Bay Admits ROTF Wasn't Very Good

This just in: Bay also admits: Sky is blue! Earth revolves on its axis once every 24 hours! Water is wet!

no sh!t sherlock

Faint………………… Heh just kidding…… Wait! Why am I feeling weird? Heart hammering, muscles twitching, limbs going cold, ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!



Doctor’s note: patient died of surprise do to amazingly unusual news, hey Nightbeat get the body bag over here.

i liked ROTF. there, i said it

Two things.
1. Why are we getting recycled news over and over, we've already heard about this interview.
2. We should have to admit that the 2nd movie was influenced by the strike. Sure it might have still had the juvenile jokes and action over plot, but I think it would have been more coherent with more resources available. It might have been better to delay the movie til after the strike, but there might have been property rights and stuff involved (like losing trademarks on names and stuff).



On another note. I personally enjoyed ROTF when I focus mostly on the Optimus scenes and ignore the twins.

(sigh) That's great Mike, now mail it back to 2 years ago when it could've mattered...

Dr. Heavy B wrote:i liked ROTF. there, i said it

I still don't find it a very good movie, but I wouldn't mind it even a fraction as much if it weren't for there being so much crybabying about people not liking it that you're almost forced to like it just to shut them up. There's a whole lot in it that I can happily overlook if it weren't for people being babies that they love it and I don't.
I think I dislike the fans more than I dislike the movie..... And that's not a personal thing against anybody who likes it either. I live in Chicago and I hate the Bears because I find their fans tragically obnoxious, and ROTF gets similar hate from me.

I left the theater happy with both movies. Each left me wanting more. Sure, there's sections I skip watching the dvd. But really I do that with any movie because I can't stand filler, I just want my favorite parts. Maybe that's why I still like ROTF in a world that hates it. There's lots of tidbits that I find great in it, like the opening battle in China, the Forest Battle, or Jetfire's introduction.

Shia -

Then it's just a bunch of robots fighting each other

- Yes please... more robots fighting each other. I don't even care if it makes sense anymore, I love seeing metal mashing. Hell, cameo Jazz walking across the screen waving in the background like nothing ever happened to him for all I care. Robots smaaaaash.

Feels like Bay is just distancing himself from it because he's been told to. I doubt he really feels it was crap, maybe not great or as good as the vision of it was, but probably not crap. Many have said they wouldn't return for the next installment, now he's trying to alleviate fears and win back some that complained. If he wanted to do something humorous ,it'd be great to see a movie critic character get squished in DOTM.

Screw this crap. He's just saying it to get people to see DOTM. He and I both know that ROTF is awesome.

oolldd news
I bet if i made a cut of both movies joined together to make one movie, the parts worth keeping would be shorter than either of them. Sad part is that he complains about bad writing.... well, there isn't that much dialogue in the end fight scene with the Fallen... am I asking too much for a battle with the infernal Fallen to last a while?... a while longer than the forest scene perhaps? This is Transformers, not... 'lets make the audience wait forever through boring dialogue and no action for itty bits of action'

Then again, tf movies are like most sci-fi cg movies nowadays.... sigh.

I thought it was the best thing that happened since the Bible!

SlyTF1 wrote:Screw this crap. He's just saying it to get people to see DOTM. He and I both know that ROTF is awesome.

Actually, this is probably somewhat right. He probably figures because of all the negative reactions of ROTF that no one will go see this upcoming film. However, I do believe there is some honesty in his words here. I mean, he did the whole story in three weeks. I'm sure he wasn't satisfied with that amount of time. Michael Bay doesn't seem to like feeling rushed too well. He even wanted DOTM to be released in 2012 initially, so that he wouldn't feel rushed. Maybe he just thinks he could've done more with ROTF than he did. He shouldn't beat himself up over it though.

And ROTF being awesome is still a personal opinion...you can't know if it's awesome or not.

OptiMagnus10 wrote:

SlyTF1 wrote:Screw this crap. He's just saying it to get people to see DOTM. He and I both know that ROTF is awesome.

