The Energon Pub

Until we decide how things will be handled DO NOT post any links for your ebay auctions in any of the forums.

In case some do not have a clue as to what is going on..
This thread explains it all.

http://www.seibertron.com/forums/viewto ... 21562&sid=

What about non ebay sales? Posting a thread to see if anyone has such and such for sale?

This site keeps getting worse and worse.

Toyotus Superion wrote:What about non ebay sales? Posting a thread to see if anyone has such and such for sale?

This site keeps getting worse and worse.

Umm, non ebay sales were the main issue to begin with. If Ebay threads are out, non ebay certainly are or what was the point of shutting down Carbomya.

As much as I am a huge advocate of getting the BST forum, I think the ban of non ebay and ebay threads is plenty clear.

Toyotus Superion wrote:What about non ebay sales? Posting a thread to see if anyone has such and such for sale?

This site keeps getting worse and worse.

Sorry if you don't like the place.
There has been a mountain of complaints within the last year about that section because of the low life people that have been screwing others.

Ryan wants to keep himself free and clear of any kind of liability.

And Bonger is correct.
Just be patient as we are trying to figure out something that works..

Cyber Bishop wrote:Ryan wants to keep himself free and clear of any kind of liability.

As well as Ryan being concerned about the people who post here, is there some sort of legal concern behind this? I'm just curious because of the way you phrased it.

In this day and age, people can sue for anything. I think ryan is worried about being sued because some dumbas$ ripped someone off.

Though, I dont see why ryan should be worried about that kinda stuff at all. He doesnt handle said transactions. Infact, they are private transactions. Somtimes with paypal involved.

True. I was just wondering if maybe, since his name is on the site and he is the owner, there might be some legal ramifications. If there would be then I myself would probably drop the forum pretty fast. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, though.

Leonardo wrote:True. I was just wondering if maybe, since his name is on the site and he is the owner, there might be some legal ramifications. If there would be then I myself would probably drop the forum pretty fast. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, though.

There is asome discussion about this in the thread regarding this topic in the TF General forum.

I doubt it'd be possible to sue him, as he's made it quite clear that he doesn't have any control over transactions and that they're taken at your own risk.

The main concern (aside from all the complaints he's had to put up with), as I understand it from one of his posts, is in regards to any legal proceedings that do wind up taking place.
Ryan may not be responsible for the transaction itself, but he is responsible for almost the entirety of the relevant evidence of the transaction, since a lot of it may well consist of PMs and forum messages on his servers. This would essentially make Ryan one of the prime 'witnesses' in a case he had nothing to do with.

The ramifications of this - which may include flying cross-country for court dates, taking time off work (and indeed time from working on more important aspects of the site, not that we're biased ) and plenty of stuff I can't even think of right now - seem too much hassle to deal with over a small part of a forum, which is a small part of a site, which is Ryan's hobby.

Here's an idea. PMs are just that...PRIVATE. No one has access to them, nor are they allowed to them. (Granted you're allowed to report them if you're being harassed through them.)

All of us know who we've dealt with on here, good and bad, etc. If you have B/S/T items...why not just PM each other like a mass emailing and pass the wealth back and forth to each other?

Keep PayPal in the mix, work with those you know are legit, and see what happens? I doubt something like that could hurt, I mean it is off of the board itself. The messenger is tied in, of course, but the rest of us wouldn't have to see what's going on behind closed doors.

And in case a person is looking for something (without making it blatantly obvious that they're asking...) they could just post something like "Hey guys, I'm looking at (insert here) on eBay, any tips?" and those of you who have the item, or connections to get it, could dogpile that person's PM inbox with deals, trades, etc.

Heck, when Carbomya was still in effect, rather than waste a thread that would quickly die, I'd just cut out the middle man and go directly to the other party via PM and ask them if they were interested.

It kept it off the board's pages, it was private, we both knew each other enough to trust the other, etc. No problems, no complaints, and one less headache for Ryan.

