The Energon Pub

Moosey wrote:Really like the thought of making this hobby greener. Unfortunately, as a hobby revolving around "getting stuff,"being green can definitely be hard. Perhaps we could find a way to cleanly recycle figures in our collection that we don't want anymore? While of course you could sell them, I think it would be good to know that your figure could be used for something else.

Another thought could be to write a petition to get Hasbro to use "green" plastics in their figures. While I get that quality of plastics matter to a lot of people, I probably wouldn't mind too much. (unless the plastic quality was ridiculously bad)

On the other hand though, definitely agree with Fenrir. I am usually skeptical about "green" movements (for example, my town has separate bins for recycling, but all of it goes to the dump anyways)

Moosey wrote:Wait... You DON'T lick your toys with lead based paint? Have I missed something?? (Really hope that came across as a joke like I intended)

fenrir72 wrote:

Moosey wrote:Wait... You DON'T lick your toys with lead based paint? Have I missed something?? (Really hope that came across as a joke like I intended)

We had one member who used to lick his MP01 the now infamous tfanboy iirc.

Dead Metal wrote:I don't quite get this, how would it bee greener if I got rid of all my collection, and from now on only ever had two figures at home, one of which would be traded for another every time I buy a new one?

budmaloney wrote:We all keep buying the same figure. Why not share it digitally or even physically.

william-james88 wrote:"Don't worry about Hasbro being wasteful, they have been a lot greener lately, with all the hallowed out parts they've been making."

Yotsuyasan wrote:

william-james88 wrote:"Don't worry about Hasbro being wasteful, they have been a lot greener lately, with all the hallowed out parts they've been making."

Well, as a proud owner of Generations Jetfire myself, it is good to know that I am doing my part for a greener Earth!

Ironhidensh wrote:Simple hard truth: the world will not go green until it is cheaper to go green. Money rules all, and has the final say.

william-james88 wrote:"Don't worry about Hasbro being wasteful, they have been a lot greener lately, with all the hallowed out parts they've been making"

fenrir72 wrote:Canada recently dumped a lot of medical plastic waste in the Philippines and until now hasn't taken it back. Speaks miles on the hypocrisy of Western and some Asian governments. Japan for instance, very environmental conscious, has like a 3 to 4 year life span for cars. But the dump/sell it to third world countries as 2nd hand refurbished vehicles.

Your heart maybe in the right place but overall, I'm really skeptical. same with the recent earth Day gimmick.

Drift082111 wrote:I've been looking to thin my collection and this is a good motivator. Thank you for sharing.

Moosey wrote:Really like the thought of making this hobby greener. Unfortunately, as a hobby revolving around "getting stuff,"being green can definitely be hard. Perhaps we could find a way to cleanly recycle figures in our collection that we don't want anymore? While of course you could sell them, I think it would be good to know that your figure could be used for something else.

Another thought could be to write a petition to get Hasbro to use "green" plastics in their figures. While I get that quality of plastics matter to a lot of people, I probably wouldn't mind too much. (unless the plastic quality was ridiculously bad)

On the other hand though, definitely agree with Fenrir. I am usually skeptical about "green" movements (for example, my town has separate bins for recycling, but all of it goes to the dump anyways)

Dead Metal wrote:I don't quite get this, how would it bee greener if I got rid of all my collection, and from now on only ever had two figures at home, one of which would be traded for another every time I buy a new one?

The figures in my collection, don't go anywhere, they're not going to go and increase the size of the plastic island, because they're at my home.

Also, if I constantly kept rotating my collection the way you're planing on doing, I would only be harming the environment more. Because I would have to box them, and then ship them out to someone. That not only uses up materials, but energy, causing more emissions, since most of the energy involved would be fossil fuels. That's like claiming that driving electric cars or hybrids is more environmentally friendly completely ignoring how electricity is made or what an impact the production of the batteries needed for them have on the environment.

That plastic island is there because it's the trash people dump, not the figures we have in our homes. You would only be increasing its size with all the packaging material, and other trash that gets made from shipping.

If you want to reduce the size of that island, you'll have to get it, destroy it and then make sure that it won't be made again, by recycling and getting everyone else to recycle. Recycling isn't hard, all it takes is a few more seconds of your life instead of throwing everything in one can.

