Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Sabrblade » Mon May 18, 2009 4:46 pm

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Blurrz wrote:Armada is a great series. Minus the kids, which ALL series has, Armada has one of the most epic endings ever. Grand battle on Cybertron, Unicron's revival. It's freaking amazing. My favorite series, ever.
You're only describing the Unicron Battles and neglecting the rest of the series. Frankly, that story arc was the best part of the series, and yet it only took up about 20% of the whole show.

smiggy3000 wrote:I was making a bad joke about Animated, i've not seen in yet.
See it. Watch it. Love it! THIS, I COMMAND! :P :P

smiggy3000 wrote:What realy bothered me about 'Cybertron' was the team ups when they connected. The giant claw wasn't that bad, but it was the 5 minuetes they wasted each episode trying to combine Optimus with Jetfire...
Optimus combined with Jetfire in Armada, not Cybertron. In that series, it was either Leobreaker or Wing Saber. And at least during those five minutes we got some humor out of it like:

Prime: "Here we go again"
combining partner: "Why do we always go through this same formation over and over?"
Prime: "I don't know why. But as long as we can take down the Decepticons I'm glad we do!"
Partner: "Yeah, let's slag those Decepticreeps once and for all!"
Prime: "Optimus Prime: (Savage Claw/Sonic Wing) Mode!"
"When there's gold feathers, punch behind you!!"

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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby smiggy3000 » Tue May 19, 2009 1:49 am

Sorry, my mistake. Jetfire was there though, he had a cool cargo plain mode...
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby skids 2.0 » Sat May 23, 2009 2:40 pm

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I onyl saw Armada, and is what got me into transformers. Not only this but i have to say, through all its flaws, i still like it. I mean, if it werent for Armada, i am sure i would not have been so into teh 2007 film!

So i agree, why all the hate for it, i mean, i was at the age of the target audience when it aired originally, and i have to say, you moan about how G1 is better, but like me, some other people here may have never got a chance to see it!
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Rial Vestro » Sun May 24, 2009 12:05 am

skids 2.0 wrote:you moan about how G1 is better, but like me, some other people here may have never got a chance to see it!


Everyone has a chance to see G1 weather they wear actully around in that erra or not the episodes are avalible online. Truthfully allthough I did watch season 3 of G1 when it first came out and reruns of the first two seasons I was too young to actully remember any of it. By the time Beast Wars came out I had completly forgotten about Transformers untill my dad reminded me about it then I started to remember some things like my G1 Bumblebee allthough I remember him being bigger than what I've seen him online. I allso remember my brother haveing Jazz but not knowing how to actully transform him.

I spent time looking up the G1 episodes online and even bought the entire series online off ebay, well allmost the entire series. The seller had either forgotten this had happen, not known about it, or I don't know what but right in the middle of Omega Supreme telling about how the Constructicons use to be his friends Transformers got recorded over by part of some movie. (don't ask me what movie I have no idea) and the scene from said movie was just a sex scene with the woman fully exsposed.

Anyway I still managed to find alot of episodes on YouTube as well as Transformers RID which for some reason the cable would cut out every time that show aired on Fox so it was like it never aired at all. And I watched all of the Unicron Trilligy on YouTube and have a few episodes of Energon on DVD. Cybertron I watched durring it's short run on Kids WB.

I didn't have Cartoon Network from the episode of Armada where Starscream switched sides till right before Transformers Animated aired.

Anyway, long story short, just because you weren't around when G1 first aired doesn't mean you lost your only chance to ever see it.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Burn » Sun May 24, 2009 12:47 am

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Rial Vestro wrote:Anyway, long story short, just because you weren't around when G1 first aired doesn't mean you lost your only chance to ever see it.


That's all well and good, but for those who didn't grow up on G1 I can see why some don't feel a connection to it.

Seeing it is one thing, growing up with it and going into the stores and finding the toys is an experience in it's self.

And that goes for all the eras.

Personally, I grew up on G1, I was a kid going into the stores and seeing what I couldn't have.

Now I can watch a series go into a store and pretty much have what I want.