Actually, this is probably somewhat right. He probably figures because of all the negative reactions of ROTF that no one will go see this upcoming film. However, I do believe there is some honesty in his words here. I mean, he did the whole story in three weeks. I'm sure he wasn't satisfied with that amount of time. Michael Bay doesn't seem to like feeling rushed too well. He even wanted DOTM to be released in 2012 initially, so that he wouldn't feel rushed. Maybe he just thinks he could've done more with ROTF than he did. He shouldn't beat himself up over it though.

And ROTF being awesome is still a personal opinion...you can't know if it's awesome or not.

Still, I think it's one of the best things ever to be done with Transformers.

MINDVVIPE wrote:Sad part is that he complains about bad writing....

What's so sad about it? Orci and Kurtzman couldn't write their way out of a wet paper bag if their lives depended on it.

SlyTF1 wrote:

OptiMagnus10 wrote:

SlyTF1 wrote:Screw this crap. He's just saying it to get people to see DOTM. He and I both know that ROTF is awesome.

Actually, this is probably somewhat right. He probably figures because of all the negative reactions of ROTF that no one will go see this upcoming film. However, I do believe there is some honesty in his words here. I mean, he did the whole story in three weeks. I'm sure he wasn't satisfied with that amount of time. Michael Bay doesn't seem to like feeling rushed too well. He even wanted DOTM to be released in 2012 initially, so that he wouldn't feel rushed. Maybe he just thinks he could've done more with ROTF than he did. He shouldn't beat himself up over it though.

And ROTF being awesome is still a personal opinion...you can't know if it's awesome or not.

Still, I think it's one of the best things ever to be done with Transformers.

Better statement. And I can agree 100%. But I have no doubt that DOTM will still manage to rock even more.

Burn wrote:

MINDVVIPE wrote:Sad part is that he complains about bad writing....

What's so sad about it? Orci and Kurtzman couldn't write their way out of a wet paper bag if their lives depended on it.

This. Not even Prime has the awesome story I thought it would have at first. It kind of does have "human Decepticons" though.

PS: Another sign of their uncreativenes is the harvester in the next episode. It looks just like a piece of Eden from Assassin's Creed and it does the exact same thing. And it's found almost in the same place of the world. Almost.

Burn wrote:

MINDVVIPE wrote:Sad part is that he complains about bad writing....

What's so sad about it? Orci and Kurtzman couldn't write their way out of a wet paper bag if their lives depended on it.

Whatever, I wasn't referring to their writing. I was just making the point that a "fight scene" makes use of a team of storyboarders and so on, and have more freedom to just have battle choreography... in a script, it would just say somthing like:
Fight scene
Megatron and Starscream are wounded, flee
Optimus kills the Fallen

Thats leaves so much room for a lengthy battle. That was my point.

Yet another 3 paragraph rant scrapped at the last second because you ignorant jackasses aren't worth getting banned over.

*reads the thread*

That's nice. I still thought it was great.

T-Macksimus wrote:Yet another 3 paragraph rant scrapped at the last second because you ignorant jackasses aren't worth getting banned over.

Not posting your rant is pointless if you still call everyone who liked it "ignorant jackasses." Just some friendly advice. Also quoted for to avoid further edits.

Yes! The more he says it, the more I want to see DOTM. I want to quote that bit from Raising Arizona where those prison psychiatrists ask Nic Cage if he's just telling them what they want to hear, and Cage says he is telling them what they want to hear because he's telling the truth, but seeing as it's not on Wikiquote, I know I'd just butcher it.

SlyTF1 wrote:Screw this crap. He's just saying it to get people to see DOTM. He and I both know that ROTF is awesome.

so it took him over a year to find out what we and every one else on the planet knew 2 years ago? No i know whats going on, this is all a ploy to make people think hes seen the error in his ways to try and make people think DOTM might actually be good but really, he still thinks ROTF was the greatest thing ever. Only way DOTM could be good is if bay and those morons that currently write tf:prime (can never remember their names, the ones that fraked up star trek) had no hand in the writing or planing of the script. Bays got a decent filming style but his imagination and scripting abilities suck.

