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Feel free to discuss anything about any of the thousands of Transformer toys here. Anything from Generation 1 all the way to the soon to be released, the never to be released or the hope to be released is fair game! Want to show off your stuff? Please post your's and see others in the Transformers Collections Forum.
Meanwhile, in "new" news....video review for the new Twintwist Recolor.
I'm actually axcited for these, will be my first Legacy Purchase (although its a subline, not mainline), but this and presumably Topspin will go well with the others since I have the Legends versions of those, so these will be a little different not only in color, but in terms of accessories.
Bucket/Want List: Botcon 2016 Customization Class Ratchet (G2 Deco), or Customization Class Ratchet (Marvel Comics Deco) **would also be willing to pay for an Unpainted Botcon 2016 Ratchet, TT Legends Fortress Head (only) with working Electronics
Wish List of Modern Combiners: Road Caesar, Monstructor & Dinoking (proper size to fiction), Landcross, Guard City, Battle Gaia, & G2 Defensor. Wish List of Titans:Metrotitan,Majin Zarak
Reuters, whose article was syndicated around, vaguebooked for headline clicks. Though not mentioned in the article, the actual investor report it's from specified this batch of increases is wizards of the coast/magic the gathering specific due to increases in tcg-related manufacturing costs, not company wide.
o.supreme wrote:Sales limited to geography I don't really count
Exactly. Because it they did, a 100% complete and great condition G1 Pretender Thunderwing and Bludgeon are only worth 80$CAN (63$US) each because that's what I paid at my local geek store 5 or so years ago.
Come see my latest creation, a Galvatron Combiner using 4 SS86 Sweeps as limbs HERE!
Seibertron was part of a round table discussion with Hasbro a few days ago. Nothing new was revealed, it was just a question and answer period. Out question was to know if there would be more weapon multipacks but we got the same non answer though Hasbro did clarify that sometimes weapons that are not included with a particular character could be released down the line with another if there is room in the budget and tooling for it. For instance, we saw that with Core Class SS Ravage who had an accessory specifically for SS BB Soundwave.
One of the biggest points of discussion was the whole deal with Hasbro releasing Siege Soundwave, which was plentiful, rather than the Netflix Soundwave which both had the G1 alt mode many fans wanted AND was only released as a Walmart exclusive at a higher price due to coming in a multipack. Well, Hasbro was very blunt and honest regarding this, it is due to the exclusive status of the molding. If new molding is released exclusively through a retailer, then that retailer has the rights to the selling of that toy and the tooling for a certain amount of time. Not all contract are the same. For instance, Amazon had exclusive rights to the Kingdom Terrorsaur release/tooling but the time of hat exclusivity was short enough that now Target owns the rights to selling that tooling since they will do that with the redeco coming soon.
But the time for Walmart's exclusivity on Netflix Soundwave has not expired yet and we don't know when it will expire or if Hasbro intends on rereleasing it when it does. But at least now we know why Hasbro is rereleasing Siege Soundwave. We have images of the packaging below.
Speaking of the packaging, questions came up regarding the open box nature of the legacy line. This is where Hasbro clearly stated that the legacy line is still designed with kids in mind and they product tested this line with kids. It turns out kids prefer the open box design over closed box. Also, Cybertron Metroplex was picked over other titan options for it's appeal to kids. They said kids liked the idea of a big construction-type vehicle, it added to the coolness factor of the giant robot.
There was also acknowledgement of price hikes that are not confirmed to end, and of yellowing on toys, they are looking into that.
Finally, the question of Menasor's Combiner Wars ports came up. Yes, they did use the same port system used in the Combiner Wars line, but it was done simply because it's a good system for partsforming and not for backwards compatibility. It is only used in the leg segments and while people could attach legs from the combiner wars era, it will not be 100% sturdy.
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Interesting to hear how much input for the legacy line still comes from kids and what they would want. Even for the titan class which I admit even I thought was not really targetting them (simply because that seems like a higher end collectible price point and lack of exposure to kids at retail).
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We have news that Transformers Legacy leader class wave 2 has been found at US retail. shapercreator14 found them at a Target in Cleveland, Ohio. Blitzwing is the only new toy in this wave, the other is a repacked G2 Optimus Prime.
We have news that Transformers Legacy exclusives have been found at UK retail. Legend of Matt found them at a Smyths in Bristol. These are all exclusive redecos of Kingdom Beast Wars molds: Sandstorm, Buzzaw and Nightprowler. They are Walmart exclusives in the US.
So...the exclusivity rules...those apply to Netflix Bumblebee as well. I know people have said he can't be rereleased because of VW, but could it more have to do with Walmart's rights to the new tooling?
MeGrimlock78 wrote:So...the exclusivity rules...those apply to Netflix Bumblebee as well. I know people have said he can't be rereleased because of VW, but could it more have to do with Walmart's rights to the new tooling?