Know which one I enjoy more? Being the kid. It was far more exciting. That's why I connect more with G1 and I can see why others don't.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Burning Saber » Sun May 24, 2009 4:16 am

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Having grown up on G1 myself, I have to say i don't feel the trilogy hatred at all. Cybertron was one of the reasons i got back into Transformers, I absolutly love it and have as much passion for some of those characters as i have for the G1 characters i grew up with. And really, Coby, Lori and Bud where on par with Spike (way better then Daniel). Now, i've only seen bits and pieces of Energon (the episodes i could find on DVD) but after getting through the first couple of episodes with Kicker being an ass, I didn't mind it either. Never saw Armada though, so I have no opinion on that series. Overall, I have to say they were decent shows.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby mitchsantona » Sun May 24, 2009 2:21 pm

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Burn wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:Anyway, long story short, just because you weren't around when G1 first aired doesn't mean you lost your only chance to ever see it.


That's all well and good, but for those who didn't grow up on G1 I can see why some don't feel a connection to it.

Seeing it is one thing, growing up with it and going into the stores and finding the toys is an experience in it's self.

And that goes for all the eras.

Personally, I grew up on G1, I was a kid going into the stores and seeing what I couldn't have.



Now I can watch a series go into a store and pretty much have what I want.

Know which one I enjoy more? Being the kid. It was far more exciting. That's why I connect more with G1 and I can see why others don't.



I totally agree with that connection. I would save up my allowance money and study my checklist to see who I was going to try to get next. I could only afford one at a time, so each one was a major decision. Now with the invention of Ebay and the fact that I have more than 5 dollars a week, I'm going back and getting the figures I couldn't. (As well as all the new stuff)
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Rial Vestro » Sun May 24, 2009 6:31 pm

Burn wrote:Seeing it is one thing, growing up with it and going into the stores and finding the toys is an experience in it's self.


That's understandable but not what I responding to. He was talking as if because he wasn't around then that he never had a chance to see G1 and I was just makeing a point that he could be watching G1 right now.

Personally, I grew up on G1, I was a kid going into the stores and seeing what I couldn't have.

Now I can watch a series go into a store and pretty much have what I want.

Know which one I enjoy more? Being the kid. It was far more exciting. That's why I connect more with G1 and I can see why others don't.


Personally I conected with Beast Wars and Beast Machines more than G1 not because I grew up with it but because of the story and the characters. It just seemed like BW was alot better wrighten and because they kept the cast fairly small it was ALOT more memerable.

With G1 the series wasn't too bad in itself dispite the continuity errors but the thing that really bad about it is the huge overhaul of characters. Even the starting cast before any new characters were added was HUGE. It's just impossible to give all thoughs characters enough screen time to really remember all of them.

I mean, I could list every single BW/M character right off the top of my head but any of the other series I'm going to forget who the majority of the cast members were.

Even some BW Characters who share their names with G1 I don't really remember much about their G1 counterparts.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby smiggy3000 » Mon May 25, 2009 4:03 am

I know what you mean, i've started re-watching Beast Wars after I watched the first series of Beast Machines. I'm on a one-a-day habbit and the characters are more fleshed out compared to G1, and the small cast alows mroe focus on both sides at times. Beast Machines though had a ridiculously small cast, and no proper enviroment...
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Cyberstrike » Mon May 25, 2009 3:46 pm

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Justicity wrote:
smiggy3000 wrote:At least we can all agree that Transformers Animated is now the worst...

I don't.

Obviously it's not as unanimous as you think.


The first season sucked. Seasons 2 and 3 were pretty good. Although Transformers: Cybertron had a much satisfing ending than Animated.
Know this: I would rather be hated for being honest for my opinions, than being loved as a liar!
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Rial Vestro » Tue May 26, 2009 9:19 am

smiggy3000 wrote:I know what you mean, i've started re-watching Beast Wars after I watched the first series of Beast Machines. I'm on a one-a-day habbit and the characters are more fleshed out compared to G1, and the small cast alows mroe focus on both sides at times. Beast Machines though had a ridiculously small cast, and no proper enviroment...


