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-Kanrabat- wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Because that's getting its own spin off movie as a prequel. Hopefully showing shockwave's leadership of the cons in megs absence.

Will this be an actual thing?
And without any woke poison?

woke poison…wow. Sometimes you can just smell fans in their posts

ZeroWolf wrote:Because that's getting its own spin off movie as a prequel. Hopefully showing shockwave's leadership of the cons in megs absence.

This is the first I've heard of that.

~ Grim

Rtron wrote:Lol, imagine getting triggered so hard by a piece of marketing.

Laugh all you want but it's the "death by a thousand cuts" syndrome. By its lonesome its not that bad. But Hollywood shove identity politics hardcore since years, often sabotaging their own movie or the whole franchise in the process. The put on a pedestal things that should NOT matter in the movie. Race, gender, sexual orientation, NONE OF THIS MATTER. The stories and characters are. If I want to see a movie "celebrating Latino culture" I'll watch Coco.

I want to see a movie about Transformers and Transformers culture. But the marketing say that's not what I'm going to get.

I'm tired of this kind of marketing:

Randomhero wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Because that's getting its own spin off movie as a prequel. Hopefully showing shockwave's leadership of the cons in megs absence.

Will this be an actual thing?
And without any woke poison?

woke poison…wow. Sometimes you can just smell fans in their posts

Well, name a single "woke" movie with heavy "woke" marketing that got tremendous success and brought sales records. I'll wait.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

Rtron wrote:Lol, imagine getting triggered so hard by a piece of marketing.

Laugh all you want but it's the "death by a thousand cuts" syndrome. By its lonesome its not that bad. But Hollywood shove identity politics hardcore since years, often sabotaging their own movie or the whole franchise in the process. The put on a pedestal things that should NOT matter in the movie. Race, gender, sexual orientation, NONE OF THIS MATTER. The stories and characters are. If I want to see a movie "celebrating Latino culture" I'll watch Coco.

I want to see a movie about Transformers and Transformers culture. But the marketing say that's not what I'm going to get.

I'm tired of this kind of marketing:

Dude, I'm from a third world country, you don't need to lecture me about Hollywood hypocrisy. It's been like this forever, you're just noticing it now. And honestly, I'd rather the new buzzword be something positive like this than, I don't know, the metaverse bullshit that's going on on the tech sector.

Rtron wrote:Dude, I'm from a third world country, you don't need to lecture me about Hollywood hypocrisy. It's been like this forever, you're just noticing it now. And honestly, I'd rather the new buzzword be something positive like this than, I don't know, the metaverse bullshit that's going on on the tech sector.

Well, I agree 100%.

Also, I must point out what is actually "woke."
The woke put on a pedestal inherent characteristics when it shouldn't matter in the movie.

For example, the recent Strange World is full woke while the classic Brokeback Mountain is not.

Big Grim wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Because that's getting its own spin off movie as a prequel. Hopefully showing shockwave's leadership of the cons in megs absence.

This is the first I've heard of that.

~ Grim

To be fair it goes quiet from time to time but it was last talked about in the wake of Bee's success.

Rodimus Prime wrote::lol:

I knew it! I'm glad my instincts about this movie were right. Now I don't have to waste any more time being even mildly curious. After all, it's for "the homies."

Holy racism Batman!

People in these comments just seething over “oH iTs wOkE” because it’s going to (probably briefly) deal with culture outside of America. Was it woke in the Bumblebee movie how it explores 80s American culture by showing us Hailey Steinfeld’s character’s life? Yeah yeah we all want a “100% on Cybertron zero humans plot” but it’s not the end of the world, more and different media will always be coming.

Man, some of these comments make me ashamed to be a Tf fan. If Megatron’s Master Plan happens in real life, y’all would be right in that parade cheering on the Decepticons.

Stormshot_Prime wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote::lol:

I knew it! I'm glad my instincts about this movie were right. Now I don't have to waste any more time being even mildly curious. After all, it's for "the homies."

Holy racism Batman!

People in these comments just seething over “oH iTs wOkE” because it’s going to (probably briefly) deal with culture outside of America. Was it woke in the Bumblebee movie how it explores 80s American culture by showing us Hailey Steinfeld’s character’s life? Yeah yeah we all want a “100% on Cybertron zero humans plot” but it’s not the end of the world, more and different media will always be coming.

Man, some of these comments make me ashamed to be a Tf fan. If Megatron’s Master Plan happens in real life, y’all would be right in that parade cheering on the Decepticons.

