The Energon Pub

So this will probably come across as sour grapes from a Botcon non-attendee, but what on earth is going on with these exclusives on the secondary market? At the moment, there is an eBay seller with 103 separate listings for the Junkions set over the course of this weekend, most of which have sold at a 50-100% profit. Who knows how many more he has on hand...

Now, I live in the real world and I get that scalping/speculating happens in our hobby. It generally doesn't bother me and if anything, I'm grateful that I can find certain items after-the-fact, even at a mark-up. And even though I'm a bit overwhelmed by the number and initial price of many of FunPub/TFCC's offerings, I like that they can get certain characters made that wouldn't otherwise be. Certainly, I'm not under any obligation to collect these exclusives if I don't want to, so my attitude is largely live-and-let-live.

But something seems pretty off to me when a scalper is able to control this large a quantity of what is supposedly a "limited" inventory. What happened, did he walk up with $10,000 in cash at Botcon and buy a hundred sets (or more, potentially)? Was this a behind-closed-doors sort of deal?

The speculation wouldn't bug me nearly so much if FunPub was holding another couple thousand of these figures to sell online to club members. But last year most of the remaining exclusives sold out within a couple hours of being listed online.

I understand that FunPub is a business and it behooves them to sell their products any way they can, but it bothers me that they are willing to play ball with the scalpers to such a ridiculous extent. Can someone buy an extra exclusive or two to trade, store, or sell? Sure. But more than a hundred? What's going on!?

What frustrates me the most is that I'm probably going to buy right into this and bid on this guy's auctions, in order to get a set or two of these for my collection. I'd love another option, but the TFCC seems to have no real intention of providing one.

/rant

From what I understand about the buying limits, I'm not sure how a guy could get 100 of them. BBTS has some coming, but they had people go specifically to get the sets. Might be a similar operation here. There were 2000 Junkion sets. so if he has 100 of them he somehow got control of 5% of the stock.

Keep in mind that every year during Botcon, we have a 2 week period of time where prices go stupid on ebay and will stabilize shortly.

Seriously, just be patient and you will get your stuff. Being the first to own doesn't always pay off.

And to an extent, TFCC has combatted the scalping of troop builder sets. Botcon 2009 Sweeps were $50. I had 2 sets and sold one for $175 during Botcon weekend. They raised the price somewhat so now those throwing the troop builders on ebay don't make as hefty a profit as they did in 2009.

I believe that with the Golden Ticket power (new this year), holders could buy unlimited amounts of the exclusives. I think.

Certainly they could buy more than a regular Primus package holder (1 each).

Gotta love capitalism.

tigertracks 24 wrote:I believe that with the Golden Ticket power (new this year), holders could buy unlimited amounts of the exclusives. I think.

Certainly they could buy more than a regular Primus package holder (1 each).

Gotta love capitalism.

If that's true I guess they anticipated having far too many sets left over and wanted to get rid of as many as possible to lessen shipping costs.

Though I don't get why, if that's the case, they don't just sell more to the average ticket holder at the end of the event. Like, in the last two or three hours open it up to multiple purchases or something.

I really am shocked about this. If you're selling figures for collectors you should be selling TO collectors, not people who will obviously be reselling. A collector club is a fragile house of cards that stands on both money and CONSUMER GOOD WILL. Opening the door to potentials scalpers like this will only hurt them in the future.

Sellers were allowed to purchase 2 sets of exclusives per badge.Alot of sellers brought alot of employees with them, for instance toyarena.com( they were in line behind me) had 7 employees with them. bare in mind the limits were only imposed on the first night( thursday). On friday anyone could walk up to the club store and buy away. I had aprimus package, Purchased my 1 set thursday night and then Friday morning I purchased 2 more, 1 for a friend and 1 to help cover some of the costs. I sold said set at the show for slightly more than I paid.

Diem wrote:I really am shocked about this. If you're selling figures for collectors you should be selling TO collectors, not people who will obviously be reselling. A collector club is a fragile house of cards that stands on both money and CONSUMER GOOD WILL. Opening the door to potentials scalpers like this will only hurt them in the future.

This is my main problem. Certainly, I'd like to get the items I want for a reasonable price, but I'm truly beside myself that one guy has sold over a hundred sets in 72 hours, starting BEFORE the convention ended:



I get that FunPub is a business, but I remember back in the early days of Botcon when the MIB took over and the fans had an uproar over their commercial sensibilities. And FunPub blows them out of the water in that regard.