Its probably both to be fair, so even when the walmart part ends, the VW part could still scupper him till the time they get the license again.
MeGrimlock78 wrote:So...the exclusivity rules...those apply to Netflix Bumblebee as well. I know people have said he can't be rereleased because of VW, but could it more have to do with Walmart's rights to the new tooling?
Its probably both to be fair, so even when the walmart part ends, the VW part could still scupper him till the time they get the license again.
Great write up Will
Thanks man, I really wanted to give examples and context in a way that would help people understand.
I am looking at facebook comments regarding this and many fans are still having a really hard time acknowledging that their are not the main focus of any toyline, especially one like Legacy.
Anyways, people were talking about previous titans going on sale and I'm pretty sure I got both on sale. Not discounted, that never happened. But pretty sure there were sales. @Kanrabat, didn't Walmart have Omega on sale by the end? I bought mine at Toysrus though, and they had like a 20% off sale, so that was good enough for me. Bought Scorponok from them as well since we was also on sale at some point (and predaking, who was on a really good sale once). People were probably talking of discount/liquidation though so me buying on sale is probably not the same thing. I won't be buying any titans anymore though, no room and no interest. I got the big bots I wanted. Will probably sell fort max, I don't take him out to play with him with my kids ever, unlike Omega and Trypitcon.
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Motto:"Anything worth doing is worth suffering for."
Weapon: Twin Swords
Blitzwing got officially revealed not even 2 weeks ago and he's already out? I haven't even seen the wave 1 leaders yet, wow (although that may have more to do with the glut of Slags & Grindors still sitting around taking up space more than anything).
If Blitzwing is THAT early, I wonder how long it'll take to see Jhiaxus and the Deluxes...
MeGrimlock78 wrote:So...the exclusivity rules...those apply to Netflix Bumblebee as well. I know people have said he can't be rereleased because of VW, but could it more have to do with Walmart's rights to the new tooling?
Its probably both to be fair, so even when the walmart part ends, the VW part could still scupper him till the time they get the license again.
Great write up Will
Thanks man, I really wanted to give examples and context in a way that would help people understand.
I am looking at facebook comments regarding this and many fans are still having a really hard time acknowledging that their are not the main focus of any toyline, especially one like Legacy.
Anyways, people were talking about previous titans going on sale and I'm pretty sure I got both on sale. Not discounted, that never happened. But pretty sure there were sales. @Kanrabat, didn't Walmart have Omega on sale by the end? I bought mine at Toysrus though, and they had like a 20% off sale, so that was good enough for me. Bought Scorponok from them as well since we was also on sale at some point (and predaking, who was on a really good sale once). People were probably talking of discount/liquidation though so me buying on sale is probably not the same thing. I won't be buying any titans anymore though, no room and no interest. I got the big bots I wanted. Will probably sell fort max, I don't take him out to play with him with my kids ever, unlike Omega and Trypitcon.
Yeah, I've seen comments and attitudes similar in other sites as well. Personally, I'm fine with kids being the focus, as they are the life blood of the franchise, and have been since fhe beginning.
As for Titans, I was always unlucky with the Titans I wanted when the class first started, but after I moved a few years back, I just didn't have the space to display bots of that size. Doesn't mean I can't enjoy pictures of them though
william-james88 wrote:@Kanrabat, didn't Walmart have Omega on sale by the end? I bought mine at Toysrus though, and they had like a 20% off sale, so that was good enough for me.
I never planned to get Omega for a long while but the more I saw people talking how awsome he was, the more I regretted missing out.
Then, Walmart online had a second run for 225$CAN instead of the going rate of 250/275$CAN so all my instincts SCREAMED to get him. I did and I'm glad my online purchase went through. I picked him up at the store in the highest point of the COVID panic. I was with my sister by car and we had to line up bumper to bumper for one hour to get my bot. Bless her heart.
No regrets at all because as for now, Omega is the best titan ever. I still have to unbox my Select Black Zarak. I'm waiting for the last upgrade kits to arrive by mail before finally playing with him.
Come see my latest creation, a Galvatron Combiner using 4 SS86 Sweeps as limbs HERE!
william-james88 wrote:Interesting to hear how much input for the legacy line still comes from kids and what they would want. Even for the titan class which I admit even I thought was not really targetting them (simply because that seems like a higher end collectible price point and lack of exposure to kids at retail).
I'd like to see some evidence of their claim because I have huge doubts about kids being their target audience and source of decision-making input. Given a majority of their character choices are G1 (of which kids have nearly zero connection unless their parents force it on them) and the high pricepoint compared to other, arguably more desirable toys in the same aisle, I can't imagine much of the retail sales result in these toys going into the hands of children. It's even further evidenced by the exclusive nature of many of the toys, resulting in scalpers making 3 to 4 times the retail value through reselling. No parent is going to spend that money to give their kid something they may not even care to have.
