Future Transformers Sequels to be a Blend of Bumblebee Movie Characterization and Bayhem

So more action and more focus on emotional development? It would depend on director and writing staff if they can pull it off

ZeroWolf wrote:So more action and more focus on emotional development? It would depend on director and writing staff if they can pull it off

I read it as same focus on emotional development but more action. It can be pulled off. Infinity War pulled it off.

I don't believe anything they say about these movies ahead of time anymore, especialy when they're in planning stages.

ScottyP wrote:I don't believe anything they say about these movies ahead of time anymore, especialy when they're in planning stages.

Especially after the Last Knight right? Remember all that talk about making this huge writing room and getting Robert Kirkman and others. And what did we get? More of the same (or worse).

william-james88 wrote:

ScottyP wrote:I don't believe anything they say about these movies ahead of time anymore, especialy when they're in planning stages.

Especially after the Last Knight right? Remember all that talk about making this huge writing room and getting Robert Kirkman and others. And what did we get? More of the same (or worse).

But also gave us the Bumblebee movie,which was already being planned before the Last Knight was released.

"Afterall, it wasn't necessarily the action element that fans disliked from the Bay films."

But I thought that the (too much) action element is what people disliked from the Bay films...

Bumblebee was an excellent balance of action and actual, cohesive, story.

Kyleor wrote:"Afterall, it wasn't necessarily the action element that fans disliked from the Bay films."

But I thought that the (too much) action element is what people disliked from the Bay films...

Bumblebee was an excellent balance of action and actual, cohesive, story.

There is a bit of that but from what I have read and experienced, what people hate most from Bay is the inapropriate humour, the lack of attention to the robots, the lack of a focused story, the over complicated designs of the transformers, and all that sex talk.

william-james88 wrote:

Kyleor wrote:"Afterall, it wasn't necessarily the action element that fans disliked from the Bay films."

But I thought that the (too much) action element is what people disliked from the Bay films...

Bumblebee was an excellent balance of action and actual, cohesive, story.

There is a bit of that but from what I have read and experienced, what people hate most from Bay is the inapropriate humour, the lack of attention to the robots, the lack of a focused story, the over complicated designs of the transformers, and all that sex talk.

Oh, there have been some complaints about the action as well. Not that there's too much or whatever, but that it's either been too violent (focusing too much on the graphic killing aspect or the collateral damage rather than the fight choreography) or too incomprehensible (see the first movie's robot fight scenes that had so many blurs, close ups, and awkward angles that made actually seeing what was going on at times an effort of futility).

Action is good, but it has to serve the story. Bayhem is mindless spectacle at the expense of stories and characters.
Transformers doesn't need Bayhem.

william-james88 wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:So more action and more focus on emotional development? It would depend on director and writing staff if they can pull it off

I read it as same focus on emotional development but more action. It can be pulled off. Infinity War pulled it off.

The Marvel movies are generally a good blend of action, humor, story, character, etc.

The plot of AOE and TLK certainly left alot to be desired. But I personally love the "Bayformers" design aesthetic. And I grew up with G1 (and own a truckload of the toys). For cartoonish whatever, G1 rules. For live action, Bayformers looked perfect. These are advanced, robotic beings. Their bodies should look advanced and complex. The Bumblebee prologue scenes on Cybertron looked very rushed and amateurish; the cgi itself wasn't hateful, but the designs themselves were just G1-rehash; too simplistic, not well thought out, and certainly not original. The G1 designs do NOT translate to photo-realism. The toys were from a simpler time and the cartoon models were designed to be drawn quickly and on the cheap. They are fun for nostalgic masterpiece toys, but that's where they should end.

That's what I'm talking about! The best part about Bumblebee was the first 2 minutes on Cybertron and then the fight with Blitzwing. The rest of the movie was complete and utter boring garbage.

“I think the more human we can make these characters the more people will love them” ...

Are you kidding me, dude? I could slap this idiot. First of all, that’s how you write character to begin with. Even if you’re writing a weird alien it’s still going to be a departure from what we consider human, and therefore still TIED to humanity and human feelings in some way that’s interesting to us, IF done well... Transformers has been doing this SINCE IT’S INCEPTION, in EVERY ITERATION. Hence, the fan reactions to the thoughtless carnal shit show movies!?!??

God good.

Secondly, the fans have been whining about that since the first movie. This is not some kind of thought provoking statement, Jesus Christ. It’s them finally listening to our feedback. I don’t know why, but the nonchalance of that statement just hit my nerves.