Megatron Wolf wrote:so it took him over a year to find out what we and every one else on the planet knew 2 years ago?

Except everyone who loved it. You know, $800+ million's worth of moviegoers. Just sayin', ya know?

Capt.Failure wrote:

Megatron Wolf wrote:so it took him over a year to find out what we and every one else on the planet knew 2 years ago?

Except everyone who loved it. You know, $800+ million's worth of moviegoers. Just sayin', ya know?

Yea man, don't you know? so many people loved the movie, so its gota be good. When lots of people like something, thats how you know its good, how else would you know its good?
Lots of people do crack, I bet crack is good for ya too. Time for some crack.

I'm just kidding round by the way, not tryin to hurt ye feelings

MINDVVIPE wrote:

Capt.Failure wrote:

Megatron Wolf wrote:so it took him over a year to find out what we and every one else on the planet knew 2 years ago?

Except everyone who loved it. You know, $800+ million's worth of moviegoers. Just sayin', ya know?

Yea man, don't you know? so many people loved the movie, so its gota be good. When lots of people like something, thats how you know its good, how else would you know its good?
Lots of people do crack, I bet crack is good for ya too. Time for some crack.

Your post is invalid to the situation at hand.

There, the director said it.

Now can I say it freely, without being accosted?

MINDVVIPE wrote:

Capt.Failure wrote:

Megatron Wolf wrote:so it took him over a year to find out what we and every one else on the planet knew 2 years ago?

Except everyone who loved it. You know, $800+ million's worth of moviegoers. Just sayin', ya know?

Yea man, don't you know? so many people loved the movie, so its gota be good. When lots of people like something, thats how you know its good, how else would you know its good?
Lots of people do crack, I bet crack is good for ya too. Time for some crack.

When it's a movie you can. Watching a movie isn't going to kill you or cause health problems.

MINDVVIPE wrote:

Capt.Failure wrote:

Megatron Wolf wrote:so it took him over a year to find out what we and every one else on the planet knew 2 years ago?

Except everyone who loved it. You know, $800+ million's worth of moviegoers. Just sayin', ya know?

Yea man, don't you know? so many people loved the movie, so its gota be good. When lots of people like something, thats how you know its good, how else would you know its good?
Lots of people do crack, I bet crack is good for ya too. Time for some crack.

Movies don't earn that much when they're hated. Hated by critics and Transformers fans, sure. But they're in the vast minority. When you keep to a tight circle who all agree it's easy to see that opinion as fact.

Fact is, just because critics (who I gave up on years ago) and most Transformers fans hate it does not mean "everyone hated it." Way more people loved it. I'm sorry if this angers you, but that's just how it is.

And your sarcasm doesn't help your point. I didn't like Avatar, ALOT of people didn't love Avatar. But legions more loved it. I know I'm in the minority there, but I don't deny the fact people still liked it.

Covenant wrote:There, the director said it.

Now can I say it freely, without being accosted?

No.

Covenant wrote:There, the director said it.

Now can I say it freely, without being accosted?

I find those who liked it tend to be the accosted ones.

Clarification: On Transformers forums and "movie buff" forums. I have yet to meet someone irl or off of forums who hates it.

I went to see ROTF three times in the theaters and enjoyed it each time. I admit, I do find myself skipping the entire college scene most times that I watch the movie and wondering how Optimus beats up Megatron in the forest scene, but I still think it's a good movie. I like the first movie better now that I've watched them both many times, and I know the plot isn't really strong in ROTF, but I still think it was fun and entertaining; it does move the overall story along. It could have been better, but it's too late for that and I just like it for what it is. These live-action movies have gotten me back into Transformers after I stopped watching the shows when Energon aired, so they remain one of my favorite branches of Transformers. I'm really excited to see DOTM and hope it turns out to be great; I hope this series can continue with a few more movies!