Yotsuyasan wrote:See... to me the joy in collecting is in large part owning the figure and physically having it in my collection. It isn't like train spotting, where I have a little notebook where I jot down, "Briefly owned Arcee. Traded her on to open up space for a new figure. Here's my awesome photo of her."

I like to be able to pick up a figure, feel it in my hand, look at it from any angle I choose in three dimensional space, transform it between modes, pose it how I like when it is back in robot mode, and place it back on its shelf where I can admire it at my leisure.

Also, figures I am planning to keep in my collection are not going to end up in a landfill somewhere. Not a land based one, and certainly not floating in the middle of the Pacific ocean.

This is not to say your intentions are not noble. But at the same time, to borrow a turn of phrase from an organization I typically don't find myself agreeing with, you can have my Transformers when you pry them from my cold, dead hands.

Rather, I should think it better to concentrate on packaging. You want to make a difference? Get Hasbro to remove the plastics from the packaging, and use only biodegradable materials.

We all love our plastic bubbles on the cards or windows on the boxes. For those of us who still shop the old fashioned way, it is nice to see a figure before buying it and make sure they aren't missing anything, or don't have any horrible mistakes in the paint applications. But it wouldn't be the end of the world if they were gone. Brick & mortar shoppers would just have to do what online shoppers do: open up the figure as soon as possible and make sure it is okay, maybe even as soon as you get back to your car, to save yourself having to drive back to the store if there is an issue bad enough to warrant a return or exchange.

As for the inner packaging, I'm sure the plastic trays could be replaced with molded paper materials such as this:



Also, while they've gone back to plastic, for a while Hasbro was using paper ties to hold the figures in the trays. I loved them! So much easier to get the figure out with them! I was a little sad when they went back to plastic.

For the non-MIB collector, this is the best way, I feel, to make our hobby more green. We aren't throwing out our toys! Heck, even the ones I no longer display, I just have packed up in boxes somewhere. And if I ever do decide to get rid of them, they'll probably end up on eBay, not in the trash. But these toys all come in packaging, and with rare exception, that I do throw out.

fenrir72 wrote:Another funny thing about "Green" , aside from being on FBI's watch list, kind of id1otic! The daylight bulbs which GW Bush Jr. mandated to use so as to economize electricity gave Philips the license to print money when they held the patent. It killed the fluorescent bulb industry. Sure it was indeed energy saving but very TOXIC to the environment. It's like a mini Mercury granade which needs to be disposed off veeeerrryyyyy carefully!

william-james88 wrote:
I have my collection and I am well aware of where it is at all times (unless we live in the toystory universe afterall). If I were to give them all away, I would not guarantee that those toys would end up in landfills. Keeping my old collection is the only way I know it is not contributing to more garbage.

william-james88 wrote:I am very impressed at how seriously and mature everyone is taking this. I will gladly take the opposite role though since this line is screaming to get out:

"Don't worry about Hasbro being wasteful, they have been a lot greener lately, with all the hallowed out parts they've been making"

Cobotron wrote:I was happy when Hasbro went from wire ties to the raffia ties. Thought that was a good move. Now their back to plastic ties that get tossed. I used to save the clear coated wire ties and use them for all kinds of things. Especially hanging TFs in my display. Still have a large cache of them.

One easy step is to be sure to recycle all that packaging. IMO, these toys are ridiculously over packaged. You all would laugh at the lengths I go through to disassemble the packaging. I separate the plastic windows from the cardboard to sort it all into the proper bins.

I agree with Dead Metal. Although, the production of these toys consumes energy and materials, it would be a cold day in hell before I would ever see a single toy leave my house for the dump.

I'm relaxing on my own little plastic island as I type. Better in my home than in the sea.

budmaloney wrote:

fenrir72 wrote:Canada recently dumped a lot of medical plastic waste in the Philippines and until now hasn't taken it back. Speaks miles on the hypocrisy of Western and some Asian governments. Japan for instance, very environmental conscious, has like a 3 to 4 year life span for cars. But the dump/sell it to third world countries as 2nd hand refurbished vehicles.