Sadly, I think that FunPub sees this sort of thing as beneficial to their reputation. After all, they've sold most or all of their inventory, and the high aftermarket demand only drives up the exclusivity of their products and helps their ability to promote future Botcons.

people were buying and selling those things at the con..It wasnt like funpub was handing this guy all of those sets. Im sure he had to do his share of wheeling and dealing to get all of those sets..

Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

LiKwid wrote:people were buying and selling those things at the con..It wasnt like funpub was handing this guy all of those sets. Im sure he had to do his share of wheeling and dealing to get all of those sets..

Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

Also the fact that buddy and his friends (whomever they may be) all got Golden Tickets, allowing each to get three of every set on day 1.

Mkall wrote:

LiKwid wrote:people were buying and selling those things at the con..It wasnt like funpub was handing this guy all of those sets. Im sure he had to do his share of wheeling and dealing to get all of those sets..

Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

Also the fact that buddy and his friends (whomever they may be) all got Golden Tickets, allowing each to get three of every set on day 1.

Changing the limit per set was a bad move on fun pubs part I agree.. Some people abused the hell out of that this year, toy arena is a fine example.

Always been my experience that the best way to beat scalpers is to beat them at their own game..

LiKwid wrote:Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

This. You guys are forgetting that they ARE selling to the fans. These are called souvenir sets for a reason. They are souvenirs for attending Botcon. They are made specifically for the event.

Flux Convoy wrote:

LiKwid wrote:Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

This. You guys are forgetting that they ARE selling to the fans. These are called souvenir sets for a reason. They are souvenirs for attending Botcon. They are made specifically for the event.

Yeah, I don't think this activity really qualifies as "scalping". If anything, these people are doing the masses a favor by giving them an alternate way to acquire these souvenirs without having to go the event. It's very different from a TRUE scalper, who buys 1000 tickets to a concert and then resells them at a huge markup.

Flux Convoy wrote:

LiKwid wrote:Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

This. You guys are forgetting that they ARE selling to the fans. These are called souvenir sets for a reason. They are souvenirs for attending Botcon. They are made specifically for the event.

Not that I am complaining because I never wanted the sets, but I calculated what it would cost for me to attend when the location was announced. And when Botcon costs around $1000 just because of airfare, hotel costs, food & entrance tickets, the toys suddenly look outrageously overpriced. Yes, it's a fun event, but forking over that sort of dough before you even have chance to purchase the "goodies" is a little crazy, at least in my mind. So the secondary market is the only feasible option, but that's where the scalpers lurk because they understand this logic.

I feel that the people that attend the event should get first-crack at buying one of each of the exclusives. The rest should go up on the club store so that members can get one of each until they run out. Then put them up for the general public. These figures are intended for the fans as collectors items. They are not intended for people to turn around and re-sell at jacked prices.

I realize that this is not a feasible option. It would be nice though.

SJ21 wrote:These figures are intended for the fans as collectors items.

I truly do not mean for this to sound elitist but you're wrong. They are meant to be at show exclusives. Souvenirs for the fans who are attending. That is why whatever doesn't sell at the show goes up later. They want to sell through at the convention and not even have to bother with selling them at the store.

Sadly he's right. Let's think about it: if you could buy them at the store from day one, even at a slightly higher price, then it negates the point of going to the convention at all if you're a toy collector and the rest doesn't matter to you. It's not a pleasant fact of the matter, but it is there.

Kung Fu Man wrote:Sadly he's right. Let's think about it: if you could buy them at the store from day one, even at a slightly higher price, then it negates the point of going to the convention at all if you're a toy collector and the rest doesn't matter to you. It's not a pleasant fact of the matter, but it is there.

The point of the convention is not supposed to be the toy exclusives, it's the guests, the dealer room, the panels, the dealer room...

I get that the exclusives should be available to convention goers, but why not offer them to order minus the FREE ATTENDEE FIGURE? Again, while I know they are meant to be souvenirs for the convention that is great, but let other members not able to attend the convention have a shot at pre-ordering. Otherwise, why sell non-attending packages? The boxset is supposed to be a convention exclusive too.

Hell, if they want to keep the add-on souvenirs a secret, make us blind pre-order them, with only a slight description of what figures are in the set.

I'm not upset about this, I just think the exclusives should not be made the big deal for attending...back in the day, there was one or two exclusives, and no add-on souvenir sets...(cranky, old fart voice)...we made our own souvenirs by buying and trading in the dealer room...

Kung Fu Man wrote:Sadly he's right. Let's think about it: if you could buy them at the store from day one, even at a slightly higher price, then it negates the point of going to the convention at all if you're a toy collector and the rest doesn't matter to you. It's not a pleasant fact of the matter, but it is there.

Yet leftovers from both NYCC and SDCC hit Hasbro's website. Just saying.

