War For Cybertron - No Combiners

These guys are going way too overboard with this. You shouldnt have to play as a body part, you should be able to play as the WHOLE frekn Transformer.

That's alright. These guys are giving us so much more, I'll happily let this slide.

one...i agree, they're already giving us a great amount of goodies with this game as is and adding a combiner where you can only control one limb at a time would just suck! two...if the game is based prior to first contact with earth, that would be there would be no combiners yet cause the contructicons were the first combiners to appear (correct me if im wrong) but they didnt appear right away in the television series.

while i dont really mind in this game surely the simplest way around this is to play the LEADER of a special team , run into the rest of your team over the level - probably with twits where their individual abilities and powers are necessary - and you simply all combine at the end of the level to beat a big boss or take out an encampment or something.


TBH though combiners should really be their own game done ala socom navy seals.

I don't really mind either way, but this could work if these combiners were like the Power Core ones. I mean, let's say in the multiplayer there was a kind of reward system based upon how many 'kills' you get, à la CoD, then when one of these Power Core TFs reach it, they could summon their drones which could fight with them a bit, and then at the next stage of these rewards they would get the ability to combine with the drones for a short amount of time, naturally getting a lot stronger. I think it could work pretty well, there may be balancing issues, but I'm sure those could be figured out.

I love combiners, but I understand why they wouldn't include this particular function this time around. It would be cool if you could control the one of the team members and all the others were AI controlled, and you could switch between them like in the Lego games or the Legends games. Of course when the group combines you would have full control of the Combiner form. BUT, there's no need for that in this game; the action alone is exciting enough. I would like to see combiners done right once again tho, be it in Games, Shows, or Toys.

This will still be a sweet game without the Combiner characters.

well, one player could control the legs (movements), the other one the arms. as the biggest problem of the combiners is to put together different minds and to coordinate the movements, this would have been realistic

Talking about a test for the ultimate team players. The best way to play that out is voice interaction so both legs aren't going in separate directions while the torso is trying to go a third route.
I agree, this game will be awesome even w/out combiner technology. There is this neat little trick that game publishers have started to do for years now. It's called expansion packs. They could always figure out the combiner details later and release it as an expansion pack.

That was a pretty dumb article...its not like; when fused Mixmaster is in complete control of the left leg, they are fused as one being, Devastator. The others do not exist in that form its only Devastator(unless i am way off).

And when has Kotaku been a "Godzilla" ? i only heard about it late last year.

Probably they will make an expansion whit the combiners and probably also on earth. It's a possibility if the game as enought sucess for it. To me is a must have definatly.

omegaprowl wrote:one...i agree, they're already giving us a great amount of goodies with this game as is and adding a combiner where you can only control one limb at a time would just suck! two...if the game is based prior to first contact with earth, that would be there would be no combiners yet cause the contructicons were the first combiners to appear (correct me if im wrong) but they didnt appear right away in the television series.

I believe combiners were there before contact with earth. There was an episode where we learned about why Omega Supreme hates the Constructicons so much. In it he reflects back to Cybertron when he and the Constructicons were friends. Megs turned them against him and gave them their combining technology. This was all before Earth. I think it was season 2. I'll have to go check the dvd.

It would suck to just play a single limb though. In the future as a team concept maybe that would be fun.

You know, another possibility is to get five of your friends, with whom you work well together, on a combiners team and play the combiner each making decisions on character control for the entire group, sort of like how the theory behind combiners works in the first place.

Why can't this just work like Star Wars: Battlefront?

One person in control of the body, the others take on weapons points across it. So whoever is playing the core body is in control, meanwhile, everyone else controls turrets belonging to their component (i.e: Brawl's cannon).

That worked alright in Star Wars. If you think its not fair on some of the players, think about the AC130 Spec Ops 'Overwatch' from Modern Warfare. One player's up in the air, invincible, while firing on bad guys, whilst the other is on the ground facing said bad guys head on. The same strategy would apply: The body parts will each have to work together to defend the core body as he completes objectives.