I put the disclaimer there which keeps his nose clear.
As long as you put some sort of disclaimer

"Staff and owner not responsible for trades or sales"
"users are responsible for their own transactions"
"Trade at your own risk"

I am trying to figure something to help people that want to trade in the short term until a solution is found.

Cyber Bishop wrote:I put the disclaimer there which keeps his nose clear.
As long as you put some sort of disclaimer

"Staff and owner not responsible for trades or sales"
"users are responsible for their own transactions"
"Trade at your own risk"

I am trying to figure something to help people that want to trade in the short term until a solution is found.

Yeah! Even better. Thank you!

I got it! Get a consortium of the best B/S/T'ers together, get their wants/wares, etc. and put it into one giant post. Pass copies of it via PM to each of the interested parties so it goes only to those who want in, and won't bother those who don't.

Also, we'd make it abundantly clear...just because you receive the list, doesn't mean you're forced to buy, sell, or trade anything. This is just giving you an option in the off chance that you'd choose to do so.

A nice disclaimer: (A work in progress)

By receiving this sales/trade/contact PM publication, you hereby acknowledge that you are willingly receiving this by your request.

You will also agree to the following:

All services will be between you and the other party. You will not involve others into your 1-on-1 dealings, unless otherwise specified. (I.E. Going in for a group buy, or a group buy that soured, etc.)

All transactions will be taking place privately behind the scenes and will not be done so on the Seibertron forums themselves.

Seibertron.com, it's owner, the site moderators and administrators will not be held accountable for any reason, whatsoever. Caveat Emptor = Let the buyer beware (or...if you don't look, sometimes get took!) and you are doing this at your own risk.

Any and all complaints will be handled through PayPal disputes, the United States Postal Service mail fraud division, eBay, or any other official service that might fit your current situation. None of this shall be presented to Seibertron or it's controlling members.

Any violation of these rules laid out here will mean automatic and immediate dismissal from the private trade party. You will be blacklisted for any of these infractions, whether it's one or more.

These rules aren't here to hinder, but to protect everyone, so please, look at this as a gift and treat it as such. Don't be cavalier about it, this is a serious responsibility, yet one in which we can have fun, if all parties are willing to do their part.

If you agree to these rules, please continue. If not, thank you for your time and we wish you the best of luck in your searches.

Oh and a few other things...since this would be in private...that means no one would be posting negative comments about dealing with people, on the forums. You keep that to PM.

Also, if you have a transaction and it's clearly scummy, alert others in this "consortium" (if it becomes that) only after all parties involved have found an ending to their matter. (I.E. received the stuff just fine, or got ripped off) Once you know how it went and it's finalized, then report that bad apple to the rest of us in the private trade party so we know who and who not to deal with.

Another addition would be feedback. For each positive transaction, an Autobot logo would be given. For each negative transaction, a Decepticon logo would be given.
For neutral, we could use the Auto/Con logo that I use in my toy reviews.

Each person would be responsible for tacking those logos onto the user name of the person you dealt with, before sending the PM onto the other members. (I.E. I sell Cyber Bishop a TF:A Voyager Optimus Prime. He was quick with payment, fullfilled his end of the bargain, so I'd apply an Autobot logo next to his name before sending out the PM to everyone else. And vice versa.) Otherwise we'll never know who's doing a great job and who's being bad. Also we would keep a record of transactions, so we'd know how many of a certain logo was given to each person, so as to know they haven't bolstered their own feedback falsely.

Another thing...no trading of personal information in the PM letter. That kind of thing is to be one on one (or in group buys) but it is not to be posted on the PM for any reason. (This is where the FBI link (in another thread), PayPal, Mail Fraud Division, eBay...etc...comes in.)

For everyone's protection...Priority Mail with Delivery Confirmation should be standardized. The people will get their items quicker, plus it's trackable. Insurance is not required, but highly recommended. If a person would choose not to take Priority, but go with Media Mail, or Parcel Post, or First Class...then you'd acknowledge that you chose that shipping method and will not hold the other party accountable for it. "Once it's out of my hands, the burden is on you." NOTE: Parcel Post is trackable, but far more expensive.