Regarding their claim that the open box was a kid-tested idea, I suddenly envisioned the old, shortly-lived Toy Box reality show where a panel of 5 kids decided the fates of new toy inventions. I can just imagine the main office having a bring-your-kid-to-work day, and they asked those kids which box they preferred. "There, now we can say we product-tested the box with kids!" No, it had nothing to do with them cutting corners to save money on packaging.
daedalus25 wrote:Given a majority of their character choices are G1 (of which kids have nearly zero connection unless their parents force it on them)
Man that takes me back about a decade... when my wife and I would spend night after night with our kids forcing them to watch OG Transformers on endless repeat.
Bucket/Want List: Botcon 2016 Customization Class Ratchet (G2 Deco), or Customization Class Ratchet (Marvel Comics Deco) **would also be willing to pay for an Unpainted Botcon 2016 Ratchet, TT Legends Fortress Head (only) with working Electronics
Wish List of Modern Combiners: Road Caesar, Monstructor & Dinoking (proper size to fiction), Landcross, Guard City, Battle Gaia, & G2 Defensor. Wish List of Titans:Metrotitan,Majin Zarak
william-james88 wrote:Interesting to hear how much input for the legacy line still comes from kids and what they would want. Even for the titan class which I admit even I thought was not really targetting them (simply because that seems like a higher end collectible price point and lack of exposure to kids at retail).
I'd like to see some evidence of their claim because I have huge doubts about kids being their target audience and source of decision-making input. Given a majority of their character choices are G1 (of which kids have nearly zero connection unless their parents force it on them) and the high pricepoint compared to other, arguably more desirable toys in the same aisle, I can't imagine much of the retail sales result in these toys going into the hands of children. It's even further evidenced by the exclusive nature of many of the toys, resulting in scalpers making 3 to 4 times the retail value through reselling. No parent is going to spend that money to give their kid something they may not even care to have.
Regarding their claim that the open box was a kid-tested idea, I suddenly envisioned the old, shortly-lived Toy Box reality show where a panel of 5 kids decided the fates of new toy inventions. I can just imagine the main office having a bring-your-kid-to-work day, and they asked those kids which box they preferred. "There, now we can say we product-tested the box with kids!" No, it had nothing to do with them cutting corners to save money on packaging.
This is not the kind of thing that there's ever going to be "evidence" for, you can either take their marketing at their word or you can disbelieve it. I think it's obvious that many of their decisions, like character choice and the G1 focus more generally, are obviously prioritizing collectors over children. But other choices, like play features and box marketing, could reasonably be expected to target children. I also wonder how much of this is based on what kids or parents want, versus what retailer ordering professionals want.
Though on that topic, and on the subject of exclusives you raised, it's also clear that retailers know the adult collector demographic is important, even if it's a bigger part of their web presence then in-store selling. Target, Wal-Mart, and Amazon have all done dedicated collector events and mini-sites, which often include toys that have very limited appeal to children.
In sum, I don't have any reason to doubt what Hasbro says at these events, but I don't think it's as reductive as they sometimes imply or as fansites sometimes infer. And as an aside, and with no evidence other than my own biased recollection, it seems to me that they often use kids as an excuse for things they know fans broadly don't like, such as the open-window packaging. I'm curious why Transformers is keeping it even as many of their Marvel Legends products are moving to closed-box, and I can't imagine there's that much difference in the demos for those lines.
Just because the new toys are G1-inspired, doesn't mean they can't appeal to today's children. If their parents tell them they had similar figures representing the same characters when they were kids that's just a bonus. A kid will walk down a toy aisle and be drawn to whatever they find fun and visually stimulating. And the Legacy figures are nothing if not colorful, especially the packaging. Even if they know nothing of G1 the new toys can be appealing.
I think if we look for which figures are considered more adult-focused, we would have to look at prices. So the Titan class, commander class and maybe even leader class (since it's now $60 if taxes are added) are more towards adults I would think. But maybe leader class is a gray area. I know when I was young only rich kids got Fort Max.
"Hasbro clearly stated that the legacy line is still designed with kids in mind and they product tested this line with kids. It turns out kids prefer the open box design over closed box."
They also focus-group tested the open boxes with shoplifters and toyswappers. Turns out, shoplifters and theives prefer the open box design over closed box as well, by 100%. "Keep 'em coming, Hasbro!" all toyswappers are reported to have said. "Can do!" Hasbro is said to have answered. "I'm sure the honest customers will be glad to pay more, once we raise our prices again to cover our losses!"
Last edited by DeathReviews on Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
"No matter where you go or what you do, always remember, I'm right behind you!" - Death
Motto:""So you see evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb!""
