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What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:43 am

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Ah quick strike, I liked his animal mode design (though silverbolt blew it away...and was a great toys to boot.) But yeah he was just...there? I guess, the writers probably thought he was cook but he got overshadowed so quickly and just wasent useful.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby Sabrblade » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:29 am

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Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Jan 27, 2019 4:53 am

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2019 and Let's revive this thread a bit (given the smaller BW affiliated threads that have popped up since)

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Let's start with this guy? Other than having a voice that put him in the top three for the entire series, alongside Megatron and Tarantulas, what's your view on RAMPAGE!

A friend of mine thought Beast Wars went "too dark" in Season Two, preferring the lighter hearted Season One. As an aside, The Low Road, my most hated episode, is one of his favourites. That "darkness" in his view is typified by this maniacal King Crab. Thoughts on the bot that in any other continuity, from Tech Specs alone, would have been a leader?
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:49 am

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You know what? I think it would have been awesome if Rampage had led a third small group of outcasts from the two main factions. An ally to neither and a thorn in both sides. It would have made for an interesting dynamic but alas, budgeting reasons wouldn't have allowed for that and the new additions to the Maximals and Predacons
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:53 am

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The Fuzors could have been that faction. Since Transmutate, that could have kicked off an interesting side story, with the increasingly morally conflicted Silverbolt. Plus it would have been the chance for them to show off some of the more outlandish Fuzor designs. Forgetting budgeting reasons, of course, as you must with any possible new cast members in the show.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby Sabrblade » Tue May 21, 2019 2:10 pm

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Just posted this in the Beast Wars Neo thread, but I feel it fits here too since it pertains to the larger Beast Era as a whole.


I'm on Episode 29 [of Beast Wars Neo] now and, after all these years of such limited accessibility to both this show and Beast Wars Second, I think it's safe to say that the Western fandom has blown something out of proportion (quelle suprise!).
 
In the BWII movie, Optimus Primal is treated as a "legendary Supreme Commander" by Lio Convoy's teammates, revered and awed as some greatly respected figure. This movie, being one of the scarcely few pieces of JBW media that the Western fandom had access to thanks to Ctenosaur Fansubs, helped fuel the initial misconception that the "Convoy" of Beast Wars might have been treated by Japan as the same "Convoy" of the G1 cartoon. Of course, Beast Wars Metals would debunk this when it showed the two to be separate individuals like in the English version.
 
Still, though, this "legendary" status that Optimus Primal held in the BWII movie remained, which felt at odds with his depiction in Beast Wars as merely a lowly ship captain. Yet, Japan still regarded him as a Supreme Commander in their version, a title that to a Western fan seemed more prestigious than the captaincy rank Primal held.
 
When it was later confirmed that BWII and Neo actually took place eons after Beast Machines (rather than contemporary to the "three centuries later" hometime of the BW cast, as the Western fandom originally believed), this "legendary" status of Primal's suddenly made some degree of sense retroactively, since he alone saved all of Cybertron from extinction by Megatron, sacrificing himself at the end of Beast Machines. Indeed, this was even incorporated into the Convoy Council's backstory in the Legends LG-EX Blue Big Convoy pack-in comic.
 
 
But... here's the thing.
 
ALL THREE Convoys of the Beast Era are treated as "legendary" figures.
 
 
Out of the gate, Big Convoy is called a "legendary warrior", known for being a "One-Man Army" who won many front-line battles singlehandedly. And later in the series, he's called a "Supreme Commander" in regards to his being in charge of Break, Stampy, Longrack, Colada, and Heinrad. A guy put in charge of merely five (later six) individuals is given such a lofty title, when he's pretty much just a mere ship captain. Sound familiar?
 