I don’t want a return to bay styled action, unless it makes sense for the story and is well choreographed and uses its environment thoughtfully, like Bumblebee. Shiny metal pieces of something floating around my screen like a screen saver on crack ain’t for me. Shit happening for no reason for 30 minutes at a time is useless to me. And boring as hell. I do agree though, a bit more action could be good BUT ONLY, if they take the lessons they learned from the Bumblebee movie and carry them over, and really honestly incorporate them. If it becomes more thoughtless bullshit and no characterization or story telling just for the sake of a bunch of mindless violence... My head will explode out of the sheer stupidity, like a bay movie. Lol...

Now it's a reboot...

Bumblebee Producer Says Next Transformers Movie Will Be A Reboot

"The main Transformers movie we are working on is a reboot, and I will say that the Bumblebee sequel will be more directly linked to the timeline that we set up,"

Jumpstart1083 wrote:“I think the more human we can make these characters the more people will love them” ...

Are you kidding me, dude? I could slap this idiot. First of all, that’s how you write character to begin with. Even if you’re writing a weird alien it’s still going to be a departure from what we consider human, and therefore still TIED to humanity and human feelings in some way that’s interesting to us, IF done well... Transformers has been doing this SINCE IT’S INCEPTION, in EVERY ITERATION. Hence, the fan reactions to the thoughtless carnal **** show movies!?!??

God good.

Secondly, the fans have been whining about that since the first movie. This is not some kind of thought provoking statement, Jesus Christ. It’s them finally listening to our feedback. I don’t know why, but the nonchalance of that statement just hit my nerves.

I don’t want a return to bay styled action, unless it makes sense for the story and is well choreographed and uses its environment thoughtfully, like Bumblebee. Shiny metal pieces of something floating around my screen like a screen saver on crack ain’t for me. **** happening for no reason for 30 minutes at a time is useless to me. And boring as hell. I do agree though, a bit more action could be good BUT ONLY, if they take the lessons they learned from the Bumblebee movie and carry them over, and really honestly incorporate them. If it becomes more thoughtless bullshit and no characterization or story telling just for the sake of a bunch of mindless violence... My head will explode out of the sheer stupidity, like a bay movie. Lol...

exactly!

SkyFire Prime wrote:Now it's a reboot...

Bumblebee Producer Says Next Transformers Movie Will Be A Reboot

"The main Transformers movie we are working on is a reboot, and I will say that the Bumblebee sequel will be more directly linked to the timeline that we set up,"

Sources?

Oh good. I was worried that these movies would start making sense.

Count me as one of the entities that wants to keep Bay OUT of future films as much as possible...

Yes, you read that title right. And if you are confused, that's fine, it means you have been rather attentive. Very recently, Lorenzo di Bonaventura stated that not only would there be a big Transformers film following the Last Knight (though not necessarily continuing that film's plot), but that subsequent films would bring back some Bayhem.

And now, ladies and gentlemen, we are being told that the next big film, following the Last Knight, will be a reboot. We are also being told that the sequel to Bumblebee, the buddy film with Optimus Prime, will tie into the new continuity of said film. Both scripts are being developed at the same time and it is unknown which film will start filming first or be released first. We know many fans were hoping for a reboot simply because that would mean that the films were stepping away from the Michael bay films. But we have since been told that the next films would contain Bayhem regardless, so it seems the reboot is simply to avoid continuity problems, like having Megatron show up in the Bumblebee sequel, as opposed to a change in style or content from previous Transformers films. Of course, this is merely inference from all that was said recently and in this interview from Gamespot.

Looking at what is being told to us, is this the reboot you were hoping for? Let us know!

"The main Transformers movie we are working on is a reboot, and I will say that the Bumblebee sequel will be more directly linked to the timeline that we set up," Di Bonaventura told GameSpot.

"I think Paramount should just pick the best script and release that first," the producer said. "I don't think there is a plan in terms of what movie comes out first, and I always think you should just go with the best script first instead of planning a franchise based on release dates."

He went on to say that the Bumblebee sequel will be bigger than the previous one, despite the spin-off having had the smallest budget in the franchise. "It is going to bring Bumblebee into a bigger adventure," Di Bonaventura said. "What was fun about the first one was that we didn’t have to be beholden to the other Transformers movies."

Think it might be time to put a muzzle on di Bonaventura given all the different things he's saying.