What do you think guys and gals?

yeah I was all set to purchase a figure from another member and I heard so much stuff about horrible punkass ripoff artists that I decided to not even bother to buy it.. I'm sorry if that upsets you, but I just don't want to be ripped off..... it's sad that people come here to make others in misery, but hey, that's the nature of the internet.. you never know what kind of morals the other person has behind the next screen...

they could have god in their sig, and sodomist, bomb planning in the evening, with a little devil worship and wicca on the side.. so you never know what to expect..

I am an open book, an honest soul.. that is why I have a link to my myspace page below.. you want to get to know me.. the real deal.. send a request..otherwise.. I just consider you a screen name, and don't believe everything I see or hear.. sorry but too many crackpots out there...


EDIT: Autobot032 that wasn't directed at you, I was just using an example.. don't get offended, ok...?

skywarp-2 wrote:yeah I was all set to purchase a figure from another member and I heard so much stuff about horrible punkass ripoff artists that I decided to not even bother to buy it.. I'm sorry if that upsets you, but I just don't want to be ripped off..... it's sad that people come here to make others in misery, but hey, that's the nature of the internet.. you never know what kind of morals the other person has behind the next screen...

they could have god in their sig, and sodomist, bomb planning in the evening, with a *removed because it was unnecessary to repeat* on the side.. so you never know what to expect..

I am an open book, an honest soul.. that is why I have a link to my myspace page below.. you want to get to know me.. the real deal.. send a request..otherwise.. I just consider you a screen name, and don't believe everything I see or hear.. sorry but too many crackpots out there...


EDIT: Autobot032 that wasn't directed at you, I was just using an example.. don't get offended, ok...?

None taken. Beyond having God in my sig, none of the rest of what you said, applies to me. Although, you might want to remove the Devil Worship/Wicca slam...I'm sure we have some people here who adhere to those beliefs and it's not fair to attack them like that. Point is, we get what you're saying, but that comment's unnecessary to get the point across.

NOTE: To those of you out there who are Wiccan, or Satanists (I believe that's the correct term? If not, I sincerely apologize.) please don't misconstrue my words here. I'm all for you having the ability to believe how and to who/what you may believe. I wasn't trying to knock you or your personal lives. I apologize if it seems otherwise.

And Skywarp...seriously man...get that out of there!

As of right now DO NOT conduct any trades via PM.

I am thinking about another venue.. I will post when I am closer to completing this idea.

Cyber Bishop wrote:As of right now DO NOT conduct any trades via PM.

I am thinking about another venue.. I will post when I am closer to completing this idea.

Oh no, of course not. I was just thinking up some ideas on how to approach this if it became a viable option, that's all.

Listen to the man people...do nothing right now. We might just get Carbomya back...let's not screw it up. Okay?

Autobot032 wrote:

skywarp-2 wrote:yeah I was all set to purchase a figure from another member and I heard so much stuff about horrible punkass ripoff artists that I decided to not even bother to buy it.. I'm sorry if that upsets you, but I just don't want to be ripped off..... it's sad that people come here to make others in misery, but hey, that's the nature of the internet.. you never know what kind of morals the other person has behind the next screen...

they could have god in their sig, and sodomist, bomb planning in the evening, with a *removed because it was unnecessary to repeat* on the side.. so you never know what to expect..

I am an open book, an honest soul.. that is why I have a link to my myspace page below.. you want to get to know me.. the real deal.. send a request..otherwise.. I just consider you a screen name, and don't believe everything I see or hear.. sorry but too many crackpots out there...


EDIT: Autobot032 that wasn't directed at you, I was just using an example.. don't get offended, ok...?