There's your team work.

it's okay if we don't have combiners in the game, we already have Trypticon and Omega Supreme. they're big enough to kick ANY combiners butt.

I'd rather want combiners to appear in the multiplayer mode as killstreak rewards. Y'know, for example Defensor increases defence (doh) of all autobot characters, and fights for a certain amount of seconds, and Superion increases attack (just like Stopping Power and FMJ in MW2). Same deal for the Cons.

Having Combiners in multiplayer would be exceptionally difficult to pull off (though I did like the idea posted earlier about having a Combiner show up as a bonus for x amount of kills).

However, I don't feel that they should be excluded from the game entirely. They could still be implemented in the game as an integral part of the story, and you can still keep the team gameplay mechanics.

Just imagine having a five (or six) party team consisting of the Combiners as individuals. You play like you would on the other levels, acting as one character while the others are controlled by AI and switching the controlled character on the fly. Then, when you meet a certain requirement (i.e.: gain so much energon to use, everyone at a certain health level or above) and the level permits it (enough room to manuever) you can activate the combine ability and unleash some Devastator fury on your enemies. Voila. Problemo solved.

At least that's how I'd do it. Thoughts?

Other than the Constructicons/Devastator, all the other G1 combiner groups were either created on-screen or just appeared out of nowhere in the second season.

Technically the Constructicons have a history on Cybertron, but even that is fairly rife with contradictions. Megatron claims to have built them in their first appearance, and the Autobots certainly seem to be surprised at this group that can turn into an even bigger slaggin' bot. Omega Supreme's tale of woe is about the only "evidence" that they existed prior to their debut on Earth.

That said, Trypticon was built by the Constructicons out of a human city, so it's not like War for Cybertron is adhering too closely to canon. Not that they could anyway.

I can see both draws and negatives to the combiner experience, such as the scramble city style combining that would allow individual bots to take up places on one part of the body or another, or to even sabotage enemy combiners. Then again it's still completely retarded to consider the combiner limbs for playable characters or that any giants should even be allowed in multiplayer mode. We haven't had a single TF game yet that permitted gestalts or other giants to be playable, so why start now? The giants are only there to be knocked down.

From a game-design standpoint they're doing the right thing. For combiners to work, gameplay mechanics have to be worked out between five people. Why bite off more then you can chew? Start by making a good game that has some basics down and maybe tinker with the idea in a sequel or downloadable content. Learn to walk before you learn to run.

Dammit, there's no Triple-Changers in the game either. I can see why, since a Triple-Changer would be overpowered compared to the other playable bots--too bad they couldn't be non-playable bosses who could adapt to your play style with multiple alt-modes. Oh well, maybe next time...when we get Sixshot as a boss.

As far as Combiners go, just give me the limbs as playable characters. Maybe make their unique power to where they 'summon' the other limbs to form the gestalt for a limited time, or somethin akin to 'calling in' an air strike attack.

Personally I adhere to the idea that combiner technology has beenon Cybertron for a long time pre-Earth. Just because we didn't see an origin of a particular combiner doesn't mean it doesn't have one. I think for the most part Autobots didn't know about Devastator until Earth simply because Devastator and Omega were on other parts of Cybertron.
Defensor also had no origin given on Earth. Doesn't mean he was not around on Cybertron. It wasn't until the 3rd season that we got to see some siginificant time on Cybertron so that leaves plenty of history we just don't know about.
I like the idea of using a combiner as 'an air strike' or a favor called in like in Mercenaries. I can just see it now both sides calls in a favor and a combiner shows up to duke things out between them.

Every one appears to have missed the humor of being Long Haul. To quote Lil'formers: "I'm the crotch?"