It's allso one of the main reasons I hated the first moive. Small cast of Transformers and the larger human cast got more screen time.

You know it's bad when you care more about the human characters than the giant robots.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby smiggy3000 » Tue May 26, 2009 12:26 pm

Unfortunatley that may make the new movie bad in some respects as they make the cast larger, but only for the sake of making it larger, so that the new transformers arn't well thought out...
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Rial Vestro » Tue May 26, 2009 8:09 pm

smiggy3000 wrote:Unfortunatley that may make the new movie bad in some respects as they make the cast larger, but only for the sake of making it larger, so that the new transformers arn't well thought out...


It doesn't really seem too large and I'm hopeing that the main reason for not showing them so much in the first movie was because of the budget. I know they have a bigger budget for this movie so I'm just hopeing that means more screen time for the Transformers.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Dagon » Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:15 am

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i_amtrunks wrote:It's part of the fandom.

Plenty of people said Beast Wars was crap compared to G1, then more hated against Beast Machines.

The hate then transferred to the AEC trilogy and Animated, as they were released.

It's a rose coloured glasses kinda deal.



Yes. I disliked most of the Unicron Trilogy because I thought it was lame and didnt find the storytelling to be that compelling. I scoffed at all of it's flaws and failures and swore that G1 was and will be the best series ever. And then I found myself tryingto explain all of G1's flaws and failures to my girlfriend who had never seen it.
I think that my dislike of the AEC shows is just because I'm older now. I rememeber G1 had epic storytelling (for when you're like, 6) growing up, and AEC sometimes renamed characters from one frame to the next. There's something very irritating about having to hear a characters' name everytime they appear on the screen, and it's pretty clear that the AEC shows were trying to sell toys rather than tell stories.
G1 did the same things.
But hell, I like G1 better, cause I grew up with it and it has characters I cared about. None of the newer shows have that for me.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby smiggy3000 » Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:04 pm

too true my friend...
and it had epic charactirisation, and non of the "lets combine and increase our strength", they could kick butt all by them selves...
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Rial Vestro » Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:58 pm

G1 flaws vs Unicron Trilligy Flaws.

G1 Had out of whack character origins offten telling multiple different origins for the same characters. Allso telling multiple storys for just how the heck Transformers are made in the first place.

A/E/C Had out of whack character names AND origins. Mainly in the form of just who or what the hell was Armada Sideways.

In G1 the screwed up origins of characters really didn't effect the overall plot of the series sence they really never mentioned them ever again. Example after the Stunticons and Airialbots were created useing Vector Sigma to give them their personalitys no one ever even mentioned that they didn't need Vector Sigma to give the Dinobots life and it was so far after the creation of the Dinobots that you'd probly forgotten by then that Vector Sigma had never been mentioned before when creating new Transformers.

While in the Unicron Trilligy it was kinda obvious when they screwed up characters origins because it was offten done in the verry next episode. Again Sideways. I'm working for Unicron, now I'm going to randomly turn into Nemesis Prime, now I'm Sideways again, and oh wait I'm really Unicron. Not to mention that nothing Sideways ever did made any gawd damn sence. He was my favorite character for all of like what, 3 episodes? When did he turn into what looked like the static you see on old TVs when they don't have cable. That was about when Sideways became the stupidest TF ever sence nothing made any sence after that.

In terms of Plot, G1 story telling lasted for all of an episode or 3 then that was it. The series as a whole wasn't really plot driven. Where as A/E/C Every episode was just a continuation of the last episode.

To put it simply you could watch G1 entirely out of order and it'd still make just as much sence. Non of the single episode plots required you to know what happened in the series 10 episodes earlier to understand their current situation. That was basically how 80's cartoons were, the plot of the week and then done with the occasional cliff hanger.

Modern day cartoons are little more complex than that. You actully do have to watch all of A/E/C in order to even try to understand what the hell is going on. I remember when Armada first started, I missed a few episodes somewhere in the series and by the time I got back to it Starscream had joined the Autobots and I was like "what the hell are you doing there?" then I lost my satilight shortly after and it was only after watching on YouTube I realized why he joined the Autobots and that he was really only with them for all of like 3 episodes and then it didn't make sence why he went back to the Decepticons.

