From KOs to fan designed toys: Is CHMS entering the 3rd Party market?

Man that magnus figure looks amazing!!!!

Youtube upload, no password needed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXGs4ON9AQw

not gonna lie. that ultra magnus video made me nerdgasm.

I'm intrigued by the Prime unit and a little quizzical about the Magnus form. There is a lot going on in that transformation and it just seems like there's a lot that can go wrong without top notch production. Prove me wrong CHMS.

At first when I looked at it I thought, WOW, that outdoes city commander! Large by not having to work around Hasbro's own product. But the more I look at it, that weird shoulder configuration really bothers me.

In armoured form it looks ridiculous. I cannot 'not' see it now when I look at it. If the cab is a masterpiece-esque figure like Faith Leader, the Shoulder assembly should be able to telescope away from the body a little, surely enough to make room for the armour. That arms sticking out sideways look, giving him ridiculous wide shoulders just looks silly.

I would not be surprised if Igear come out with a Magnus repaint of Faith Leader and a trailer to match.

Also, I got one of CHMS's early mould seekers, it was super floppy in places, and dangerously tight in others, and it has two left rear stabilisers... I seriously don't trust their QC.

K.O, 3rd party, authentic. Who cares! Cool things are cool and this has potential. Wanted to read opinions on the toy because there have been times where I have changed my mind one way or another about a product based on information/observations others have about said product or QC issues with certain manufactures. 7 pages of of philosophical debate on TM ethics and I am ready for bed. Not intending to sound snotty but there has to be a thread on this subject somewhere thats 500 pages long.

Looks impressive. It's funny too, I JUST preordered a re-release City Commander set from BBTS and just today received a DIA Commander set for my Henkei Prime that I ordered from ebay (very awesome by the way ).

I have a question to the anti-KO folks:

What about G1 Shockwave? If I want a G1 Shockwave I have 2 options:

1. Purchase a disgustingly overpriced (and very likely yellowed/worn out) real G1 Shockwave from a seller on ebay, the sale of which provides exactly $0.00 in profits for Has/Tak
2. Purchase a KO Shockwave from CHMS or whoever makes it for a far less expensive price, and as above, Has/Tak gets exactly $0.00

Does it make any difference if a toy is not KO'ed until it is no longer available at retail? Assuming the KO is sold as a KO, so that it can't be passed off as the real thing to unsuspecting collectors, but that depends on seller honesty/integrity, it should be fine as I see it. They aren't competing with Has/Tak because Has/Tak got out of the G1 Shockwave business many years ago, and from all I've read, they never plan to return to it (because they can't as I recall, either due to legal issues, a lost mold, or both).

I understand from a collector's point of view why it could be bad; their previously rare and extremely sought after figure can now be purchased at a very cheap price (comparatively speaking) where they may have had to pay a lot or go through a lot of trouble to get their own.

That brings up one catch-22 that I see with some KO's, and that is when they make every mark on the toy (copyrights etc.) as well as the packaging itself identical to the original. Again, if the legit/original Has/Tak figure is no longer available at retail, it cannot possibly hurt Has/Tak in any way, but it has the potential to hurt a collector who paid a high price for what they thought was an original Has/Tak product from a dishonest seller who ILLEGALLY represented the figure as an original and not a KO. I have a big problem with that, because it is fraud and a total ripoff.

Other than that, I have no problem with KO's or third party products of any kind. I only have a problem with people being ripped off (and as I said, in this case Has/Tak don't count because they see no money from the purchases of vintage figures that they no longer produce because they saw that money LONG ago when the figure was purchased by the seller from retail).

Anyway, back on topic. I'm loving all the third party stuff we're starting to get now. It's awesome and is giving us a lot of options which should eventually lead to some of these third party companies getting bigger, allowing for falling prices and more variety (and hopefully faster production so we get new stuff quicker instead of waiting for many months or even years for them to complete a project they've announced/hinted at).

*yawns*
as usual, the bickering about 3rd partys and knockoffs.
*sighs*
anyway, these look quite cool
that little decepticon symbol is cute, i dont care much for the alternators-looking sillouhette, but the magnus looks epicty epic.
also, if you look on the linked video, the front of the cab of the base magnus figure had one hell of a tansformation, as does actually, the chest and head armour piece.

waiting eagerly for more news such as release date, price point, or, for that matter, prototypes.

That's insanely complicated for a voyager sized toy. I'm skeptical.

Did Hideaki Yoki design the first Masterpiece Prime? If not him, than whoever should be very proud at how much his work has been built upon The cab (atleast from the ankles up) is a MP 01 Prime.

This Magnus looks epic. I still like my City Commander better, only becuase it is G1 with personality, BUT this set might be hard to pass up. Could be my first double dipped/3rd party piece.