I could see the value of characters like Devastator, Superion, and the rest as bosses in the single player mode. In the multi-player mode I just don't see how they could be used in a way that would be fun for everyone.

these guys are thinking to much inside of the box they outside of the box once by giving us custom transfromers we could make but then again im not compeltly sold on that option as of yet until i see screen shots i may have made misteak in preording this game to early until i see what the custom transformer looks like.

combiner situation who says it has to be 5 make t 2 one person control legs, the other contrl the top half arms, or make conbiner where one person controls it armada game prime flys firginting unicron he cant fly without using jetfire combined form that only took one person not 2.

but honestly i dont care either way as long mutiplay is good and god characters to play as in mutilplayer mode

Mechastrike wrote:it's okay if we don't have combiners in the game, we already have Trypticon and Omega Supreme. they're big enough to kick ANY combiners butt.

And unfortunately they're unplayable...

dragons wrote:combiner situation who says it has to be 5 make t 2 one person control legs, the other contrl the top half arms, or make conbiner where one person controls it armada game prime flys firginting unicron he cant fly without using jetfire combined form that only took one person not 2.

But that's the problem, I don't want to only control half the robot. I want to be the entire robot.

Scatterlung wrote:Why can't this just work like Star Wars: Battlefront?

One person in control of the body, the others take on weapons points across it. So whoever is playing the core body is in control, meanwhile, everyone else controls turrets belonging to their component (i.e: Brawl's cannon).

That's similar to an idea someone had for a Targetmaster-styled system. My answer is also very similar: I don't want to give up control of my character to someone else just so I can control one gun.

Shadowman wrote:

Scatterlung wrote:Why can't this just work like Star Wars: Battlefront?

One person in control of the body, the others take on weapons points across it. So whoever is playing the core body is in control, meanwhile, everyone else controls turrets belonging to their component (i.e: Brawl's cannon).

That's similar to an idea someone had for a Targetmaster-styled system. My answer is also very similar: I don't want to give up control of my character to someone else just so I can control one gun.

But see, I would say that 'in the heat of battle' (depending on how seriously you take it) you wouldn't have time to complain. Just get in that turret and shoot for all your worth!

Scatterlung wrote:

Shadowman wrote:

Scatterlung wrote:Why can't this just work like Star Wars: Battlefront?

One person in control of the body, the others take on weapons points across it. So whoever is playing the core body is in control, meanwhile, everyone else controls turrets belonging to their component (i.e: Brawl's cannon).

That's similar to an idea someone had for a Targetmaster-styled system. My answer is also very similar: I don't want to give up control of my character to someone else just so I can control one gun.

But see, I would say that 'in the heat of battle' (depending on how seriously you take it) you wouldn't have time to complain. Just get in that turret and shoot for all your worth!

Yeah, but that fails on two fronts:

1. I still don't want to give up control of my character to someone else so I can control one gun. There is no way I would ever agree to that.

2. There's no benefit to turning five smaller combatants into one big one. You just become one big target. Even if you control one turret, you can't reposition yourself for a better shot unless whoever controls the main body wants to, not to mention, the main body will be moving a lot, so it would be difficult to hit all those small targets who are killing you.

Shadowman wrote:

Scatterlung wrote:

Shadowman wrote:

Scatterlung wrote:Why can't this just work like Star Wars: Battlefront?

One person in control of the body, the others take on weapons points across it. So whoever is playing the core body is in control, meanwhile, everyone else controls turrets belonging to their component (i.e: Brawl's cannon).

That's similar to an idea someone had for a Targetmaster-styled system. My answer is also very similar: I don't want to give up control of my character to someone else just so I can control one gun.

But see, I would say that 'in the heat of battle' (depending on how seriously you take it) you wouldn't have time to complain. Just get in that turret and shoot for all your worth!

Yeah, but that fails on two fronts:

1. I still don't want to give up control of my character to someone else so I can control one gun. There is no way I would ever agree to that.

2. There's no benefit to turning five smaller combatants into one big one. You just become one big target. Even if you control one turret, you can't reposition yourself for a better shot unless whoever controls the main body wants to, not to mention, the main body will be moving a lot, so it would be difficult to hit all those small targets who are killing you.