Wow you guys are taking me waaaay too seriously, haha.
I'm poking fun at the matter of using ticket sales to say a movie is good. Its obviously ALL opinion. There are so many grey areas, like, the people being dimwitted, or going coz they're friends are going, or they just don't listen to critics either and want to find out for themselves since the marketing (trailers) are so awesome. Duh, theres gonna be people all across the board feeling differently. None of this matters at all, all that matters is that Bay comes across like hes made DOTM good. I'm sure he'll have done an awesome job of that when half the world shells out to see it. Will I like it? who the hell knows, I gota see it first. Did i like ROTF? parts. There, now maybe you guys can stop taking me so seriously since I clarified the serious parts.

well atleast he admits it

MINDVVIPE wrote:Wow you guys are taking me waaaay too seriously, haha.
I'm poking fun at the matter of using ticket sales to say a movie is good. Its obviously ALL opinion. There are so many grey areas, like, the people being dimwitted, or going coz they're friends are going, or they just don't listen to critics either and want to find out for themselves since the marketing (trailers) are so awesome. Duh, theres gonna be people all across the board feeling differently. None of this matters at all, all that matters is that Bay comes across like hes made DOTM good. I'm sure he'll have done an awesome job of that when half the world shells out to see it. Will I like it? who the hell knows, I gota see it first. Did i like ROTF? parts. There, now maybe you guys can stop taking me so seriously since I clarified the serious parts.

Heh, yeah gotta apologize to you. I saw your edit to the post saying you weren't being serious AFTER I posted a response.

Sorry, sometimes lack of sleep and caffiene leaves me a little hot headed. That and I don't suffer a fool, which you sounded like (mind you in jest which fine, but I didn't know that).

Capt.Failure wrote:Heh, yeah gotta apologize to you. I saw your edit to the post saying you weren't being serious AFTER I posted a response.

Sorry, sometimes lack of sleep and caffiene leaves me a little hot headed. That and I don't suffer a fool, which you sounded like (mind you in jest which fine, but I didn't know that).

Water under the bridge.

Megatron Wolf wrote: so it took him over a year to find out what we and every one else on the planet knew 2 years ago?.

No, as someone said earlier, $800+ in ticket sales says other wise. People liked it. get over it already.

Megatron Wolf wrote: Only way DOTM could be good is if bay and those morons that currently write tf:prime (can never remember their names, the ones that fraked up star trek) had no hand in the writing or planing of the script. Bays got a decent filming style but his imagination and scripting abilities suck.

If there so damn bad then who should direct any upcoming movies? Who should do the writing? You know what,.. Scap that. Cause no matter who does, people will find something to bitch about. Even when someone attempts to admit their faults, they still call him out and shut him down.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. If someone does decide to reboot the movies, i hope its someone like Uwe Boll. Then you'll truly know what a bad director can achieve. Or not achieve

Personally, i liked ROTF. But if Bay can admit that it wasn't as good as it could be, that should be a good thing for everyone. Especially for those that didn't like it. But instead, he gets even more backlash. Makes one wonder why even bother?

Skyfire-5 wrote:Reported for agreeing? Wow that's Sheen-like crazy talk...

It's because when I first started posting here, it was to avoid people who turn and attack those who's opinions differ. By agreeing, you may have well said the same thing he did.

I really thought these forums were better than that. Guess I was wrong.

The only best parts of ROTF was Megan's Lil sexy scene on the bike and the combining scene of devastator. The other thing is that Michael Bay should have incorporated the Transformers theme song somewhere in the movie. That is why these movies feel incomplete to me.

1) Isn't this old news?
2) Isn't front paging this old news mainly going to result in flaming over this topic for the nth time?
*reads over thread* Yup, thought so.

Let's just try to keep a level headed discussion going here guys

Personally, I think it was less than TF1 in terms of overall plot, story, character, involvement, etc. But it kept me on the edge of my seat when it needed to. For that, I appreciate what was accomplished. I don't think ROTF was terrible (I'd give it a B- overall) but obviously it could've been better. The Writer's Strike caused a lot of poor ratings on TV and factored in heavily to ROTF. With Orci and Kurtzman now gone, I'm even more hopeful that it will be better. And, optimistically speaking, I hope that all those who worked on DOTM learned from any mistakes on ROTF, and are truly trying to improve on it. I'm psyched for DOTM, and not much is going to sway me from that.