Does this have any relation to the fan support that surfaced for a customizer who's custom MP Magnus trailer design got caught in the 3rd party/KO vacuum?

Primus Yess! Let it be true!

A G1 voyager sized cartoon accurate Optimus Prime which looks like it's going to be produced in a good ammount. I hope the quality will be fair. And of course hope it will get the Optimus Prime deco with some diaclone trailer deco.

If I finally get my G1 cartoon accurate "toy" and into scale with other Hasbro lines version, this will be my first 3rd party purchase.

Fingers and eyes crossed.

Mykltron wrote:That's insanely complicated for a voyager sized toy. I'm skeptical.

I know right?
the whole headlight area/front whel thing hardly looks physically possible...
but still, even a simplified version would be epic.

From the video it's look like they maintained the original G1 design and gave the character a new transformation as well. Very nicely done.

even from a Non-magnus fan point of view this is still incredible, It's like the whole world has woken up after the masterpiece range were sold, realising the amount of adult collectors out there armed with a passion and a wallet, If I was a Magnus fan I'd be all over this, so far it doesn't even look like it has been 3D-printed, just floating around in Cyberspace. Get Your "Prints" Out for the boys!

Blackstreak wrote:From the video it's look like they maintained the original G1 design and gave the character a new transformation as well. Very nicely done.

From the video it's look like they are the second company to KO Masterpiece Prime!

The trailer rocks hard! seriously!

As far as the scale concerns: Hybrid Style Convoy had nearly the same transformation (with the headlight and wheels folding into the chest and what not) process in a scout/deluxe design. Granted they are notoriously weak, but double the size and the fact that this figure has been redone so many times (My Grandmother has a Masterpiece Prime minicon that will be up for preorder this month, release date 2013) I'm sure they can handle production.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

I do understand the facts that one of them is being passed off as an original in an attempt to get your money disingenuosly. However, I counter with the other one is using fanboyism against the collector to get your money disingenuously

I can agree with just about all of the rant except for this part. Can't see what's so disingenuous about the 3rd party products. The price may be overinflated, but nobody's forcing anyone to buy it.

Same as KO's, no one's forcing you to buy them. That's why I don't get why everyone gets worked up about KO's, but is ok with 3rd party stuff. I look at my CHMS Sunstorm and my Fansproject DIA Commander the same way, unofficial products. There's no difference. And Has/Tak isn't loosing money because of either, that's way they are allowed to exist. Do you think for one second if Has/Tak felt their property was in any harm of loosing money that they'd allow KO's and 3rd party stuff to be sold, I doubt it. They'd go all gangbusters and wipe them all out. That's why I find those who decry KO's while praising 3rd party products as hypocritical, to me they're the same thing.

Can anyone say Prime Repaint?

Seriously, does anyone here NOT want that cab in Prime colors?

i don't have the city commander,but it already looks like crap compared to this! It is over-complicated,but that's how I like it.

D-340 wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

I do understand the facts that one of them is being passed off as an original in an attempt to get your money disingenuosly. However, I counter with the other one is using fanboyism against the collector to get your money disingenuously

I can agree with just about all of the rant except for this part. Can't see what's so disingenuous about the 3rd party products. The price may be overinflated, but nobody's forcing anyone to buy it.

Same as KO's, no one's forcing you to buy them. That's why I don't get why everyone gets worked up about KO's, but is ok with 3rd party stuff. I look at my CHMS Sunstorm and my Fansproject DIA Commander the same way, unofficial products. There's no difference. And Has/Tak isn't loosing money because of either, that's way they are allowed to exist. Do you think for one second if Has/Tak felt their property was in any harm of loosing money that they'd allow KO's and 3rd party stuff to be sold, I doubt it. They'd go all gangbusters and wipe them all out. That's why I find those who decry KO's while praising 3rd party products as hypocritical, to me they're the same thing.

The only disingenuous thing about KOs is when they're passed as the real deal. Which does happen, sadly.

I can understand people getting worked up about them because they "pollute the waters". If you're buying off ebay it's tough to tell a (say) KO Swoop from a legit Swoop. You might want to avoid ebay altogether, really. Some people don't have this luxury.

Did anyone watch the video? "Not" Ultra Magnus looks f#@king amazing

Just noticed the video now. It does look like an amazing idea. Better use of parts than CC too with none turning into a BFG. About the only thing I can criticize is the long shoulders.

Wow, the video does look promising...and probably expensive. If they keep it affordable like their KOs I'd surely be interested, but I'm guessing it'll be priced more like the typical 3rd Party figs. I dunno, if it runs 100+ it might be a tough sell for something already done well. Too much 3P, gotta pick and choose.