Basically while G1 has it's flaws, they're more forgivable because they don't effect the entire series. You can easily ignore 2 of the Constructicon origins and just stick to the one you like the best. Personally I go for the whole, they use to be friends with Omega Supreme origin. But A/E/C you can't just ignore an episode without screwing up whatever little plot they had even more than it allready was.

The Nemesis Prime episode for example. You could pretend it never happened but then why are Hot Shot, Megatron, Starscream, Red Alert, and Demolisher different colors for the rest of the series. It's exsplained in the same episode Nemesis Prime appeared in so either you go with 1 character randomly changing forms or 5 characters randomly changing color. Either way it's screwed up plot.

Now, you can actully watch the series on their own and not need to watch the previous series and Energon actully makes perfect sence as a stand alone series but as a continuation for Armada... Megatron was NOT turned to stone, he sacrificed himself to stop Unicron, and he never had a sword in Armada. The only sword they could have been talking about that he used was the Star Saber which was a completly different sword in Energon than Megatron's sword. So, Megatron's stone carcus should not of even exsisted and Alpha Q should not of been able to pull a sword from it sence neither of thoughs things had anything to do with the events of Armada. It allso wouldn't make sence that after sacrificing himself to stop Unicron in Armada that same Megatron would be spending all of Energon trying to revive Unicron. That just doesn't make any sence.

Armada is WAY worse than G1 was.

Energon, makes alot more sence if you totally forget Armada ever exsisted and view it as a stand alone universe. As an Armada continuation the plot just falls apart when you realize, Megatron basically gave his life to kill Unicron in Armada and now in Energon he's going to spend the entire series trying to revive this guy who he sacriced himself to stop him in the first place.

Think about it, if you really wanted to kill someone, lets say they killed your family they deserve it, so you kill this person. 10 year later if you had the option to bring the murderer back to life would you?

Now Armada made no freaking sence to begin with so even if they changed Energon so it was better matched I'd still pretend Armada never exsisted, it was just a horrible series.

I don't know how many different ways there are to exsplain it, I just can not find anything good about the Armada series. The only good I can find, is that it was a nice toy line. Other than that, nothing.

How can you NOT hate Aramda. Seriously this topic doesn't even make sence. It shouldn't be why all the Unicron Trilligy hate it should be why all the Armada love.

I suddenly want to go watch ROTF. Even though I hear it's a horrible movie which I exspected anyway after the first one. I think even Micheal Bay's Transformers would have a better plot than Armada. And we all know how great Micheal Bay is with plots.

Bay: Hey what's that?

Demolition exspert: What you mean that 1 building that's still standing?

Bay: Yeah, why is it still standing?

DE: We weren't even filming over there.

Bay: So? Why is it still standing?

DE: We were filming in the other direction, I didn't rig any exsplosives over there.

Bay: Your fired! Can we get someone to blow up that house?

Shia: Are we filming it?

Bay: No but it's on my set and I want to blow it up.

Shia: OK, I'll be in my trailer, call me when you're ready for actors.

Bay: Can't go to your trailer, I blew it up while you were out here talking to me.

Shia: Damn it, that's the 7th time this week, and it's only Monday.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Skids » Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:06 pm

Any beef I would have had is with the English adaptations, especially Armada. It might have been better were it not so rushed. But the whole "Pokemon" aspect of the Microns/Minicons sucked. When the series got away from that nonsense, it got better.

Hasbro's reapplications of G1 names (obviously done to protect trademarks) was also kind of annoying. It was as bad as RID, calling Black Convoy "Scourge" before they could have come up with the appropriate equivalent of "Nemesis Prime". Because of that, a character obviously meant to be "Wheeljack" is given the name "Downshift" in Energon and so forth.

It could have been handled better, and that certainly could have been done if the handlers were not so much in a rush to put out product hereabouts.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:28 pm

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Rial Vestro wrote:G1 flaws vs Unicron Trilligy Flaws.