None taken. Beyond having God in my sig, none of the rest of what you said, applies to me. Although, you might want to remove the Devil Worship/Wicca slam...I'm sure we have some people here who adhere to those beliefs and it's not fair to attack them like that. Point is, we get what you're saying, but that comment's unnecessary to get the point across.

NOTE: To those of you out there who are Wiccan, or Satanists (I believe that's the correct term? If not, I sincerely apologize.) please don't misconstrue my words here. I'm all for you having the ability to believe how and to who/what you may believe. I wasn't trying to knock you or your personal lives. I apologize if it seems otherwise.

And Skywarp...seriously man...get that out of there!

I think what you took as an example of how people can profess one thing and practice another as a slam on satanists or Wiccans in the wrong way .. here's another example someone can say they like blue as their color here on the forums and have everything they own in red... that's all I meant, so I won't remove my comment because there was nothing wrong with it..

skywarp-2 wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

skywarp-2 wrote:yeah I was all set to purchase a figure from another member and I heard so much stuff about horrible punkass ripoff artists that I decided to not even bother to buy it.. I'm sorry if that upsets you, but I just don't want to be ripped off..... it's sad that people come here to make others in misery, but hey, that's the nature of the internet.. you never know what kind of morals the other person has behind the next screen...

they could have god in their sig, and sodomist, bomb planning in the evening, with a *removed because it was unnecessary to repeat* on the side.. so you never know what to expect..

I am an open book, an honest soul.. that is why I have a link to my myspace page below.. you want to get to know me.. the real deal.. send a request..otherwise.. I just consider you a screen name, and don't believe everything I see or hear.. sorry but too many crackpots out there...


EDIT: Autobot032 that wasn't directed at you, I was just using an example.. don't get offended, ok...?

None taken. Beyond having God in my sig, none of the rest of what you said, applies to me. Although, you might want to remove the Devil Worship/Wicca slam...I'm sure we have some people here who adhere to those beliefs and it's not fair to attack them like that. Point is, we get what you're saying, but that comment's unnecessary to get the point across.

NOTE: To those of you out there who are Wiccan, or Satanists (I believe that's the correct term? If not, I sincerely apologize.) please don't misconstrue my words here. I'm all for you having the ability to believe how and to who/what you may believe. I wasn't trying to knock you or your personal lives. I apologize if it seems otherwise.

And Skywarp...seriously man...get that out of there!

I think what you took as an example of how people can profess one thing and practice another as a slam on satanists or Wiccans in the wrong way .. here's another example someone can say they like blue as their color here on the forums and have everything they own in red... that's all I meant, so I won't remove my comment because there was nothing wrong with it..

You may not have meant any harm by it, but some may find it terribly offensive. Especially with the other criteria you had listed.

...and the color thing...would've gone over a whole lot better.

Just sayin'.

Autobot032 wrote:

skywarp-2 wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

skywarp-2 wrote:yeah I was all set to purchase a figure from another member and I heard so much stuff about horrible punkass ripoff artists that I decided to not even bother to buy it.. I'm sorry if that upsets you, but I just don't want to be ripped off..... it's sad that people come here to make others in misery, but hey, that's the nature of the internet.. you never know what kind of morals the other person has behind the next screen...

they could have god in their sig, and sodomist, bomb planning in the evening, with a *removed because it was unnecessary to repeat* on the side.. so you never know what to expect..

I am an open book, an honest soul.. that is why I have a link to my myspace page below.. you want to get to know me.. the real deal.. send a request..otherwise.. I just consider you a screen name, and don't believe everything I see or hear.. sorry but too many crackpots out there...


EDIT: Autobot032 that wasn't directed at you, I was just using an example.. don't get offended, ok...?

None taken. Beyond having God in my sig, none of the rest of what you said, applies to me. Although, you might want to remove the Devil Worship/Wicca slam...I'm sure we have some people here who adhere to those beliefs and it's not fair to attack them like that. Point is, we get what you're saying, but that comment's unnecessary to get the point across.

