned that two of their comrades were still outside the city. And the whole "you'd better stay close to me" thing would work the same with any character perceived as weaker than Hot Rod. That sequence doesn't show any romantic interest, it highlights that Hot Rod is over-confident and prone to boasting.

Ah, but we are talking fans here, they'll see a romantic relationship in everything. If it had been another bot, the pairing would have been made with that other bot. (Galvatron and Hot Rod/Rodimus Prime seems to be a well like pairing).

Unfortunately, I haven't found the Screenshot with Megatron and Soundwave holding hands (though Megatron is usually paired with Starscream).

I'd say, as long as it isn't explicitly stated, everything goes (and everything else goes in AUs).

As for "love", it's the only frame of reference we have, but an alien species might feel something different and totally unexplainable for each other that's not love but just as valid. Who knows what a Transformer would find attractive in another.

NNOOOOOOO!!!
Please don't! I still have nightmares from the "theores on Transformers reproduction" thread!
For the love of Primus, let this topic die!

Mmmmmmmmm, Transformer sex.

As long as it's tastefully done, I'm all for intimate relationships of some kind.

Tekka wrote:Mmmmmmmmm, Transformer sex.

And you say I have problems.

Whiner-tron wrote:

Tekka wrote:Mmmmmmmmm, Transformer sex.

And you say I have problems.

I do?

*Holding a shovel(sp?)*OK lets not kill this post.

Whiner-tron wrote:NNOOOOOOO!!!
Please don't! I still have nightmares from the "theores on Transformers reproduction" thread!
For the love of Primus, let this topic die!

your jumping the gun abit arnt you! we're talking about reltionships, not reproduction!

and as far as changin the bot and it would play out the same, i think not. take the scene where they're pushing the luancher, remove arcee and lets sunstitute springer,
Hot rod and kup run into the launcher room,
springer: glad you could join the party roddy, i was worried you'd miss out on all the fun.
hot rod: i wasnt worried for a micro second

and the dynamic has changed to a pair of jocks in the changing room!

I'm going to agree that the writers intended something between Hot Rod and Arcee in the '86 movie... and there's a number of times Arcee hangs over Springer in season three. And I'm not a TF 'shipper. (In other series/fandoms, yes, but somehow TF has never inspired my 'shipper tendencies.)

As for the idea of relationships in TF, it's likely a "meeting of the minds" sort of matter. Even without the need for reproduction, I would think that any lifeform with a sentient and social personality would be inclined to enjoy interacting with another lifeform of complementary personality, even to the point of being "close". If the TFs do have anything approaching the idea of sex, it's probably purely a cerebral/data transference concept.

And I'm of the mind that there is no such thing as a "gay" TF relationship, since the TFs don't have sexual genders. Mental genders, sure, but I don't see why a species of robots that don't have sexual reproduction would feel any need to limit close mental relationships to structural differences. (Well, other than the writers don't want to get into murky waters with the anthromorphosizing tendencies of audience perception. )

ThunderThruster wrote:and as far as changin the bot and it would play out the same, i think not. take the scene where they're pushing the luancher, remove arcee and lets sunstitute springer,
Hot rod and kup run into the launcher room,
springer: glad you could join the party roddy, i was worried you'd miss out on all the fun.
hot rod: i wasnt worried for a micro second

and the dynamic has changed to a pair of jocks in the changing room!

That'll be because you've changed the dialogue.

Use the same tones of voice and it becomes... well... creepy.

The reason it's controversial for me, is because the majority of our feelings come from biological impulses, and all exist for purposes of reproduction and raising of offspring.

Have you ever seen 7 year old kids passionately in love?

No, because they haven't started puberty yet. Without puberty there aren't the hormones that give them the basic urges and emotions we romantisize.

And kids are of course still sentient, so not falling in love and being happy with friendship whilst being sentient is perfectly realistic.

Even before puberty we're different though.
As we become male or female, our brains develop differently, so even as children, sex and reproduction is the reason we are, as two sexes, different.

In the end, it's all about survival, and without the emotions related to reproduction, all that would be left is the need to form communities and friendship.