I love CHMS and put their stuff on the same level as Hasbro. I dont even refer to them as "KO's". I refer to them as "repaints" because they give us characters that Hasbro has no intention of doing like the complete Rainmakers set and Animated Medic. They also give us "reissues" to previous Henkei releases that were the victims of greed and poor decision making. I look foward to finally getting Wildrider and could care less if his inner ankle has a stamp that reads "CHMS".

As for their new plans, I look foward to the new Ultra Magnus mold. It looks a little stubby, but with its legs bent in an action pose, it should do just fine. And the cool thing is the vechicle mode is more G1 Accurate than the City Commander trailer. I love my City Commander set, but I think we can all agree that it is out of scale with the Protector Rodimus and most deluxe figures. Kind of like "Ultra Class" figures. A scale that was never needed by collectors but loved by kids.

I don't quite understand the rabid support for CHMS. Their KOs are decent, but every one of them I ever got was inferior to an official realease that I owned. Of course I only ever bought the Seeker mold.

But, if their 100% new products are any good, it might make me a firmer supporter for them.

If they do half as good as these images and they do Optimus Prime I will be most pleased (like I have been with their seekers)

JESUS CHRIST!!! Did you see that transformation?! It's going to take a small miracle for them to build that into a voyager class figure. At least without it all breaking on the second transform. Truck mode looks brilliant, as does the core robot mode. Almost identical to the Masterpiece. I'm not overly blown away by the full robot mode. The wide chest, long arms and short legs are giving me a primate vibe. Think I'm still favouring City Commander.

I am getting properly pissed off with all these 3rd party companies doing similar figures. I find it hard enough to decide between Hasbro's and Takara's colour schemes. I can't deal with multiple molds.

If this Ultra Magnus gets produced, I will definitely buy this. If it looks anything like the renderings, it'll pretty much crap all over City Commander. This is what I've been waiting for.

And I'm really getting annoyed with these "teasers". I'm pretty sure that's Optimus Prime except he's not Optimus Prime.

Best Ultra Magnus,EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is it? It has some pretty long arms. I also wonder if it can hold deluxe cars .... maybe scout sized cars?

Plus we've seen other fairly impressive CG images that cover up very flawed products before ...
http://www.bigbadtoystore.com/bbts/prod ... icture=out

The video makes it looks awsome, but this pic tempers my expectations.


But I suppose I'm just someone who doesn't WANT to be excited about this since I'm such a fan of CC. The design here has great points. The Prime is very GeeWun, 100% of the trailer integrates into the figure and the armor doesn't seem to hinder arm movement (since it makes up the arms).

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Is it? It has some pretty long arms.

My complaint exactly lol. The arms are beyond wayyyy too long.

Gauntlet101010 wrote: About the only thing I can criticize is the long shoulders.

unfortunately mate i think they are just trying to be as accurate to the g1 aesthetically as they can.

that goes for all the comments about proportion in general, i think.

ArmadaPrime wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote: About the only thing I can criticize is the long shoulders.

unfortunately mate i think they are just trying to be as accurate to the g1 aesthetically as they can.

that goes for all the comments about proportion in general, i think.

I can agree with that statement regarding the G1 toy but UM wasn't a chode in the cartoon.

I personally don't mind the arms too much considering that I've been waiting for a "true" Ultra Magnus in both vehicle and robot mode. This project might do that.

Based on the sketch, I don't mind the length of the arns so much as how far out they are with the wide shoulder width...

Kibble wrote:Based on the sketch, I don't mind the length of the arns so much as how far out they are with the wide shoulder width...

That's true as well. If they didn't go down to his knees they may have been able to real them in to his chest some. That area is the only real complaint I have but it's enough to turn me off to the mold entirely.

Of all the 3rd Party that tried to tackle the G1 UMagnus, this is the closest to the G1 UMagnus. As UMagnus fan, I really like this version a lot. Yes, there are still major problems that need improvement such as:
-Chin are too huge.
-Ear antennas need to bring forward.
-Shoulder joint are too wide out.
-Arm and torso are a little bit out of proportion.
-In vehicle mode, the trailer is attached too far back to the rear.

If they can fix the above items, I 'll purchase in a heart beat. The Magnus Prime mode is awesome! Hech, it even has a side window in vehicle mode, take that MP10, LOL. CityComander is a great figure, but he's no G1. CC fits better as Classic/ Alternated UMagnus.

Hey for those that picked up KO animated Arcee blue and green, what were your over all opinions? I heard once that the paint apps alone where better looking than even Hasbro could have done. The QC views along with anything else are greatly appreciated, thanks!

I actually got ahold of Medic (the green one) and I rather like her, she looks great next to Bulkhead and the plastic is good quality.