Your heart maybe in the right place but overall, I'm really skeptical. same with the recent earth Day gimmick.

I hear you, it's not an easy thing. Being skeptical though implies you expect a result. That may be the wrong way of approaching any environmental concern. The key is to keep trying nonstop, and with cumulative and "evolution", we achieve things. It's really sad to hear Canada is doing something like this. Considering most of the nurses in Canada are contract workers from the Philippines.

Drift082111 wrote:I've been looking to thin my collection and this is a good motivator. Thank you for sharing.

You're welcome, I find that to be the case for me too.

Moosey wrote:Really like the thought of making this hobby greener. Unfortunately, as a hobby revolving around "getting stuff,"being green can definitely be hard. Perhaps we could find a way to cleanly recycle figures in our collection that we don't want anymore? While of course you could sell them, I think it would be good to know that your figure could be used for something else.

Another thought could be to write a petition to get Hasbro to use "green" plastics in their figures. While I get that quality of plastics matter to a lot of people, I probably wouldn't mind too much. (unless the plastic quality was ridiculously bad)

On the other hand though, definitely agree with Fenrir. I am usually skeptical about "green" movements (for example, my town has separate bins for recycling, but all of it goes to the dump anyways)

Brilliant idea. Lots of research on new plastics that biodegrade. I remember I saw a biodegradable pen that you plant and it grows to a tree. What if you have disposable Transformers figures, that if you plant them would grow into a tree. A seed could be based on each character. For example, Lavender for Decepticons and so on. It could be a new line along the existing line. The Transformers' sparks can be a real thing. Till all are one tag line.

Thanks for suggesting a petition though. This is on my list now as the next step.

Dead Metal wrote:I don't quite get this, how would it bee greener if I got rid of all my collection, and from now on only ever had two figures at home, one of which would be traded for another every time I buy a new one?

The figures in my collection, don't go anywhere, they're not going to go and increase the size of the plastic island, because they're at my home.

Also, if I constantly kept rotating my collection the way you're planing on doing, I would only be harming the environment more. Because I would have to box them, and then ship them out to someone. That not only uses up materials, but energy, causing more emissions, since most of the energy involved would be fossil fuels. That's like claiming that driving electric cars or hybrids is more environmentally friendly completely ignoring how electricity is made or what an impact the production of the batteries needed for them have on the environment.

That plastic island is there because it's the trash people dump, not the figures we have in our homes. You would only be increasing its size with all the packaging material, and other trash that gets made from shipping.

If you want to reduce the size of that island, you'll have to get it, destroy it and then make sure that it won't be made again, by recycling and getting everyone else to recycle. Recycling isn't hard, all it takes is a few more seconds of your life instead of throwing everything in one can.

The answer may well be ...collect more. Take them off the walmart shelves before some kid throws them out and end up in a landfill. Celebrate them, take pictures of them, display them so it becomes cultural icons that people don't throw away.

Yeah now that you mention it, having constantly shipping them back and forth would put a load on other environmental concerns. It was a suggestion, perhaps if it's done in a local context, like some Transformers club in a University campus, where people "time share" their collection for a flat membership fee.

Sadly the plastic in the ocean isn't technically an island. The sun breaks down the plastics into small tiny bits called microplastics. These tiny bits become everywhere. Fish eat them, they ruin habitats and prevent things like plankton to flourish affecting the food cycle. The oil spill could have been cleaned up, maybe. Because we can see it and sort of capture it. While microplastics are increasingly getting smaller and become a challenge. The shear size of this garbage patch is reported to be bigger than Texas. Calling it a patch is an understatement.

So until we come up with a solution, the ways to prevent it are recycling and stopping the addition of more plastic. The planet is a closed system, whatever we add, it will stay there. If we can't remove it then we have to stop the adding at the very least.

I think the best way to explain how we can make a difference is with supply and demand in economics. If there is no demand, supply goes down. And we really care about the supply because we want to stop it from growing further. If demand for more figures stops, Hasbro would be forced to look at different business models. It could try and meet the green demands, by making biodegradable products for example. Or it could pour it into digital space. That's the general idea.