What's more, Beast Wars Neo takes place, what, a few years after Beast Wars Second? Is that all? If so, then that's how long Lio Convoy has been MIA. And yet, here in Episode 29, he too is called a "legendary warrior", the exact same wording used previously to describe Big Convoy (Stampy even points out this notion, and Mach Kick later calls them "two legendary warriors"), with Big Convoy's teammates even going gaga over Lio Convoy with the same kind of awe and wonderment that Lio Convoy's team had for Optimus Primal in the movie.
 
 
It really seems to me like this whole "legendary" thing really isn't all that special, certainly not to the extent that the early Western fandom made it out to be, what with how few folks in the West actually got to experience these two shows back then. Same goes for being a Supreme Commander. Sure, that actually meant something in the G1 era (being the highest-ranked sole authority in the Autobot army), but by the Beast Era, any blue-helmeted mouth-plated novice could be one, and all it gets ya is an average-sized spaceship and a small crew of misfits. And you apparently get to be called "legendary" by the next guy's crew. :p
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Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Tue May 28, 2019 3:00 pm

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So, Transmetals.

At time of writing, I recently purchased TM Rhinox (for the first time ever). Other than Optimal Optimus (A design, I loathe) I have now owned all of the Transmetal 1 line.

So Terrorsaur, Waspinator, Inferno, Airazor and Rhinox failed to make the leap into TM on the show. As I noted in another thread, all of the Fliers were omitted. I think the reason for this is that it would have dramatically altered the flying dynamic of the show. All three Flier alt-mode vehicles would have been substantial speed increases. This most likely would have put them at odds with the budget restraints available to the series at the time.

Out of all of them, Optimal Optimus included, Rhinox probably has the weirdest "Vehicle" Mode. What makes it weird is that it is missing something. A turret or any kind of similar weapon, via some mild shifting of the animal head in 'All-Terrain' Mode, would have made it so much better. As it stands, the bio boasts of this form offering a speed and mobility increase, which is at odds with the design. I think this one would have needed a lot of "Creative License" to be workable on the show.

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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Nov 03, 2019 4:21 am

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In light of reading through a few of Will's Top 5-10 lists lately, I decided to...

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..This thread, with some DREAM CASTING ideas.

For story purposes, Optimus Primal, Megatron and Dinobot are default to any roster. Arguably Tarantulas is by Season Two onwards. Other than that, from the many Beast Wars figures available to the line, choose your teams!

Season One - 14 characters
Season Two - 16 characters
Season Three - 17 characters

These are the guideline roster numbers you should look to fill. Beast Wars never had the luxury of Sunbow for being able to throw everyone onscreen, so our casting picks should be likewise limited. Sound Off!
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Nov 03, 2019 4:33 am

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What side limits like equal amounts of predacons to maximals etc?
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Nov 03, 2019 4:41 am

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ZeroWolf wrote:What side limits like equal amounts of predacons to maximals etc?



It is weird you say that, because even the show flip-flopped the numbers. Season one was the only time there was equal numbers in the show. Tigatron and Airazor nebulously inflate the Maximal side in Season one and two, despite the fact there were rarely instances of everyone being together in a given episode. Most of the time, the Preds were one or two less than the Maxi's. So roughly 50/50 or 60/40 should be a right balance. But it is entirely upto you, if you want to askew the numbers completely ala Beast Machines.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Nov 03, 2019 4:57 am

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Thanks, I shall have a think, Theresa couple I know I definitely want, but I'm undecided on others :-?
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Nov 03, 2019 5:03 am

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By the same token, there is a couple I would drop instantly.. :lol:
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Nov 03, 2019 5:23 am

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Oh I meant a couple I'd add (though I'm keeping silverbolt and BA :lol:) definitely adding more transmetals. I wonder if the writers of the show knew that Beast Machines if they would have altered his character to better show his aversion to organic modes. After all he's okay with them in beast wars.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Nov 03, 2019 5:28 am

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I think the aversion to organics was an implied trait of G1 Megatron. That his spark had instilled in BW Megs. Adding to the underlying corruption narrative I ascribed to him, when we discussed it previously.