G1 Had out of whack character origins offten telling multiple different origins for the same characters.


Thats not exactly true.

Rial Vestro wrote:Basically while G1 has it's flaws, they're more forgivable because they don't effect the entire series. You can easily ignore 2 of the Constructicon origins and just stick to the one you like the best.


Technically none of the "origins" are in conflict with each other.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby No Death for Prowl » Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:36 pm

Well, I'm hoping that I at least find Energon entertaining since I just received the Ultimate Collection DVD of the series in the mail today. I would hate to regret this purchase just a few episodes into the whole thing.

I just know I've been watching the G1 Season 1 on DVD and enjoying the hell out of it. There's an undeniable charm to it and it manages to hold up pretty well 25 years later, IMO.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Rial Vestro » Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:44 pm

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:G1 flaws vs Unicron Trilligy Flaws.

G1 Had out of whack character origins offten telling multiple different origins for the same characters.


Thats not exactly true.

Rial Vestro wrote:Basically while G1 has it's flaws, they're more forgivable because they don't effect the entire series. You can easily ignore 2 of the Constructicon origins and just stick to the one you like the best.


Technically none of the "origins" are in conflict with each other.


How do you figure that?

The first time we see the Constructicons Megatron flat out says "It was worth all that time building them." but later in the series it's shown that they allready exsisted on Cybertron and Megatron simply reprograms them.

The only one that really isn't in conflict is the one where the Constructicons built Megatron, ignoring that fact that there were 7 Constructicons in that scene.

The only way you could really say that the origins aren't in conflect is if you ignore the fact that Megatron claims to have built them and I'm assumeing they would of had to of been built on Earth because I don't think they even had a way back to Cybertron at the time. I really hope that for once I'm actully remembering this correctly but wasn't the whole point of even haveing the Constructicons so they could build the space bridge? Or am I rememebering this wrong again and they allready had the space bridge before the Constructicons were introduced?

Don't make me think right now, I've got too many things happening all at once right now, my brain's on overload, I haven't had a full night sleep in the last 2 weeks. #-o
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:56 pm

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Rial Vestro wrote:How do you figure that?


Easily....as I have explained to you in the past many many times.

Rial Vestro wrote:
The first time we see the Constructicons Megatron flat out says "It was worth all that time building them."


"Building" is not always synonymous with "Creating" and not one was it said that the Constructions were "CREATED" on earth.

And it was never the intent of the writters that they be thought to be new creations.

Rial Vestro wrote: but later in the series it's shown that they allready exsisted on Cybertron and Megatron simply reprograms them.


Not a contradiction because it was never said where or when the Constructicons were created.

Rial Vestro wrote:The only one that really isn't in conflict is the one where the Constructicons built Megatron, ignoring that fact that there were 7 Constructicons in that scene.


Actually there were 8 id I'm right.

Rial Vestro wrote:The only way you could really say that the origins aren't in conflect is if you ignore the fact that Megatron claims to have built them


Nope as explained above.

Rial Vestro wrote: I really hope that for once I'm actully remembering this correctly but wasn't the whole point of even haveing the Constructicons so they could build the space bridge?


Nope

Rial Vestro wrote: Or am I rememebering this wrong again and they allready had the space bridge before the Constructicons were introduced?


You are remembering it wrong.

They had the Space Bridge before the Constructioncons.

Rial Vestro wrote:
Don't make me think right now, I've got too many things happening all at once right now, my brain's on overload, I haven't had a full night sleep in the last 2 weeks. #-o


Then get some sleep buddy.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Sabrblade » Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:16 pm

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Rial Vestro wrote:Again Sideways. I'm working for Unicron, now I'm going to randomly turn into Nemesis Prime, now I'm Sideways again, and oh wait I'm really Unicron. Not to mention that nothing Sideways ever did made any gawd damn sence. He was my favorite character for all of like what, 3 episodes? When did he turn into what looked like the static you see on old TVs when they don't have cable. That was about when Sideways became the stupidest TF ever sence nothing made any sence after that.
He first revealed his Trans-phase Mode in episode 27 "Detection".