As a collector though, being aware of this and pushing for it is the goal. The 1 to 2 figure rule could be working for me. I cycle through the second figure and just keep the 1 I want most. I exercise prioritization, control consumption and in a way compromise. We want a sustainable solution and not an extreme one that would go away like a fad. Collectors should be part of the solution and not considered a problem.

Yotsuyasan wrote:See... to me the joy in collecting is in large part owning the figure and physically having it in my collection. It isn't like train spotting, where I have a little notebook where I jot down, "Briefly owned Arcee. Traded her on to open up space for a new figure. Here's my awesome photo of her."

I like to be able to pick up a figure, feel it in my hand, look at it from any angle I choose in three dimensional space, transform it between modes, pose it how I like when it is back in robot mode, and place it back on its shelf where I can admire it at my leisure.

Also, figures I am planning to keep in my collection are not going to end up in a landfill somewhere. Not a land based one, and certainly not floating in the middle of the Pacific ocean.

This is not to say your intentions are not noble. But at the same time, to borrow a turn of phrase from an organization I typically don't find myself agreeing with, you can have my Transformers when you pry them from my cold, dead hands.

Rather, I should think it better to concentrate on packaging. You want to make a difference? Get Hasbro to remove the plastics from the packaging, and use only biodegradable materials.

We all love our plastic bubbles on the cards or windows on the boxes. For those of us who still shop the old fashioned way, it is nice to see a figure before buying it and make sure they aren't missing anything, or don't have any horrible mistakes in the paint applications. But it wouldn't be the end of the world if they were gone. Brick & mortar shoppers would just have to do what online shoppers do: open up the figure as soon as possible and make sure it is okay, maybe even as soon as you get back to your car, to save yourself having to drive back to the store if there is an issue bad enough to warrant a return or exchange.

As for the inner packaging, I'm sure the plastic trays could be replaced with molded paper materials such as this:



Also, while they've gone back to plastic, for a while Hasbro was using paper ties to hold the figures in the trays. I loved them! So much easier to get the figure out with them! I was a little sad when they went back to plastic.

For the non-MIB collector, this is the best way, I feel, to make our hobby more green. We aren't throwing out our toys! Heck, even the ones I no longer display, I just have packed up in boxes somewhere. And if I ever do decide to get rid of them, they'll probably end up on eBay, not in the trash. But these toys all come in packaging, and with rare exception, that I do throw out.

We would have to break that concept of joy and make a sacrifice. It is a luxury that sooner or later we may not be able to afford. Like legit, we can't have sushi because the fish are eating all the microplastics.

It is imperative that we have to change how we enjoy the fandom. I, like you, can't think any way other than 3D. Something about transforming a figure over and over again it's beautiful. I strain my figures sometimes because of that.

I realize the challenge in changing a fandom that relies on toys. Everything in this hobby is about the toys. The movies...made to sell toys. The cartoons...toys. Games...toys. But let's be honest here and it may seem harsh and I apologize for the sharpness of it.

It really doesn't end does it? There is always one more figure around the corner you want to preorder. One more G1 figure you gotta get your hands on.

Just count how many components are in one single figure. Different materials, paints, screws, etc. Now multiply that by how many figures in a single line per year, then how many they have produced. And that is just Transformers. There is still Marvel, angry birds, Star Wars, pokemon, Lego ....endless plastic. They're all competing for an hour? two hours a day of a child's playtime? Or shelf space in your office.

So you get to enjoy your beloved character, that's an amazing thing right. To realize one's imagination in the real world. An entire industry is booming because of this. But at what cost? The more you learn about how long it took for Earth's ecosystem to become this way, the more you appreciate it. There isn't another planet around us that we can live on feasibly at the moment. We can't even live in space for a long time. We only have this infront of us right now. That's all we have.

I am so thankful for generations figures. I'm so thankful for Masterpiece. But look at Masterpiece now, they're hardly even limited anymore. These companies, as much as we love their products, they don't give a damn. You express a single interest in one character...they see that....they will drench you with that character. They will plaster him/her in every nook and cranny. You like Optimus? Here! Optimus black, Optimus red, Optimus underwear, Optimus repainted, Evil Optimus......just buy our stuff please. Screw your backyard, you want this truck don't you? Fish? naaah screw them, no one eats them. That problem is far away anyways. Plus my top researchers are saying it's not a problem you should worry about. Optimus? It's not like ocean currents are connected and science clearly tells us that....you want that Optimus don't you? Here I have made 10 different version. Collect them all. Oh wait. I just had Yoshi from design make up 50 different more characters so you can collect. and so on.