Weapon: Dual-Sonic Disrupter Gun
If the powers / were to repaint this Metroplex and give us Metrotitan then I would open my wallet for that. But they would have to ditch the giant pizza cutter and give him 2 big weapons like his G1 counterpart....'nuff said!!!
Motto:"They wanna play my emotions, but I'm like the ocean-- too calm to get upset by somebody's notion."
Weapon: Concussion Blaster Gun
I am surprised at both someone finding Blitzwing already, and that it seems like a decent amount of people haven't seen anything from wave 1 yet... I live in KCMO, and the first sighting I had of any deluxe (Arcee) was back on Monday, April 4th. This same store had two Legacy Blasters (one I bought), 3 Bulkheads, 2 Galvatrons, and 1 Laser Prime. Being almost literally in the middle of the midwest, I just thought that if I was seeing stuff, most likely everyone would be, especially by now. I went to 4 different Target stores today, 2 of which had Arcee; one Walmart had an Arcee and 2 Skids, but no luck with Kickback or Dragstrip anywhere. I've had some bad luck with timing so far. I have both on preorder, but after seeing Arcee at the beginning of the month, I really thought I'd score at least one of those two that I want.
If you're not seeing anything yet, hang in there; I don't see how it could be much longer. Someone mentioned a while back that the deluxes are the most difficult to find, and I 100% agree with that. Not surprising but I've seen Bulkhead the most. The Walmart I was at today had 6 Bulkheads and 2 Blasters (and 1 Galvatron and 1 Laser Prime on the shelf below):
I assume Legacy has hit around where I live although all Ive seen is a single damaged package Arcee, oh yeah and LOTS of Buzzworthy Silvertreak, although that is a subline technically, it is still quite plentiful,no sightings of anything else though.
Bucket/Want List: Botcon 2016 Customization Class Ratchet (G2 Deco), or Customization Class Ratchet (Marvel Comics Deco) **would also be willing to pay for an Unpainted Botcon 2016 Ratchet, TT Legends Fortress Head (only) with working Electronics
Wish List of Modern Combiners: Road Caesar, Monstructor & Dinoking (proper size to fiction), Landcross, Guard City, Battle Gaia, & G2 Defensor. Wish List of Titans:Metrotitan,Majin Zarak
Rodimus Prime wrote:Just because the new toys are G1-inspired, doesn't mean they can't appeal to today's children. If their parents tell them they had similar figures representing the same characters when they were kids that's just a bonus. A kid will walk down a toy aisle and be drawn to whatever they find fun and visually stimulating. And the Legacy figures are nothing if not colorful, especially the packaging. Even if they know nothing of G1 the new toys can be appealing.
That's right, and Hasbro has always said that. Everytime they do, fans speak out against it as if they run the company. But yeah, you are 100% on the ball. Aaron archer said the reason they chose Scoop was because having an orange character in the wave would work well for colour variation on shelves. John warden said the reason they chose Krok as a mainline figure was because a kid would see a robot that transforms into an crocodile. And just now they said Metroplex was picked because construction-type vehicles are favoured among kids.
Of course, fans buy too and are a big part of sales (supposed 30%, that counts anyone aged over 8 ) so these G1 characters are definitely there to get their sales. But that doesn't mean they are the only ones buying, taht's what people have to realize. Do fans really think it was other older collectors who bought all those Earthrise Arcees?
Also, o.supreme already posted this video, but I'll repost it here since it definitely answers why there being specific G1 characters in this line of transforming robots is irrelevant when it comes to selling to kids.
This is not 100% Hasbro verified fact, it's the thoughts from an industry professional, but it definitely lines up with Hasbro's statements and it's explained in a way that may help those not in the know of robot toys within the toy industry.
In the end, any cool looking transforming robot would sell to kids. ANY. But to get that also very lucrative adult market, they make it characters we'd also like to buy.
Someone asked for evidence. We have it. In terms of marketing strategy, we have the adds for kids as well as the channels and places these toys are. Legacy figures are being sold in the toy aisle, next to other toys aimed at kids. If the main market was collectors, the toys would be sold only in collector shops, like high end statues and mafex figures.
Also, we have this internal slide from Hasbro showing their target market being 5-8 year old kids (it was not meant for you to see).
And lastly, we have my anecdotal evidence of what I find in thrift stores. If only collectors bought Generations figures or SS figures, I should find none of them at thrift shops, but that's not the case. Meaning enough of them are bought by parents and kids for them to go through the second hand toy cycle and end up as random toys found in thrift stores with missing panels or heads or whatnot.
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were to repaint this Metroplex and give us Metrotitan then I would open my wallet for that. But they would have to ditch the giant pizza cutter and give him 2 big weapons like his G1 counterpart....'nuff said!!! 