I'm not sure why people equate paying money with liking something. I paid $6 or $8 (in gift card money) to see ROTF, and I hated it. I paid because I love Transformers and sorely hoped that it might be better than the first Bay movie, which was disappointing. ROTF was actually far worse, which was surprising since my expectations were already low. Then I paid another $10 or $15 (still on the gift card) to see the IMAX version to see if that was at least more visually appealing and if maybe I'd like the movie better the second time. I didn't. I then rented it a third time for $1 to show my brother, and I still didn't like it (and neither did he).

So in all I paid maybe $20 to $25 for something I didn't like no matter how many second chances I gave it. As opposed to paying little to nothing to see many movies I loved--$5 buying a random movie at Blockbuster, $1 at Redbox, nothing at the library. (And yes, I borrowed ROTF from the library recently to see if there were at least some special features I could enjoy. There weren't. I guess they didn't have the special edition disc.)

Bottom line, people can't pay BECAUSE they like a movie if they've never actually seen it. The decision about whether they liked it or not happens after they pay. And undoubtedly there are some other people like me who tried really, really hard to give it a chance it never deserved, and paid multiple times because they like TRANSFORMERS, not because they thought ROTF was a good movie.

P.S.--I also paid to see Kickass because some friends of mine wanted to go out and that's what they wanted to see. Guess what? I hated that movie, too.

amtm wrote:Bottom line, people can't pay BECAUSE they like a movie if they've never actually seen it. The decision about whether they liked it or not happens after they pay. And undoubtedly there are some other people like me who tried really, really hard to give it a chance it never deserved, and paid multiple times because they like TRANSFORMERS, not because they thought ROTF was a good movie.

P.S.--I also paid to see Kickass because some friends of mine wanted to go out and that's what they wanted to see. Guess what? I hated that movie, too.

I'll return to this thread since the troll poster seems to have been removed.

While yes this is a valid arguement, you also have to realise that you can't immediately assume the only reason people saw it over and over was to "give it another try." There is more evidence toward moviegoers liking it (box office results, exit poles, etc) than the claims of it's universal hatered. Just because you had to give it more tries to enjoy it doesn't mean everyone did.

I'd actually wager the non-Transformers fans would fit the bill of "repeated viewings due to enjoyment." You gotta remember, Transformers is at best a fringe fandom in the eyes of the average movie viewer. The non-Transfans didn't see it with expectations of fitting a well established mythos, or with specific ideals of how a character should act or how the plot should progress. Try to view the film's success from a neutral, non-fan standpoint and it's easier to believe.

As for Bay's opinion? Easily grandstanding to drum up positive buzz. It won't help, since critics hate his films regardless other than The Rock. But as with RotF the viewers will determine it's success.

amtm wrote: I'm not sure why people equate paying money with liking something.

Uhh,.. ya. Thats usually how it works in the consumer world.

amtm wrote: I paid $6 or $8 (in gift card money) to see ROTF, and I hated it. I paid because I love Transformers and sorely hoped that it might be better than the first Bay movie, which was disappointing. ROTF was actually far worse, which was surprising since my expectations were already low. Then I paid another $10 or $15 (still on the gift card) to see the IMAX version to see if that was at least more visually appealing and if maybe I'd like the movie better the second time. I didn't. I then rented it a third time for $1 to show my brother, and I still didn't like it (and neither did he).