Scalpers are douchebags, but if people out there are dumb enough to pay, who am I to begrudge a douchebag his/her profit?

Flux Convoy wrote:

LiKwid wrote:Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

This. You guys are forgetting that they ARE selling to the fans. These are called souvenir sets for a reason. They are souvenirs for attending Botcon. They are made specifically for the event.

That's exactly the point.

"Yeah, I wanna buy 100 souvenirs. Got a lot of happy memories, I guess."

I'm fine with the first line of the figures being sold at Botcon, that's fair enough. But by allowing people to buy up these large numbers of sets, the TFCC are literally guaranteeing that those fans who are not lucky enough to make it to Botcon will be paying inflated prices, and that extra money will be going into the hands of people who probably aren't even fans to begin with. Good for the Club, but bad for the fans.

The argument that these figures are meant to be for Botcon attendees is fair enough, if a little biased towards those fans who live in the States, and who live near enough to Botcon that it isn't a ridiculous proposition to go there. But if the Club knows that these scalpers will be distributing the figures to fans, why not do it themselves and earn a little fan goodwill as a bonus?

Yeah it's a risk, but fans are the lifeblood of a fanclub.

tigertracks 24 wrote:

Kung Fu Man wrote:Sadly he's right. Let's think about it: if you could buy them at the store from day one, even at a slightly higher price, then it negates the point of going to the convention at all if you're a toy collector and the rest doesn't matter to you. It's not a pleasant fact of the matter, but it is there.

The point of the convention is not supposed to be the toy exclusives, it's the guests, the dealer room, the panels, the dealer room...

I get that the exclusives should be available to convention goers, but why not offer them to order minus the FREE ATTENDEE FIGURE? Again, while I know they are meant to be souvenirs for the convention that is great, but let other members not able to attend the convention have a shot at pre-ordering. Otherwise, why sell non-attending packages? The boxset is supposed to be a convention exclusive too.

Exactly. I'm not opposed to convention exclusives, but they used to be a special bonus of attending, not the raison d'être.

And regarding exclusivity, I agree that that's the whole point of the free attendee figure and to a certain extent, the customizing class figure. But with non-attending packages available, it's clear that the general intention is for these figures to be a representation of the event as much as a site-specific purchase. If they sell 1500 sets at the event, offer the remainder at a 20% markup to club members through the TFCC website. Don't let such a huge portion of the supply go into the hands of a single dealer.

Diem wrote:

Flux Convoy wrote:

LiKwid wrote:Want to put a end to it? Go to botcon...

This. You guys are forgetting that they ARE selling to the fans. These are called souvenir sets for a reason. They are souvenirs for attending Botcon. They are made specifically for the event.

That's exactly the point.

"Yeah, I wanna buy 100 souvenirs. Got a lot of happy memories, I guess."

I'm fine with the first line of the figures being sold at Botcon, that's fair enough. But by allowing people to buy up these large numbers of sets, the TFCC are literally guaranteeing that those fans who are not lucky enough to make it to Botcon will be paying inflated prices, and that extra money will be going into the hands of people who probably aren't even fans to begin with. Good for the Club, but bad for the fans.

The argument that these figures are meant to be for Botcon attendees is fair enough, if a little biased towards those fans who live in the States, and who live near enough to Botcon that it isn't a ridiculous proposition to go there. But if the Club knows that these scalpers will be distributing the figures to fans, why not do it themselves and earn a little fan goodwill as a bonus?

Yeah it's a risk, but fans are the lifeblood of a fanclub.

Well put.

It's pretty hard to avoid scalping, no matter how FunPub handles it.

If you are serious about getting exclusives and not paying some mark-up without attending the show, the beat way around that is to ask a friend who is going to pick them up for you. A lot of Seibertronians couldn't make BotCon 2011 so they asked their friends in advance to snag them some sets.

Rodimus Prime wrote:Scalpers are douchebags, but if people out there are dumb enough to pay, who am I to begrudge a douchebag his/her profit?

Yeah. What they're doing is offering a service to those who didn't attend. Who didn't stand in line for hours. Who didn't buy a $300 ticket package. Who didn't book a hotel or a flight.

100% markup? That's cool with me.

speaking specifically about Almar_ent, the ebay seller selling all those botcon sets being discussed here.

he started all these auctions at 1 penny, and let the market (ie the collector community) dictate the value of these sets.

that seems a lot more fair than what Toy Arena or BBTS is doing by buying them up and setting a fixed price well above the issue price at botcon.

For my money, he is an asset, not a scalper, there are fans all around the world who want these but cannot attend the show.

starting auctions at essentially 0 and letting the bidders dictate the closing price isnt anything like a traditional scalper.