Burn wrote:Think it might be time to put a muzzle on di Bonaventura given all the different things he's saying.

Ain't that the truth.

Sabrblade wrote:

Burn wrote:Think it might be time to put a muzzle on di Bonaventura given all the different things he's saying.

Ain't that the truth.

Preach on brothers!

william-james88 wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

Burn wrote:Think it might be time to put a muzzle on di Bonaventura given all the different things he's saying.

Ain't that the truth.

Preach on brothers!

This guy must be the biggest internet Troll ever!

The easiest way to understand this,in my opinion,is that the movies are folliwing up the storyline setup in Bumblebee,carring references to the other films,but not whole continuity,like when the idea of the World War II Transformers presence,was not brough up in the Bumblebee film.

Why can't the bumblebee movie be the reboot! And be the start of a new series
Instead of wasting more time on the previous main movie series and call that a reboot

Ultra Markus wrote:Why can't the bumblebee movie be the reboot! And be the start of a new series

Because I don't think di Bonaventura really understands what the term "reboot" means.

Burn wrote:

Ultra Markus wrote:Why can't the bumblebee movie be the reboot! And be the start of a new series

Because I don't think di Bonaventura really understands what the term "reboot" means.

that's true, he said so himself:

Reboot, I always hate that word because for one, I’m not sure I really understand what it means.

william-james88 wrote:

Burn wrote:

Ultra Markus wrote:Why can't the bumblebee movie be the reboot! And be the start of a new series

Because I don't think di Bonaventura really understands what the term "reboot" means.

that's true, he said so himself:

Reboot, I always hate that word because for one, I’m not sure I really understand what it means.

Well, if this is to be Bumblebee 2, sequel to the first, and this sequel will follow the continuity of the new reboot, then it could be said that by default, the first Bumblebee movie was the first in this reboot.


Or di Bonaventura has no idea what the crap he's saying and I think we should wait for Paramount to have an official press release on the subject before we take him at his word.

"What was fun about the first one was that we didn’t have to be beholden to the other Transformers movies."

Yeah I guess it's slightly hinted here

The lesson to be learned: Unless it's 100% clear that they are speaking our language, never trust anything anyone from the corporate side of things ever says about "continuity", because 99 times out of 100 the concept of "continuity" means something completely different between the fandom side and the corporate side.

Nexus Knight wrote:Or di Bonaventura has no idea what the crap he's saying

I worked out what it is.

He's taken inspiration from the movies. The continuity of them can be confusing at times as well.

I said this a few days ago about another of his interviews ... Larry ‘D’ strikes again!

Burn wrote:

Nexus Knight wrote:Or di Bonaventura has no idea what the crap he's saying

I worked out what it is.

He's taken inspiration from the movies. The continuity of them can be confusing at times as well.

LOL

Good one, Burn.

william-james88 wrote:Yes, you read that title right. And if you are confused, that's fine, it means you have been rather attentive. Very recently, Lorenzo di Bonaventura stated that not only would there be a big Transformers film following the Last Knight (though not necessarily continuing that film's plot), but that subsequent films would bring back some Bayhem.

And now, ladies and gentlemen, we are being told that the next big film, following the Last Knight, will be a reboot. We are also being told that the sequel to Bumblebee, the buddy film with Optimus Prime, will tie into the new continuity of said film. Both scripts are being developed at the same time and it is unknown which film will start filming first or be released first. We know many fans were hoping for a reboot simply because that would mean that the films were stepping away from the Michael bay films. But we have since been told that the next films would contain Bayhem regardless, so it seems the reboot is simply to avoid continuity problems, like having Megatron show up in the Bumblebee sequel, as opposed to a change in style or content from previous Transformers films. Of course, this is merely inference from all that was said recently and in this interview from Gamespot.

Looking at what is being told to us, is this the reboot you were hoping for? Let us know!

"The main Transformers movie we are working on is a reboot, and I will say that the Bumblebee sequel will be more directly linked to the timeline that we set up," Di Bonaventura told GameSpot.

"I think Paramount should just pick the best script and release that first," the producer said. "I don't think there is a plan in terms of what movie comes out first, and I always think you should just go with the best script first instead of planning a franchise based on release dates."

He went on to say that the Bumblebee sequel will be bigger than the previous one, despite the spin-off having had the smallest budget in the franchise. "It is going to bring Bumblebee into a bigger adventure," Di Bonaventura said. "What was fun about the first one was that we didn’t have to be beholden to the other Transformers movies."