Naturally for me, Silverbolt and BA were instantly cut...
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Nov 03, 2019 6:29 am

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I think they should have done a bit better to show that in story, maybe a bug of megs arguing with himself, believing that he was talking to G1 Megs, afterall BW megs would argue in favour of the power, at least, at first.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Nov 03, 2019 6:33 am

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ZeroWolf wrote:I think they should have done a bit better to show that in story, maybe a bug of megs arguing with himself, believing that he was talking to G1 Megs, after all BW megs would argue in favour of the power, at least, at first.


Absolutely. Let's be frank, it would also go a long way to explaining Primal's personality shift from level headed leader to becoming a zealot, if he was given the same negative implication with his exposure to G1 Prime's spark.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Nov 03, 2019 8:46 am

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AllNewSuperRobot wrote:
ZeroWolf wrote:I think they should have done a bit better to show that in story, maybe a bug of megs arguing with himself, believing that he was talking to G1 Megs, after all BW megs would argue in favour of the power, at least, at first.


Absolutely. Let's be frank, it would also go a long way to explaining Primal's personality shift from level headed leader to becoming a zealot, if he was given the same negative implication with his exposure to G1 Prime's spark.

That would have been great and led to a better series overall
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby Sabrblade » Sun Nov 03, 2019 8:57 am

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Sounds like y'all need to read "A Meeting of Minds" by Simon Furman. ;)
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Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Nov 03, 2019 8:59 am

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Let's be honest, we could fill a thread with ideas on how to make Beast Machines a better show...
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Nov 03, 2019 9:13 am

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AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Let's be honest, we could fill a thread with ideas on how to make Beast Machines a better show...

Would the first point be to not to have made it :lol: what hurts more and with the loss of transtech (at least in terms of non-club material) is the loss of potential. I know some designs were salvaged but there's always the thought of what could have been.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Nov 03, 2019 9:18 am

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It could have work, if they hadn't undermined practically all of Beast Wars characterisation. As far as Transtech goes... My stance is the same as with the rest of the Beast Era IE if it wasn't part of a show, it doesn't count. So in that way I put Transtech in the same "concept only" boat as Machine Wars. The convention exclusive stuff, just non-canon fanfic.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Sun Nov 03, 2019 1:26 pm

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At least Machine Wars made it to some store shelves though :lol:
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Mon Nov 04, 2019 2:55 am

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ZeroWolf wrote:At least Machine Wars made it to some store shelves though :lol:



True. Weirdly enough, to look at some of the Transtech concept art I was curious how some of them would even work as figures...

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Let alone, how they would stand??? :lol:
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby ZeroWolf » Mon Nov 04, 2019 3:29 am

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I like how they tweaked it to make Animated Blurr, also getting Guyver vibes from Cheetors head there.
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Re: What Might Have Been - Beast Wars Discussion

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Mon Nov 04, 2019 3:50 am

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ZeroWolf wrote:I like how they tweaked it to make Animated Blurr, also getting Guyver vibes from Cheetors head there.



Indeed. Definitely saw Guyver there myself. Transtech sounded so interesting in that it seemed to be Reboot, with Transformers. I wonder if we would have gotten some Vok resolution from it?

Meanwhile, DREAM CASTING:

Season One - 14 characters.

I stuck to the character limit but not how they were arranged by the show. I like the concept of Guerrilla Warfare, so my roster would have been based around squads, defending Territories.

Maximal - Axalon:

Optimus Primal (Bat)
Silverbolt (AKA Magnaboss Silverbolt)
Airazor

Maximal - Combat:

Dinobot
Armordillo
Wolfang
Polar Claw

Predacon - Darksyde:

Megatron
Transquito
Terrorsaur

Predacon - Raiders:

Manterror
Razorclaw
Spittor
Jetstorm - Drone

The idea being the Base unit is Stasis Pod recovery and air support. The secondary team is direct conflict and Energon retrieval.
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