As for Nemesis Prime, he was merely a 'puppet' that was used by Sideways in that one episode.

And what the deal with him working for/being Unicron, call it a dub error.

Rial Vestro wrote:Megatron was NOT turned to stone, he sacrificed himself to stop Unicron, and he never had a sword in Armada. The only sword they could have been talking about that he used was the Star Saber which was a completly different sword in Energon than Megatron's sword. So, Megatron's stone carcus should not of even exsisted and Alpha Q should not of been able to pull a sword from it sence neither of thoughs things had anything to do with the events of Armada. It allso wouldn't make sence that after sacrificing himself to stop Unicron in Armada that same Megatron would be spending all of Energon trying to revive Unicron. That just doesn't make any sence.
After Galvatron sacrificed himself, his body became the decayed corpse seen in Energon.

You're right that Megatron never had a sword of his own, becuase that sword is isn't his personal sword. This is another dubbing error. It was called the "Megatron Sword" in Japan (instead of Megatron's sword, like it was here) merely because it was created from his spark in the episode it's first seen in, whereas the dub makes us believe it was Megs' own sword all along... WRONG!

And Megatron wasn't really trying to revive Unicron's mind, just his body and power, so he could use him as the ultimate weapon. Having Unicron himself being fully ressurrected wasn't his primary intention. Do you think he wanted Unicron to control his mind?

Rial Vestro wrote:Now Armada made no freaking sence to begin with...
How does "Collect Them All" or "Gotta Catch'em All" make no sense? We do it all the time as fans collecting teh TF figures. We do it for a hobby, and they did it because the Mini-Cons had powers in them.

Rial Vestro wrote:I suddenly want to go watch ROTF.
That's a rather poor argument cuz ROTF was cool. Ignore the critcs, they're butchers and nitpickers.
"When there's gold feathers, punch behind you!!"

Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Rial Vestro » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:02 am

Sabrblade wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:Now Armada made no freaking sence to begin with...
How does "Collect Them All" or "Gotta Catch'em All" make no sense? We do it all the time as fans collecting teh TF figures. We do it for a hobby, and they did it because the Mini-Cons had powers in them.


The whole compairison to Pok'emon doesn't really bother me. But "colecting things" does not qualify as a plot. Actully haveing characters who are consistant with their original origins and names is.

Besides that, the whole collecting Mini-cons thing only lasted while they were on Earth, after they started flying back to Cybertron the story no longer had much of anything to do with the Mini-cons. The last big thing they did with Mini-cons was creating the hydra cannon which didn't last verry long and actully would of been nice if they worked that into Unicron's destruction. Would of liked to see them fire that thing on Unicron insted of the whole "Unicron feeds on us fighting so now Megatron of all people is going to kill himself in order to create a state of peace on Cybertron and stop Unicron from feeding on their war." plot line.

Sorry but no matter how you look at it Armada was just one porly wrighten piece of crap. It had verry few if any good moments to speak of and the worst ending of any TF series. I'd rather have Unicron defeat by anyone or anything other than Megatron dieing as a hero while Optimus Prime tries to save his arch enemy. If they had to make Unicron so gawd awfully corny by makeing him feed on hate insted of Planets like he should be eating, why couldn't Optimus be the one to sacrifice himself insted of Megatron?

They couldn't even keep the factions straight for the series. It started out as the Autobots want to save the Mini-cons and the Decepticons want to use them as weapons, preddy simple. Then it turned to the Autobots want to use the Mini-cons as weapons too and to make matters worse once they left Earth no one even cared about Mini-cons anymore. Then going even forther into the shattered glass universe, the ending where Megatron gets to die a heroic and honerable death while Optimus knowing it was the only way to stop Unicron trys to SAVE Megatron. I mean come on, you've got one enemy willing to kill himself to stop another and finally bring peace to Cybertron, why would he not want that?