Ha ha! Man, have to laugh at this. I can understand paying to see it the first time and then coming out not liking it. Thats fair. But then not only did you pay to see it a second time (paying with a gift card is irrelevant since you could have used that gift card for something else that you actually liked. So either way, you wasted your money) but you paid again to see it a third. This isn't fan loyalty, this is stupidity. Sorry. But thats the truth. Just because your a TF fan, doesn't mean you have to like, or force yourself to like anything TF related.

amtm wrote:Bottom line, people can't pay BECAUSE they like a movie if they've never actually seen it. The decision about whether they liked it or not happens after they pay. And undoubtedly there are some other people like me who tried really, really hard to give it a chance it never deserved, and paid multiple times because they like TRANSFORMERS, not because they thought ROTF was a good movie.

Like i said before, i agree that you won't know if your going to like something unless you've seen it. But what are you trying to say? Thousands of people contributed millions repeatedly because they wanted to force themselves to like this movie? Really?? And this is why ROTF has earned as much as it has?? seriously man.... Thanks for the laugh!

I'm impressed! People only rarely come right out and admit the weakness of a movie they made recently. That movie hurt the brain of anyone desiring a coherent plot. Maybe he realizes that by confessing this, he has a chance of bringing these audiences back into the theater. I had not intentions of watching the third movie after seeing the second, but now just maybe...

I enjoy it greatly myself. Wasn't a single movie of 2009 that entertained me more and had me leaving the cinema feeling like I had a whole lot of fun sitting down (I usually can't bear to be sat still for more than 30 minutes at a push)

funny thing is when you read the article carefully bay isnt saying the whole movie is crap, he is saying certain aspects (the mystical theme in particular) didnt work and were "crap" which as it happens i agree...

the movies dont get me so worked up as i have low expectations for them and just look forward to the toy line...

will DOTM be a intellectually and philisophcally enlightining experience? no, not likely. will it be flashy with a bunch of cool robots and explosions? yep count on it.

cmon guys your all taking this much to seriously. its a sci-fi action movie based off a cartoon based off a toyline...
none of this is life changing stuff.
its just light entertainment... about robots...

I think Michael Bay needs to stop using the Writer's Strike as an excuse for ROTF . I think that the re-writes during filming, not to mention the writers' TRYING TOO HARD TO MAKE AN EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, SUPERMAN 2, or WRATH OF KHAN OUT OF ROTF played a HUGE part in what could've been an excellent sequel. If it wasn't for the action, the movie wouldn't have been enjoyable in my eyes. Racist stereotypes aside, the thing they do not understand about TRANSFORMERS is that it's about the F&*^ING ROBOTS and NOT THE HUMANS. Make that the focal point!!! QUOTE ME ON THIS AS WELL: ROTF is less enjoyable when see collagen-lip filled Megan Fox playing a made up, OC or The Hills type of chick who wasn't even humbled by the events of the first movie, and, Sam's sequence where he dies, and meets the Primes. Aside from those scenarios, ROTF could've been so MUCH BETTER as far as storylines are concerned.

Ah, this is hilarious. Just about everyone involved with ROTF has said it's no good, and still all the fanboys and apologists are making excuses for why they are right and everyone else is wrong. Funny stuff. What's even funnier, is while all the ROTF fanboys act like they all some kind of martyrs or something, it's usually the other way around at least on this board. If you don't think the film is absolute perfection, you point out one valid flaw, and prepare to be torn to shreds. Gotta love it, makes for entertaining reading.

shadowynne wrote:funny thing is when you read the article carefully bay isnt saying the whole movie is crap, he is saying certain aspects (the mystical theme in particular) didnt work and were "crap" which as it happens i agree...

So, this is what's it's all about? That was my favorite aspect of the entire movie! It's the reason I liked ROTF so much. That and the score. And of course because of the TF's but that's obvious.

The story was pretty simple: kill Prime, put the blame on Sam, resurrect Prime. Oh, and don't forget to blow @#$% up while doing it. I don't care if people think the movie was crap, or even the director. I still enjoy watching it even if for the fight scenes.

So Bay himself admits he made a faulty product. Do we all get refunds now on our ticket prices.

I still like how it wasn't his fault. It was all the writer's strike. I can see him in the editing room saying "None of this makes any damn sense. If only I had some one who could write to clean this up. I'm a director and in no way expected to have storytelling abilty."