Is it even outside of the USA? Because all of those movies people call "woke" are just about americans, or, at most, a very american perspective on other countries... From an outsider's perspective, these guys are literally getting angry over nothing. And some are straight up spouting insane rambles.

Stormshot_Prime wrote:
Holy racism Batman!

It has NOTHING to do with "racism". Or "sexism". Or any other isms. I can point out dozens of youtube channels featuring black/latino/female/LGBTQ people that are ANTI-WOKE.

What we don't like is when the woke wear race/gender/sexuality like a "devout" Christian's giant golden cross around their neck to show how "virtuous" they are.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

Stormshot_Prime wrote:
Holy racism Batman!

It has NOTHING to do with "racism". Or "sexism". Or any other isms. I can point out dozens of youtube channels featuring black/latino/female/LGBTQ people that are ANTI-WOKE.

What we don't like is when the woke wear race/gender/sexuality like a "devout" Christian's giant golden cross around their neck to show how "virtuous" they are.

It might not be in your case, I don't know you. But look at some of the other replies... They're very sus. If you're being honest about your beliefs, then I think you're misdirecting your anger. You should be angry at corporations for making a mockery of every cause, and at people who want to feel morally righteous while actually being assholes, not at people that want to be represented. Using the word "woke" doesn't communicate what you seem to think it communicates. And that's the last thing I'll say on the matter, this is a Transformers forum.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

Randomhero wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Because that's getting its own spin off movie as a prequel. Hopefully showing shockwave's leadership of the cons in megs absence.

Will this be an actual thing?
And without any woke poison?

woke poison…wow. Sometimes you can just smell fans in their posts

Well, name a single "woke" movie with heavy "woke" marketing that got tremendous success and brought sales records. I'll wait.

The two Black Panther films had similar articles to this one which would state the high percentage of coloured cast members . The first marketed a black male lead along with a 99% coloured cast and made over one billion dollars. The new one promoted a different origin for Namor, with Mayan roots, along with the rest of the cast being mostly black women, and it's doing very well at the cinemas too. Both had heavy "woke" marketing and both got tremendous success and both broke sales records.

If Hollywood wants to make a movie which has its primary focus as the 'celebration black and latino culture', that's fine. But what does celebrating black/latino culture have to do with a civil war between two factions of giant alien robots from a completely different planet?

william-james88 wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

Randomhero wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Because that's getting its own spin off movie as a prequel. Hopefully showing shockwave's leadership of the cons in megs absence.

Will this be an actual thing?
And without any woke poison?

woke poison…wow. Sometimes you can just smell fans in their posts

Well, name a single "woke" movie with heavy "woke" marketing that got tremendous success and brought sales records. I'll wait.

The two Black Panther films had similar articles to this one which would state the high percentage of coloured cast members . The first marketed a black male lead along with a 99% coloured cast and made over one billion dollars. The new one promoted a different origin for Namor, with Mayan roots, along with the rest of the cast being mostly black women, and it's doing very well at the cinemas too. Both had heavy "woke" marketing and both got tremendous success and both broke sales records.

I don't consider the first Black Panther movie itself to be "woke" at al. Its marketing was, but not the movie. In fact that movie is ironically "anti-woke". Manly men, Wakanda is a closed-borders country with ethno-centric values. The marketing was "woke" by chanting "diversity" while the movie was anything but diverse.

As for the second one,all i heard was its just some generic "fast food" movie. And if you split hair and over-analize it, it's actually "racist" against Hispanics. TlDr, Black Panther 2 is NOT "woke" at all. Just "meh".

In fact, movies tha are pure woke are thankfully rare. The problem is often the marketing who act like a real Tartufe and pretend that their generic Hollywood junk will "change the world" or something.

DeathReviews wrote:If Hollywood wants to make a movie which has its primary focus as the 'celebration black and latino culture', that's fine. But what does celebrating black/latino culture have to do with a civil war between two factions of giant alien robots from a completely different planet?

This.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

DeathReviews wrote:If Hollywood wants to make a movie which has its primary focus as the 'celebration black and latino culture', that's fine. But what does celebrating black/latino culture have to do with a civil war between two factions of giant alien robots from a completely different planet?

This.

“What does the setting and characters have to do with the actual movie?!”

-Kanrabat- wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

Randomhero wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Because that's getting its own spin off movie as a prequel. Hopefully showing shockwave's leadership of the cons in megs absence.