The whole, "heroes never let anyone die even the villains" thing really doesn't apply here. Look at the pros and cons. It's 2 lives die or 2 billion if Megatron and Unicron would of lived. Normally when a hero saves the life of a villain it's because that villain is going to serve time in prison which I think is much worse than death. But really, where are you going to get a prison the size of a planet? Pluse it's a war. Hitler wasn't taken prisoner, he was killed, and I exspect the same for Megatron.

Now Sideways isn't the only character who doesn't make any sence.

Thrust started out as a bad ass stratigist who was loyal to Megatron. As the series progressed he never came up with one decent plan that actully worked, started to look more and more like and insaine idiot, and ultimatly ended up betraying Megatron by working with Sideways behind his back which was all the complete oppisite of what his character was originally established to be. Sky-byte did the same thing in RID but at least for him there was actully a reason behind it and he came close to success before he was lanced into space and came back from space as an insain idiot. Thrust didn't even have a reason for the change in his character, it just happened without reason.

Tidal Wave was introduced as a millitary leader along the same rank as Megatron himself, he was worked up to be both powerfull and intelligent. Well they got the powerfull part right but this one they couldn't even wait a few episodes to change his character. In the verry same episode Tidal Wave proved to be the Decepticon's most powerfull IDIOT. He's about as smart as Animated Lugnut. Actully I think Animated Lugnut is smarter than Tidal Wave and certainly a better leader as seen in Decepticon Air. Tidal Wave was introduced as a millitary leader just comming back from a victory on another planet yet it strikes me that if he was some kind of leader returning from battle where the hell was the rest of his team? And how can a guy that stupid lead anyone to victory. I allso don't get why Megatron and Tidal Wave were able to combine when they had never met eachother before. Allso adding in, why was Tidal Wave so loyal to Megatron if he only just met him and suposidly had his own army. Yeah basically Tidal Wave's entire introduction didn't make any sence.

At least Optimus and Jetfire allready knew they could combine before they did it. Megatron and Tidal Wave combining, why did they even do that, they just met, why would they be able to?

Overload didn't even get to be a character. He was nothing more than a weapon they just happen to have, never an exsplination for it, that Optimus could combine with.

Only 5 of the Powerlink repaints were ever exsplained, the rest just randomly appeared at the end of the series. Optimus Prime was in his Powerlink colors at the end of the series and there was never any reason for him to change colors.

Optimus allso got other characters names wrong 90% of the time. And I'm convinced he thinks that he's Megatron sence he keeps calling Sparkplug "Leader-1".

Armada truely was nothing more than a toy commercial sence basically any toy they hadn't included in the series was cramed into the last few episodes weather or not it even made sence to have them there. I think the only characters they never managed to show were all of the beast wars remolds except for Rhinox who did get about 5 sec. on screen.

All the Transformers are toy commercials suposidly but Armada is really the only series I think that truely sacrificed whatever little plot they had in order to sell toys. Other series seem to be perfectly fine with non-show characters in the toy line but Armada, no, they had to cram nearly every toy they had into the show.

Sabrblade wrote:
Rial Vestro wrote:I suddenly want to go watch ROTF.
That's a rather poor argument cuz ROTF was cool. Ignore the critcs, they're butchers and nitpickers.


Not really. My argument was simply that even though I hated the first movie and I'm sure I'm going to hate ROTF, I'd still bet that there's more of a plot than Armada had.

I hate Armada because of the lack of a plot that made sence. I hated the first Bay movie because I felt like the movie focused too much on the human characters and not enough on the actual Transformers unless your name was Bumblebee.

While yes Bay's movies do have alot of exsplosions, there's still some what of a decent plot in the first movie. Just not alot of that plot really shows the main characters and insted has humans trying to understand the plot of their own movie.

In simple terms, even the Bay exsplosion spectacular is bound to have a better plot than Aramada and I'd gladly watch the live action movies 100 times over before watching Armada ever again. Allthough honestly that's not saying much for the movies, they rank just abouve Armada for me. Basically it's like saying, I hate them but can at least tolerate them where as Armada, I just hate and I get a huge head ach any time I even try to think about it.