NOTE: To those of you out there who are Wiccan, or Satanists (I believe that's the correct term? If not, I sincerely apologize.) please don't misconstrue my words here. I'm all for you having the ability to believe how and to who/what you may believe. I wasn't trying to knock you or your personal lives. I apologize if it seems otherwise.

And Skywarp...seriously man...get that out of there!

I think what you took as an example of how people can profess one thing and practice another as a slam on satanists or Wiccans in the wrong way .. here's another example someone can say they like blue as their color here on the forums and have everything they own in red... that's all I meant, so I won't remove my comment because there was nothing wrong with it..

You may not have meant any harm by it, but some may find it terribly offensive. Especially with the other criteria you had listed.

...and the color thing...would've gone over a whole lot better.

Just sayin'.

fair enough, but if your a Satanist, you have way more offensive materials to deal with out there then my comments, like movies and tv shows, preachers, and almost the entire world as an enemy..

I'm not into any organized religions, there is too much strife and war because of their beliefs.. I can go pray on a hill, with the good book, and have one on one time with God in his house, called Earth and Nature, then support what I believe is a corrupt system..

there has been more death in the world and fighting from religion then any other cause..even freedom...

it's too easy to use that as a disguise for war...

but I'm not going too deep into that this isn't the place or time..

Please stick to the topic.

Like I said I am working on someplace that you guys can go until we smooth things out here.

I have an idea. What if temporarily we set up a user group with a forum on a free site and passed the link around. We could use that in the interim till everything here gets straightned out.

Bonger wrote:I have an idea. What if temporarily we set up a user group with a forum on a free site and passed the link around. We could use that in the interim till everything here gets straightned out.

I think this is a bad idea. It wouldn't solve the problem and you wouldn't even have join date or post count to go by.

Of course it wouldn't involve Seibertron at all, so you can just do it without anyone's permission. Still, if you wanna do non-ebay sales and trades aren't there other sites good for that?

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Bonger wrote:I have an idea. What if temporarily we set up a user group with a forum on a free site and passed the link around. We could use that in the interim till everything here gets straightned out.

I think this is a bad idea. It wouldn't solve the problem and you wouldn't even have join date or post count to go by.

Of course it wouldn't involve Seibertron at all, so you can just do it without anyone's permission. Still, if you wanna do non-ebay sales and trades aren't there other sites good for that?

Actually that was my Idea as well. It would be only good known traders from Seibertron that would be invited/allowed.
You can set up a site to accept or decline people.

Again I ask that nobody take any kind of action

do not create a forum
do not pm
do not post ebay, trade, sale, buy here

Until I give any further notice.

Carbombya had big problems because people made no effort to post references (such as universally accepted ones like eBay and Heatware) yet other people were gullible enough to try a trade with them anyway. With Heatware it's really easy to verify that a person is who they claim to be; send them an email via heat and if that's really the same person, they'll reply. It's not like it's rocket science. Don't trade with people who have no references, check up on the ones that claim to, and you'll cut down on alot of issues.

If the people of Seibertron used their brains and only traded with people that have good and verified references (or exercised precautions in dealing with people who have none - for example if you as a buyer have feedback that's spectacular and the seller has none, demand the seller ship first), trading on the internet is alot safer. Closing Carbombya is throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

Cyber Bishop wrote:Please stick to the topic.

Like I said I am working on someplace that you guys can go until we smooth things out here.

I'm sorry, I can't help it. When our Philosophers Forum was taken away, we had to gravitate to another thread about another closed forum in order to compensate......


I know that's off topic Bishop and I'm sorry, but I agree with whoever said it earlier in this thread: things around here are on the decline. The Philosophers, now Carbombya, what's next? I figure it's not your alls' fault as the moderators and the people running the works here, but it's due to some of our members being jackasses. I have no ideas for fixing the problems, I think I'm just weighing in. Ever since the summer it just seems that people are ruining our good time.....or at least parts of it. Sad.