1. Well, I wouldn't make it so you'd only have one gun. Each member of the team has a special ability, and in the combined form you'd still be able to use it (assuming its a shield or something) so that would be an extra. Also, adding more turrets to all sides would make it fairer. But this still doesn't sell it. I would still cite, though, the strategy and team work involved as a key feature. If you don't want to be part of a team and use said abilities strategically to defend the whole, be a character who doesn't combine. Obviously the fact that behaving as a team should reap a higher bonus for each kill or objective completed, rewarding cooperation.

2. Again, you become more obvious and easy to hit, so it becomes more important to use that forcefield or shoot back and defend the bulk. As for hitting smaller targets, it still comes back to team work. Do your bit, and hope your allies are doing theirs and I don't see much reason other than tiny details that you couldn't get a lot done.

I think it'll boil down to "No! I wanna be the big guy, not the leg!" otherwise.

Scatterlung wrote:1. Well, I wouldn't make it so you'd only have one gun. Each member of the team has a special ability, and in the combined form you'd still be able to use it (assuming its a shield or something) so that would be an extra. Also, adding more turrets to all sides would make it fairer. But this still doesn't sell it. I would still cite, though, the strategy and team work involved as a key feature. If you don't want to be part of a team and use said abilities strategically to defend the whole, be a character who doesn't combine. Obviously the fact that behaving as a team should reap a higher bonus for each kill or objective completed, rewarding cooperation.

Giving up control to someone else isn't "teamwork," even if you still have some minimal amount of control.

Scatterlung wrote:2. Again, you become more obvious and easy to hit, so it becomes more important to use that forcefield or shoot back and defend the bulk. As for hitting smaller targets, it still comes back to team work. Do your bit, and hope your allies are doing theirs and I don't see much reason other than tiny details that you couldn't get a lot done.

But that's the problem, all of that is significantly more effective when you AREN'T one huge target. I can still defend my allies while also retaining my ability to move of my own free will. This is why they aren't implementing this: "Teamwork" doesn't mean "give up control," and a lack of control isn't fun.

SlyTF1 wrote:These guys are going way too overboard with this. You shouldnt have to play as a body part, you should be able to play as the WHOLE frekn Transformer.

My thoughts exactly. Why is playing as one limb, or as the gunman versus the guy on the ground, even being debated? How idiotic is that?

This makes about as much sense as Michael Bay saying dinosaur bots don't work...then giving us, let's see...some crappy wannabe one-eyed skeleton cat bot as ravage, a scorpion bot that doesn't transform as scorponok, a fly bot that can't do anything but wear a satellite dish and get ripped apart as an insecticon, a farting pile of rusted metal as jetfire...yeah, you get the point.

Ultra Magnus wrote:It would be cool if you could control the one of the team members and all the others were AI controlled, and you could switch between them like in the Lego games or the Legends games. Of course when the group combines you would have full control of the Combiner form.

I had always thought this would be a cool idea also; for a single player game. Might not work too well online with multiple players and one giant robot though.

My mind briefly envisioned a system where one constructicon player would have full control of the gestalt, but it would switch off every few moments from player to player. It's inelegant, but it would carry the idea that Devastator wouldn't be functional unless "all minds agreed (and are paying attention)". The hard part would be getting all minds to know what each one is up to.

Then again, I take that back, it wouldn't be hard with 360 and PS3's voice support.

Here's a way to make combiners work in a multiplayer video game. You play as one of the combiner team, running around, shooting stuff, doing your usual online gameplay kind of stuff. When certain requirements are met, like powering up or something, get all your teammates together and do the combine move.

In the combined form, the gestalt would be HUGE, like the movie Devastator in comparison to Skids and Mudflap. The defense/lifebar for this thing is also suitably huge, because it's such a big target.

Control is handled by averaging all team member inputs. Simply walking around would cause extreme damage, and the guns that it shoots would have a very widespread area of damage (either they make huge explosions or fire in a shotgun-like spread pattern). The way damage is dealt would ensure that precise control isn't necessary.

When the gestalt takes enough damage, it splits back into individuals and gameplay continues as normal until they can power up again.