Hell forget Bay, I'm going to go assassinate the creators of Armada.

Seriously though I wasn't planing on seeing ROTF, but now that you've reminded me about Armada I've suddenly realized, "hey it could be worse." and now ROTF isn't looking so bad. I really don't think anything could ever be worse than Armada.

I'd rather go watch Go-Bots than Armada. You know, that cartoon that's allso from the 80's but no one liked.

Hell, you made the Pok'emon connection and I'm just going to throw this out there. Even Pok'emon cartoons are better wrighten than Transformers Armada. There I said it. The only reason I don't watch Poke'mon anymore is because at the end of the first season it was reviealed that Gary has never used his Pok'edex while Ash has used it every single time he comes across a new Poke'mon, some times even when seeing Poke'mon he's allready caught. Gary was actully smart enough to realize something that all the fans allready knew and apperently Ash was the only person too stupid to figure it out. Pok'emon say their names so it's really unnessisary to even have a Poke'dex to find out their names. There is other information you could use a Poke'dex for but Ash only uses it to point out the obvious.

Pikachu: Pikachu

Ash: What's that?

Oak: Here's a Poke'dex.

Dex: Pikachu

Ash: Oh it's a Pikachu, wow, that's Professor Oak. (leaves to start his jurney)

Oak: I hate thoughs stupid kids. I'm glad I made the Poke'dex so they stop calling me at all hours asking what the hell the bloody names of the Poke'mon they catch are.

In the game there's actully a reason for it sence part of the game is to fill the Poke'dex with information for him but on the show that was never a reason for it. I thought it was at first but then when I realized Ash was only useing it to state the obvious I realized he wasn't helping Oak to fill the thing with information it was allready there, he's just an idiot who doesn't realize they allready say their freaking names.

So yeah, I stopped watching Poke'mon because Ash is a freaking moron but I have played all the hand held games up till Ruby and Saphire, and all the consol games up till Collicum. Both of which I thought were really stupid. The problem with Ruby was by that point the "legendary" Poke'mon witch had allways been the colest looking characters before now looked like poop and all the original legendary characters weren't added to the game pluse it not being compatible to trade with the older versions. Collicum was a horrible attempt at bringing the hand held games to the screne. Insted of playing like you did Stadium you played like the little hand held versions except that now you can steal shadow Poke'mon from other trainers and they made it impossibly difficult to train your poke'mon sence you got them with only 1 attack and had to make them like you in order to unlock their other attacks and their XP bar. That's right before your even allowed to train your pokemon they have to like you first and the only way to get them to like you is either to summon Celiby which you can only do once or use them in battle WITHOUT killing them which is impossible when they only have one attack and won't even use it 90% of the time because they allso have to like you to follow your commands. Seriously, the Celiby thing, that's a little too easy sence it unlocks everything for a single character. The other way is impossible difficult. Why couldn't it just be as simple as leveling them. The XP bar on normal Poke'mon which you start out with 2, Espeon and Umbreon, moves 100 times faster the progress bar on Shadow Pokemon likeing you. It should just be that they get half XP for the next 5 levels or something. Anyway, Soon after that the games started to get even more rediculas and I stoped playing them.

All that being said. I'd rather watch Poke'mon than to Watch Transformers Armada. Hell I'll watch ANYTHING other than Transformers Armada. Well anything except porly made fan dubs of Japanese only series.
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Sabrblade » Thu Jul 02, 2009 3:27 pm

Motto: "It's not done right if it's not done well."
Weapon: Saber Blade
I hear that Micron Legend is a big improvement over Armada.
"When there's gold feathers, punch behind you!!"

Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: Why all the 'Unicron Trilogy' hate?

Postby Kenny28 » Thu Jul 02, 2009 10:28 pm

I preferred the comics myself...goddamn Pat Lee screwing everything up...

That said, it was mostly the dubbing and annoying "Minori-team" kids from Armada that bugged me more than anything else...that and story pacing in Energon/Superlink and Galaxy Force.

I wonder what all those series would've been like if they followed Aaron Archer's ideas more...
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