Will this be an actual thing?
And without any woke poison?

woke poison…wow. Sometimes you can just smell fans in their posts

Well, name a single "woke" movie with heavy "woke" marketing that got tremendous success and brought sales records. I'll wait.

The two Black Panther films had similar articles to this one which would state the high percentage of coloured cast members . The first marketed a black male lead along with a 99% coloured cast and made over one billion dollars. The new one promoted a different origin for Namor, with Mayan roots, along with the rest of the cast being mostly black women, and it's doing very well at the cinemas too. Both had heavy "woke" marketing and both got tremendous success and both broke sales records.

I don't consider the first Black Panther movie itself to be "woke" at al. Its marketing was, but not the movie. In fact that movie is ironically "anti-woke". Manly men, Wakanda is a closed-borders country with ethno-centric values. The marketing was "woke" by chanting "diversity" while the movie was anything but diverse.

As for the second one,all i heard was its just some generic "fast food" movie. And if you split hair and over-analize it, it's actually "racist" against Hispanics. TlDr, Black Panther 2 is NOT "woke" at all. Just "meh".

In fact, movies tha are pure woke are thankfully rare. The problem is often the marketing who act like a real Tartufe and pretend that their generic Hollywood junk will "change the world" or something.

It's fine if those two films don't fit within your definition, but they did for others. People even coined the term "Woke-anda". And they had lots of articles like the one I newsed. That's why I mentioned them, they seem like a good comparison to what we see here. If you don't have an issue with those films, then I think you won't mind this next Transformers either. From everything I see, this film won't be a pure "woke" film. It will be a live action TF film though, with Bay involved in some aspect, which comes with everything people may or may not like about those. But that's another discussion.

I also do not want the movie to be 100% focused on the human characters, but the comments everyone is reacting too seem so minor and do not imply this at all. If the protagonists are POC in 90s Brooklyn, their ethnicity and culture is inevitably going to be part of their character(s), even if that only extends to the slang they use, music they listen to, etc.

The fact that some grown-ass men today are reacting this strongly to the mere suggestion that nonwhite 90s kids are going to act like nonwhite 90s kids is probably the strongest argument for why we still need this kinda emphasis, even if it's just in the marketing and barely noticeable in the movie.

Also, none of the comments in the article suggest this is what's happening at all, but are we seriously going to pretend that oppressed minorities suffering from injustice is a theme that does not resonate in the slightest in a franchise about warriors fighting for 'the right of all sentient beings' against tyrannical jingoists?

-Kanrabat- wrote:I don't consider the first Black Panther movie itself to be "woke" at al. Its marketing was, but not the movie. In fact that movie is ironically "anti-woke". Manly men, Wakanda is a closed-borders country with ethno-centric values. The marketing was "woke" by chanting "diversity" while the movie was anything but diverse.

As for the second one,all i heard was its just some generic "fast food" movie. And if you split hair and over-analize it, it's actually "racist" against Hispanics. TlDr, Black Panther 2 is NOT "woke" at all. Just "meh".

In fact, movies tha are pure woke are thankfully rare. The problem is often the marketing who act like a real Tartufe and pretend that their generic Hollywood junk will "change the world" or something.

Did you...watch the first movie? The core plot was about *changing* those exact values, and the movie ends with Wakanda opening its borders and T'Challa making an effort to specifically address the 'woke' Killmonger's concerns. Not to mention the focus on the women (Shuri and the Dora Milaje) and references to white people as being 'colonizers' (and where on earth did you get the impression of 'manly men'? Every major male in the movie cries or expresses sensitivity/'wokeness' without shame at some point in it). It's awkward that this movie tramples all over your point, but that's a pretty weak reason to insist that it isn't incredibly 'woke'.

And you can't really have an opinion on the sequel if you haven't seen it and (from the looks of it) know very little about it.

From your language I assume you won't consider (off the top of my head) 'Mad Max: Fury Road', '12 Years A Slave', 'Get Out', 'Moonlight', 'Blackkklansman', 'Wall-E' (hell, most recent Disney animations), 'The Help' or 'Persepolis' to be woke either. All focus very heavily on woke themes and/or characterization and all were successful, either financially, critically or both. And if you don't consider those to be woke, I can't really fathom why you're getting so upset about some innocuous comments about Rise of the Beasts.

What's really bizarre about all this is that Bumblebee already set the precedent for this in a major way. Hailee Steinfeld's character was a huge focus (both in marketing and the movie itself), with the film going into her family, history, personality and trauma. People like you didn't seem to mind when it was a white girl, but apparently trying to do the same with nonwhite people is completely enraging?