Sorry this tone is not targeted personally at you by the way. If anything I'm self talking. ^_^

With regards to packaging you raise a very very important point I haven't realized. That is an excellent place to start. Making it all about the toy. The clam shells are just there to protect the toy and that's it. Why are we MISB obsessed. Thank you for posting the link. This should be in the petition. We should encourage places like Tf-direct that sell with no box. For one it is way cheaper for shipping and the box art is great but if you want it either download hi res or pay for it separately. Love love the idea. I'm implementing this.

fenrir72 wrote:Another funny thing about "Green" , aside from being on FBI's watch list, kind of id1otic! The daylight bulbs which GW Bush Jr. mandated to use so as to economize electricity gave Philips the license to print money when they held the patent. It killed the fluorescent bulb industry. Sure it was indeed energy saving but very TOXIC to the environment. It's like a mini Mercury granade which needs to be disposed off veeeerrryyyyy carefully!

Sorry but I don't get the reference with the FBI?
Well there has to be hit and misses. Mercury though is bat guano poisonous.

william-james88 wrote:
I have my collection and I am well aware of where it is at all times (unless we live in the toystory universe afterall). If I were to give them all away, I would not guarantee that those toys would end up in landfills. Keeping my old collection is the only way I know it is not contributing to more garbage.

I wish we did live in a Toy Story universe

william-james88 wrote:I am very impressed at how seriously and mature everyone is taking this. I will gladly take the opposite role though since this line is screaming to get out:

"Don't worry about Hasbro being wasteful, they have been a lot greener lately, with all the hallowed out parts they've been making"

badum tish!

Cobotron wrote:I was happy when Hasbro went from wire ties to the raffia ties. Thought that was a good move. Now their back to plastic ties that get tossed. I used to save the clear coated wire ties and use them for all kinds of things. Especially hanging TFs in my display. Still have a large cache of them.

One easy step is to be sure to recycle all that packaging. IMO, these toys are ridiculously over packaged. You all would laugh at the lengths I go through to disassemble the packaging. I separate the plastic windows from the cardboard to sort it all into the proper bins.

I agree with Dead Metal. Although, the production of these toys consumes energy and materials, it would be a cold day in hell before I would ever see a single toy leave my house for the dump.

I'm relaxing on my own little plastic island as I type. Better in my home than in the sea.

So far it seems everyone is pro reducing the packaging. But if you had to , would you minimize your collection?
I like the idea of using the ties to hang figures. I use them to wrap all my wires. Then I added them as plant terrain in a warhammer 40k I made for a friend.

Mykltron wrote:(I'm glad I proof-read this, because I missed out the word 'not' in the third sentence)

budmaloney wrote:I am so thankful for generations figures. I'm so thankful for Masterpiece. But look at Masterpiece now, they're hardly even limited anymore. These companies, as much as we love their products, they don't give a damn. You express a single interest in one character...they see that....they will drench you with that character. They will plaster him/her in every nook and cranny. You like Optimus? Here! Optimus black, Optimus red, Optimus underwear, Optimus repainted, Evil Optimus......just buy our stuff please. Screw your backyard, you want this truck don't you? Fish? naaah screw them, no one eats them. That problem is far away anyways. Plus my top researchers are saying it's not a problem you should worry about. Optimus? It's not like ocean currents are connected and science clearly tells us that....you want that Optimus don't you? Here I have made 10 different version. Collect them all. Oh wait. I just had Yoshi from design make up 50 different more characters so you can collect. and so on.

Yotsuyasan wrote:Also, from a financial standpoint, if the hardcore collectors all stopped each buying their own figures and started trading a few of each figure between themselves, we'd become a much less important part of the market then we already are. Hasbro would have no need to cater to us at all. Goodbye, Generations. Goodbye, Masterpiece. Goodbye, any high end collectable figures. Hello to a bunch of simplistic stuff marketed purely to the kiddies.