This kind of a setup would basically make the combined form a temporary powerup. They merge, stomp around and destroy buttloads of stuff for a few minutes, and then when they've taken enough damage, they split.

I'm sure a bunch of hardcore Transformers fans would hate this because they really want intelligent, well-defined combined forms, plus they probably want to control the whole damn thing themselves (as unfair as that would be), but from a gameplay perspective, this would work great. Plus it fits into the mythology, since this is basically how the original Constructicons worked when forming Devastator.

Plus, if you had a decent level of teamwork, you could direct this force of nature good enough to really do some damage.

Requiem Prime wrote:My mind briefly envisioned a system where one constructicon player would have full control of the gestalt, but it would switch off every few moments from player to player. It's inelegant, but it would carry the idea that Devastator wouldn't be functional unless "all minds agreed (and are paying attention)". The hard part would be getting all minds to know what each one is up to.

Then again, I take that back, it wouldn't be hard with 360 and PS3's voice support.

That still forces me to give up control, even if I DO gain control of the entire combiner form, the problem is that I'd still have to give it up.

8 bit wrote:

Ultra Magnus wrote:It would be cool if you could control the one of the team members and all the others were AI controlled, and you could switch between them like in the Lego games or the Legends games. Of course when the group combines you would have full control of the Combiner form.

I had always thought this would be a cool idea also; for a single player game. Might not work too well online with multiple players and one giant robot though.

See, now that's an idea for combiners that works. You control one guy, probably the one who forms the main body, while the other team members are all AI controlled.

I'd think they could make the controls so that the combiner just does whatever the majority of the member do. So if three out of five memebrs say walk forward, it walks forward. If three out of 5 say fire a weapon, it fires the weapon. It would make the combiner a bit slow, but powerful, which is what they are!

This is stupid... the whole reason they are not putting in combiners is because they wanna build on a franchise... why do u think they added devastator in the SECOND film instead of the first. If they wanted to put combiners in the game they could have easily figured a way out, but they didnt. Expect a War for Cybertron 2 with combiners.

Scaleface wrote:I'd think they could make the controls so that the combiner just does whatever the majority of the member do. So if three out of five memebrs say walk forward, it walks forward. If three out of 5 say fire a weapon, it fires the weapon. It would make the combiner a bit slow, but powerful, which is what they are!

Yeah, but two other people end up being ignored which is the main problem of combiner teams in this sense. There's no way it can be fair to the entire team unless the team itself is some kind of hive-mind.

I don't see a system like that keeping 2 people from playing, since it would change from moment to moment what the majority rules says. When one guy changes from walking to punch, if 2 others are ready punching the combiner punches. Plus, I'd guess that the players can TALK to one another, so one player might say "PUNCH THAT GUY" and if two others join him in puching punch the combiner punches. If one plays says DUCK and at least two others don't join him, the combiner just stands there.

I'd also guess that any member of the gestalt team can desolve the combination at any time, so they other members wouldn't piss them off too much for fear of them leaving and ruining the combiner.

I'd like to see Targetmasters just played as a player with a AI companion who can shoot aim at an enemy for you. You could even throw him and he becomes a follower, or you could pilot him as a small scout while the bigger guy hides.

Triple Changer, if one mode was a flying mode, could just be a special effect of flying. When they fly they take on jet or helicopter mode.

Action Masters would be easy. They lack alt modes, but heal quicker, are faster and stronger.

Micromasters are easy to. They are small and energy efficient.

Scaleface wrote:I don't see a system like that keeping 2 people from playing, since it would change from moment to moment what the majority rules says. When one guy changes from walking to punch, if 2 others are ready punching the combiner punches. Plus, I'd guess that the players can TALK to one another, so one player might say "PUNCH THAT GUY" and if two others join him in puching punch the combiner punches. If one plays says DUCK and at least two others don't join him, the combiner just stands there.

But that's the problem, I don't want partial control. I want full control. I don't want to just hope the 'bot will do what I want it to, assuming four other people happen to agree with me. Control of my character is not a democracy, nor should it be.