The Energon Pub

Hey everyone,

I was messing around with Masterpiece Sideswipe this afternoon and I really enjoy the overall quality of the figure. The lack of diecast metal really doesn't bother me. In fact I'm finding that I prefer plastic these days since it's not as likely to suffer from paint chipping. I think metal should still be used for critical joints and maybe feet for stability, but that's about it.

Back in the day, the cheap toys were made mostly of plastic and the better ones had some diecast content. In those days, I associated diecast metal with a quality piece.

In the last few years though, my feelings have changed. While sometimes I do miss that nice feel of diecast, I think these days a lack of it doesn't necessarily equate to a lack of quality. Toy engineering has come a long way in 30 years, and for the most part I'm loving the results. Except my poor Binaltechs and even MP-01 never see the light of day for fear of scuffs and scrapes.

How about you guys?

I think Burn had a similar thread. Anyway, die-cast with no redeeming use for the figure = "Titanium" series (especially WWI Optimus Prime). 'nuff said.

fenrir72 wrote:I think Burn had a similar thread. Anyway, die-cast with no redeeming use for the figure = "Titanium" series (especially WWI Optimus Prime). 'nuff said.

Hmmm. Yeah, I remember seeing the Titanium line on the shelves some years ago and I didn't buy any of them. Some of the designs were interesting but I probably would've just kept them packed away.

fenrir72 wrote:I think Burn had a similar thread. Anyway, die-cast with no redeeming use for the figure = "Titanium" series (especially WWI Optimus Prime). 'nuff said.

Me too.

Yea, I used to associate die-cast with quality too, and in some cases that still holds true (like model cars etc), but for Transformers it just sucks. Hasbro's MP Thundercracker for instance is a good example. It has no diecast, while all other versions do, and TC is loads more fun and actually feels better and more sturdy than my MP11 Starscream, due to the fact that all the die-cast parts are now plastic so the torso actually holds together.

fenrir72 wrote:I think Burn had a similar thread.

Holy crap that was a long time ago!

My biggest gripe then was the Titanium line.

To me it was Hasbro's way of shutting the fans up for good. For years we'd been moaning and bitching and crying for more die cast in our TF's. So they caved and listened to the fans and gave us a line of incredibly awkward, heavy, hard to pose figures which pretty much turned us off die cast all together.

It was a Hasbro conspiracy.

Because you can guarantee, if they busted those Titanium molds out and redid them in plastic, they'd be great figures.

Except you Megatron, your Titanium version is going to suck regardless of what it's made of.

Burn wrote:To me it was Hasbro's way of shutting the fans up for good. For years we'd been moaning and bitching and crying for more die cast in our TF's. So they caved and listened to the fans and gave us a line of incredibly awkward, heavy, hard to pose figures which pretty much turned us off die cast all together.

It was a Hasbro conspiracy.

If that's actually true.. that's really funny.

"You want diecast? Okay, here's your diecast. Enjoy!"

If I were to re-issue WWI Optimus,I'd keep the die-cast on the feet and the joints in his hips.And make the paint stick for Primus' sake.

fenrir72 wrote:If I were to re-issue WWI Optimus,I'd keep the die-cast on the feet and the joints in his hips.And make the paint stick for Primus' sake.

I just looked that figure up on YouTube. It's a nice design, but man it's a floppy, scratched-up mess.

If it were re-engineered and released with fixes and improvements, I'd probably buy it.

the reason i am against die cast is that it actually becomes brittle as it ages. the same process breakdown that happens to painted die cast parts also happens inside die cast to causing it to fracture at certian points over time. die cast in the feet is great, otherwise dont use it.

I actually stripped down a WWI Prime for repainting a few years back.

Gave up on it, too much effort stripping the paint off for a clean paint. And seriously, even broken down the individual parts were as heavy as a plastic deluxe.

I've been reading reviews of Masterpiece figures. Lots of negative comments: too small, feels flimsy, needs more metal to justify Masterpiece classification and pricing.

I loved my vintage G1 figures and still do, but when I look at my Masterpiece figures.. they're just so awesome. They're almost completely made of plastic yet so much better than anything I had as a kid. I think they're well worth their name and price.

Die-cast is great if it's used correctly. I can't comment or speculate on the Titanium line but the first two Alternity figures put the metal in the wrong place, resulting in figures that might suddenly limbo dance just as you were about to finish putting them in a pose. The metal needs to be below the centre of gravity in robot mode or it can ruin it. MMC's not-Shockwave is a perfect example of die-cast done right - he feels hefty and robust and his robot mode is very well grounded.

I like die cast in the right spots. It makes them feel like a show pieces rather than action figures.

How the heck do you keep the paint stuck to the Fig anyway? My MP-01 is chipping/dried (shins most especially) Those btw are the die-cast parts.

Also, one thing that surprised me, my G1 Kup is one of the die-cast releases. His torso is diecast and yet there is nary a chip, drying of bubbling of the paint. G1 Metalhawk too, there is no oxidation on my unit. (Fyi for those who don't know about the original toy, he was the only die-cast character released for the Masterforce line (not counting the joints for the other releases if applicable).

Die cast is great for things that will never pose - model cars, trains, spaceships, tanks, etcetera.

It sucks for anything articulated, because there will always be poses that the figure could technically acheive because of the range of motion, but never able to sustain because of the weight of the die cast. Even if it's feet only, there'll never be any decent combat "kicking" poses (for example), or running poses with the back leg up in the air (for dynamism), because the weight of the foot will drag it down.

So while it might be great in G1 bricks, it's a bad, BAD choice for modern style, highly articulated figures.

I LOVE the feel of diecast metal. However, if used stupidly, it make a mess. Best examples are my Titanium Optimus Prime and "GI-Joe" Megatron. Both figures suck, especially Megatron who just explode in your hand. Oddly, Titanium Starscream, while not perfect, hold himself very well and is a great figure.

I have Binaltech Grimlock and my only complain is his weird transformation scheme for his arms. That have noting to do with diecast. I also have a few Alternity figures. The only one who is at fault is Starscream with his diecast doors that are too heavy and keep popping off in transformation.

I have MP-01 Last shot and he's one HEAVY mofo. Not as posable as MP-10 due to all that metal, but he's imposing and feel like a real robot. I LOVE it, despite is bad truck mode.

I got a few G1 figures and Go-Bots as well and all diecast are always in the right spots. They knew where to put the metal at the time.

Strangely, the only figure I have with paint that chip off all over the place is my Beast Machine Ultra (I call it Leader) Jetstorm. I bought it MISB and when I played with it, it was paint chips. Paint chips everywhere.

Anyway, I don't mind a 100% plastic figure. As long that it don't feel cheap and it's well painted. Even if I love carressing diecast almost on erotica levels, diecast have to be used at the right spot to make the figure functional and enjoyable. So, on the top of my head, here's the best figures that use diecast and are fun to play with:
-MP-01
-Titanium Starscream
-All "cabin headed" Super Gobots from the 1980's
-G1 Optimus Prime (especially with the diecast long smokestack upgrade)
-G1 Soundwave