Isn’t this the same kind of misinformation and confusion we got leading into each Bayformer movie. Seems SNAFU to me ...

Will, love the picture of Scrapper and Grapple poring over plans. Very apropos.

Well... I think that, though it sounds like a leap in the dark, the reboot was the only way to save a plot which was in a dead end. I think Paramount should sue previous writers for the damage they created to this franchise.

What damage? In this day and age reboots are used with abandon. Though they could have just gone the way of bond with one off stories more or less (current bond has more continuity but even that will change when Daniel Craig leaves)

Maybe we should look at Bee as a re-quel as it can be both a prequel and a reboot depending on the fans wish despite it not fully committing to either path fully. While Bee 2 sounds like it will be committing to the reboot (watch them use it to set up GI Joe and Mask lol...oh dear I've jinxed it haven't I)

Though would fans still be happy with a reboot but if they cribbed the action from the older films (the bayhem as they put it)

I talk about damage because many fans don't like AOE and TLK and weren't quite enthusiast of the first three movies neither. I think that the wrong road was taken with AOE; TLK is only a consequence, in the worst way.

But there's one thing I'm still surprised of: didn't Thy expect it at Paramount?
I mean: I don't think there's one Tf fan which could appreciate TLK (I appreciate it but only if I watch it like a NON tf movie). I ask myself how could They not consider this? It was evident! They've wasted millions of $ in something that was a complete failure at first sight.

I don't even know what's going on anymore, I'm not quite sure if they do either but man this is just confusing without any clear word.


I guess we will just wait and see, at least we will likely have more films that are made like Bumblebee and not like Bay's films (as in confusing plots and crude humor) even if they stick with the Bay continuity I guess they could find a way to make it work even if it's limiting themselves with what they can do.

I'm at least somewhat hopeful about the fact that Lorenzo of all people is using the word reboot even if he might not know what it means. (I honestly doubt he actually had no idea what a reboot was, just trying to make excuses for not moving on at the expense of making himself look like an idiot.)

I am thinking he's afraid to give a straight answer for fear of upsetting people and them wanting his head. It also might be a way to test waters by appeasing those who want one thing more than the other. Either way he's playing both sides before settling on a path with it and I feel that is pretty crappy to do in a lot of ways. I just want Bay out of the live-action films while borrowing the action sequences and music from that time because those were the well constructed elements of the live-action films.

Bay is out though, I can't see him signing up for more, and can't see how much input he'd put in anyway if he's not in the director chair. You'd be better off hoping that they don't go with the writers of the past films

ZeroWolf wrote:Bay is out though, I can't see him signing up for more, and can't see how much input he'd put in anyway if he's not in the director chair. You'd be better off hoping that they don't go with the writers of the past films

Speaking of bay and fake news: http://transmy.com/movie/bay-is-back-wi ... t6CbXSIJk0

Dinobot4ever wrote:Isn’t this the same kind of misinformation and confusion we got leading into each Bayformer movie. Seems SNAFU to me ...

Will, love the picture of Scrapper and Grapple poring over plans. Very apropos.

Haha, yeah, I thought that worked perfectly, glad you like it

And you are right about that misinformation. We were told something similar for both AOE (which was a soft reboot, but the same thing as before anyways) and for The Last Knight (which proved to be yet another soft reboot of the TF universe, not gelling with past films, but still the same thing as before anyways).

While the word reboot has been on a lot of people's minds, I think what matters most is that the film is good and I am slightly less optimistic than I was the last time we spoke.

It's gonna be this! No wait, this! No THIS!

It's like watching the screenwriters of the Bayformers films stumble stupidly over themselves as they try to grasp basic story telling concepts.

Bring in Unicron for the sequel, kill him, make it cause a Bayverse-version Unicron Singularity, show a few clips of screwed-up continuity and say that's why, and Bob's your uncle.

Ugh it's like that scene from Generator Rex Season 1 episode 8 Breach, where Breach just says "It is a school but's not a school," repeatedly

william-james88 wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Bay is out though, I can't see him signing up for more, and can't see how much input he'd put in anyway if he's not in the director chair. You'd be better off hoping that they don't go with the writers of the past films

Speaking of bay and fake news: http://transmy.com/movie/bay-is-back-wi ... t6CbXSIJk0

Dinobot4ever wrote:Isn’t this the same kind of misinformation and confusion we got leading into each Bayformer movie. Seems SNAFU to me ...