I think you guys are giving too much weight to this interview.

The impression I got from this, is how they are proud of their work, and how someone who came from their paths of life can now contribute and be part of Transformers.

Though this interview does seen to forget guys like Tyrese Gibson and Amaury Nolasco.

TulioDude wrote:I think you guys are giving too much weight to this interview.

The impression I got from this, is how they are proud of their work, and how someone who came from their paths of life can now contribute and be part of Transformers.

Though this interview does seen to forget guys like Tyrese Gibson and Amaury Nolasco.

Agreed. But it's the fact that people are reacting with such disgust to even the possibility of nonwhite culture having a focus that is troubling.

Cheesinator wrote:

TulioDude wrote:I think you guys are giving too much weight to this interview.

The impression I got from this, is how they are proud of their work, and how someone who came from their paths of life can now contribute and be part of Transformers.

Though this interview does seen to forget guys like Tyrese Gibson and Amaury Nolasco.

Agreed. But it's the fact that people are reacting with such disgust to even the possibility of nonwhite culture having a focus that is troubling.

It’s downright horrifying. All because the latest political buzzword has come to be used as a “safe” avenue to express general bigotry. A franchise about change on a fundamental level seems to have a lot of people mad that things dare change. ALL OF THIS for a movie that, overall, will probably be relatively generic (not to discredit my excitement, just a realistic expectation).

william-james88 wrote:It's fine if those two films don't fit within your definition, but they did for others. People even coined the term "Woke-anda". And they had lots of articles like the one I newsed. That's why I mentioned them, they seem like a good comparison to what we see here. If you don't have an issue with those films, then I think you won't mind this next Transformers either. From everything I see, this film won't be a pure "woke" film. It will be a live action TF film though, with Bay involved in some aspect, which comes with everything people may or may not like about those. But that's another discussion.

I dont believe one bit that ROTB will be "woke". At all. What I take issue with is that the marketing is telling me that my all-dressed pizza was made to "celebrate" green peppers. I can only sigh at this.

Stormshot_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

DeathReviews wrote:If Hollywood wants to make a movie which has its primary focus as the 'celebration black and latino culture', that's fine. But what does celebrating black/latino culture have to do with a civil war between two factions of giant alien robots from a completely different planet?

This.

“What does the setting and characters have to do with the actual movie?!”

The risk is that it sounds like they're trying to make TWO movies. One, 'a story about black/latino culture'. The other, a story about giant, sentient alien robots fighting a civil war. Some movies actually manage to navigate through several sub-stories in one film, but it's a tricky business.

Will this be a movie that's primarily a story about black/latino culture, which just happens to have sub-story in it about an alien robot civil war? Or will it be a movie about an alien robot civil war, which just happens to have a sub-story about black/latino culture? They're going to have to be extremely careful that the two separate aspects of this movie don't wind up competing with each other, or they could easily confuse and bore the audience.

The Bayverse TF movies have meandered through lots of mini-stories which supposedly stitch together into an overall narrative. Maybe their plan is to do the same here. But I think the Bayverse films suffered in that regard, because I felt all the myriad sub-stories didn't jive, and simply became disjointed and jarring.

Stormshot_Prime wrote:

Cheesinator wrote:

TulioDude wrote:I think you guys are giving too much weight to this interview.

The impression I got from this, is how they are proud of their work, and how someone who came from their paths of life can now contribute and be part of Transformers.

Though this interview does seen to forget guys like Tyrese Gibson and Amaury Nolasco.

Agreed. But it's the fact that people are reacting with such disgust to even the possibility of nonwhite culture having a focus that is troubling.

It’s downright horrifying. All because the latest political buzzword has come to be used as a “safe” avenue to express general bigotry. A franchise about change on a fundamental level seems to have a lot of people mad that things dare change. ALL OF THIS for a movie that, overall, will probably be relatively generic (not to discredit my excitement, just a realistic expectation).

I can't speak for other people, but I would have the same angry reaction if the director claimed that the movie was made to "celebrate French people and Christian values".

I can't speak for other people, but I would have the same angry reaction if the director claimed that the movie was made to "celebrate French people and Christian values".

For instance - in any of the previous TF movies, did the marketers ever say anything like that? Why then, do they feel the need to do so now? Why not simply allow admiration of a culture to happen organically on its own? Criticism of movies and stories is expected - there are entire industries built around being critical and skeptical of movies, their stories, and the motivations behind their being written and produced. What is it about skepticism/criticism of this one which causes some to say it's 'horrifying'...?