Will, love the picture of Scrapper and Grapple poring over plans. Very apropos.

Haha, yeah, I thought that worked perfectly, glad you like it

And you are right about that misinformation. We were told something similar for both AOE (which was a soft reboot, but the same thing as before anyways) and for The Last Knight (which proved to be yet another soft reboot of the TF universe, not gelling with past films, but still the same thing as before anyways).

While the word reboot has been on a lot of people's minds, I think what matters most is that the film is good and I am slightly less optimistic than I was the last time we spoke.

Agree. My optimism is a bit more guarded now. I think a wait and see approach is in order.

Looks like romance is not out the question
http://collider.com/transformers-movies ... ove-story/

One of the things I want to see, and I don’t know if we’ll do this particular thing, but I think we will eventually do a love story between Transformers. What does a love story mean? Definitely not sex, maybe not even kissing, but the idea that they would have that emotional crush has never really been brought in. That’s kind of the direction we’re going to try to head into, which is to give them human desires that, up until now, we haven’t seen much of. I think that will change the relationship with the Transformers. So we may do some wild action, we’ll do action for sure in the main line, but it’s a different kind of attempt. I know we will hold on to a lot of the lessons from Bumblebee.

TrypticonCarne wrote:Looks like romance is not out the question
http://collider.com/transformers-movies ... ove-story/

One of the things I want to see, and I don’t know if we’ll do this particular thing, but I think we will eventually do a love story between Transformers. What does a love story mean? Definitely not sex, maybe not even kissing, but the idea that they would have that emotional crush has never really been brought in. That’s kind of the direction we’re going to try to head into, which is to give them human desires that, up until now, we haven’t seen much of. I think that will change the relationship with the Transformers. So we may do some wild action, we’ll do action for sure in the main line, but it’s a different kind of attempt. I know we will hold on to a lot of the lessons from Bumblebee.

This is pretty cool. I'm a sucker for a well done romance so hopefully this pans out well.

I personally consider Silverbolt/Blackarachnia and Chromedome/Rewind to be the only Transformer/Transformer romances in the franchise with substantial depth and good writing.

Other times the romances can be not actually awful but pretty shallow or too squicky/uncanny/creepy.

I think romance can work in the franchise but it's the kind of thing to be careful with and not just put two Transformers together just because or for some token romantic relationship.

It's kinda part of my reasoning for why I dislike the token female Transformer role in Transformers shows and would prefer multiple female characters on both sides or none at all, not that they always end up in romances or anything but how many times has Arcee been a character just to fill in that quota? I kinda actually like Windblade being around since both times she's been in a show it's been in addition to already existing female characters and the other is that she is the main female character but not the only one who existed and I like that in Cyberverse her and Bumblebee are more like close friends then a couple.

I think I'm kinda rambling here but anyways I think romance can be done right even on the big screen...but I do not trust the current creative team to get it right, not as they are as they need someone like Travis Knight again who can put care and thought into his writing and have a reason for something to exist besides filling a trope, maybe not him specifically although I think he could pull off a decent romance but someone like him.

I get the impression from people's reactions when IDW did the chromedome/rewind coupling that they may shy away from that and instead just hook arcee up with someone or go wholehog and make a live adaption of the girl who loved powerglide.

Though it would be a powerful gesture if they did the chromedome/rewind romance, but we'll see what they do when the time comes.

ZeroWolf wrote:I get the impression from people's reactions when IDW did the chromedome/rewind coupling that they may shy away from that and instead just hook arcee up with someone or go wholehog and make a live adaption of the girl who loved powerglide.

Though it would be a powerful gesture if they did the chromedome/rewind romance, but we'll see what they do when the time comes.

I don't think the actual pairing of Chromedome and Rewind is gonna hit the nail again, not the type of relationship itself but specifically those two...I don't know what they can do that isn't retreading old ground or would be superior to what came before.

Also I swear that Arcee has had some sort of romantic relationship/tones with half of the well known Autobots in the franchise. From Bumblebee to Clfiffjumper to Ratchet to Sideswipe to several of her fellow 1986 Autobots (I was actually going to say Hot Rod, Springer and Blurr but then realized I don't actually remember Blurr and Arcee ever being a pairing)

I think the only major Autobots I can think of that she hasn't had anything like that is Ironhide, Jazz and Optimus himself, and even then I could be wrong.


Actually curious to see a list of all her romantic partners in the franchise whether made clear or implications only.